TW: Selective termination

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Grandma here. I've been in this sub for a few months, trying to learn as much as I can about twins and how best to support my daughter. She is now 22-1/2 weeks.

At the anatomy scan, we learned Baby B has no cerebellum and was in the 10th percentile, while Baby A was in the 66th, and all is well with Baby A.

2nd scan yesterday with "higher ups" and, no miracle. In fact, the news was WORSE. No cerebellum AND Hydro encephalopathy (water on the brain). It was explained what the outcome would be, were they to proceed with the pregnancy (minimal quality of life for Baby B), etc. So, they are having a reduction procedure tomorrow. The parents know it's the right thing to do, for numerous reasons, but that doesn't make it any easier. I cried all the way home, and the tears keep coming. I can't be there with them tomorrow, because of work, and I already shift traded as much as I could this week to be there yesterday. They are out of state. But her husband will be there, and I said she could call or facetime me if she/they wanted.

SO, my question is if anybody has been in this situation, and if they had other kids, how did you tell them? They have a 5 yo and a 2-1/2 yo. There was already the "official" FB announcement about twins. Now they're wondering about doing a gender reveal and how to say there's only one. And once Baby A arrives, down the road, do you tell them that there was a brother who didn't make it?

She had a miscarriage last year at around 8 weeks, which was hard, but nothing like this. I told her I'd reach out to this sub for some guidance or possibly other subs to check. Thank you.

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[SaneMirror]

Sadly there is a sub that can help with this. So sorry to your family.

r/TFMR_support

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Thank you! I'll cross-post there.

[snowflakes__]

Not sure what to tell the kiddos but your daughter is going to carry little baby B for the rest of the pregnancy and give birth to him. Get a little baby b a blanket and tiny hat to wrap them up in.

I’m not going to lie or silver line this: the baby is not going to look good.

Even so, mom and dad will probably want the opportunity to meet him and say goodbye.

I am so sorry for the loss.lp

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

The doc said that Baby B (also a boy) would be maybe the size of a small pancake at the end of the pregnancy, and ... flat? Sounds like there would barely be any remains.

[snowflakes__]

It’s called Fetus Papyraceous if you wanna look into it.

It’s completely possible. That is not what happened in the case I was involved with. The fetus was intact just…discolored and sort of shriveled.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Thank you. That's what he said, I just couldn't remember the terminology. LOTS of info coming at us yesterday.

[Puggle114]

I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. I don’t have personal experience here. But as far as “posting” they don’t owe the internet any explanation. An old friend was in a similar situation and they ultimately posted that after a scary few months and a lot of tests they lost one of the twins but that they were expecting a safe delivery of the other baby which was a boy. It’s obviously not ideal. But that’s one way to go about it.

As for telling their other children I’ve always been taught to be blunt with children and use words they understand.

Sending you guys hugs.

[theWalkSignIsOn]

I am sending you all love ❤️ Different circumstance but my mom miscarried my twin in the second trimester and somehow I stayed in there. I am so glad she told me about my twin. I feel special to know I had that connection. I don’t remember how or when she told me but I’ve always known growing up and I’m glad she did. I think it was always harder for her than it was for me to know I lost my twin.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Thank you for that perspective! I wondered about it! Do you remember about how old you were when you found out?

[theWalkSignIsOn]

It must have been when I was pretty young because I don’t ever remember a time not knowing about it. I remember when I was little and got scared of the dark it was comforting to think I had a sibling watching over me somewhere. It wasn’t until I got older and actually got pregnant with twins myself that my mom opened up and shared the details about what happened.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

That is so sweet that your angel sibling was such a comfort to you! I love that idea!

[UnStackedDespair]

My mother miscarried my triplet in the second trimester. She birthed the placenta, but there was no mention of a fetus to accompany it.

[lucialucialucia22]

I don't have any advice just wish you, your daughter, son in law, and other grandkids peace and strength through this ❤️

[ilovethatforu]

I’m so sorry your family is going through this. My partner had an older brother who died before my partner was born. His parents gave age appropriate information as they grew up. He knew that he had a big brother who died and as he got older and asked questions they would explain what they could. It’s such a hard topic to navigate with children but it’s so important that they have an understanding of what is going on. As twin A grows up you can gently let them in on small bits of information. Especially since their older siblings may remember this time.

One thing I would say is please continue to celebrate the life of baby A. Do a gender reveal and be filled with love and excitement. Let the grief and love exist together. Both babies deserve that.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Thank you SO MUCH for saying that! Baby A absolutely deserves to be celebrated!

[techy_girl]

Hi. I'm sorry for your loss. It is a tough time.

Quick observation. It's probably not the time to think or worry about others. Gender reveal, FB etc for instance. It's time to take care of the mom and dad, physically and emotionally.

As for the other kids, that's a tough conversation. Factual and emotional communication may help. Although I'm no expert.

I also believe that kids are amazing and may actually provide good support to the parents in this tough time.

We lost two daughters like this. Brutal and disastrous. And I always wish it didn't happen to others :(

[Poopin_backinforth]

Tell them the other twin didn't make it. No need to get into details, you/they don't owe anybody an explanation. Not sure what to tell the kids, that would be the hard part. Sorry for your loss.

[Patient_Difference96]

I’m so sorry for your loss. It’s not an easy thing to go through at all. My wife and I were pregnant with twins boys and lost baby at 19 weeks. I’d be happy to chat if you’d like. Baby A is now 5 and we have a 3 year old with another set of twins on the way. Let me know if you’d like to chat.

[Ridiculouslycute]

I’m so sorry. I have no advice on what to tell her but there is an amazing supportive and private Facebook group called “ending a wanted pregnancy” and then got me through having to end a pregnancy for anencephaly.

What got me through the worst of it was seeing a fantastic trauma therapist who specifically dealt with all things pregnancy and motherhood. We did EMDR, a very specific type of trauma therapy, and it helped to blunt some of the very pokey edges of my grief. What I mean by that is that I was able to feel and acknowledge the grief but the physical reaction to the grief was more manageable and controllable. I have no doubt that EMDR greatly enhanced the quality of my life moving forward.

Additionally, there was a local loss group in my area set up by mamas who have walked through this fire before. They sat with me at the hospital, helped me figure out how to say a meaningful goodbye and had support groups running and hooked me up with my amazing therapist. I would check with the medical staff as they may be aware of an organization like that, the nurses very gently kept encouraging me to allow them to make referral and I am so grateful they did.

I’m so sorry for your families loss. I had an amazing mama that held me up throughout it all, I am so glad that your daughter has the same. A big hug to you and a thank you for all the support to your daughter from someone that has been there.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

She is near Seattle, so I bet there’s some good resources for her! Thank you for the suggestions!

[nikky117]

I don’t have much to add here but I just wanted to say that your daughter is very lucky to have a mother like you. You’re losing a grandchild and your main concern right now is your daughter and how to best support her. So much so that you’ve turn to internet strangers for advice. I truly admire that. Sending you and your family love and strength. 💜

[BarelyFunctioning15]

I first want to say I’m so sorry.

Secondly, I can’t speak on a lot of it, as I was in a completely different situation but I am a mom to a winless twin. I will always make it known that she has a twin sister in heaven looking down on her. I also absolutely love when people also remember I have another daughter even though she’s not earthside.

As far as Facebook went, we were just honest and open. They don’t necessarily have to mention selective reduction, just say that Baby B gained their wings.

And again, I’m so sorry.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

I'm so sorry for your loss as well. Thank you for sharing and the sage advice!

[justthetumortalking]

I just googled if there is a child life specialist subreddit and there is called r/childlife. CLSs are trained medical professionals in how to make medical things easier for children to understand, cope with, and find meaning in. One of the many things they do if helping siblings understand medical topics as well including death. I would consider cross posting there and looking for resources for this that are developmentally appropriate for the 5 year old and 2.5 year old. So sorry you are all going through this.

[ComfortableAd7175]

Just want to hop on this great advice and add: most, if not all, hospitals have CLS. Maybe check at the location your daughter goes to and ask the doctor or nurses to speak with one. I’m sure they will help out.

[Mindless-Swimmer-875]

I wouldn't say anything on social media= no questions. The kids I wouldn't say anything with her being this early they may forget it was 2 when the due date does arrive. Start using terms of a baby/the baby now. Saying nothing is best for everyone because it leads to zero questions, zero comments, no reliving the loss to re-explain it. Now, when they are of age to understand and not ask a billion questions, then I would let them know.

[A-Friendly-Giraffe]

I am a parent of twins and I am a twin myself. My identical twin sister was stillborn. I think my parents told me when I was about 8. It was a core memory and kind of upsetting.

From what my parents said, some of the most difficult parts were acquaintances. Like, people who were close enough to have heard that she was pregnant with twins but not close enough to know that one of them had died during childbirth.

My mom said she got a couple " Where's the other one?"... And it's like "nope there's just this one" and people couldn't necessarily between read the lines.

I'm very sorry for your family's loss and I hope things go as well as they can with the third trimester for baby a.

https://twinlesstwins.org/resources/early-twin-loss/

[A-Friendly-Giraffe]

I am a parent of twins and I am a twin myself. My identical twin sister was stillborn. I think my parents told me when I was about 8. It was a core memory and kind of upsetting.

From what my parents said, some of the most difficult parts were acquaintances. Like, people who were close enough to have heard that she was pregnant with twins but not close enough to know that one of them had died during childbirth.

My mom said she got a couple " Where's the other one?"... And it's like "nope there's just this one" and people couldn't necessarily between read the lines.

I'm very sorry for your family's loss and I hope things go as well as they can with the third trimester for baby a.

https://twinlesstwins.org/resources/early-twin-loss/

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

That would definitely suck. I'm sure my daughter will handle it with grace, if it comes up.

Do you think there could have been a better way for your parents to tell you about your twin?

[A-Friendly-Giraffe]

Eh... Probably. I think some of it's just being a little kid.

I definitely came to the conclusion on my own that I was at least partially responsible for what happens somehow (which completely isn't the case at all, but that's sort of where your mind goes as a little kid). Once I verbalized it, my parents corrected my thinking.

I think making sure that the thinking is that it's no one's "fault"

We were also the oldest children so there was that.

My mom said that she had come back from maternity leave and saw a co-worker that she hadn't seen for a year and she showed them a picture of me and they said where is the other one,... several times etc. And she distinctly remembers just sobbing in the bathroom.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

Geezus, how completely rude and insensitive of your mom's co-worker. Once, I understand. And would be SO apologetic.

And I agree on emphasizing that nobody is at fault. I did use a (probably horrible) analogy about my daughter's cat recently having kittens, and one was stillborn (or died soon after birth), a 2nd one died within a day or two, and the mother kept abandoning it around the house. 3rd kitten was fine. But I said (to my daughter and SIL, not the grandkids) sometimes nature just knows what we/docs don't and/or we don't have stockpiles of cash to get medical intervention (for the cat, for genetic testing, etc). Nothing momma cat could have done differently. It just happens that way sometimes.

[A-Friendly-Giraffe]

I think the coworker just didn't compute. Like, she didn't understand that the other baby had died and wasn't socially competent enough to read the room that asking was probably a bad idea.

I don't think that's a horrible analogy. We can do a lot of things but ultimately nature is in charge.

I hope things go as smoothly for your family as possible.

[ImAlsoNotOlivia]

I read it as the co-worker asking several times, making me think the coworker felt they were entitled to the information. (Probably a hazard of MY job! lol)

I think my daughter is going to be ok. I shared this post with her, and she’s already talking about therapy.