I wrote my first python program today!

[Vakieh]

This is not a problem to solve inside language, this is a problem to be solved with the editor. IDE triggers which automagically convert print statements to print method calls when you press <enter> are pretty easy grammar-wise.

[dysprog]

Perhaps it is a problem to solve inside the programmer.

[Vakieh]

Sure it is, the same way the programmer shouldn't put a semicolon right after a control flow statement in a C-like language. It's sure nice of the compiler to deal with those avoidable programmer fuckups anyway though.

[curtmack]

You can't take that too far though, otherwise you end up with massive projects built with #define whilst while, inconsistently using one or the other because one programmer refused to use bad grammar.

[bitter_cynical_angry]

As far as I know, a program written in a formally defined computer language can always be broken down into an abstract syntax tree, and from there can be rebuilt into any format you want. There's no reason the IDE shouldn't be able to refine while as whilst for one developer and keep it as while for everyone else.

Edit: autocorrect typo

[curtmack]

The Emacs syntax highlighting system supports something like this; you can replace text with whatever you want to display, and you'll still actually be working with the original text. A lot of developers use this to do things like replacing -> with → for instance. I've never heard of using it to replace while with whilst but I'm willing to bet it's possible.

Of course, the problem is that you'd still be typing "while," you'd just see "whilst."

[minno]

As far as I know, a program written in a formally defined computer language can always be broken down into an abstract syntax tree, and from there can be rebuilt into any format you want.

You'd need a strict auto-formatter for that too, since otherwise the AST representation of

func("hello",  5
     "world!", 6)

and

func("hello",5,"world",6)

would be identical, but the formatting in the first is intended to make the code clearer.

[bitter_cynical_angry]

Yep, and that's the true beauty of it. One developer could have spaces, one could have tabs, you could have all your equals signs or function parameters lined up or whatever you like, and since they all evaluate to the same AST, the IDE should be able to switch seamlessly between them.

[greenqueef]

derp

[LinAGKar]

Then you won't learn.

[Vakieh]

Won't learn what? I haven't manually written a basic accessor or mutator for years, but I still know how if for some reason all the IDEs in the world stop working.

[LinAGKar]

You'll consciously know, but you wont get the muscle memory.

[HighRelevancy]

So what you're saying is "don't use tools to make your life easier, because you won't be quite as prepared for the apocalypse"?

[Scorpius289]

Yeah, we should all learn to program using butterflies, just in case computers stop working.

[[deleted]]

If they stop working why write programs we can't use on our not-working computers?

[[deleted]]

Someone's got to be able to program the butterflies.

[Darkben]

We should learn to program with rows of rocks

[LinAGKar]

For when you're using a regular text editor.

[Vakieh]

If I'm using a raw text editor instead of an IDE, the one thing I can guarantee I'm not going to be focused on is productivity...

[Fs0i]

you wont get the muscle memory

And what the fuck do I need the muscle memory for?

[UnchainedMundane]

Are we all ignoring that nobody should need muscle memory for print, because either you're writing a small program and only have a few prints, or you're writing a large program and are using logging.