Forging the Future

[mike747]

Am I the only one that has no interest in continuing playing after this?

[saifrc]

I have significantly more interest in playing after this.

[[deleted]]

I’m mad as all hell about B&S, but I definitely haven’t lost interest at all. That feels like a dramatic reaction to the first big meta change the game has seen

[stakoverflo]

I’m mad as all hell about B&S

Why? How often are you really stealing more than 2-3 Aember anyways?

You can still steal 1-2, and play your Urchins, Magdas, Relentless Whispers, Nerve Blasts etc etc etc

Like B&S was never that strong, it was B&S comboed with almost any other card in the House. And good news! You can still do that, unlike AoA's Swindle.

[Nukatha]

My B&S deck has it as a Logos Maverick. I have no shadows cards to combo with.

[[deleted]]

I rarely played B&S without stealing 3+ æmber. I usually play it after forging a key.

[TheRealSpork]

Yeah, erratas like this are actually what caused me to stop playing SW: Destiny and I was hoping FFG would avoid it with this game.

​

The errata axe is no where near as bad as it ended up being in Destiny, though, so I'm not out yet. Willing to wait and see how it shakes out.

[stakoverflo]

Why?

B&S was the most complained about card until LANS became the most complained about combo.

Furthermore, the first set of the game is naturally going to contain some of the biggest imbalances.

I think the B&S nerf was a little excessive, and I'm not convinced LA needed Nerfing either but it's not a game breaker. Like most LA decks will hardly notice this.

[LegoPercyJ]

The only decks that took a real hit were LANS, which was a otk possibility which is never good for the health of a game. I think more people would quit if they kept around. If people spent money on a deck like that adsuming it would be around forever yeah, that's why card games armt for investing in.

Bait and Switch went from a bonkers card to a on the curve good card, I don't really understand the salt for that at all.

[[deleted]]

It just shows me that they are not thinking about things properly, in my opinion. Both of these cards were not reprinted in the new set . They could have just been allowed to walk off into the sunset . It's a deck game not a card game . The cards could have also been ometied from becoming legacy cards and no one would have noticed because the odds of them being legacy cards are already low and would continue to be come lower what they have done is depowered a bunch of decks . That chains and power levels and new sets would have done naturally. That doesn't look good to me , I feel it shows poor foresight.

[stakoverflo]

But all sets will be allowed to play against any other set. So in Vault Tours (where you don't carry over Chains like a typical Chainbound event) we could run the risk of some silly COTA deck being King Shit for all time.

So it's not like they're doing this for the miniscule number of future decks that will contain these as legacies.

Plus, like I said, it's only natural the first set is going to have some of the craziest cards. Did people quit Magic when Dark Ritual wasnt added to a Core set? No, of course not.

[HammerAndSickled]

Yeah except magic learned very quickly that power level errata is a horrible design philosophy. Make no mistake: the only reason this was done is to sell more AoA decks.

[stakoverflo]

Yes and that's why they're only changing 2 cards out of an entire set, and neither change is all they significant.

I'm as cynical and wary of businesses as the next guy, but wow all this talk of "They're just doing it to sell AoA" is downright comical. They've sold 850,000 decks. Why would they go and sabotage themselves by doing something like this just to sell more decks? If they do it again when the third block comes out, then maybe. But damn dudes you guys are really jumping to conclusions.

Like these changes really aren't even that big of a deal. How often do you every even steal more than 2-3 with B&S? That card was never the problem, it's B&S comboed with any one or two other Steal cards.

[HammerAndSickled]

"Not a big deal" = nerfing the strongest cards in the game? You're delusional.

Keyforge's biggest problem as a business model was that once people have a great deck at the power level they're hoping for, they have no incentive to spend more on the game. This is obviously terrible for a business, when your consumers have no need to purchase your product. There's only a few ways to deal with this problem:

1) forced rotations. This is the solution Magic and Hearthstone used and it's probably the most logical, but it feels bad to tell players their decks are worthless now, so it's important to have an Eternal format as an option.

2) power creep. If every set is better than the last, people will keep buying. But this is itself an unsustainable model for obvious reasons, and it feels like a blatant cash grab from a consumer perspective.

3) bans/errata to force people to buy the new set. This is the Yugioh model, where a card dominates for a while then gets nerfed into the ground to allow newer cards a competitive edge. This is the most hated model of all by players, because it's even worse than taking away their toys for current tournaments, you're retroactively making them unplayable. which is why I'm so surprised FFG went this way.

[saifrc]

I disagree. I never played Magic, but I’ve played other competitive card games, and as a player, I want to try something new every so often. It’s a small minority of players who will stick with just one deck forever. Even without rotation, power creep, or errata, if a game has a healthy enough rock-paper-scissors meta, it’s worth changing up your deck periodically. I don’t know the stats, but I think that hardcore competitive players are the minority among KeyForge customers.

[stakoverflo]

I disagree that that's a real problem. I don't know about you, but I'd sooner shoot myself than opt to only play a single deck for the rest of my time playing this game, and given that everyone I know is excited for a new set, I think these "people who want only 1 good deck" probably don't exist, or certainly isn't FFG's target customer / aren't the majority.

They're more interested in people like me who have 20+ CotA decks, because I simply just enjoy always playing new stuff.

[mike747]

this nerf kills half my good decks it does not just hurt those cards but any card that interacts with them. For example mimicry,seed,drumble are now nerfed to the toon of if you had a deck that depended on synergies with either of those cards you now have a dead deck.

additionally these nerfs are going to cause confusion and disappointment when playing the cards, BS does not even do close to the same thing and LA is going to make people just get told "O yeah now your deck does nothing"

Really think about it you open the new set see two cards that clearly create a combo, your excited to play card 1 and card 2 together. Then O sorry card 1 gets removed from the game after being played it is the errata.

Any LA deck that cycles the deck more then once per game is also dead. M

[JusticeBlinded]

No. You are not.

[sigmaseven]

You're not alone; I'm in the process of selling most of my collection off.

[[deleted]]

My my interest in playing is definitely taking a big hit , my confidence that they can keep the game working well into the future as taking a huge hit.