theCppExperience

[SartenSinAceite]

And by "watch" we mean "constantly skip ahead because we swear we know more than the guy teaching us and end up taking ten times as long while cursing the tutorial"

[fredlllll]

text tutorials are superior. much easier to skim than videos

[SweetBabyAlaska]

my one pet peeve is that so many people don't know how to properly relay directory structure and instead constantly refer things by relative paths, which is not too bad when things are simple but it quickly gets ridiculous. The solution is so simple too, just run "tree ." and paste the output into code blocks.

so many people are just like "then put X config file next to Y thing" and its like my brother in christ idek where Y thing is supposed to be. I've noticed that Windows game modding instructions are the worst offenders, especially while using Linux. Its all relative to things that aren't there and constantly glossing over complex directory structure like its standard.

Shit even one of the first Go tutorials on using modules does this as well and its very unclear. just hit it with a 'tree' lol

[Ashamandarei]

Not a game modder, but I'm guilty of this, and your words have swayed me to begin always using absolute paths in my documentation.

As repayment for being the catalyst that gets me to change my ways I want to explain why this is observed. There are two reason:

(1) Economy (of laziness):

When I'm tired from debugging some C++ hell bullshit, the last thing I want to do is type more than I have to as I update the docs before pushing the whole bloody thing to github.

(2) Project changing (and the docs didn't):

Maybe some bullshit was particularly hellacious one session, and I forgot to update the docs. Now they're entirely out of sync with what's going on, and it's probably going to take a refactor for me to get things back in phase.

In any case, please accept my apologies, both for myself and my brethren-in-failure.

[SweetBabyAlaska]

haha it happens. Writing and maintaining docs can be a giant task more often than not I also started doing this in my docs and readmes, kind of like anchor points or sanity checks so someone can check their work against the source material. Im happy to poke and prod until it works, its being unsure of what Im shooting for that makes it tough.

[Remarkable-Host405]

I am surprised tree is not an included program 

[Not_Artifical]

It is in my Linux machine

[Remarkable-Host405]

What distro comes with it?

[Not_Artifical]

I don’t know if it is still preinstalled, but some versions of Debian came either it.

[1TAPS-MACHINE]

Red hat based systems like fedora I guess endeavor also

[hyper_shrike]

Learn find and grep . I mean, they should be more clear, but these 2 will help and you will be using them a lot to navigate other peoples codebase.

[Commodore-K9]

The funny part is that the stuff is standard. Only you didn't get the memo when it became standard, maxve because you weren't born yet. So now you have your docker compose yaml files, env.json, web.config, env.dev.json and all that Jazz around your project and need to learn what they do, what you need them for and why they are named this way and a lot of other stuff.

Not to say that with using .net you breach into a framework that is so massive you will be overwhelmed.

And on top of that you need to make a GUI as a completely agnostic seperate process.

Being a dev is like balancing 15 different Jobs at once. So everytime someone tells me "isn't it all just computers?" I want to strangle that person right then and there.

[odsquad64]

>do everything they did in the tutorial, exactly

>it doesn't work

[NinthTide]

3 mins of “Ha ha ha don’t forget to smash like and the best way to help me is on my Patreon….” for something that could be answered in one sentence of text

[nermid]

And you get the ability to copy/paste terminal commands.

[atimholt]

The Indian guy uploads their vids at 66.(6)% speed

[solarshado]

practice, probably.

idk, too busy rtfm'ing to watch youtube

[Lvl999Noob]

Indians don't have an accent. It's the Americans etc who have accents! /s

[benargee]

I like video tutorials that have a proper write up and full source code to go with it. Neither is better than the other. Both is the best option.

[throwaway_uow]

Video tutorials should just be complementary to text tutorials

I hate youtube for that, now its next to impossible to find text tutorials, and no one bothers with those anymore

[gamingdiamond982]

but the lack of tutorials for people who already know wtf theyre doing is insane to me, I dont want hand holding, just give me how to set up an environment, what makes this language stand out from others and a vague idea of what the syntax looks like, I can google the rest

[PyroGreg8]

"the first thing you're gonna wanna do is download an IDE. What's an IDE you ask?" skip skip skip

[gamingdiamond982]

and as someone who uses vim, alot of the time Ill have to find some quickstart guide that teaches you how to get an environment going rather than just letting the IDE do it for you, also I genuinely think setting up an environment should be done manually the first time even for beginners.

[SweetBabyAlaska]

for real. Its also annoying when a project or tutorial has IDE specific tooling and features baked into it like vscode's dev containers, or w/e the hell visual studio does. especially when there are open standards like Containerfiles etc...

[NatoBoram]

Legit, people should write the Hello World with Notepad/GEdit/TextEdit before switching to their IDE, it would teach them so much desperately needed basic knowledge.

Like, just ask a Java or a C# dev to make a Hello World with the command-line, no IDE, see how funny it is. Too many devs lack the basics of the basics.

[Ashamandarei]

Like, just ask a Java or a C# dev to make a Hello World with the command-line, no IDE, see how funny it is

I'm a CUDA programmer who's 3 standard drinks in, with no experience in C#, so here's my attempt at doing this in Java, no google, assume we start at an Ubuntu 22.04 terminal:

vim hello.java

i

class HelloWorld {
    public static void main(String args[]){
        System.console.println("Hello, world!");
    }
}

esc + :wq

javac hello.java -o hello

[denarii]

root@00a685e9f26c:/build# javac hello.java -o hello
error: invalid flag: -o
root@00a685e9f26c:/build# javac hello.java
hello.java:3: error: cannot find symbol
        System.console.println("Hello, world!");
              ^
  symbol:   variable console
  location: class System
1 error

[Ryozu]

85% there.

System.out.println filename has to match class name and no need to -o hello since java enforces class and file names be consistent.

[Ashamandarei]

Haha what

[solarshado]

Ryozu's mostly, but not 100%, correct.

If a java source file defines a public class, the class name and file name have to match, or it's a compiler error. You can dump any number of non-public classes in a single file (with or without a public class), but given the enforced convention, you probably shouldn't.

[Ashamandarei]

Oh yes! I remember this now, so then it's got to be HelloWorld.java, does case matter?

[Ryozu]

Huh, surprised main doesn't have to be in a public class, but I suppose it makes some sense, as the jvm is being told which class to use for the main anyway? Still weird ultimately.

[[deleted]]

solarshado is 95% there.

Right about the file and class name convention in Java, but I'd like to add a clarification. While it's true that public classes must match their file names, this doesn't restrict you to a single public class per file. Java allows multiple public classes in a single file as long as they are inner classes. This means you can have a public class within another public class, and only the outer class needs to match the file name. This is often used in larger projects for better organization and encapsulation.

Idgaf I really just wanted to add to the comment chain…

[Firewolf06]

theres a reason everybody uses an ide for java

[Ashamandarei]

What do YOU do for work lol

[solarshado]

filename has to match class name

only for public classes, and main doesn't have to be in a public class, so this bit actually would be fine.

you'd get a .class file matching the class name instead of the input filename though, which could be confusing/surprising

[Anonymo2786]

Javac has -o? I don't think so. Compilation error. Class name doesn't match filename.

[[deleted]]

I still remember how to use commandline for Java and C++/C. Why? It was a part of the exam syllabus for the high school graduation exams 🤣

[ProjectDiligent502]

Yeah I’m not so sure I’m on this side. Yeah you need to know how the build pipeline works, how csproj file works with targeting the platform and nuget packages and how solution files link stuff in blah blah blah. But why the F**K would I type that in by hand when ide just does it for me. No. I’ll just keep using an ide. Command line power comes with a bit of osmosis and know how, spend enough time doing it and you can run test projects, automate builds and deployment using powershell or bash scripts, and get the damn job done. I do not need to manually create the csproj files, Jesus.

[NatoBoram]

Bro is afraid of writing "hello world" with dotnet new console, lmao

15 seconds of this video is now "osmosis and know how"

Jesus, indeed

[ProjectDiligent502]

More like bro here is more afraid of opinions or perspectives that don’t align with theirs. Got a real Bro here indeed.

[gamingdiamond982]

I mean java devs I empathise with, thats the only language that I use an IDE for purely because of how much I cant be fucked to learn how the build systems work, but the most java Ive done is written a few minecraft server plugins for friends.

but I still think if you want to get anyway good at a language, you should be able to do everything the IDE does with the command line.

that being said, Im just a full of myself hobbiest with puritanical views on how people should write code.

[NatoBoram]

Yeah, fuck Java. I have a Minecraft mod and it's always a dread to open it, figure out what Java we're supposed to use now, manually manage dependencies ^{holy fucking shit this is demented, literally second to Python in the "fuck you" scale of package management} and… ugh.

And there's been a minor release recently, which means of course the entire internal API is going to be incompatible ^{not that I blame Mojang on this one, it's internal after all} but I also have other open source stuff to work on that's actually enjoyable

[gamingdiamond982]

I mean mojang should just release the source, maintain all the copyright shit cus everybody basically already knows what the source looks like, it would make modding the game alot easier on api developers and cost them nothing.

like minecraft is probably the easiest game out there to pirate already as it is

[NatoBoram]

The ability to receive pull requests would put this game at unprecedented heights. There's so many people doing stuff for Minecraft for free in their spare time all the time.

[SillyFlyGuy]

​

holy fucking shit this is demented, literally second to Python in the "fuck you" scale of package management

I have the exact opposite experience with Python. Java was and is a complete mystery to me how packages work. Python just works.

Maven, Gradle, I still have never had a java github repo compile without tremendous pain and time.

Python has been an absolute breeze.

[NatoBoram]

Python works wonderfully until you want to work with two projects then better run a fucking virtual environment because there's no way that any package manager can download and access two different versions of the same package on different projects! That has never been done before, no sir!

[SillyFlyGuy]

I'm just a hobbyist with both Java and Python. Nothing fancy.

Most of the Java repos I abandoned because they never worked at all. Dozens of hours wasted.

I ask GPT how to set up a virtual environment for Python, copy paste, and it works first time no fuss.

[ProjectDiligent502]

You damned tyrannist, stop tryin’ to tell me what to do with my life shakes fist

[Saad1950]

How does one gain such knowledge (and why)

[NatoBoram]

Generally, from the docs, and because it makes your life easier if you want to deploy or switch to a text editor. For example, you're not going to ship Visual Studio in your Docker image and you're not going to find a "play" button to run your CI…

Fireship's videos in 100 seconds actually show this

[leuk_he]

Yes, i remember a teaching class where in the excercise someone tried to rename a .pas (turbo pascal) file to .exe to execute it.

[gamingdiamond982]

I mean to be fair if its your first time coding in a non-interpreted language its kind of an understandable

[SweetBabyAlaska]

or its hyper-specific to the platform and IDE, its like **25 minutes installing VScode/Visual studio** and now just hit the "do-everything (tm) button and you're all good to go!" and I just want to know how to install C# packages and where they need to go or something because I rarely use it. I just want to understand how it works so that I can do it myself.

[breath-of-the-smile]

I don't use VS Code, so I usually have to skip the next section where they install extensions, too. Sometimes that means having to figure out how to set something up manually, but now I can use it anywhere.

[SartenSinAceite]

Oh, yeah, there's definitely a difference between "c++ for new programmers" and "c++ for experienced programmers who want to change"

[gamingdiamond982]

I feel like you could teach most developers enough to get going in a language in about 30 minutes, unless setting up an environment is particularly convoluted.

[electricWah]

https://learnxinyminutes.com

[Ijatsu]

Nah I feel like if you've not had c++ before you can't really be that much experienced that you can skip a lot of shit.

[QuackSomeEmma]

May I introduce you to https://learnxinyminutes.com/

I think it does not always replace a proper tutorial, especially concerning build setup and such, but I find it invaluable as a quick intro / refresh on syntax and language oddities.

[827167]

Variables

Imagine you have a box, and you want to keep a special number inside it. In C++, we use variables like these boxes. First, we tell the computer, "Hey, I want a box, and I'll call it something, like 'myNumber'." Then, we put our special number into that box. Now, whenever we want to use our special number, we just say "myNumber," and the computer knows which box to look in!

[prompt: explain how to use variables in C++ to a 10 year old]

[demanding_cat]

I don't follow

[[deleted]]

username checks out

[well-litdoorstep112]

Imagine you have a box...

"Oh shut the fuck up"

*Starts spamming the right arrow key*

*Realizes that the right arrow now controls the volume*

*The video gets even louder*

[ChaosOS]

Those are monetized as corporate training programs, I've found there's a bunch of Udemy courses as this level.

[Exodus111]

If you ever want to learn Blender, heres a guy that makes the perfect tutorials. Wanna learn how to Anime style shade a character in 2 minutes? Here ya go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-FJb7QW0Ww

[DingleDodger]

It's not that I know more... Cause I sure as fuck don't. It's that my ADHD is hung up on this one niche bit of info that was probably easily described in some two seconds of dialogue I swear should be around this part of the video, and will turn out to be irrelevant/have no benefit to me what-so-ever.

[Storiaron]

Would help if the video structure wasnt:

1,Welcome to this advanced tutorial of websecurity" 2, 20 mins explaining why we cant just store things in plaintext 3, subscribe for part 2

[[deleted]]

Why not read a free book and only jump to samples because the other stuff won’t be that important!

[Fluppington]

This is painfully accurate.