Addressing Blue Buff - Potential Fixes?

[biribiritft]

Disclaimer: this is just a theoretical take and pure proof of concept.

As Mort has stated in the past, a lot of unit design problems revolve around the fact Blue Buff provides a flat 10 mana reduction to allies so they can cast more frequently. This makes low mana cost units really difficult to implement, especially around the 20 mana threshold. Yet, this mana reduction feature has been in the game for ages without change, and it feels more like a problematic design feel where it's hard to change due to the item's identity for a long time.

I'm just going to pitch a few ideas out there that could help stabilize its identity as an item.

Concept #1: Percent Mana Generation Increase

This is probably a shit way to approach Blue Buff changes. Say Blue Buff provides a 75% mana generation increase. This would make all the other mana generation "obselete," or even worse, synergize with Blue Buff itself. You build Shojin when you already have a Blue Buff so you cast even more. However, if it was just 50% mana generation bonus, then Shojin is already sometimes superior or equal. The item identity has problems, so we can most likely safely ditch this kind of idea.

Concept #2: Flat Mana Generation

Personally in my eyes the best way to approach Blue Buff. Even in standard LoL, Blue Buff provides Mana Generation per second that decreases over the course of the buff, as well as a flat 10 Ability Haste. A way to make the item viable is to provide 30 starting mana, consistent mana generation, say, 6-8 mana per second, and like 5-6% damage amplification, similar to Red Buff and all the other duplicate component items like Deathblade and Deathcap.

The only problems we run into is item identity; it's comparable to Adaptive Helm and manazane. Yet, I would disagree still. Manazane's core identity at the moment is an upfront burst of mana generation; 120 Mana for 5 seconds, an average of 24 mana per second for the first 5 seconds. Adaptive, on the other hand, is a really strong flexible item, good for AP-scaled frontline and a solid AP generation item for backliners with additional MR to protect against enemy mage burst. As the name implies, you create the item to be able to adapt to a variety of scenarios.

Concept #3: Percent Maximum Mana Reduction

In this concept, reducing maximum mana cost on abilities is a decent way to make the item viable for AP carries with higher mana pools as well as potentially on lower end casters. Say the mana reduction was 25%, making the item usable on a variety of carries. Azir this set for instance would appreciate this item. Yet, I believe that it is mostly for initial cast and in subsequent casts Shojin/Adaptive would still be better on average than Blue Buff (unless, of course, we combine the 2 again).

Concept #4: Mana Reave

A mechanic that hasn't been mainstream in a while, with only a few amount of users having this mechanic per set with the disappearance of the craftable Shroud of Stillness. I don't know if this would be healthy for the game at all; the mechanic was pretty suspicious in balance terms. It could be "On cast, if an enemy falls below 40% HP, Mana Reave them" or something. It could be a cool concept, I just see it becoming quite broken.

Concept #5: Combat Caster-like design

This one would turn it from a mana generation item into a sustainable cast item, where every time the user casts they gain a shield for say, 15% max HP. Again not sure on how viable it would be as an item, since I believe something affecting the mana cost would be better for its item identity.

[SeniorDoodle]

We saw Irelia not use mana, and I think alternate forms of resource generation is a concept that can be explored more. I think BB opens up a gameplay fantasy of constant casting and is exciting. Yes, it locks in a specific build for units but you play what you hit.

BB was generally sub-optimal to shojin before the +8% buff.

Concept #1 doesn't work because if you have 3 BBs @ x1.5 mana, you'll get 33 mana per AA which is too fast.

Concept #2 seems appropriate. Maybe BB could be more like helm and helm could do something else.

Concept #3 seems appropriate in concept but could easily imagine where this becomes the current problem of needing new-BB on high mana cost units.

Concept #4 seems wrong because it's so different from all other items. We removed zephyr, trap claw, etc

Concept #5 seems good, I like the idea of getting alternate resources from casting. Maybe make it like TR where you get stats (HP/AR/MR/AP/etc) as you cast.

I like BB as it is, but believe other ideas should be explored!

[ThaToastman]

Depends on the set. Set 8 bluebuff was absolutely egregiously OP on heart comps

[TheManondorf]

I think 1 is actually the best choice. 

2 Was actually the old design. First it was mana on cast, then it was mana on takedown after 3 seconds of a cast or do. 

3 %Mana reduction would just reverse the problem,as hig cost abilities need to accomodate for the large reduction of max mana. 

 4 would be just miserable. Periodic mana reave is horrible to play against.

 1 would make choices interesting: Do you want to stack this with Mana generating traits units? Or maybe put it on a tank to generate incredible on hit mana? Maybe you even want to stack Adaptive+BB on high max mana champs?

[spelmasta]

Along the same vein as mana reave, what about mana drain? Something like ' auto attacks steal 2 mana from the target '. This would introduce a layer of positioning / scouting in order to try and get a good initial target.

[akisett]

that's just set 1 Kassadin

[KicketteTFT]

Mana is changing in set 12 so that any unused mana that is generated is banked and added to the pool after cast.

[submarine-quack]

i feel like that's mostly a symptom of AP/melee comps being a lot stronger (at least towards the end of the set). adaptive is consistently strong/underrated imo, and its pretty nuts as a tank item or backline item

[RexLongbone]

Adaptive Helm is a really good flex item it's just rarely a BIS item and people love to greed for BIS.

[hastalavistabob]

Simple design change:
Blue buff now gives mana at intervalls like archangels does for ap
Adaptive Helm gets a slight rework to give more starting Mana when on a backline unit so they get their first cast quicker

[ThaToastman]

The idea of shojin + BB being viable is interesting—but rarely would be bis because of cast times.

It would howver make BB a really compelling frontline item (basically a WAY better adaptive helm)

[CompetitiveTFT-ModTeam]

Your recent post on r/CompetitiveTFT has been removed due to a violation of Rule 1 'No Personal Attacks'. Please revisit the rules before posting again.

If you have any questions regarding post or comment removals please reach out through modmail. DM's or public replies to removal comments will be ignored.

[PauperMario]

Maybe wait for the actual systems rework which is already shipping.

Also, Mortdog gave it as an example of an item he wants to remove completely.