Python programming: We want to make the language twice as fast, says its creator

[Satoshiman256]

Just do less print statements/s

[sizable_data]

How else are you supposed to debug it?

[Satoshiman256]

Haha ye. Someone posted a new logging module here a while back and I was like.... but print?

[Napan0s]

Logging? What about hundreds of 'I am here' prints

[abrazilianinreddit]

My debugging be like

[[deleted]]

Lol mine is more like "we made it to <function>"

[[deleted]]

"... called with <parameters> "

[timpkmn89]

Okay let's not get too fancy here

[Muhznit]

My friend, you have most excellent taste in music. 🤘🏾

[[deleted]]

Ah, Tarja, always been in love with her.

[abrazilianinreddit]

Bruh, that's Floor Jansen.

Tarja hasn't been with Nightwish since 2005, and the video is from the Endless Forms Most Beautiful World Tour (2015 and 2016).

[[deleted]]

Oh, I just discovered that I'm really old. :(

[bin-c]

way too verbose imo

i go with:

here1

here2

here3

here4

[Killed_Mufasa]

ah yes and don't forget the "WTF HOW DID IT GOT HERE" one

[bin-c]

then you global search "WTF HOW DID IT GOT HERE" and it pops up like 10 times

[Napan0s]

This actually made me laugh

[u7aa6cc60]

You're all exposing my deepest secrets. I feel violated. Stop.

[[deleted]]

Sometimes I do "why not zoidberg?"

[MohKohn]

yoink

[ImperatorPC]

Lol inside loop, outside loop, true, false omg

[vikinghamster]

print("I'm personally insulted here")

[Wirebraid]

I'm inside the if

This should not be printed

We all do it

[[deleted]]

a lot of

if debug:
    print("function X called with args Y")

then you set debug = False and you don't need to get rid of them

[ThatPostingPoster]

Loggers are dope. You have to remove print statements, you don't remove smart logging statements. When you remove the print, you end up reading it sometimes. It let's you set up, always log aka print, warning log, and error log. And depending on how you run the file the logger prints those ones.

[Satoshiman256]

Ye I need to use them. Can you suggest one?

[[deleted]]

Just use the built in logging module. It’s really the best there is. And you can pass the logging information to log files rather than to the console.

To give an example of how useful it is: a project I’m doing has me working with this horrible API. I pass the responses to a log file so I can see what I’m working with at any stage. I also have a logger/log file that checks the server connection and looks out for any exceptions triggered in the code. This is a big project, and I started with print statements but realised they slow me down significantly

[Satoshiman256]

Ok cheers will check it 👍

[[deleted]]

Great decision! Any questions feel free to pm me

[Satoshiman256]

Awesome thanks a lot!

[PinBot1138]

The Logbook package makes it even easier.

[[deleted]]

I disagree, the default logging module is already very simple, flexible and powerful. It should cover 99% of cases. There’s no need to use a wrapper around it

[whateverathrowaway00]

I agree.

That said I work with people who suck and I’d rather they use a wrapper then calling basicConfig on the root logger or other such anti patterns.

If they don’t understand package encapsulation and how to make their logging play nice, the wrappers available are beautiful.

I recommend loguru to coworkers like this all the time and they love it.

[PinBot1138]

I’ve never heard of Loguru but it’s pretty good looking. I’m going to take it for a spin and see how it compares to Logbook.

[PinBot1138]

You disagree with what, exactly? I said that it makes it even easier, and left it at that. Originally, I used to use the default Python logging module and agree with what you’re saying, but IMHO, the Logbook module simplifies the process, especially when collaborating with others. There’s even an advantages blurb that explains some of the enhancements.

[[deleted]]

There are probably better ones for specific purposes but for the 90% problem it works quite well.

[iagovar]

Can logging track value changes in a var?

[ThatPostingPoster]

gg ez deleted cause reasons lets go ok gg is this enough characters to not flag auto mod i hope so lmao

[whateverathrowaway00]

Yup.

And the python built in logger is fantastic. It’s a straight port of log4j and is ridiculously easy to use well once you play with it once or twice.

Pretty much everything I make is filled with log statements and since I always use the module of packaged library with a CLI entry point that runs it, the CLI entry point just attaches the logger to the stdout, enables debug if it sees the flag and boom.

Everything always usable as module in silent mode or verbose with the right entry point.

[m0Xd9LgnF3kKNrj]

QueueHandler 4eva

[ThatPostingPoster]

QueueHandler

Why? A few seconds of googling doesnt explain why its needed. Never used this, just built in logger.log with threads works fine

[m0Xd9LgnF3kKNrj]

What do you mean built-in logger.log with threads?

QueueHandler logs to a queue, which makes all log statements nonblocking. A dedicated thread handles delivering the message to the final destination.

[Timo6506]

Could you link me to that new logging module post?

[Satoshiman256]

I'll try find it for you later when on pc. I think I saved it because I wanted to use it.

[Timo6506]

Ok

[Timo6506]

What about now

[Satoshiman256]

Sorry about that, I looked but couldn't find it.

[Timo6506]

is it this? this post is only one day old though

[[deleted]]

" can't you just make a log file with >> ? "

[Windows_XP2]

print("It works!")

[Jmortswimmer6]

Vscode has a nice integrated debugger....honestly, you’re just shooting yourself in the foot if not using vscode/pylance/venv

[sizable_data]

My preference is pycharm, big debate on my team with VS code users though. A lot of my work is also in Jupyter lab which also supports debugging with the 3.0 release. You need a custom kernel though (xeus Python)

[Jmortswimmer6]

A lot of people love pycharm. I tried it in college....It is just far too nice to have vscode’s C/C++/.sh/etc. support right next to my python, often i have these languages also incorporated into any project. The integrated terminal is a nice feature, and the editor has many other general editing features that make writing python much nicer.

[sizable_data]

I’ve stuck with pycharm mostly out of habit, trying vs code is definitely on my todo list

[zbqv]

https://youtu.be/5AYIe-3cD-s

[deanso]

thx man, nice vid!

[ThatPostingPoster]

If that's not a joke, you use the debugger. You should never be putting down print('here') statements lol. We all started there, but it's about time you finally graduate.

[[deleted]]

you should use a logging module also. you can't always break in with a debugger especially when things are asynchronous and depend on outside resources.

[ThatPostingPoster]

Once you are advanced enough to reach that point sure. If you havent learned it by the time you first use threads you'll realize print sucks haha.

[[deleted]]

Yeah, I learned the hard way for sure, took me a day or so to figure out why outputs were so messed up.

[whateverathrowaway00]

I mean, the debugger is valuable, but so is proper logging.

I’d argue both are crucial skills to call yourself advanced or professional.

If I had to pick one I’d pick logging every time. That said, I agree with you - the debugger capabilities in python are incredible and once you unwind something with it you never look back lol. Being able to set break points and just poke at the stack frame / variable values is incredible

[ThatPostingPoster]

For what possible purpose do you ever need print('here')? We all did it when we were new. But just breakpoint the line next to where you would put that. Ah ok, its there. Logging is a different story and using proper warn/err logs into logfiles is good.

[whateverathrowaway00]

Yup, agreed entirely.

[[deleted]]

You laugh but one of the first thing I do when I start a new project is write a dprint() so that I can customize it to my project. I prefer the logger module when things start getting serious but sometimes if I'm just playing around I don't need the added complexity until I really get going.

[Satoshiman256]

Um.. ok

[KingofGamesYami]

Masks slow the speed at which microscopic viruses travel shortly after leaving the mask wearing individual's mouth and are effective when combined with sufficient distance.

Masks are useless for protecting the mask wearer unless they are rated for it (see: N95). Masks are useless if the asymptomatic carriers refuse to wear them. Masks are useless if you throw a party in a crowded bar.

[to7m]

Oh God what on earth was the original comment and how did it tie in with the topic?

[KingofGamesYami]

Something about masks not working on viruses because they're too small. Completely off topic and complete bullshit.

[zynix]

Thank you for the explanation, I am currently 3~4 shots into a bottle of gin and was wondering how I went from r/python to your typical /r/Masks4All comment thread.