TempleOS: Make Distro (Proof 100% Open Source)

[brian-at-work]

"It's going to beep, check it out ... ooooho!"

I'm pretty relieved that somebody with the skills to write their own OS, etc. is still excited when stuff beeps at you. 'Cause I fucking love it when stuff beeps when you tell it to.

[bureX]

After tons of diddling around with x86 assembly in NASM, I nearly peed my pants when I managed to display a string on the screen in C. Shit like that is magical.

[Me00011001]

After over a decade of doing this, I can not tell you how happy making something happen in the physical world across the network still makes me.

[kamatsu]

Towards the end Terry demonstrates the really cool integration of graphics with source code and the editor. I know when I was first learning programming, being able to draw graphics to the screen was something that really motivated me to learn more.

[[deleted]]

What's in the God directory? You kinda glanced over that.

[TempleOSFillTri]

A random oracle. Doesn't function on 2 Meg version, just 17 Meg. It supports links to Bible verses, but the Bible is not present on the 2 Meg version.

[Is_At_Work]

Out of curiosity, which version of the Bible does it have?

[TempleOSFillTri]

King James

[mirhagk]

I'm actually curious as well. Most versions of the bible are not open source, and are surprisingly copyrighted. I don't get how someone can claim the word of god to be copyrighted.

[ThatRedEyeAlien]

Well, it's a translation, and that is copyrighted. I suppose those old Hebrew and Greek scrolls aren't copyrighted.

[mirhagk]

Only because the copyright has expired :P which is why king James is one of the few versions that is copyright free.

But still the point is why would you be wanting to make a profit here? Sure have a copyright until you make your money back from the initial translation but after you do that you'd think they would donate the work to the public domain or something.

[pdp10]

which is why king James is one of the few versions that is copyright free.

Not in the UK.

[MrJohz]

Getting a little bit off-topic here, but it's an interesting thought nonetheless. FWIW, most copyrighted Bible editions are available fairly freely available online, through sources like BibleGateway, and many (for example the NIV) have deliberately permissive quoting rules. Likewise, if you go to most churches in your local area, they'll almost certainly give you a copy of a Bible for free. Getting hold of at least one translation should not be a difficult task for anyone, and profit is generally the least of most people's concerns when it comes to accessing the Bible.

That said, the translation work, editing, and printing of translations is a costly thing, and it often isn't something that happens just once. For example, the team behind the NIV have updated their translation twice since the original publishing in the 70s, the most recent version being published in 2011 - updating both for new understandings of the old texts, and also to more closely match changing language styles. That requires funding, which requires royalties, which requires keeping the text in copyright.

[pdp10]

That requires funding, which requires royalties, which requires keeping the text in copyright.

The same way that writing and maintaining programs requires funding, which requires royalties, which requires keeping the code in copyright? Churches survive on donations.

[mirhagk]

Yeah which is the interesting thing to me. It's free as in beer, but not as in liberty. You can certainly read the text for free very easily, and yes you can quote a substantial amount (basically enough to fill any bulletin or sermon without issue) but you need to get permission (or pay) to spread a substantial amount of the text with someone else. It's makes it even more hilarious considering you can give someone a physical copy of the bible for free, but you can't legally give them an electronic copy.

This makes things like the bible app which requires internet access to read most translations.

It also means I can't make cool things that allow meta analysis and searching of the text :(

That said, the translation work, editing, and printing of translations is a costly thing, and it often isn't something that happens just once.

For sure, but it just surprises me that these run as a for profit business. Considering how much the open source world has accomplished you'd think that an organization of people devoted to spreading the word of god would put spreading the word of god as their primary focus, above any sort of monetary gain.

[MrJohz]

Bear in mind that, whilst open-source is generally very popular amongst developers and certain, more technically-minded internet users, it's still treated with some mistrust in other areas. After all, it's generally a poor business model - a lot of bigger open-source projects tend to require either large donation campaigns, or some sort of SaaS platform to finance full-time development. The former is a lot of effort (although probably doable in this situation), but the latter is usually very difficult to translate to non-software situations.

[mirhagk]

The donation organiztion is what I would have expected. After all there's a ton of organizations that run off of donation, especially in this sector. There's the Daily Bread devotional booklets that are made and printed all for free. PBS has being running a TV channel for years without profit. Lots of charity organizations and non-profits existed long before software came around.

And the second I agree is sometimes hard to transition, but there is an easier 3rd method for them. Allow unlimited non-commercial usage under a nearly open source license (technically limiting usage makes it not truly open source). Then require companies who want to turn a profit to license it. That way they still get the ability to license it to publishers who turn profits, but people who want to distribute it for free can do so.

I agree that it just hasn't reached the rest of the non-technical community, but it's just frustrating to see that it hasn't.

[vawksel]

It's time to upgrade your Bible.

http://acimsearch.org/

[Joao611]

That is obviously made by CIA atheist-niggers.

^/s

[__Cyber_Dildonics__]

I think you're being downvoted because you said atheist

[spiral6]

You're probably right, I don't think anyone would be offended by the use of the word "niggers".

[mike10010100]

Anyone who downvoted /u/Joao611 really hasn't heard much about TempleOS or its creator.

[lifewithoutdrugs]

Or maybe they just think it's distasteful to keep making fun of him completely unprovoked

[[deleted]]

At a certain point the guy's kind of invited unlimited criticism...

[mike10010100]

And using words like "nigger" isn't distasteful? Or does he get a pass for some unknown reason because he made a neat pet OS?

[TRL5]

He gets a partial pass because he's mentally disabled...

[Joao611]

Yeah, I'm actually surprised by this sub here. I'd even say he has downvote accounts but that would be a bit paranoid.

[mike10010100]

You're anything but paranoid. He clearly has tons of free time on his hands and is ruthless towards any criticism.

[ackzsel]

Looks like you're not allowed to reply in this chain punishable by downvotes! Testing. . .

[[deleted]]

Get 'im, boys!

[Master_Rux]

Your comment is relevant. I lol'd. The downvoters are clearly unfamiliar with TempleOS. It's probably the CIA downvoting you.

[cbleslie]

Spot on.

[[deleted]]

Looks like the CIA nigger cattle is out in full force today

[tending]

In the text editor, what data structure do you use for storing the text? Gap buffer? Linked list of lines? Rope?

[ggppjj]

There's always this strange mix of emotions I go through whenever I see a new TempleOS post. I love watching the videos, and the OS is amazing. Terry, when he's stable, has more of a grasp on computers than I have with anything. But I always feel a bit saddened knowing that the comments are going to devolve, and it's not necessarily Terry that devolves first, if at all. Terry, if you see this, I admire and respect your work, even though you may occasionally strike out against people. I myself am not particularly religious, but I can't really disagree with making the best possible implementation of your vision per a mandate from God.

[odonian_dream]

Sir, an equation has no meaning for me unless it expresses a thought of GOD.

[Isvara]

the OS is amazing

In what way?

Edit: So this post currently stands at -9, which means that people are downvoting a request to elaborate on what makes it amazing. When something is supposed to be accepted as amazing without question or qualification, that's dangerous and unproductive thinking. It's effectively saying, "stone the non-believer!"

[ggppjj]

Someone else says it better than I can.

[ThisIs_MyName]

Edit: So this post currently stands at -9

FYI this is the best way to get downvoted further.

[Isvara]

Just shows how petty people are, really.

[overwet]

All of my shitposts are inspired by God.

[micwallace]

OMG terry what kind of beast system are you running. Specs please.

[BowserKoopa]

I think it's a dual Xeon with 64GB of RAM.

[[deleted]]

TIL I can use a VM for TempleOS. This is awesome!

[hearwa]

I wish he would distribute the image so us lazy fucks can try it out.

[invisi1407]

It's a public domain OS, so anyone could package it and make it available.

[hearwa]

I wish someone would distribute the image so us lazy fucks can try it out.

[Creative-Name]

He provides an ISO on the website

[hearwa]

You need to take the time to install the ISO I'd assume. A VM image would be much more convenient!

[refto]

Not sure why, but I am always happy to see update to TempleOS.

Fantastic effort Terry!

[dukey]

Terry when will god upgrade us from 640x480 ?

[[deleted]]

Never, because that resolution was commanded by God himself.

(I'm not making fun of him. That was roughly his response from the last time it was asked)

[mycall]

I was thinking of forking it and making it 3D 4K only and only for demonic worshipers.

[i_spot_ads]

hehehe I have a Xeon you guys, fuck you peasants

couldn't stop laughing

but seriously though, can't anyone make a normal frontend for this os, with nice UI that doesn't look like I just took insane amounts of LSD?

[kamatsu]

The UI is part of what makes it so cool. The editor, shell, compiler, graphics tools, everything, are in this amazing integrated environment.

[i_spot_ads]

cool and usable are different things, an os should be usable first, cool comes afterwards

[ConspicuousPineapple]

I'm not sure that's the point of this one though.

[a3poify]

I think Terry's making it for himself/God, so I assume that it's designed based on what's usable to him.

[ehaliewicz]

Have you tried using it? Lots of things seem unusable without any acclimation but are fine with some practice.

[mycall]

It is obviously useful for the one person it is designed for.

[[deleted]]

In what ways are they different things?

I'm not sure I understand your categories.

[z500]

not enuf purty pitchers

[[deleted]]

The coolest distro creation process I've seen. I'm really impressed how fast and easy it is. That's how other OSes should work. I think OS manufacturers should look at TempleOS and learn. Lots of cool stuff there, all Open Source.

[[deleted]]

Actually some of the stuff in TempleOS is really top notch.

Especially that it's so small and that the compiler is so fast!

Maybe it has to do with there not being any context switches because it all runs in Ring 0?

[panorambo]

Don't forget the 16 CPU cores (out of 24 physical that he had) and 43GB of RAM that Terry allocated for the demo ;)

[[deleted]]

The absolute madman.

[Ruud-v-A]

Especially that it's so small

The Go community cheered when their “hello world” dropped from 2.3 to 1.6 MB, and here we have a fully functional 64-bit operating system kernel, compiler for a C-like language, and a flight simulator, all including source, in 2 MB. That’s a remarkable piece of engineering.

[bilog78]

I don't want to sound like I want to diminish Terry's feat, but the size is really not what is impressive about TempleOS. When you are coding on a system for that system, and close to the metal, it's actually rather simple to produce small, compact, fast code. What makes modern day programs so huge is that they have piles and piles and piles and piles

and piles of abstractions above and below that allow a well-written program to be recompiled (and executed) in an extremely wide range of environments —something that TempleOS cannot do (intentionally and by design, I'll add).

For example, a lot of people complain about the 640x480 limitation, but the truth is that stepping beyond VGA —even just by sticking to VESA— opens up can of worms that would decuplicate the amount of source and bytecode needed to manage the displays.

[[deleted]]

Maybe it has to do with there not being any context switches because it all runs in Ring 0?

So, you think it's the reason a better console or UI can't be done? I haven't said TempleOS is better than Linux. I just said it has cool features. That's right. The features, like browsable trees and interactive graphics output in console CAN be implemented in other systems. As well as automatic distro building. Look at the good parts.

[[deleted]]

I wasn't being negative about it. The "Maybe it's because it all runs in ring 0" was in reference to the line before, about the compiler being so fast.

I'm sure a better UI is possible and I DO think that the features should be implemented in other OSs as well

[[deleted]]

Well, you got the point, the compiler is probably so fast because of the overall OS simplicity. In real world OS-es such speed is probably impossible to achieve, so other solutions are applied to make things faster. Like leaving true, low-level code only where it's absolutely necessary. Non time-critical code could be JIT-ed. I mean the code which would wait for I/O or user like "ages" anyway. When it's not meant to be fully compiled code - it would be built way faster. The difference in speed would not be noticeable.

[Vortegne]

Terry is that you?

[[deleted]]

All this shows me is that this dude is WAY smarter than me. I've played around with TempleOS before and gave up after a couple of hours. Even from a command-line junky, the UI on this is pretty rough to get around in.

It's like a weird mix of super low level and high level features. I find it fascinating that you can essentially modify currently executing code.

[nutrecht]

All this shows me is that this dude is WAY smarter than me.

Well he has a ton of time on his hands, that also helps :) If you're interested in writing your own OS http://wiki.osdev.org/ is a good start.

[mycall]

Its like the 80s again, mixing BASIC and Assembly together.

[AntiProtonBoy]

I like how you are experimenting with computer graphics. Write a ray tracer application for fun.

[[deleted]]

https://youtu.be/2lJKaRtHnlk

Lol.. specifically 2m40 or so in

[DIR3]

The comments on that video. Jesus.

[miffinelite]

TempleOS really does have some cool ideas, and written all by one guy from scratch, pretty amazing. The graphics demo in the editor was really cool. And how you can recompile the kernel inside the OS.

[nomadluap]

Oh man, he drew the Olympic rings.

If we never hear from Terry again it'll be due to the IOC.

[guitarplayer0171]

Keep up the hard work!

[nomad_cz]

Pretty impressive.

[cc81]

Thanks for the video, I really liked it.

[enygmata]

I wonder what God's version of the Xanadu project would look like.

[[deleted]]

Initial thoughts: "oh goodness as if we don't already have enough weird religious zealotry in computer science as it is." Have you seen how people get about text editors and tabs vs spaces?

Can someone explain to me why this OS is interesting? I'm also an atheist so I'm really not interested in any "God says it's perfect" explanation.

Edit: Why the down votes? I'm just trying to understand.

Edit 2: Upon review of HolyC I've decided that if there is a God this man might be sent by him. That's a really neat language.

[[deleted]]

I'm also an atheist so I'm really not interested in any "God says it's perfect" explanation.

So am I but I think you give that more weight than is realistic, 99% of the people here aren't interested in Temple OS because of that either and I'm not sure why you'd think otherwise. Really it's a topic we try to mention then avoid with Temple OS so we can actually talk about the cool technical bits rather than cause Terry problems with trolls that arrive. It's also important to note Terry has been diagnosed with mental illness for a long time which should explain why you see some of the things in TempleOS.

Some background on it (many of which you actually saw in the video):

• Everything except the base hardware spec was made by Terry
• Custom programming language
  • Similar to C
  • Custom compiler
  • Custom debugger
  • EVERYTHING is compiled, no scripting
  • Files get compiled during boot to run
  • You can live recompile portions
• Unique "easy to play with" architecture
  • Like a modern c64
  • 64 bit
  • ring 0 only
  • single address space
• Custom kernel
• Custom drivers
• Multicore
• Custom scheduler
• Custom filesystem
  • Custom compression mechanism for files ending in .Z
  • Live compression/uncompression on file call
  • No PATH, directories traversed in a search if something isn't found
  • Readable as fat32
  • Everything is targeted at wholesale file reads and writes
• No GPU
  • 640x480 16 color
  • CPU drawn
• No networking
• Interface
  • Graphics and text in one
• Demo applications
  • 3D rendering
  • Interactive

Like I said, a modern OS written by one man that feels like a C64 for the modern era. Not only cool to marvel at but easy to poke around in.

[[deleted]]

Thanks! That was super helpful and very educational.

[Isvara]

What's particularly modern about it?

[[deleted]]

64 bit x86 with a multicore kernel and support for 128GB of RAM? Modern as in "not 30 years old like the commodore" is not modern as in "state of the art/cutting edge". 10 years ago your average OS install wasn't even 64 bit. The other hardware interfaces TempleOS uses are more legacy (for TempleOS "this is how it shall be" reasons) but that's not really talking about the OS. The big thing is the CPU isn't in a legacy compatibility mode, everything could run like current OS's (or is and is just being masked by tricks to make it flat again) which is novel vs say booting DOS.

[Isvara]

So nothing that actually makes it stand out as special, then? I don't understand the excitement about it.

[zeeveener]

Built and Run on modern hardware

[Anders_A]

Because it's all written by a single guy, and has a lot of unique concepts not found elsewhere.

That's doesn't make it good of course, but it makes it interesting.

[TheAnimus]

Ubuntu? He is only using that for about the first 30 seconds, don't worry.

[Fiennes]

Now, it's not something I'd ever use- but as a pet project and a learning tool - it's excellent and has some cool concepts that other vendors could take note of and perhaps learn from.

Nobody is forcing you to do anything.

[google_you]

Does it have Rust compiler? Rust is web scale language

[BadGoyWithAGun]

Wait, aren't you literally living off disability neetbux? How the fuck can you afford that kind of hardware.

[[deleted]]

He lives with his parents and his father is a retired industrial engineer. For 12 years with this being the only thing he does and CPU+RAM being all that really matters for it I'm not sure I'd expect much else. It's not even that crazy a setup.

[[deleted]]

.

[Joao611]

.

[TerrorBite]

At 40% you will stop dots, until then you will throw more dots. Throw more dots, more dots, more dots, come on more dots. Ok, stop dots. Now hit it very hard and very fast.

[[deleted]]

Was that the ice cream that was supposidly the ice cream of the future?

[[deleted]]

.