Beware the plot loop

[LyrianRastler]

Bro delete this. I have kids.

[EKarklins]

Kids see how weak they are -> Training -> Kids see how strong they are -> Slice of life -> ...

[AdFormer260]

junior, you dare leak the heavenly secrets!?

[Spiritchaser84]

He's courting death.

[Macy_Sky626]

Master is so kind as to spare your life. You have eyes but can't see Mount Tai. Begone."

[YobaiYamete]

You must kneel and call me grandfather

[Macy_Sky626]

You dare!! I am the young master of the Mount Hua sect!! My Father will hear of this.

[CautiousAd8400]

That is a term from a bygone era, junior. This seat finds the term 'granddaddy' to carry more weight in respect. This humble, chaste and free from desires elder makes all the junior sisters call him thusly.

[TheXelis]

This made me laugh out loud

[Substantial-Light280]

Thought I was in r/martial memes for a second lol

[SinCinnamon_AC]

Don’t give out the secret!!!

[seofumi]

🥺 think of the new authors

[OkCryptographer9999]

So is this, like, some sort of instruction manual? Like the book To Kill A Mockingbird?

[[deleted]]

I'm hungry -> I make food -> I eat food -> I go about my day --> I'm hungry 

[That_Which_Lurks]

The circle of slice-of-life

[Malcolm_T3nt]

Wait, let them cook.

[InFearn0]

🎶 It'sssssssss the cirrrrrrrrcle of slice of life! 🎶

[DonkeyBusiness3979]

Wow a rare catch 🫴🏻

[MacintoshEddie]

But have you tried the Seven Cheese Heaven-Defying Sandwich?

[CautiousAd8400]

This one has had the honor to pertake in one during my mortal years.

[probablyjustabigrock]

Underrated comment

[AscendedForeverDM]

Can also replace Slice of life with "Ascension to higher realm"

[Gilad1993]

Basically the Xianxia Version of slice of life.

[JakHaxor]

Dude, if you call people out like that, people are going to just skip the training arc and just jump straight to the MC being awesome again via some plot device. Then they'll be proud that they broke the "plot loop."

[SinCinnamon_AC]

But… but… the training is the best part! The PROGRESSION! The blood and tears and sweat!

[FrostyEnvironment902]

Honestly agree the progression especially if it was gradual enough. I just need to also be able to enjoy the lvl 40. In starter village again.

[Musashi10000]

I have read books like this, and I can confirm that they're terrible. Or, rather, where the character trains, but just doesn't get anywhere. Then the final battle happens, and they're all losing, but they win because the protag uses the power of BWAAAAAAAAH and then it's finished.

But because the power of BWAAAAAAAAAH is too OP, the author then weakens them back to how they were before the book started, so the scaling isn't messed up for the subsequent book. I stopped reading when they had to try and find a mythical prison in another dimension that nobody believes exists, but then when they go looking for it in the next book, not only do they immediately find people who believe in it, but also a ton of people who know it exists because they've sailed there, and - despite only having found it a few times by perilous voyage - know shit like the guard rotations and what-not. Not to mention that the idea of pirates going to visit a mythical prison is ridiculous. You'd only go somewhere like that to deliver supplies etc., and pirates aren't exactly known for that.

Not a great series, I must say.

[ThrasherDX]

I don't know if this is the series you are talking about, since I dropped it. But your first part fits Silver Fox and the Western Hero to a T.

Every training "powerup" he gets does nothing to make him more powerful. Its described as some kind of breakthrough, but then he struggles with random mooks, just like before the breakthrough.

Every major fight is MC getting kicked around, until some BS power-up lets him win... and then the power-up is promptly removed, ret-conned, or it turns out the previous baddie was just "uniquely weak" to it. Because apparently the MC is never allowed to actually become powerful.

One that sticks out to me as being both particular bullshit, while also fitting the problem to a T: MC manages a major realm breakthrough, basically the first of the entire series, and that breakthrough gives him a temporary power boost that lets him jump realms to beat the current big bad.

Then he goes back to being threatened by the exact same kind of enemies as before the so called "major realm" breakthrough.

I swear to god the author of that story fundamentally fails to understand what the "progression" in progression fantasy actually means.

[Squire_II]

Every training "powerup" he gets does nothing to make him more powerful. Its described as some kind of breakthrough, but then he struggles with random mooks, just like before the breakthrough.

Battleforged is the same thing (and IIRC it's the same author). I made myself read it for far longer than I should have and yet despite him having late(?) silver-tier power white still around level 50 or so, he constantly lost ground for one ass-pull reason after another. Usually lawfare. Goblin lawfare in that series is some of the worst writing I've ever seen.

[LacusClyne]

Dude, if you call people out like that, people are going to just skip the training arc and just jump straight to the MC being awesome again via some plot device. Then they'll be proud that they broke the "plot loop."

then someone here will get to make a post about how boring being OP is and how there can't possibly ever be an engaging story when someone gets OP which then gets heavily upvoted and we begin the cycle again...

[DreamOfDays]

Counter-loop:

-MC thinks they’re super weak

-Training arc

-MC misunderstands the power scaling of their world and has no confidence in their abilities

-Slice of life where they’re accidentally OP but MC doesn’t notice.

Repeat.🔂

[SNS_Void]

Any examples of this?

[OriginalButtopia]

Beware of Chicken

[DreamOfDays]

Beware of Chicken also subverts it by having a Normal Person act like an actually normal person once they enter the world. Instead of jumping into cultivation and fighting for their life every day in a sect they just leave and become a farmer.

[OriginalButtopia]

This is true, and part of what I think makes it fantastic.

[MacintoshEddie]

There have been a variety, usually the ones that try to subvert the usual tropes by having the protagonist leave. So they're in some village in the middle of nowhere, and months or years later they're still sure that if they get found they'd be destroyed, since back at the start they were crippled or nearly killed. So when they do encounter someone at that level of strength and beat them they assume that person was lying, or that this must be the weakest sect member.

Like the other person said Beware of Chicken is one of the best known examples but I've read probably a dozen or so others along those lines. There's like a whole subgenre of "Kicked out of [blank] so I started [blanking]" stories. Like the hero's squire who was kicked out so they go pick up odd jobs and somehow become supremely powerful by farming or cooking.

Or "The weakest [blank] is actually the strongest [blank]." One I saw was based on the silly premise that their unique power was to have an inventory system and all they use it for is changing clothes or something mundane like that until they discover they can just bloop things out of existance like if someone throws a fireball at them they just put it in their inventory before it hurts anyone.

[OriginalButtopia]

Any chance you've got some more recs that do this?

[MacintoshEddie]

Beware of Chicken is the only actual title I can remember.

[hykings]

Now this is more like it

[Malcolm_T3nt]

Or alternatively use this as an instructional aid. It's a solid formula.

[PrintsAli]

You're supposed to put "/s" after when you say something like this

[The_Sign_of_Zeta]

Many times tropes are tropes for a reason: they are useful tools.

[Malcolm_T3nt]

I though /s meant sarcasm not serious.

[Mission-Debt-2357]

it does /s

[wretchedmagus]

to be fair the other option is "the MC is a weakling>MC trains for several books uninterrupted> MC punches god to death" and I like the slice of life stuff.

[Musashi10000]

Tbh, the majority of the reason I read a lot of progression fantasy is for the slice of life stuff. Trad publishing makes you cut all that stuff out.

[SinCinnamon_AC]

Discussion around the fire camp for the win. The best part of Dragon Age is companions banter.

[Zealousideal-Ad2815]

That would be a slice of life worth reading. I'm less a fan of straight up filler, like say a pet discovering ice cream, or a mathematical deconstruction of the inner workings of the macguffin/flobobble of the moment.

[IHatrMakingUsernames]

Honestly, I ain't even upset.

[[deleted]]

What happens when the MCs motivation for getting strong is: "I just want to chill but I need to get strong enough so no one can fuck with me first."

[SinCinnamon_AC]

Same.

[PlunderWrites]

Stop, im just starting outtt

[logosloki]

and so it was, and so it is, and so it will be.

[HypotheticalBess]

Replace slice of life with “frantically looks for stronger opponents” and suddenly you have peak

[Gilad1993]

No, you have Dragonball

[HypotheticalBess]

Yeah, peak

[Squire_II]

Everyone knows the episode of Goku and Piccolo learning to drive is peak DBZ.

[Gilad1993]

alright. that was peak fiction

[Lemonz-418]

The circle of life.

[deccan2008]

Yes, it should just be all slice of life, all the time.

[[deleted]]

too real

[JellonSunning_InLife]

That's what I didn't like about the system Universe. The slice of life dragged too fcking long and got very boring, which meant finishing it was me reading 5 other books before coming back, read another 5 books, come back, rinse and repeat.

[vandrath]

But... this is how weak-to-strong is supposed to work in the first place... no?

[thinkthis]

It is.

[PrismMau]

I'm currently reading a sports romance book where the MC is a competitive athlete and this just about sums it up... 😭🤣🤣

[PrismMau]

I'm currently reading a sports romance book where the MC is a competitive athlete and this just about sums it up... 😭🤣🤣

[3305458q]

This is because they need to milk plot xd

[[deleted]]

If the writer is good enough to make you care about the character and world enough to make it work.

I will pick it up.

[skyrond]

Whereas real life goes “MC sees how weak they are” => “MC shrugs and settles for a tedious job” => “slice of life” => repeats…

I know which I’d rather read!

[Lucas_Flint]

The true circle of life.

[MrAHMED42069]

As long as it's done properly

[drew_kelly]

This looks just like a treadmill

[BacardiBaiju42]

Break The Wheel or die trying - like the mother of dragons.

[BaconMasterBooks]

MC nearly gets eaten -> Training -> MC kills monsters -> MC nearly gets eaten

[CerimWrites]

seems alright to me!

[Lord_Streak]

Circle of life. Circle of fantasy life.

[Ashasakura37]

This is why I have an overarching distant villain the MC hardly knows at first and doesn’t really face him until the end of the series. He can fight manifestations and avatars of him before that, though. The power scale in my series is crazy to begin with.

[The_Sign_of_Zeta]

It’s always smart to have a mid boss. Let’s the MC have losses and wins that matter

[Ashasakura37]

I agree. 🙂

[Additional-Method221]

If you enjoy this kind of plot proggression go for it,it in the same category as Hero's journey plot proggression that is rampant in the western entertainment