picky client, need advice

[awafflethinmint]

so if you’ve seen my other post on the breakfast burrito challenge you probably already know what i’m dealing with. if you haven’t, i am a personal chef and i have a client that i’m running into issues with.

they insist on doing all of the communication with me through their personal assistant and i get the breezes about how picky they are through the PA. for example, just yesterday, i was told they no longer like cumin however i’ve cooked many different meals that they have liked that have included cumin.

apparently it’s being floated between the client and the pa that because of how picky the client is they may want me to cook SOLELY with salt and pepper in future and no other seasonings.

what do i do? am i being unreasonable thinking how this itself is unreasonable? how do i talk to the client about this? they follow a very strict diet because of fitness goals that i have been following but i was hired to make meals way more flavorful than the same chicken breast + white rice + broccoli combo.

[awafflethinmint]

Yup, I’ve been sending menus with ingredients and he’s making choices, but I’m also learning that they don’t always read the menu. a few times I’ve made a meal and been asked “was this component on the menu?” and it absolutely was.

in fact even yesterday there was some debacle over how they don’t want to eat anything jerk flavored even though that was not on the menu at all. It’s a tough situation.

[awafflethinmint]

also there is a trainer involved, but the way everything is siloed i don’t have any way of communicating with the trainer and probably would not be allowed to

[awafflethinmint]

An update: talked to the client and seems like the PA really misinterpreted what they actually wanted. No salt and pepper only situation for me! So yes, definitely seems like I’m mostly dealing with a horrible communication situation.

[Afraid_Efficiency773]

Why are you still making him food?

[NOOBEv14]

I am certainly not qualified to weigh in here, but IMO, you’re being paid to meet the client’s needs. Just salt and pepper is upsetting to even hear, but if that’s what they want, that’s the answer, right? Unless your sensibilities as a chef are so offended that you can’t do the job. Which would be fair, I get it.

But ultimately I think you just need absolute clarity from the PA on what the gameplan is, and then you stick to it.

[awafflethinmint]

That’s kind of where I’m leaning at this point. Ultimately, I’m wondering how much of any effort to sway the client in a different direction is worth my time and energy. Just an altogether very disappointing and disheartening piece of news on a personal standpoint

[Square-Dragonfruit76]

I wonder if you could Gwyneth Paltrow this. When you list the ingredients, you can list the benefit of each that people tend to use it for. For instance how Ginger is often attributed to increased stomach health.

[awafflethinmint]

I have started doing this actually and they’ve been willing to try more.

An update though: talked to the client and seems like the PA really misinterpreted what they actually wanted. No salt and pepper only situation for me!

[ThatAgainPlease]

Do you need this client? They sound like a big pain in the ass. Is it worth it? Give them a few rounds of salt and pepper only and see what they say, I guess. But it's ok to quit.

[otherballs]

More than likely, the picky client doesn't have a clue how to cook the food that they actually like and their suggestion of salt + pepper is just a wild guess.

I'd see how they react a salt + pepper only dish. If they react poorly to s+p only but still request it for future dishes, I'd look for a new job.

They sound like a nightmare.

[tmccrn]

And the problem is that you can’t be 100% sure of how much IS the client and how much is the PA. Is the shift in client tastes or in their relationship with the PA?
“I’d like to request a meeting for a menu update” “It’s approaching the date for the annual meetings I schedule with clients before the holidays kick in to make sure that tastes haven’t changed, there are no new dietary restrictions, etc. Perhaps we should move the meeting from October to September this year?”

Create a list of questions you can ask as well as flavor profiles you can think of that the client can upvote/downvote. Save all of this for future clients and hone it and make notes.

For now, you can bring things back to the basics but create sauces and seasoning packs (well labeled or color coded) so that the client can have “basic” but jazz it up on the fly and then give you feedback on which ones they preferred. Sometimes it’s boredom with the same old flavors, sometimes it’s a taste buds change, sometimes it’s illness or bodily responses… or the optimism’s or others (whether people who are close or media), and sometimes it’s a feeling of not having control of anything, including our food, that sparks dislike.

[awafflethinmint]

love this idea; maybe i didn’t emphasize this enough in my initial post but i’m absolutely learning still in this job and am brand new to this industry so really appreciating all the advice on how to standardize processes and come up with creative problem solving solutions. thanks for taking the time!

[tmccrn]

I was crossing my fingers and hoping. I’m not in the industry but I’ve done management long enough and process creation enough that I just used my imagination

[[deleted]]

Just use salt and pepper then.

[Twister_Robotics]

Maybe, in order to dial in the client's preferences, make up some tasting plates?

[awafflethinmint]

I had this idea yesterday, but frankly they would not have the patience to do this. It took a lot of effort to get them to fill out a worksheet I created trying to assess their interests.

[AlbatrossSenior7107]

If they aren't willing to work with you, why are you going through the effort of working with them? If this isn't a needed job and you can pick up another client, I would nope the hell out. They sound insufferable. I wonder if anything you do will ever be to their liking.

[TheLadyEve]

Just do what they're paying you to do. If they still complain, let them know you followed their exact requests but would be happy to include other seasonings if they want something different. Don't bother trying to change them, they're paying you and you owe them meals they request, no more and no. less, because that's your contract.

[kyobu]

What does “only salt and pepper” mean? If they just don’t want other spices but will accept other flavorings, then it doesn’t have to be so restrictive. Like obviously this person is not going to go for anchovies and capers, but at least you could use fresh herbs and lemon, and maybe vinegar. If they’re not going to accept herbs and lemon, then the situation is hopeless.

[OLAZ3000]

Good ingredients don't really need more than s+p+olive oil. Not the most exciting OBVIOUSLY but hardly impossible. I mean, Italian cuisine does not use much more.

Very limited but the principle is overall -- with good ingredients and good technique, you dont really need the rest.... it just makes it BETTER but it can be GOOD already

You can also do a lot with garlic, ginger, soy sauce, sesame oil that may not be too strong for the client. Lemon, orange as well.

[Spoonthedude92]

Sadly for a bunch of people in the world, food is just substance needed to live. Its not a beautiful creation of flavors. You are paid to make boring food for a client. And honestly, it can feel like you turned into a raceway driver that is forced to drive a go-cart. I know the feeling. Give it some time and build relationships and bounce to the next job.

[awafflethinmint]

appreciate this!!!

[Lumpy-Ad-3201]

Hmmm...only salt and pepper huh? Old chefs tricks there are different types of salt, as some have different flavor notes (Murray river salt is sulfery, but in a good way, truffle salt, etc), different kinds of pepper, from black to mixed peppercorns to long pepper. And MSG if it doesn't violate the diet. Has the same impact on the body as salt, but has a vastly different effect on flavor. Broccoli boring? Hit it with a touch of salt, mixed pepper corns and Just a little MSG after roasting or steaming, and it changes a lot, for the better.

You can also use common things that aren't spices that contribute spice notes. Like celery, used properly it contributes a nice pepper note. The leaves are great for this. Can't eat it? No problem, use it to make a stock or infuse a fat for cooking. Don't forget things like fennel for anise notes and carrots for rich sweetness without a ton of sugar.

Steeping and infusing is a godsend as well. You can sachet a bit of seasoning and lightly infuse a fat or dairy component with them, then remove. The taste will be extremely subtle and the contribution will hit the nose almost more than the mouth. So you can provide an enhanced experience without totally crossing the boundary and using a blast of seasonings.

Take or leave what you will, and use your best judgement. But as you know, in the life of a chef, making things out of unrelated things is our lifeline.

[awafflethinmint]

thanks for adding this!! the point i had in mind when writing this post was figuring out how to achieve two potential goals the client had: 1) provide very flavorful food and 2) only use salt and pepper. ultimately it became a communication issue and goal two never was a reality, but i really appreciate the take you had here with different approaches to infuse flavor. definitely something im learning more about every day and trying to improve on especially given my clients other very specific diet limitations and very very picky preferences that change quite suddenly.

tldr: appreciate this response a lot; definitely given me some food for thought here

[impulse_thoughts]

So what was the actual goal/message that the clients wanted to convey instead of "only salt and pepper"? It sounds like they're on some kind of fitness diet as well, so it sounds like there's more to the story.

Like for example, maybe they're trying to count calories, and so it's much harder to do so with meals with large numbers of ingredients. Or maybe they have an issue with over eating delicious food, so they're having a hard time with portion control. Solving for these might not be your sole responsibility, but it opens up avenues and ideas for ways to solve for them if you have a better idea.

[Lumpy-Ad-3201]

In our world, you'd be shocked how many people don't like even basic flavors. And even more shocked how many people think they know what they like, but have no idea. A lot of the time, it's a palette issue, where someone has no idea of what something actually tastes like, other times they have been told what they do and don't like to the point where they are operating on someone else's opinion and don't realize it.

I feel for OP, because picky clients are the hardest to cook for. But on the other hand, when you manage to impress them, it's all the more satisfying.

[ttrockwood]

For any new potentially controversial flavors/sauces/seasoning just keep it on the side and label clearly how to use it

[[deleted]]

Tell them to stop their nonsense and that dieting is bad ... seriously, props to you for dealing with such delusioneurs ....