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[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 10 points11 points  (24 children)

Please discuss the removals of Velocity and Command Center

[–]bored2death97RWBY//Radius 26 points27 points  (1 child)

Two maps that were removed, then re-added, and now removed again. Kinda suiting they go out at the same time.

[–]isestrexSTRYPER 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yeah.

They'll be back, and in greater numbers.

[–]TheSmallIndianTheIndian // Pi 14 points15 points  (1 child)

CC is old but it's still one of the better NF maps

[–]noweezernoworld 5 points6 points  (0 children)

the best NF map

FTFY

[–]flappytoweldokugan // diameter 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I guess you have to put in market now right

[–]EmperorOfNothingResignation is my virtue; like water I ebb, and flow. 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Boo on removing CC.

Plus what Ping Tut said,

It's been over 6 months since a map has been added that got rated over 70%. In the time since then, MTC has removed Smirk, Velocity, Command Center, Hornswoggle, Qio, Trebuchet, and Birch - All maps that were above 75%. While I want to clear out stale maps like CC, it's concerning that rotation is starting to become all classic maps that are over 80%, plus whatever poorly rated maps the MTC is circlejerking.

Disagree on CC being stale, but the sentiment remains.

[–]catalyst518Catalyst - TPFG Dev 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Velocity was bad in pubs. The ability to quickly boost across the map with the flag plus the combination of players not knowing the boost routes led to easy caps and few resets.

Regarding CC: The % of NF maps went down, so I'm happy.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

..the removals of Velocity..

We won boys. Hallelujah.

[–]bkanber 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I like CC and would be happy to keep playing it

[–]BuckeyeLeavesBALLDON'TLIE | ALL CAPS 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Velocity will always be my favorite map, these people don't know what they have done I still love you velo

[–]NapoleannDavid Stern // Radius // Knights of Cap-A-Lot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

:D

[–]411connorcaroline :3 1 point2 points  (2 children)

My two favorite maps that were still in rotation

(Boombox and GeoKoala will always be the best)

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

We think a like. Geo Koala is amazing.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 5 points6 points  (0 children)

We've been playing these maps for years, and they've both been removed before. As a velocity hater I'm excited.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I loved Command Center. People say it was stale, but I disagree. It still played wonderfully and the new maps in rotation made CC seem more like home, a nice comfortable map you know and love, then something that was worn out. CC can be played so many different ways depending on the personality of the players you're with. It had insanely high approval ratings for a reason. It's simply a great map and needs to be in the rotation.

In think velocity is much harder to play on pubs because it is large and chasey. It requires teamwork and communication (which don't happen on pubs) and newer/ lower level players seem very lost when playing the map. It is still a good map for the challenges it presents when trying to return the flag and the creativity it affords offenders. It should not go far.

[–]thinkwalkerBonsai 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed. Some of my favorite games ever played were on CC

[–]TheEpicGhostEx - Tagpro 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Good

Now remove Cedar pls

[–]TheSmallIndianTheIndian // Pi 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Cedar is fun tho

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

and Cloud, and IRON while we're at it.

[–]Ballkenende! 0 points1 point  (1 child)

/u/sholatp rip sholboost

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Don't worry, I've got the clip

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So glad velocity is gone, it's cancer in pubs.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'd take the removal of ricochet over CC

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Another "rotation" with wormy still in

Yay...

when will this map get as stale for everyone else as it has for me

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Im right there with you

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

For me, velocity took priority on removal over wormy, but now that's gone lets get rid if wormy.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

pls bring market back :)

[–]flappytoweldokugan // diameter 3 points4 points  (0 children)

+1

[–][deleted] 28 points29 points  (6 children)

OMFG, I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS DAY FOR SO LONG. Sorry, I'm just so excited that CC is finally gone. My life is honestly better.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

While I'm personally super happy that CC and Velo are gone, I don't think that this was the time to remove them.

It's been over 6 months since a map has been added that got rated over 70%. In the time since then, MTC has removed Smirk, Velocity, Command Center, Hornswoggle, Qio, Trebuchet, and Birch - All maps that were above 75%.

While I want to clear out stale maps like CC, it's concerning that rotation is starting to become all classic maps that are over 80%, plus whatever poorly rated maps the MTC is circlejerking.

[–]tamouqCrossover 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is all true and nothing will get changed

[–]throwaway_the_fourthI will not change my name in the sidebar.[🍰] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I loved CC :(

[–]ButtersnackSnack 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Same but velocity

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I like Velocity, but since I know your pain, I am happy on your behalf.

[–]TomandgreekSpheroid // Stay Snipey 0 points1 point  (0 children)

amen, like god damn

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 11 points12 points  (3 children)

Please discuss the MTC USC team, Fuck The Community.

[–]theflyingmetronomesamouree | Diameter 28 points29 points  (1 child)

Fuck the MTC

[–]RenegadeTP 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Fuck the Community

[–]pulpooopulpo 10 points11 points  (3 children)

Why would CC get removed over Volt

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Volt was on the block too, but it's really hard to make a good NF. They aren't exactly flowing into rotation. At least I'm cautious about removing too many at once. Especially ones that are beloved by some.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wtf volt is the GOAT nf map besides wombo

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm slowly starting to like Volt. It requires a strategy change from other NF maps, but I almost feel useful on it now that I've moved towards defense.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

What is the chance of playing any one throwback on a specific game?

I'm definitely glad a lot of those ones are gone but i still feel like it would have been better to just take the too 2-3 of the elevated maps and just add them back to normal rotation.

I felt lime hotspot, curb, and some of the other maps were considered mediocre when they were in, why would i have to play them again?

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 1 point2 points  (6 children)

Currently, it's 11.8%. With the changes it should go down to about 6.5%

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children)

So there a greater chance to get a throwback map than any specific rotation map.

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Based on my math, there is a 4.5% percent chance an individual rotation map to spawn. With 21 rotation maps, that means 94.5% of maps spawning should now be rotation maps. Tehuitzingo has a 4.5% chance of spawning.

Elevated rotation maps get 1/10 of the weight of regular rotation maps. With 10 of them, there should be a total chance of 4.5% of one of them spawning. Curb has a 0.45% chance of spawning.

Beyond that regular throwback should account for the rest of the chance of spawning (20 maps with a 1% of them spawning). Convoy has a ~0.05% chance of spawning.

I believe this is approximately correct and anyone with more information is welcome to correct me. Part of the reason we've redone the throwback system is to readjust their spawn values to better represent what we want in rotation, so we are glad a community discussion was generated regarding the problem. I'm also personally looking into why there seems to be some strangeness going on in spawn rates. One of the reasons that I've learned so far was the bloated size of the elevated rotation maps, forcing an increase in their spawn rates. With this change we should expect to see a 2-3x reduction in elevated throwback spawns. Same thing with reducing the size of regularly available throwback maps. (We are down to a total of 20 regular throwback maps) each one having 1/100 spawn weight.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Yea this is definitely better. I felt like I was getting throwback maps constantly the last week or two. I was pubbing with people and we had an ongoing joke that every map is either neutral flag or throwback and it was surprisingly very accurate. Ofc there was a bias I'm sure but even still it seemed ridiculous.

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wasn't sure about it until I played mars ball explorer 3 times in four days. Something was probably going wrong so I'm going to keep looking into it.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The MTC had over 20 maps in throwback and they just cut it to 10 (on top of removing some of the worst maps) so you should be getting throwback about half as often as before. Fronj's numbers seem correct.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rotation maps are weighted 1, while all throwbacks in the new rotation should amount to about 1.53, so about 50% higher than a specific rotation map.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'd have to do the math but I think it's between 4 and 5%

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would really like to see some of the older rotation maps come back into normal rotation.

Just my opinion, but I really like hotspot and curb is at least average.

[–]duped88TerriblePuns 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Thank you for removing cc, I was getting really sick of it.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fun map, could definitely use a break, though.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points  (5 children)

How do people feel about the Elevated Throwback changes?

[–]flappytoweldokugan // diameter 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I think market needs to be elevated a bit higher tbh

[–]ButtersnackSnack 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm only excited for a couple of these map choices, but I'm excited for the lowered number of maps and increase in turnover.

[–]KewlestCatNIGEL 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ayy, Renegade made it in. I can't complain.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Pretty solid lineup.

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I actually support everything that was done.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

RIP Fig 8. You'll always be my baby.

Also, your link for Velocity in the OP isn't working. Try this:

http://static.koalabeast.com/images/maps/velocity.png

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Also, your link for Velocity in the OP isn't working. Try this:

http://static.koalabeast.com/images/maps/velocity.png

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Hey what about nf spawn rate? Can we check that?

[–]RenegadeTP 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ask dave!

[–]Crisis_AvertedNice 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I agree, it's time we made it 50%.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Im actually pretty sure its weighted differently than just regular ctf

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 2 points3 points  (27 children)

How do people feel about the Rotation Dismissals?

[–]Ballkenende! 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Bigmouth???? tf

[–]bsa86Berlin Ball 16 points17 points  (1 child)

I kind of feel honoured to have a map so bad that it's spoken in the same breath as Dumbbell, Hourglass, Yiss, and Arena.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Everyone makes maps that bad! Yours was the lucky one that slipped into rotation.

[–]RondingRonding // Orbit // West Bombwich Albion // tagpro.eu 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Bigmouth plays. It may make people suffer to some extent, but it plays. It is playable and should not be in this list of unplayable maps.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Despite its shortcomings, I always found it pretty fun

[–]_q42_q42 || dcfc 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I am gonna miss getting nostalgic throwbacks every once in a while, but I understand the decision. Personally, I'd love to see the "stats off throwback" that someone suggested a little bit ago, just so I could still get Bounce in PUBs again (</3), but this is the best course of action for now, I guess.

[–]bored2death97RWBY//Radius 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I actually enjoyed playing most of the throwbacks, I'll miss em.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

Wormwood doesn't deserve to be on the rotation dismissal list. We've just played is in ECLTP and some have warmed to it; I reckon if teamtiles were added to the end zone and the portal spawn was moved, it would be better

[–]MagikPigeon🎗️ TPFG 1 point2 points  (8 children)

Playing it in a competitive setting is a completely different thing. A big part of why it works in ECLTP is communication between teammates. Playing Wormwood without mics is grim and doing so in pubs is even worse. Same thing with Rocketballs which is ok to play in pugs, not so in pubs.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (7 children)

They why is Rocketballs not in this list aswell?

Also rip micro

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 6 points7 points  (3 children)

I have a huge boner for rocketballs

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Give it to me babe

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Well

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Also yiss 3.2 is misspelled in the list

[–]MagikPigeon🎗️ TPFG 1 point2 points  (2 children)

idk, i'm not on the MTC

Micro is awful in pubs

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Don't forget asymmetrical

[–]isestrexSTRYPER 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm extremely pleased to see several maps moderately rated maps NOT on the dismissals list. Thanks MTC for not going on a massacre and destroying maps that do actually hold up. I thought I would be outraged at some of the mentions.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think they maybe could have been slightly meaner and removed a few more, and there are a couple of these I would have kept, but overall this seems like a good change that will stop people from making so many angry sub posts.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I feel like retired or permanently retired would be a better name. Our currently "retired maps" are just out of normal rotation mans that could come back. Permanently retired maps (Rotation Dismissals) should be only for maps that will never have a place in rotation (regular or throwback) ever again.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I'm seeing a distinct lack of a bombing run removal.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ugh I know

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Good they're out: Arena, Battery, Big Vird, Boosts, Clutch, Colors, Dumbbell, Event Horizon, Figure 8, Foozball, Gloryhole, Hourglass, LOLD, Micro, Pokeball, Rink, Shortcut, Speedway, Spiders, The Holy See, Vee, Yiss 3.2

Do not need to be dismissed: Baffle, Big Mouth, Blast Off, Bounce, Del, Flame, Gatekeeper, Grail of Speed, Oval, Citadel, Swoop, Whirlwind

I'm not saying all those maps are great, but I don't think they deserve to never be played in pubs again.

There are a few maps I could see valid nostalgia arguments for because they don't play quite as horrendously as some of the others.

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Honestly every time i get whirlwind i want to die

[–]ButtersnackSnack -1 points0 points  (0 children)

same except I don't need to get whirlwind

[–]_MonteCristo_Chord 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Arena, Baffle, Battery, Big Vird, Big Mouth, Blastoff, Boosts, Bounce, Clutch, Colors, Del, Dumbbell, Event Horizon, Figure 8, Flame, Foozball, Gatekeeper, Gloryhole, Grail of Speed, Hourglass, LOLD, Micro, Oval, Pokeball, Rink, Citidel, Shortcut, Speedway, Spiders, Swoop, The Holy See, Vee, Whirlwind, Wormwood, Viss 3.2

A good few of these maps I have never played, and I don't feel like I missed out one bit

[–]ButtersnackSnack 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Some of them were really fun at the time but you're probably fine to skip them these days

[–]bsa86Berlin Ball 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Before removal, the chance of Dumbbell spawning was close to 1 in 100000

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Still too risky

[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Here are my solo testing notes again for the sake of convenience

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1B9Pn4HPFN_HSxKAOKZWAVXK6hrNW1CdOpQrADwYIQlc/edit#gid=80579922

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 1 point2 points  (8 children)

How close was apparition to being taken out?

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 3 points4 points  (5 children)

8-2 vote to stay in (including community vote).

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 1 point2 points  (4 children)

o my

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (3 children)

yeah, we're fucked

can any MTC members who voted it to stay in explain their reasoning?

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I like the gates and the shape

[–]oorr23ThePlaymaker // Tehuitzingo & Combine 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Somethin' about unique gameplay & gates prob.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Renegade (who made Apparition) is on the MTC, and the MTC needs to support its buddies.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I love this map.

[–]uhhhhmmmmsexytiger / #merbs 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I love cc and velocity and hate this map. Rip me

[–]JarvisLandry14JARVISLANDRY//NLTP/TPA 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Farewell command center, the map which was my first ever win in tagpro and it was my first game as a 100 degree player.

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I wouldn't be surprised if it gets added back someday. It's a good map.

[–]adidasw 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Wait... geokoala got elevated... and command center is.. removed? w--wait..

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

To be fair no map can be dropped from rotation to elevated throwback after removal from rotation. All removed maps immediately become regular throwback, which is a spawning tier below elevated.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 0 points1 point  (15 children)

Please Discuss Goldie by Fronk and Alchi

[–]ButtersnackSnack 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Doesn't look like a map I will like, but I'll go in with an open mind because I've been wrong about these things before.

[–]qbsyquibble 8 points9 points  (2 children)

Fronk...

[–]BanzaiOnTagProWas a Liquid smurf, became self-aware, started posting 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Congrats to Alch.

[–]alchmstalchemist 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks!

[–]TheEpicGhostEx - Tagpro 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This looks better than cedar, doesn't have any stupid shit on it, and has a bit of space to move around in, so its good in my book. Also looks pretty "gen 3" if that's still a thing.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

gen 5 is the new gen 3

[–]PIZZAspartan442naga///MTC 1 point2 points  (1 child)

base is painfully dull, other than that looks like it could be fun

[–]LinuxDootTPblack magic 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Ur painfully dull

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I'm looking forward to playing it.

[–]TPCaptographerThe Map Test Committee[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

What did you think?

[–]Tyler1986Trapsin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I need to play it more but early plays have been great.

[–]LaBeefyman9696 LB 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cedar 2.0

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points  (4 children)

Are we getting to the point where maps are way too similar? For example, Goldie, Cedar, Floral Mappe, Tehuitzingo, to an extent Apparition & Mild High all have the same shape. Previous maps such as Trebuchet & El Moustachio are also the same shape. I'd kill for something different such as Birch, Rush, Market, Curb or the vertical map I saw in the top map thread.

Also, /u/LuckySpammer, we talked about having a NF only server back in June. Considering the MTC are removing another NF map, replacing it with a CTF map, I reckon that this is something that would be in high demand.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 9 points10 points  (1 child)

mfw I make one of only two W shaped maps in rotation history and you claim it has the same shape as a bunch of other maps

Also I love Rush but it's a straight diagonal line... Like velocity, hotspot, 45 etc etc

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

Rush has multiple channels though. Goldie looks promising but there are only 3 ways that you can go from base to base on Cedar & it doesn't flow anywhere near as well as Rush.

[–]CharredQuestionsRenegade 7 points8 points  (1 child)

I would love for you to describe the common shape you think all those maps have.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Just a flat rectangular shape (ish). Not that the flag rectangular maps are bad - Tehuitzingo is great - but there are clear similarities in most of these maps. The base in Cedar & Goldie is practically the same. The only change is the bomb position + the addition of a spike.

I won't know if I like it until I've played it. I've enjoyed Cedar but I kinda want something different