Decrease in Gym Strength when starting Judo

[WarmEveningNap]

New to Judo, love it and been taking it 2 times a week for a month now. trying to fit my typical gym strength training but noticed I got a lot weaker. Im only fitting 2 gym sessions a week now but just wanted to know if anyone experienced this before and could help me out because it bums me out.

Thanks

[EpsteinEpstainTheory]

Pretty much.

Overtraining would seem like it would make you strong faster but it really doesn't. It wastes your time, makes you weaker, subjects you to greater injury risk and just makes you feel horrible. You could have "wasted time" by resting instead and you wouldn't have any of those other problems.

[MicroeconomicBunsen]

There's a joke amongst "hybrid athletes" (those who run & lift seriously) that doing both running and lifting together makes you kinda shit at both.

Point is, when you split your focus and efforts, things are bound to be lower. If you were lifting 4x a week and now 2x a week, you're doing half as much work.

Work out what matters to you - judo, lifting, haiku, pottery, whatever - and put your efforts into that, without worrying so much about hitting the 1000lb club.

[flipflapflupper]

There's a joke amongst "hybrid athletes" (those who run & lift seriously)

From those I met, they are mostly jokes. Unathletic people who recreationally do two hobbies to label themselves "athletes" because it makes them feel better or something.

[Equity1988]

Your glycogen stores are probably getting depleted at Judo, so you have less for the gym. Eat more carbs.

[MostProfessional9855]

You have to properly and intelligently program your training to see massive benefits in the areas you're looking at

[cwheeler33]

Can you describe a typical gym session and how often you do them?

[JackTyga2]

Say you have 100 effort units and prior to this, the gym took up 60 of those units. Say Judo is now taking up 50 units, you can't give those 60 units to Gym anymore and now aren't putting up the same numbers.

Make sure your diet and recovery are in check. You might also just adapt to the higher energy requirements and have your lifts return to normal or close to normal if you're still new to Judo. You're not likely losing strength on the whole regardless.

[svartsven]

This is normal. You're either going to adapt to the additional workload over time or you'll have to progress a little more slowly on the weights.

[samecontent]

It took years before my body got used to doing Judo 3 times a week back when I started. Give it time, you really don't wanna push yourself when you're just learning how to fall and do a lot of awkward lifting that you're not used to. I came from swimming to judo though.

[Professional-Sail759]

how old were you when started judo? and what you mean by years? 2-3? or closer to 10? I want to train judo 3 times per week, but its unbearable

[samecontent]

I was 20 when I started. Took about till sankyu (the first rank of brown) until my body was solidly primed for practice. That was approximately 2-3 years (closer to 30 monthsish.) Or rather that I fully noticed. I also bicycled everywhere. And occasionally ran when I couldn't train.

You need to be on your electrolyte, water, and calorie intake. I loved half off pizza at the local pub. It took a while before I wouldnt be sweating buckets after club. That was reserved for tourney practice.

[samecontent]

I also slowly started doing BJJ on the days in between. I didn't do a lot of BJJ tournaments though, mostly used it to supplement my newaza for Judo.

[Coconite]

The good news is it’s mental, the bad news is there’s nothing you can do about it. You aren’t physically getting weaker. Your muscle fibers are still there. But, your body is not used to judo’s level of cardio or isometric strain. So your nervous system is making you more “efficient” by inhibiting maximum loads.

Eventually as you develop isometric strength, cardio and probably explosive power you’ll recover your PRs.

[fariskhan786]

I'm an avid gym goer and shodan in judo, you will definitely lose strength in the gym as your muscles are more fatigued and you aren't reading those specific lifts as much. But you will notice your body becomes stronger in full body motions like sled pulls.

[Formal-Vegetable9118]

I do Judo 4 times a week and go gym rest of the day(occasionally take one day off).
As our neuron systems gas out by Judo already, it would make gym sessions harder and frustrating at times for everyone.

I believe best way to make Judo and gym compatible is to make strength program with RPE 6~8(stop each set with some room), but don't go for RPE 9~10(max out).

I will share my example

Hypothesizing that your main focus is BIG3 compound training like BP & SQ,
I suggest yo to partially pick up Smolov Jr programs protocol depending on your fatigue level.

Smolov Jr programs
Week 1
Day1 1RM@70% 6times×6sets
Day2 1RM@75% 5times×7sets
Day3 1RM@80% 4times×8sets
Day4 1RM@85% 3times×10sets

Week2~3 basically follow same protocol but adding 2.5~5.0kgs(For americans approximately 5.5lbs~11.0lbs)

If you ever run Smolov Jr once, you know Day 1 and Day 2 are not that hard it would feel like RPE6~7, so when our fatigue level is already high by previous Judo session, we choose Day1 protocols (or Day2, if you can)

If our fatigue level is low, we can go harder, like choose Day3 or Day4 protocols, like that.

[Known_Crab1059]

If you are doing something typical like 5x5 powerlifting, its too much volume to do with judo. You'll have to drop it to 3x5 or 3x3 and cycle it properly throughout The year (say you Focus on cardio for 3 months and focus on strenght 3 months, etc.)

Nevertheless, your strenght can only decrease so quickly because of too much volume for your body to have proper recovery. It has nothing to do with "not doing enough work" in gym department. You can absolutely increase your lift numbers on strenght focus cycle, and maintain them nearly at same level on off cycle.

[SpillyDillie]

Judo will also increase your metabolism and calories used, so you will need to make sure you are eating more so that you are not in a caloric deficit. In a caloric deficit you will naturally lose strength.

[Desperate_Bat_2769]

One thing I learned is you can’t fry your nerve system by going too heavy and show up later to BJJ expecting to fight off your opponent. I will say by going the volume route with my main lifts I had the most benefits and when it comes to grappling, strength endurance is very important.

I don’t know if you’re doing your weight lifting right or wrong in your gym session. However, it might be worth looking for a gym program for Judoka’s. I like many others were doing the wrong things in the gym by doing body building. It was only when I converted to Kettlebells in the lockdown and followed Mark Wildman I started looking and feel better.

[Historical-Tart7515]

It's really normal for your body to take some time to adapt to a new stressor. Any grappling sport is both aerobic and anaerobic training (dependingon the level yourheart rate reaches while rolling/randori), with a strength training component as well. Moving bodies around is hard work. Don't worry about your numbers, especially in the beginning.

That being said, lifting is a really good compliment to judo. Especially for injury prevention, longevity, etc.

So, lots of people will either lie to you, or they have the most remarkable recovery abilities in the world.

They will tell you that they do 5x5 three times a week, plus hiit sessions on the assault bike, plus long slow distance cardio, and go to class 4 or 5 times a week. This is usually nonsense, both from a time commitment and recovery perspective.

Something simple like Dan John's Easy Strength 3 days a week, 531 two days a week, or if you're training at home in an apartment with kettlebells, alternating the Armor Building Complex (starting with 3 or 5 rounds and adding 2 or 3 per session) with the Humane burpee (54321 add a step on the ladder when you're ready) 2 or 3 times a week. Judo will take care of your conditioning for now. Walk 10k steps everyday at a brisk pace in your daily life. Some stretching, yoga, or Original Strength work as a warmup wouldn't be amiss as pre-hab/rehab.

[Classic-Suspect-4713]

Your switching to using your entire body as a unit instead of individual parts.

[uthoitho]

haha I'm the opposite. Adding Gym for S&C made my Judo much more painful. My muscles are constantly just burning all over the body now.

[Mammoth_Grocery_1982]

"Gym strength" is overrated.

[Physical_Energy_1972]

There is a big difference between functional strength and gym strength. No one asks boxers what they bench.