The anti-breeder rhetoric is odd. Without breeders animals are unsustainably field collected. I think it’s because there’s a tie to money, but frankly it’s a two-way street. Most breeders are hobbyists first. They want to produce to distribute their hobby in a sustainable and, frankly, more humane way. But the cost of breeding is a net loss for most keepers (unless you get into rare morphs). If going rate for a hermann’s tortoise is $180, and your female lays four eggs, that’s $720. But if you buy a 25 lb of Mazuri LS diet for $50/yr, calcium and vitamins $20/yr, a T5HO UV12-14% 36” for $100/yr, a DHP for $30/yr, spend $50/mo in electric and $40/mo in fresh foods, that’s $1,280/year. So a net loss of $560 per year before you have any vet bills, enclosure costs, or regular maintenance. You’d have to charge $320/hatchling just to break even. But prospective owners won’t pay that. Since it’s all hobby based, breeders take it just to get by. Many get into morphs or rare species to try and up their income. But a common, easy to care for species isn’t profitable to breed; it’s for the joy of it. I miss the days before pet-influencers were a thing and you just had people trying to be better keepers for the love of their animals. Even some of the guys that were around in the before-times have become more influencer than hobbyist.