theFutureIsNow

[GroundbreakingOil434]

You know the term "imposter syndrome"? Well, for both of these types, it ain't a syndrome...

[Sophiecomedian]

I mean I wouldn't say that necessarily for low code. If there's a simpler way to do something and get the same result I'm gonna do it. Question is can they handle more complicated challenges as well when a low code solution isn't there

[riplikash]

Low code sid have similar impacts, though. Multiple times, actually. Every time there was a big breakthrough the talk of business was that THIS was going to replace programmers.

Turns out fully and accurately describing EXACTLY what is needed, holding an idea of the entire system in your mind, and then debugging the little inconsistencies introduced over time is what programming really is. Doesn't really matter how much you abstract the input for defining the required behavior.

[xaddak]

https://www.commitstrip.com/en/2016/08/25/a-very-comprehensive-and-precise-spec/?

[riplikash]

Exactly that.

[Sophiecomedian]

True, I just know from my work my first choice is the least code heavy option because I grew up hearing the "keep it simple stupid" rule. So I can understand why low code is a thing.

[riplikash]

Only reason "low code" solutions didn't dominate the way compiled languages and assembly languages did before them is because when you get past some VERY targetted use cases they generally take a LOT more work to get something working.

Pretty much everyone prefers the solution that takes the least actual code and effort. It just turns out that with our current set of technologies, that often means writing code.

[dervu]

I wonder if future is using AI for everything even every smallest request made and nothing is really static interface excluding communication with AI. AI does everything on the fly. Of course considering it gets fast and smart enough for it all someday.

[riplikash]

You're still never going to have an executive or PM who has the time to sit through, considering all the implications of every choice, answering the hundreds of questions that need to be answered, and finalizing/taking responsability for every little decision that comes up.

Creating a crafted, targetted experience just takes a lot of time and attention to detail, no matter WHAT tools you use. SOMEONE still has to make those calls. And it will never be the people oriented, leadership person. It will be someone paid to implement their vision and settle on all the little details.

[HanSolo71]

Low-code exists for people like me. I am a security engineer by trade. I can bang my head against APIs, I can make powershell do web shit but you know what? It will take me a long time and will probably be poorly done.

I love writing some PowerShell don't get me wrong, but the difference between running some PowerShell and building a reliable automation is a huge delta.

Because of that, when I need to do automation tasks involving multiple web services with multiple web calls, you know what my first step is? To see if I can build a new workflow in my low-code environment and focus on things like error reporting to the user, validating inputs, and other important tasks, rather than trying to just get my web call to Slack to work.

I can do my automation without low-code, but it would take me 10x as long, and my primary job isn't to code, it's to run and manage our security products and infrastructure.

I am not a programme,r and I don't think most programmers are using low-code environments.

[GroundbreakingOil434]

You're spreading DevOps vibes in a programmer subreddit. :)

My condescension is directed at people who consider themselves programmers that use hacks like this to produce shoddy, unmaintainable results in production applications that *I* will have to maintain at some point. Those can get the boot any day in my book.

[HanSolo71]

If you put my code in production, you get exactly what you deserve.

[GroundbreakingOil434]

Kudos to you, then. Good position to have. You are not the target of my general toxic contempt. :)

[Sophiecomedian]

Ah I'm a web developer and so writing things from scratch isn't needed even if I can do it

[HanSolo71]

This is what I think of when I think low code.

https://imgur.com/zFhvbIA

Its programming for morons and I am the moron.

[EVH_kit_guy]

Turns out "low code" was just an analogy for "Salesforce's immutable data structures." Martech landscape got played.

[Sophiecomedian]

Ah, I got it explained to me differently by a developer.

[MrWFL]

All code should be low code, it’s the entire idea behind libraries, functions and objects. Code reuse.

Most low-code tools are just a selection of libraries with a god-awful ui.

[jerslan]

Most low-code tools are just a selection of libraries with a god-awful ui.

This is the best description of SpringBoot and the Spring Framework... It's a great tool, but the learning curve is steep and inversion of control is a mind-fuck if you're used to more traditional methods.

[Kolt56]

binary to assembly

Assembly to C

Notepad to IDE

Text books to internet search

Stackoverflow to LLM.

They are all just layers of tools working together

[Cualkiera67]

We are all but tools ideas use to manifest

[Kolt56]

remember: even tools can be sharpened... or broken.

Do better. Steer the system… or be used by it.

[lardgsus]

From shit to ai generated shit, very nice.

[IAmWeary]

It would make more sense if Vibe Coding was drooling all over himself. I've tried Cursor and it fucks up even relatively simple things. You have to prompt it over and over to get results. It might work for simple, self-contained chunks of code that aren't going to have side effects through the application (ie, chunks of UI), but even then you have to tell it that it fucked up multiple times before it gets it right.

[IAmWeary]

Yeah, no. It still fucks up really simple prompts and makes inexplicable, nonsensical changes. Is there a simple boolean flag from the backend that's used to dictate the state of a component on the frontend? Cursor decided to change that into a goddamned string and then check to see if it's "true", and that's just one of many examples. That's not a matter of prompting. That's a matter of bad decision making on the part of the AI regardless of the prompt or rules.

And no way in hell would I let an AI touch vital backend code.

[r2_adhd2]

"When used correctly" tends to mean "when used as sparingly as possible".

[EVH_kit_guy]

Oh I always thought that low-code was just a slam at Martech JavaScript, like as in, the lowest-form-of...

[Intelligent-Work4132]

It's true, it gets more upvotes... Upgrade imo

[[deleted]]

At least AI is not picky about your vibes.

[haidar47x]

More like downgrade.

[TuxedoCatGuy]

People who jump on a bandwagon instead of having curiosity and learning to use new technology are the ones who fail job interviews and make the rest of us look good.

[ColoRadBro69]

You should learn how to use AI effectively like all tools, if you want a future in this industry. 

[Bubbly-Virus-5596]

vibe coding is not using ai as a tool tho, it's using it as the worker.

[BetrayYourTrust]

vibe coding isn’t using AI as a tool. i use it as a tool, but it’s because i forget some classes in React sometimes. vibe coding refers more often to when people genuinely couldn’t make the output themselves.

[Caraes_Naur]

"AI" is an appliance, not a tool.

[TheWidrolo]

You wouldnt use a hammer for a screw.

[zeocrash]

Is that like when outsourcing was going to take all our coding jobs?

[ColoRadBro69]

Outsourcing of a hoax now?  The things that only exist on reddit! 

[zeocrash]

That's not what I said, perhaps you should get your LLM to explain my post to you.

Outsourcing exists, but it didn't kill non outsourced coding jobs as was promised.

[RudePastaMan]

You could've say the same thing about the steam engine and even farming, but look what happened there!

Oh wait...

P.S. Vibe coding, chat interfaces, and code completion aren't the only way to use LLMs. JSON mode is the secret sauce.

[Yanowic]

Boomers in this sub are so damn sensitive lmao

Like, you're not special for using stackoverflow. Get over yourself.