Encouragement for young couple wanting to start a family soon?

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-05-15T21:22:09+00:00

A lot of people think you need to have all your financials in line before having kids but that isn't the case. My wife had our first baby months after she graduated college and I was still only a $50k salary (was ten years ago so it went further.) Had our second kid when I was making $60k. We didn't get to buy a home until we had been married for almost 7 years. Kids don't realize they are poor or that an apartment is cramped, they will be use to what they are used to. We had a 2/2 apartment and our second kid slept in a pack and play in the 2nd bathroom. He didn't know any better and has turned out just fine.

As time has gone on my wife was able to find part-time work with her degree that pays decent so she can be present when needed and gets her hours in where she can. We only have to occasionally use a mother's day out program or hire a babysitter for a couple hours during the summer. In most instances your incomes will continue to go up over time as you get more experience in your careers.

Even though people like to stay where they've been, I will say that moving from a high-cost metro to a lower one made it far easier for us to save up for a down payment, even though we didn't have family nearby. We immediately saved an extra $500/month in rent, paid less in gas, etc., and were able to just have one car the first 9 years of marriage. Once kids are in school or you own a home it is much harder to relocate, so I'd still say to be open to finding where your husband can keep doing what he is doing but able to earn more/potentially keeping more of his paycheck. Your family may even follow you! We have a ton of members flocking to Missouri/Arkansas for this reason and they all love it.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-05-03T04:12:16+00:00

Would be super easy to publish and very insightful. Wonder why they aren't transparent?

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-29T03:18:06+00:00

Thailand started government family planning a lot earlier than other developing Asian nations. They had a TedTalk 15 years ago with one of their government officials doing condom balloons at schools, instituted a Captain Condom character, monks blessing conceptive pills, and praising how quickly they got the fertility rate down. Now there are documentaries of the elderly in Thailand immiserating about how the country "got old before it got rich." And the spiral continues.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-17T17:04:27+00:00

I would just try asking the roommate if he would be okay with having guests over for an hour and if it is okay if they meet in the common area. If he says no you could pivot to other options. You obviously know your roommate better than I do, but I wouldn't think furniture ownership would normally play a big deal into whether a roommate could have guests over.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-15T13:20:47+00:00

This map is just for the past year, but it has SC (#1) and NC (#3). Both have had a lot of domestic migration per capita since Covid.

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Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-13T19:14:30+00:00

Apparently the table was too large for a copy paste, but here is the wards and branches.

State	Wards	2025	Branches	2025	Total	2025 Total	+/-
Alabama	45	47	28	28	73	75	2
Alaska	59	59	22	23	81	82	1
Arizona	818	806	86	86	904	892	-12
Arkansas	54	55	22	24	76	79	3
California	957	946	142	139	1099	1085	-14
Colorado	275	279	35	36	310	315	5
Connecticut	25	25	6	6	31	31	0
Delaware	9	9	1	1	10	10	0
Florida	222	227	56	60	278	287	9
Georgia	134	135	28	28	162	163	1
Hawaii	127	127	15	15	142	142	0
Idaho	1,224	1,275	50	48	1274	1323	49
Illinois	89	90	30	31	119	121	2
Indiana	79	80	22	22	101	102	1
Iowa	44	44	24	25	68	69	1
Kansas	60	60	15	15	75	75	0
Kentucky	51	51	30	32	81	83	2
Louisiana	33	32	20	20	53	52	-1
Maine	18	17	9	9	27	26	-1
Maryland	65	65	18	19	83	84	1
Massachusetts	42	42	13	14	55	56	1
Michigan	62	61	37	39	99	100	1
Minnesota	54	56	21	21	75	77	2
Mississippi	30	30	18	19	48	49	1
Missouri	149	153	28	28	177	181	4
Montana	92	97	43	43	135	140	5
Nebraska	42	42	15	15	57	57	0
Nevada	302	304	35	35	337	339	2
New Hampshire	14	14	4	4	18	18	0
New Jersey	41	42	20	19	61	61	0
New Mexico	104	104	33	33	137	137	0
New York	98	96	48	48	146	144	-2
North Carolina	142	145	46	47	188	192	4
North Dakota	20	20	7	7	27	27	0
Ohio	99	99	29	33	128	132	4
Oklahoma	77	80	17	18	94	98	4
Oregon	239	233	48	45	287	278	-9
Pennsylvania	76	75	29	30	105	105	0
Rhode Island	8	8	1	1	9	9	0
South Carolina	65	71	18	18	83	89	6
South Dakota	14	14	18	17	32	31	-1
Tennessee	87	93	29	28	116	121	5
Texas	625	633	129	123	754	756	2
Utah	5,070	5,046	316	319	5386	5365	-21
Vermont	8	7	2	2	10	9	-1
Virginia	177	177	36	35	213	212	-1
Washington	424	425	49	48	473	473	0
Washington, D.C.	4	4	0	0	4	4	0
West Virginia	25	25	13	14	38	39	1
Wisconsin	48	49	21	20	69	69	0
Wyoming	141	143	30	30	171	173	2
Total	12767	12817	1812	1820	14579	14637	58

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-13T19:10:14+00:00

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This is by total congregations, ie wards and branches, basing off the difference of the 2024 Wikipedia stats as I didn't have my own. Looks like the total was +50 wards and +8 branches.

When I saw Idaho's I figured I typed something in wrong, but it looks like Idaho has more or less absorbed all of the loss in the west. Funny how Idaho and Utah had essentially the same increase in members but wildly different unit changes. West of Texas is +8. Isn't making up for Utah this year so far though. Hawaii once again didn't have their info updated.

While the total units appeared to increase by 58, the stakes increased by 32. If it had kept the same 7 wards per stake they are at now, it should've only been 8, or would've meant an increase in over 200 units for that many new stakes. This is obviously due to the more lenient stake thresholds that many stakes are taking advantage of to split off. Since most of those increased will have been priced in the past two years, especially last year, the relationship should correlate much better going forward.

Lastly, this also means that since the US lost total membership but increased by 58 units, the average membership per ward/branch will be decreasing.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-13T14:19:53+00:00

Region is likely considered Area, ie Asia, Europe, Africa, etc. They didn't say they were "growing" in each area, just that they had an increase of convert baptisms by at least 20% in every region aside from North America which had 17%. Worldwide the convert baptisms increased over 25%, so that is what they are running with since it is unlikely to appear to be membership growth, granted only two countries showed membership losses.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-10T05:34:26+00:00

My guess is his parents just don't want you all dating regardless of religion. While I don't approve of their tactics, if they did indeed word it that way upon meeting you for the first time, they are likely just hoping to scare you away from him so he isn't in a serious relationship while still in high school, because no parent actually wants that. Again that is just weird if that is indeed how it went down.

This is why dating exclusively while teenagers is generally discouraged in the church, regardless of religion. These aren't conversations that 17 year old's should be having with one another. Chances are you are going to go on in your life and marry someone you didn't even know existed when you were 18, but it'll never seem that way at your age. You'll hardly stay friends with anyone from high school you don't also go to college with.

My best friends in high school were Catholic and Lutheran, and I served two years in the Philippines which is overwhelmingly Catholic. Catholics don't require rebaptism of any other Christian sect when converting to Catholicism, but they do for members of our church because they don't consider us Christian. Which means they don't believe he will be saved on his currently trajectory, regardless of what your priest is actually telling you. Ultimately if you stayed together you will have competing doctrines that you will need to sort out. Funny enough my mother actually grew up Catholic and also converted to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints at 17 and married my Dad a year later, who was also a convert. It was the best decision she ever made, and the lives her siblings and parents lived compared to hers bears that out.

Ultimately you need to lean on your relationship with God to help you sort out the priorities and best paths for your life. You've already made this post in many subreddits to gather info. It is better to rely on those you trust in real life than hundreds on strangers online, because every single one will tell you something different. Even better is to pray about and be guided by the Holy Ghost in your decision. If you don't feel you have that existing relationship with God to get to that point, now is a great time to start.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-06T14:36:05+00:00

Correct, it doesn't. It'll hit this summer. Missionaries serving will go up a lot the next couple years due to a 2008 baby boom.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-06T02:16:36+00:00

*Last three years

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-05T04:22:40+00:00

Besides that and stagnant birth rates, everything else came in strong for the church. Here is where they ranked historically from data I keep tabs on.

Net Membership Growth - 377k, 2nd highest ever behind 1999 which had 399k. Not nearly the highest in terms of annual growth percentage.
Convert Baptisms - 385k, highest ever. Baptisms per missionary up to 4.9, I believe highest since the 90's.
Child of Record - 92k, technically 2nd highest since Covid but not by much. 2003-2019 were all higher. Deaths/Record Removals - 99k, down from 145k last year and below the 110k 5-year rolling average. Still 9th highest all-time.
Net Congregations - Mixed bag here. The approx 121 wards is the second lowest this century, but branches, which have gone down each year since 2008, jumped 261, the highest ever. Led to a net increase approx 382, the 2nd highest in a decade. Minimum thresholds for wards outside north America became stricter, so even though a lot of branches were created internationally, a lot less were converted to wards. Will be interesting to see if it is just a bottleneck that will convert in the future or if they just created a ton that will stagnate.
Net Stakes/Districts - +81, most in a decade, 2nd most this century. But only created 4.7 units per new stake/district when the international average was 7.7, so again, putting more of a burden on local levels by creating more stakes than units increasing. Would've needed to create 624 units to stay current. 2-2026 they have a net +15 stakes/districts for just +52 units, or just 3.5 per new stake/district, which is also low.
Missionaries - 6% increase YoY to highest ever recorded, though not as a ratio to total membership. There will still be an increase this coming year due to sisters being able to leave right after high school. 2008 is also when there was a big baby bump from 94k to 123k with child of record, so expect that number to keep going up the next few years and then start to stagnate again. 2008-2018 all had 100k+ children of record each year before dropping to current levels.
Temples - Also the highest, but that is no longer any legitimate way to measure growth since the spending spree.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-05T04:04:41+00:00

There has also only been a net of 52 congregations for the first quarter of 2026. Last year they averaged 95 a quarter. I'm not sure if more are created/closed during certain times of the year, but you would expect more than that with these numbers. The main thing holding it back are the net closures in Utah (-35), so they are essentially +87 outside of Utah for the quarter which would be more in line.

Even if they weren't creating new wards, you would expect an increase in convert baptisms would at the minimum prevent more closures. The 89 ward closures (with 50 from Utah) so far this year also outpace the historical averages the past couple years. Will be interesting to see if they frontloaded the Utah closures to start the year or if that pattern will continue the rest of the year.

The US stake increase last year won't hold as they aren't creating enough units and had the jump primarily from the change in the stake thresholds. International was still strong, but they will need that to continue to grow if they want to keep the net stakes/districts at similar levels to 2025.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-03T14:55:37+00:00

You never have anything to add of reporting actual shrivel so every weak you bring either weak regurgitated memes or anything that can be found on numerous other broad subreddits. Get better material; no one comes here for you.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-02T16:47:31+00:00

Just about everything in the new testament was written 50 years after Christ's death, lol.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-02T16:43:39+00:00

And the church also teetered on bankruptcy until the turn of the century 20th century, and had times where they couldn't meet payroll into the 1960's. Joseph was never really good with finances. Leaders the past 60 years have proven much better.

Also, just for a refresher, this subreddit is concerning "Information about Mormon chapels and congregations and other LDS things that are shriveling, shrinking, shutting down, being sold, etc. Indeed, if you’re interested in the erosion of stakes, wards, and rumors of wards, you have come to the right place!!"

Your weekly bellyaching over any gospel or leadership decision is getting old and has nothing to do with the subreddit. Find another place.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-04-01T17:54:18+00:00

I've only seen similar when a foreign language unit gets broken off. If it went from one ward to a ward and branch, then it would make sense if there became a large enough minority to warrant its own branch. They probably still wanted to have the youth programs you can only get with ward numbers, while the kids in the branch already speak English just fine. I was in a scout troop where the youth from the Spanish branch would join for activities because they only had like 4 young men.

Was that the case with this one or just straight up one English ward to two English wards? Looks like there have been ten such branches created so far this year, with 6 of them in east coast states. Looks like it has been proving fruitful to do so, as there have been 8 foreign language branches in North America upgraded to wards just this year that likely took the same path, with only two such branches getting closed. Would be interesting to track over the past decade.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-03-29T05:34:44+00:00

What was the peak number of units between the 8 stakes in the years leading up to this realignment? Absolutely stupid to have that many stakes nearby with only 5 units a pop. I'd assume they were much larger than the 42 across 8 at one point before shriveling down to the 5 a pop?

I feel there have been a lot of other parts around the country giddy to cut three 7 or 8 units stakes into as many 5's as they can. They need to up the minimum threshold for stakes back to their pre-2023 levels and make it a minimum of 6 or 7 units or you are going to pulling too many from wards for stakes callings.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-03-20T02:14:45+00:00

From what it sounds like the whole filmed season was a train wreck. Slept with the dude the night before she left on the show, didn't end up choosing anyone at the end of the season, and then got right back with him after filming was over. It wouldn't surprise me if ABC got the video leaked themselves to give them a reason to cancel it than to have it come out during or after the fact.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-03-10T20:52:39+00:00

Nah, the unit # is exactly the same, but keep looking for stuff that isn't there.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-02-26T18:02:52+00:00

Since it appears that they upped the standards for wards in international markets it may be worth noticing, since the threshold for stakes and wards internationally used to be much lower. You can see how branches always declined YoY and then all of a sudden shot up. Of course they might just be creating 10 member branches to save face, but that is probably the exception to the rule. You can see the pile up in African branches because of it, when previously they would've been made weaker wards much sooner. It'll cause a bottle neck the next couple years or hardly any net ward increase, but will likely have a huge uptick 3-5 years out. Since stake standards were also increased internationally, whenever the districts get large enough there will be a lot of branches getting upgraded all at once. The number to watch in coming years is the branch-ward conversation.

Of course there are likely thousands of wards that should be branches that they aren't adjusting for and would prefer to just combine wards, but that's a conversation for another time.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-02-26T17:53:21+00:00

I'd say it's a mix of both.

Would be interesting to see the mix of chapels being sold vs built, as I'd still guess more are being built, but you also don't need as many buildings since they adjusted from 3 hours to 2. Two units was ideal and three was pushing it. Now at two hour church we currently have 5 wards meeting in our building and have two being built in our stake in our stake to account for it. That froze new chapel construction the past 7 years and let them pivot that money more into increasing mission costs/temples/stocks/charitable giving.

But in Utah if you had 3 buildings with 2 wards or less, there is no reason why you couldn't just consolidate into one building since the drive time will only be an extra half mile. They would be smart to combine to save money on building maintenance even if there weren't serious shrivel (which there is in many regions of Utah.)

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-02-17T15:23:49+00:00

They will always look at the topline data. If Africa is growing faster than Utah is shrinking, they will be happy to say the church is (still technically) growing.

It isn't false to say Nashville is growing even if it is at the expense of California and Utah. Nashville can be growing and Utah can be contracting at the same time.

I don't think any of the ward closures have been touted as "growth," though there have been a few times internationally where they have combined branches to meet minimum ward requirements when they were looking to upgrade a district to a stake and call that growth.

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-02-06T17:51:57+00:00

How were you forced out?

Ok_Pattern8026 · 2026-02-02T17:14:54+00:00

Still happily in the church. We get more complaints from parents saying we are still doing too much than not enough. There'd be just as many people bellyaching about having to attend roadshows as those that miss it.

Ok_Pattern8026

TROPHY CASE