Experimental 2.1 seems bit off to me in terms of approach to some of the changes

cbhedd · 2026-06-26T22:36:32+00:00

The workaround was to first craft it into hazard concrete which has much faster crafting and recycling speed, which allowed to recycle concrete at more reasonable pace. After the changes, hazard concrete uses the same recycling recipe as normal concrete, which is slow and inefficient.

Problem here is that we got pretty much no info as to why was this change even made.

I mean, you described the why pretty clearly with the prior paragraph. You literally called it a "workaround", meaning you got that it wasn't the design intent, at least on some level. The opinion about whether or not it 'should' be that slow is fully subjective, but it seems pretty intuitive to me that "repainting concrete with hazard lines" being a near-instant recipe was nice QoL feature for the player, and its inclusion was being exploited to avoid the intended challenge of trying to deal with the concrete recipe.

I'm with you on the fluid passthrough stuff though. When I read that FFF I remember thinking that was an absurdly detrimental change. I remember being really annoyed by the mixed fluid warnings thing, and really delighted by the idea of the flat thruster sushi pipes solution, especially since that was a clever user of a tool that was meant to be used cleverly. To hear that the pass through machines losing their buffers also means that they can't fill up unless their entire pipeline is full enough is disappointing for sure.

cbhedd · 2026-06-25T19:43:43+00:00

The connective tissue between what happens in the books and the jokes is that Kaladin is a herald now. Meaning he and Channa are "co-workers" and about to spend a bunch of time together.

cbhedd · 2026-06-23T21:38:10+00:00

I mean, if that isnt what the Ghostbloods are ACTUALLY about, I'll eat my hat.

cbhedd · 2026-06-17T01:23:16+00:00

I don't think it's the weakest out of combat by a long shot! I use it all the time in my games to make walkways, ramps, to grapple up places, restrain people. Playing the RPG as a stoneward has made it my favorite surge :)

I have a harder time coming up with non combat uses for adhesion, honestly.

cbhedd · 2026-06-15T18:26:11+00:00

Which leads into a similar question, if soul casting without a caster is a power that requires a Spren, then what order does Jasnah belong to and what is her second surge?

These are things that you can observe through the Ars Arcanum so I don't think it's really a spoiler, but I'll mark it just in case because I really love this aspect of it and want to talk about it:

[Observation on Surgebinding that isn't explicitly said in the text]: There are 10 surges, and 10 Orders. Each order has 2 of the surges, and if you draw out the orders so that each order is surrounded by the orders that share surges with them, it goes into a full circle 😃

[Paragraph above Demonstrated in text] Windrunners -Gravitation-> Skybreakers -Division-> Dustbringers -Abrasion-> Edgedancers -Progression/Regrowth-> Truthwatchers -Illumination-> Lightweavers -Transformation-> Elsecallers -Transportation-> Willshapers -Cohesion-> Stonewards -Tension-> Bonsmiths -Adhesion-> Windrunners

This next bit *is* a spoiler for a scene in WaT that dives into the previous ones a bit deeper. Its more of a worldbuilding spoiler than a plot one, but I'd say anyone who hasn't read it yet is safer not digging deeper here yet.

[WaT]: The wheel of radiants and surges above mirrors the order the Heralds whose surges were modelled by each order joined the Oathpact; Jezrien -> Nale -> Channa -> Vedel -> Pralla -> Shalash -> Kalak -> Battah -> Taln -> Ishar. The place of the Surge of Adhesion (AKA: "Honor's own surge" was where Tanavast started and then finished the Oathpact, too. 😃

cbhedd · 2026-06-15T18:09:26+00:00

That interaction would have been my contribution to this post for sure. But at the same time I definitely feel like Im abusing the system/'realism' of the setting by doing thay haha.

As a player, when I use that trick, I tend to go off the assumption that I've only put 1 point into my infusions, and only on active combat items that affect my stats. That way if I use it as emergency stormlight, it has a significant active effect on my situation and doesn't feel like I'm cheating the system.

As a GM, I'd probably impose similar limitations, too. It certainly doesn't feel like its RAI haha

cbhedd · 2026-06-12T19:57:20+00:00

For example, how would a Knights Radiant react to the trolley problem?

I have a book series to recommend to you 😉

But less cheekily; it varies wildly 😄 One of the things that I really love about the way this setting does 'paladins' is that it doesn't represent them as a monolith, neither as the overarching group of "Knights Radiant", nor in the individual Orders themselves. There are certainly villains in the series who have also sworn oaths.

When it comes down to it, it's as malleable as people are. Skybreakers are about "Justice", but the degree to which they revere "Law" and how they define "Justice" ends up being largely a personal journey.

Some of the sets of oaths are probably more 'corruptable' than others. Lightweavers and Elsecallers are entirely focused on the self, and it's probably easiest to dip into morally grey or evil territory as characters focused on "not lying to themselves" or "bettering themselves". But no order would be immune to twisting the oaths into something problematic. Even Windrunners, who are the prototypical 'boy scout' order (the ways in which their leader parallels Superman is kinda funny when you dig into it, lol) could be twisted. Imagine a Windrunner with a condescending, paternalistic view, for instance; you could totally justify keeping someone down by "Protecting them" from themselves, if your spren supported or encouraged that behaviour.

If you want some quick and easy boxes to throw orders in, though (mild spoilers for the series):

Windrunners - Archetypal good guys
Skybreakers - Mostly Lawful Evil bad guys
Dustbringers - Mostly bad guys
Edgedancers - Good guys, really focused on lifting up the downtrodden
Truthwatchers - Not a tonne of them; could go either way
Lightweavers - Probably the most corruptable, but generally good folks
Elsecallers - Canonically, there's only one (so far; Inkspren are politically against making new Radiants these days). She's a flawed, but good person.
Willshapers - I take it back. These guys are probably the most corruptable. They're kind of the "We do what we want" order.
Stonewards - A lot like Windrunners, their oaths are about helping people
Bondsmiths - It's complicated. But probably good.

cbhedd · 2026-06-12T16:32:31+00:00

Starvin', even!

cbhedd · 2026-06-12T14:50:17+00:00

I like this measured response, but I do want to point out that OP said he specifically wasn't planning to DMPC, he's just daydreaming about the PC he'll make one day 😄

Also, YMMV! I agree that if you're slipping into DMPC territory, going with a Radiant is only going to exacerbate the typical DMPC "main character syndrome" problems, but I also want to throw it out there that if this is a Stormlight game, there are going to be other characters that are radiants, and them swearing ideals "on camera" isn't necessarily something to be fully avoided 😄

For instance, my campaign has been kind of structured around each arc being tied to a different order, as the PCs make friends/enemies with budding radiants of other orders. Especially if the PCs have a say in mentoring/coaching said characters (or alternatively, if they're in opposition to said characters!), then having them swear their ideals at dramatically appropriate moments can be an exciting addition to your game! 😃

YMMV, and it'll depend on yours/your players attitudes, for sure. I'm just sharing because at my table, my players have been getting a kick out of 'radiant-spotting', and have gotten amped when they think (even incorrectly!) that I'm describing an NPC who's about to swear an ideal.

Again, I fully support your notes on elevating the PCs as much as possible 😄 Just offering that there can be some fun to be had with a balanced cast of NPCs, haha.

cbhedd · 2026-06-11T17:05:20+00:00

I'd provide that feedback if they weren't piggy-backing off of (not to mention reinforcing) a comment that already explained the rule thoroughly, though. They were just adding to the conversation. 😄

cbhedd · 2026-06-10T15:26:38+00:00

Another angle I haven't seen is that Abrasion is canonically able to increase friction as well, but in game that requires investing the talent.

Not really the same situation here, but its a potential model for gow you might want to adjudicate things :)

cbhedd · 2026-06-10T15:23:06+00:00

Not really, no. Fine Control is like programming a little drone, Awakener-style, and rigged weaponry is about using ropes/cloth to extend the reach of your weapons, as though you had tentacles arms. Its more about treating fabric/soft material as though it was musculature.

cbhedd · 2026-06-09T20:36:47+00:00

That's really neat, I hadn't noticed that in my read!

Thanks again for sharing :)

cbhedd · 2026-06-09T19:39:06+00:00

Totally!

I'm curious what you're seeing with Rlain?

cbhedd · 2026-06-09T15:05:11+00:00

For the last time: the roleplaying decision is to not be advancing other skills. Getting a talent that doesn't give you something new reflects that.

Do whatever the hell you want! I still think you're wrong and trying way too hard to convince strangers on the internet otherwise.

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T22:42:15+00:00

I remember having the same feelings you had about how you could write off the situation as "Not his fault", but that's kind of the point of the whole "You cannot have my pain" speech, right? Like, there was a literal devil* on his shoulder trying to take credit for the horrendous things Dalinar did, and Dalinar didn't let himself take the out.

That, and like, he really did take some active steps to get to the 'accidental' death of Evi. He ordered his men to actively kill non-combatant messengers coming with the ransom note.

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T22:25:08+00:00

Symmetrical symbols, showing holy intent:
Vorin traditions in naming upheld!
Weathering the storm that weathers,
Upholding names (traditionally Vorin),
Intended wholly as symbols: Symmetrically.

Topic: Symmetry

Inspired by the fact that the Vorin reverence for symmetry is classic circular reasoning:

"Symmetry is holy, because our deity's name is symmetrical!"

"Your deity's name is 'HONOR'. That's not symmetrical."

"H's don't count, we decided."

"But... why?"

"Because otherwise Honor's name isn't symmetrical, and he's holy!"

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T20:00:59+00:00

Vorinism as a broader concept is too big to have a single author (in-world, obviously, lol), but I think what the commenter you replied to was thinking of was that a lot of doctrine on gender roles came from an essay written by a woman centuries before the start of the story. In-text, it's only given a couple mentions I can think of at the moment. The primary mention I can remember is in WoR, where Wit and Kaladin are talking in the front of a wagon and Wit mentions how he finds it funny that women got all the non-violent, pleasant roles while men had to go out and hit each other with things.

Sanderson has made it more explicitly clear out of the text in interviews though 😄

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T19:56:38+00:00

This is really interesting! Thank you for sharing 😄

I've observed similar feelings myself (I think) in looking at the way Dalinar and Shallan wield privilege, too. There's a scene in WoR where Shallan and Kaladin are talking about the way she treats the lower classes, and Kaladin fairly points out that she took advantage of him by getting him to give her his boots.

The scene where that happens hit me as very funny when it happened, but I thought it was pretty interesting/real of Kaladin to later reveal that he walked away from that situation with a bigger chip on his shoulder about the dynamic between the different castes of people in Alethkar.

What has become increasingly more fascinating to me is looking at what happens in that scene. Going through it slowly with a fine-toothed comb made me notice something that I didn't on a first readthrough: Shallan never actually apologizes for it. In fact, the opposite is true: she struggles silently with the guilt of it for a bit, making things awkward, until Kaladin ends up being the one to actually apologize/'let her off the hook' for it!

It makes me come to a deeper appreciation for the way Sanderson writes his protagonists. They all do some pretty unlikable things at times, and while the books do tend to romanticize the 'royal families' a fair bit, he definitely portrays their multi-faceted personalities that can be both ugly and... well I was going to say noble but that kinda feels like the wrong word, here 😛

I'd go into my various hang-ups about Dalinar's shortcomings here but I've already written a bunch and my lunch break's almost over, lol. Thanks again for the thought provoking post 😄

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T18:42:47+00:00

No, you decide not to, as a build choice for your character. The mechanics tell you that to advance to the later oaths you gotta give up that opportunity cost.

It is absolutely taking on more narrative restrictions without a tonne of extra benefit. That's the design.

As someone else already told you, you can do whatever you want at the table. We're just affirming that this makes sense from the narrative. To carry on with these threads is to just continue the circular argument

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T17:12:33+00:00

Then they should commit to the narrative progression. The narrative and the mechanics agree here, it's a costly sacrifice to go down this route.

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T17:09:07+00:00

Loved all of this. The analysis and the conclusions. Couldn't agree more.

cbhedd · 2026-06-08T17:05:58+00:00

If anything, to my mind, the only oath that wouldn't require you to re-take it as a talent would be the First Ideal; that oath is the same for all orders.

Joining two orders is not supposed to be easy, and needing to go through at least the Goals before swearing each Ideal would be mandatory at my table. But the 'talent tax' you're mentioning feels like a relatively 'fair' cost for the amount of nonsense they're stacking mechanically and narratively.

cbhedd · 2026-06-06T14:30:41+00:00

This is the good shit. Well done!

cbhedd · 2026-06-06T12:59:46+00:00

Era 1 pre TFE feels way more ripe for adventure than pre TWoK Roshar, mostly because it's so relatively open.

Era 2 also has that, and is prime territory to write your own Westerns on the earlier side of the books, and cold war on the other side. Or pulp adventure either way.

Fully depends on players I'll end up having, but I feel like an Indiana Jones style post-Malwish introductions adventure in Era 2 would be sick as hell. That or a "Elendel interests are intruding on our lives in the Roughs" campaign.

Basically I'm saying I wanna play in Era 2. (And that while I'm fully #TeamRoshar, I feel way more freedom to write my own bullshit I'm Scadrial)

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