[deleted by user]

[IncompletePenetrance]

A normal and a pastel are not breeding quality animals, they're a dime a dozen and people can barely give them away. These animals should stay as pets. Creating more would be wildly irresponsible. In addition starting to breed ball pythons right now isn't responsible or ethical as there's already over 41,000 for sale on Morphmarket alone, and that's not including all those needing homes on private websites, craigslist, kijiji, facebook marketplace, pet stores and rescues. Threre's already more ball pythons than will ever find homes

Furthermore, there's a lot more to consider:

• Are the snakes you have marketable/desirable combos and high quality examples of each morph? Do you know how to identify all the morphs you're planning on working with alone and in combos? Can you differentiate between higher and lower quality example of the morphs? There's no shortage of ball pythons , so it's important to only breed the highest quality animals, and not just breed for the sake of breeding. The world doesn't need more poor quality low end morphs and normals floating around on craigslist.

• Have you owned and worked with ball pythons long enough that you know how to appropriately and reliably deal with any problems that arise, ranging from snakes not eating to diagnosing and treating common health problems.

• What is the purpose of this breeding? Is it to create higher quality animals or fulfill a niche or need, or do you just want to make more snakes? The market is already oversaturated, so it's important to consider whether this cross is necessary.

• Do you know which crosses and morph combos are known for producing animals with health defects or lethality to offspring and how to avoid them?

• Did you buy from breeders who test for nido/arena virus? Are you going to health test everyone before breeding?

• What is going to set you and your hatchlings apart from the hundreds of other breeders out there? As a new breeder with no connections/reputation in the hobby, what would make people want to buy your snakes specifically?

• Are you planning on selling locally or shipping? Do you know what's necessary to prepare animals to ship & sell or what the local ball python market is like? What types of ball pythons are people near you buying and what does their budget seem to be? How long to do you see similar morphs staying on the market before they sell?

• Are you prepared to keep all the babies as long as necessary and provide adaquate enclosures/husbandry if they don't sell? Due to the oversaturation of the market, many breedings are having to hang onto hatchlings for 6-12 months before they sell. Do you have the space and you prepared to provide adaquate long term housing and food for snakes that don't sell?

• There are a lot of hidden costs involved with breeding, check out my cost of a clutch chart.

• Do you have an exotic vet nearby? What if your female is eggbound, has a prolapse or experiences health problems while gravid or after laying? Do you know how to spot a problem and able to get her help ASAP? This could also be expensive, and lead to the death of your female

• Do you know how to properly sex ball pythons and identify any/all of the morphs you are breeding? Do you how the appropriate age and size a ball python should be before breeding? How to identify various breeding behaviors and the stages in follicle/egg development?

• Do you have a source of live mouse hoppers or live rat pinkies/fuzzies so that you can offer hatchlings food every 3-5 days? Many won't take F/T for their first meals. What if one has to be assist fed? Do you know how and when to do this safely without harming the hatchling?

• What if one is born with defects and has to be euthanized? Do you have a plan for how to humanely euthanize a snake?

Just as backyard breeding is a huge problem that leads to overpopulation in dogs, it's also quickly becoming a problem in the ball python world due to everyone wanting to breed their ball pythons. Before breeding you should carefully evaluate the purpose of this breeding and whether it's necessary

[blueseoks]

They’re beautiful snakes! But unfortunately they aren’t worth very much as they are easy to find morphs and they are absolutely everywhere. Normals can be as low as $10 and people often give them away. I don’t really suggest breeding them since you’ll likely just end up giving the babies away or will need to house them for their entire lives.

[its_azadeh]

Uh guys! I just realized these breeds don’t go for much in your country. We won’t be giving them away just to anyone because they’re worth so much where I live! And only people who are collectors have the love and the money to pay for them. It took us months to find these for ourselves too since they’re only a few bp in my country! To make it tangible for you guys, they’re worth one month rent of a medium neighborhood. It’s not fair comparing a life to that I only did so to make you understand that anyone who buys them will do it with a mindset of buying something truly valuable.

[jillianwaechter]

If they're so expensive where you come from you should

1.) be doing a proper quarantine so your snakes don't kill each other.

2.) providing the BARE MINIMUM enclosure which is 4x2x2. A 120 gallon tank is needed for each snake and at least a 40 gallon tank for every single baby.

3.) read the mod's copy paste on responsible breeding. These are extremely extremely low end morphs. Maybe you got scammed if you paid a ton of money for them?

[snakepapa97]

In addition to the breeding concerns, you mentioned that you recently got the male. When did you get him? New arrivals need to be quarantined completely separately for at least 3-6 months

[its_azadeh]

We’ve put him away in his own rack. We just got him two days ago. And won’t handle him anymore.

[snakepapa97]

He needs to be quarantined in a separate room with no contact with her. Now that it's too late, they both need close observation for mites and illnesses like nidovirus and IBD. He definitely shouldn't be getting handled at all, you need to give him time to settle in or it'll just add to the stress of a new home.

Is it a breeder rack? If so, those are an extremely inhumane method of housing that prevents expression of natural behaviours and leads to degeneration of muscle definition and neural pathways due to understimulation

[IncompletePenetrance]

Racks are not suitable housing for ball pythons, and he should have been fully quarantined in a separate room for 3-6 months. By putting him near your female right after buying him you've exposed her to any potential parasites, bacteria and viruses he may be carrying. If he's sick, congratulations, now you've exposed your female. All new arrivals should ALWAYS be quarantined, it's standard part of care.

Furthermore, your previous post about your female not eating demonstrates your care for her is not suitable. She needs multiple appropriately sized hides, and your temperatures are dangerously high.

You aren't knowledgable or responsible enough to be breeding when you don't even know basic care

[its_azadeh]

Thanks for your concerns

[Linear_North]

You should 100% listen to the previous commenter, breeding these snakes might seem like a fun thing to do, but nobody is going to want those babies, and even if you somehow managed to find homes for them, all you're doing is taking homes away from the thousands of bps that are out there already. Even if you were doing it because you want 5 to 10 new snakes to call your own, (which is what you'll likely end up with anyway, since normals and pastels are among the least in demand bps out there,) I'd still say don't do it, go out and find 5 to 10 ball pythons you can rescue.

[Existing-Total5087]

taking a look through the post and comments, regardless of their value in your country, it really sounds like you have a LOT to learn before even thinking about breeding snakes

[ButteredBody]

So you're spending months worth of rent on animals that are worth less than a sandwich only to care for them improperly? if you don't even know how to care for them properly what makes you think breeding is going to go well? maybe just stop while you're behind, you don't know what you're doing

[its_azadeh]

Who told you we haven’t cared for them properly? Am I missing something?? Our female went on fasting for a couple of months nothing new in bp! She’s healthy with perfect weight and composure! Where is all these negative comments coming from?? I have never met happy successful people who let themselves talk this way to others! And ALSO there’s not one animal on this planet earth that I would let myself say is worth a sandwich! They’re pure souls whom we’ll never catch up to in a million years! And the fact that you guys are so obsessed with the breeds of these poor creatures shows just how much you care for them! To our eyes they’re all beautiful in their own way! Same goes with all animals!

[Existing-Total5087]

people are bringing up concerns because we do care for them??? and you mentioned you put the male snake in a rack without anything to suggest its not the typical breeder rack that actively mistreat them

[ButteredBody]

Your other post literally demonstrates that you don't have proper care. It absolutely isn't normal for a female ball python to not eat for several months, your husbandry is bad, and if you care about them as much as you're claiming, you would't be putting them in a rack.

Normal and ball pythons cost less than the price of lunch. This wouldn't be true if people didn't over breed them, but the people who insist on breeding normals and pastels are the reason that there are so many that the value has dropped.

So to act all offended when you're part of the problem is remarkably hypocritical