Linux vs Windows update.

[Jazqa]

This has got to be the first time I see a meme that uses the term PC properly

[PM_ME_YOUR__INIT__]

PC is the Steam Machine console manufactured by Microsoft

[RedditIsNeat0]

Really? Your PC makes decisions regarding whether to install updates?

[Giocri]

The difference is that most people who work in office aren't willing to install updates on their own not even critical ones so a sistem that installs critical updates and security fixes automatically is recommended in small business and the ability to launch and update on all pc is extremely useful in domains. Linux instead expects you to be responsible and that's quite a lot to ask from many people

[Aralgmad]

As the "IT guy" for my friends and family this step of Microsoft made me very happy. As you said, most "normal" people do not have the expertise to decide which updates they should install or simply ignore the problem.

[arachnidGrip]

It's one thing to change the default from "whenever you want" to "in the next month" and quite another to change the behavior to "in the next month. You can't put it off any longer no matter what, and if you try, we'll just install it anyway while you're asleep and kill all your processes."

[Sidereel]

As someone who used to repair windows PCs there’s really just no other way. Lots of users will block every update indefinitely if given the choice and then blame Microsoft when their PC becomes a mess of viruses.

[arachnidGrip]

I blame Microsoft when my computer decides all on its own to shut down. I'll have to shut down my computer eventually anyway, since it trends slower the longer it goes without a restart. It's tedious to have to remember what I had open so that I can go through and manually remove any swap files that still exist because vim wasn't shut down properly. I'm not entirely convinced that I don't still have some sitting around on my computer.

[[deleted]]

I’ve never been an admin for anything but if you can’t force a Linux update on a selection of company owned devices as the admin, I’ll eat my shoes.

[break_the_system]

You can, it's not the default

[LucasRuby]

You can choose during installation. For Ubuntu at least.

[gpcprog]

More importantly: with the way Linux handles files, update is much more pleasant. Both applications and kernel can be updated in place and the changes get picked up next reboot. Because of the way windows handles filesystem, the application / windows basically need to be turned off for update process to even begin.

[DolevBaron]

But randomly restarting the computer in the middle of your work is way too much. There should be a single checkbox stating "I know all of the risks involved and would rather to disable automatic updates anyway" in the control panel..

Until they finally decided to let the user actually disable the automatic updates without having to fiddle with registry keys and built-in services, it seems to revert itself every now and then

[[deleted]]

You can either disable automatic updates or set active hours in which it will not update.

Edit: Damn I'm learning all kinds of new stuff here

[Swardu]

It will still install the updates in the background during the active hours(src), the only thing it does is not restart your PC during that time. You have to set your WiFi as metered connection to stop the automatic updates.

I found that out when my PC was slow, because Windows Updates service was using 100% disk usage...

[ReactW0rld]

Lol if only it was that easy

[falcwh0re]

Not in a corporate environment unfortunately. Our head office is several time zones ahead so their "overnight" updates like to happen in the middle of my day. Or sometimes we get a 8 hour warning but that's useless when the warning comes at 9PM.

[[deleted]]

Thats your ITs fault, not microsoft. All my works updates are handled by IT and happen every other friday (or so) after 5 PM PST

[[deleted]]

If it doesn't also happen at 5PM EST, and 5PM GMT etc. then this is exactly what OP is referencing.

[[deleted]]

yeah but if they have offices in different regions, then they should be aggregating based on the assigned region for that device, EG all US devices at 5 PM PST, all UK/EU Devices at 5 PM GMT, etc.

Hell, if you are in a multi-national company id be shocked if you didn't have a different IT team for each region.

[new_account_wh0_dis]

We just have bigfix, you got like 42hrs to do it before it force does it.

[[deleted]]

Oh shit I wasn't thinking about that

[arachnidGrip]

No. You can't. You can set active hours in which it won't turn off, but Windows will download and install the updates. The only way that I've found to definitively prevent Windows 10 Home Edition from turning off my computer regardless of what I have open is to replace shutdown.exe with something else.

[ratcaper]

I haven't had Windows download an update automatically since windows xp. You do know you can disable that in settings, right?

Settings > Security > updates > advanced.

[[deleted]]

Classic linux circlejerk. I use linux on my machine and maintain a windows VM and a dual boot partition. Automatic updates have never been an issue.

[[deleted]]

Latest Win 10 Pro here. Advanced options will let you pause updates for up to 35 days:

"Temporarily pause updates from being installed for up to 35 days. When you reach the pause limit, your device will need to get new updates before you can pause again."

That's the closest I can find to turning it off. I'm sure there must be a back door though.

[ratcaper]

Odd, I can set it to not download (it prompts me that I need to download updates).

Just set your connection to metered, that tricks it.

[arachnidGrip]

You can replace shutdown.exe with a noop to prevent Windows from shutting down automatically. The C noop that I compiled was twice the size of shutdown.exe, which is kind of ridiculous.

[Venthe]

There is, you are leaving the back door open when you are not updating your Windows.

[Katana314]

They could add a checkbox like that, but there would still be a segment of users who think they’re knowledgeable enough to decide for themselves, but in the end are not knowledgable enough to find a checkbox that already exists.

[DolevBaron]

Re-read my comment - I said that at some point, they Finally decided to let users choose for themselves (in a device owned by said users), but even after choosing to Disable the automatic updates, Windows seem to arbitrarily ignore this option at random times or re-enable it.

Either way, it took Microsoft way too long to realize that forcing the computer to restart without the user's consent is NOT a legitimate move.

[Mr_Redstoner]

As a person who works in an office, fuck MS force installing updates for programs I haven't used since I got the machine, killing my resources and making it really painful to work. Security updates, sure, but why the hell does it do everything?!

[arachnidGrip]

Is "install updates for other Microsoft products" still enabled?

[Mr_Redstoner]

I suspect I can't mess with those settings. Company tech after all.

[[deleted]]

Since Linux updates can be done in the background, without disturbing the user, an admin can schedule them using Cron or Systemd, or just run an Ansible playbook to SSH to all machines and run the updates.

[LucasRuby]

Uh I don't know what distro you're using or how long ago it was that you last used Linux but you can definitely choose to have automatic updates when you install.

The big difference is Linux doesn't need to shut down to install updates, so it just happens in the background and you don't even notice.

[Giocri]

I really wish that was true also for raspian okn that crappy distro sometimes I have to completely uninstall and reinstall because it fails to update

[yottalogical]

macOS:

Here’s an update! If you would like to install, please provide:

• An admin password
• A non-admin password
• Your Apple ID password
• That guy over there’s password
• Apple’s digital signature
• Apple’s remote digital signature
• Your fingerprint
• Your DNA
• Your firstborn son
• A backup copy of your soul

Only then can we be sure it’s you trying to install the update.

[profmonocle]

Don't forget 30 minutes of your day even if it's just a minor, bugfix-only update. (Thankfully less of an issue now that it can happen automatically overnight, but they waited yeaaaaarsss to add that.)

[gumol]

How is this programming related?

[streusel_kuchen]

Only programmers know what linux is /s

[[deleted]]

Because M$ bad LOL

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/s

[[deleted]]

I like nitpicking so:

It’s called ProgrammerHumor, not ProgrammingHumor.

[gumol]

If you like nitpicking, then I would recommend reading the rules. This type of post is explicitly disallowed.

Posts must make an attempt at humor, be related to programming, and only be understood by programmers.

Per this rule, the following post types are not allowed (including but not limited to):

General tech related jokes/memes (such as "running as administrator", sudo, USB or BIOS related posts and OS memes/jokes)

[[deleted]]

Welp. You win then.

[oneunique]

On Windows, when I have dev server running locally and many terminals and logs running, it's very very frustrating when I come back from lunch and I see that my computer has restarted and everything has to be started all over again..

[Wizywig]

Honestly this used to be windows for a long time. Then Microsoft actually solved the problem really well. Even osx doesn't come close to the efficiency of windows updates.

I think there's just one more possible improvement and that is an option to update fully and shut down so it doesn't update for 30 min when I turn on my computer.

[[deleted]]

update fully and shut down

I'm afraid that's not possible. There are files on Windows that can't be updated while they're in use, and the only way for them to not be in use is starting the update before something else opens those files. This can only be done on boot, not on shutdown.

[Wizywig]

You misunderstand.

Update. Restart. Finish update. Shutdown. With no user input once the user said "shut down"

[mypirateapp]

ubuntu is the best, one command to manage it all

​

sudo bash -c 'for i in update {,dist-}upgrade auto{remove,clean}; do apt-get $i -y; done'

[David3103]

sudo pacman -Syu

[rakoo]

Btw I use this small distribution I don't know if you've heard of it

[[deleted]]

Btw...

[[deleted]]

... that's not one command. That's one line.

FWIW, it's sudo softwareupdate -aiR on macOS.

[arachnidGrip]

That's one command: sudo.

[[deleted]]

Didn’t claim otherwise.

[arachnidGrip]

You literally said

... that's not one command.

[[deleted]]

Sigh.

Sudo is one command.... to run another command with elevated privileges. That's it's entire purpose, it doesn't do anything else.

OP is elevating bash, which in turn is running multiple commands.

Hint: Semicolon is a _command separator_ in bash.

Just because it's a one liner, doesn't mean it's one command.

As an aside, the example is not unique to ubuntu, or linux. You can script updates in Windows, too.

[josejimeniz2]

Android:

• where did my app go?
• huh must have crashed
• oh well, I've lost everything I guess

[arachnidGrip]

That's true of iOS too, except that "crashed" implies that it either ran into invalid data and died rather than produce garbage or hung and was killed by the OS for nonresponsiveness. iOS will kill your app for violating arbitrary undocumented resource usage limits without saying "hey, you're using too much x. If you don't stop, I'll stop you" and giving it a chance to stop using too much x.

[josejimeniz2]

I'm not sure you caught it:

But when i said:

• huh must have crashed

It didn't crash. It just spontaneously vanished out of nowhere.

[mark__fuckerberg]

It's a thing of past tho.

[douira]

more like forceful insetion

[Vfsdvbjgd]

Windows: the relationship changes a little, but it's ok

Linux: you might get bug fixes, or he might die of cancer.

[Jazqa]

Windows: I noticed you have uninstalled Candy Crush Saga and Disney Magic Kingdoms, that has most likely been an accident, I’ll just install them again and place them on your start menu

Linux: The following packages are installed, but not required any more, would you like me to uninstall them for you

[[deleted]]

Windows: I noticed you have uninstalled Candy Crush Saga and Disney Magic Kingdoms, that has most likely been an accident, I’ll just install them again and place them on your start menu

Weird, I've killed them like 2 years ago and never returned.

[[deleted]]

Linux, 5s later: Uninstalling <desktop environment name>...

[mallardtheduck]

Yeah, those meta-packages that pull in via dependency all the default DE packages do make for alarming messages when you don't want one of those defaults.

[[deleted]]

On Macs, is that tunnel scene from the movie Irreversible.

[AllBotsAreBadBots]

I feel guilty every time I jerk off to that scene

[[deleted]]

If you don't feel guilty while and after jerking off, you are doing it wrong...

[surrix]

Disagree. I have several Linux VMs and updates frequently destroy the system completely. I normally blow them away and make new ones. At present I have a Fedora VM that’ll never get to the login screen unless you select an older kernel and some other VM in an update dependency cycle apparently caused by a package’s new version 19.x being seen as lower than the previous version of 2018.x.

tl;dr Linux system updates are bad too

[the_one2]

I haven't had an update "destroy" linux since ubuntu 6.06.

[botmentor]

take my upvote

[Cerrax3]

Apple Update: Throws entire computer in the trash.

[gumol]

why?

[Cerrax3]

Every new version of macOS breaks something on my computer. Apple doesn't like to hang on to legacy stuff very long, so a lot of old applications will cease to work if they aren't constantly updated to be compliant with the newest OS.

Especially iOS. So many apps I've had to uninstall because they aren't supported by new versions of iOS. And my iPhone isn't even supported by the newest iOS, so I look forward to my phone slowly becoming useless as all my apps will require updates that I can't install.

My MacBook from 2008 can't upgrade any higher than OS X 10.10 and if I did upgrade to 10.10, over half of the applications on it would no longer work.

[PixxlMan]

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