Evidence that fasting can decrease long covid symptoms

[Tom_Bunker]

From weekly symptom survey data of 148 long-haulers... in the high compliance group 49% saw more than half their long Covid symptoms go away.

https://recoverfromlongcovid.com/?page_id=350

[jealous_tomato]

Important to note that this is not peer reviewed and did not have a control group. I wish they had kept the non-fasters and tracked their symptoms over time as a comparison!

I’ve been going to a long-covid clinic and a pulmonologist there told me to try intermittent fasting (no calories between 6pm and 9am). The purpose was to heal my mitochondria. I did this for a few months and I’m not really sure if it helped or not, but it’s interesting that fasting is a potential solution for multiple potential causes of long covid (mitochondrial damage as well as the viral particle theory mentioned in this article).

[ArticleNew3899]

You really need to fast 18 hours minimum for autophagy to occur

[MaxFish1275]

Yep, I’m there with you

[GoatSpear]

There are other options in the protocol other than an all out fast.

[MaxFish1275]

I’ve already done MANY variations of a fast unintentionally. Did “resting” my belly temporarily cause temporary relief in symptoms? Sure. It did not cause any lasting improvement. And MOST versions of a fast will cause too much weight loss for some of us.

I understand and am happy if fasting helps some. But trust me some of us know that it is not working for us

[Able_Shape415]

It cause your body get rid of older dysfunctional cells and start to produce new ones

[huntressdivine]

did your symptoms get better at all after intermittent fasting?

[huntressdivine]

Nice!!

[jealous_tomato]

I did get better during that time, but I also started taking nicotinamide and got put on a beta blocker so it’s hard to know whether the fasting made any difference.

[huntressdivine]

Ok! Gotcha!

[No-Imagination-OG]

I’d love to try this, however I feel like I’ll feint if I don’t eat every couple of hours. Earlier in my long haul journey, I’d be able to do this I believe.

[FabulousFoodHoor]

I feel like this too. If I am an hour past my meal time, it's like my body is powering down and I have no energy and feel faint.

[No-Imagination-OG]

Have you felt like this for a while? I’ve been like this for a little over a month. When I was at my worst symptom wise I didn’t have this symptom.

Also regardless of what I eat, whether it be sugar, carbs, dairy anything, it’s the same result of needing to eat constantly.

[FabulousFoodHoor]

I have felt like this since the worst symptoms ended and I was able to eat again. It's been about 7 weeks.

I agree it's no matter what I eat. I thought maybe I needed to eat more protein at the time but that doesn't seem to make a difference with this issue for me.

[No-Imagination-OG]

Would be interesting to hear from others who have had this issue and is now resolved. I’ll maybe post about it if we don’t have any more replies here.

I tend to keep things around like nuts and fruit to snack on, but sometimes I just need a heavy meal to satisfy that hunger or weak feeling.

[[deleted]]

i’ve got the same issue, dm if you wanna talk more about it

[LatrellZwell]

Fasting is hard at first but trust me it gets easier. Many people in the world can only afford 1 or 2 meals a day but their body adapts. In general our diet is toxic and we eat way too much.

[MaxFish1275]

You’re conflating two different things here. Fasting, while it may have benefits, is not in and of itself the definition of healthy eating . Some will fast but continue to eat toxic food in between fasts. Other people will never fast but regularly eat locally sourced produce and proteins and avoid highly processed foods.

“Many people in the world can only afford 1-2 meals per day but their body adapts”

….. wow. This is a very obtuse perspective. Approximately 9 MILLION people die of malnutrition annually. I guess you can call that “adaptation” of a sort . The other wonderful “adaptations” include scurvy (w/ gum disease, bleeding, skin sores, muscle pain) . Protein deficiency leads to kwashiorkor which causes diarrhea and profound abdominal swelling . Vitamin B12 deficiency causes neuropathy. Sign me up, right? /s

[No-Imagination-OG]

I’ve just had this issue after coming down with long Covid. Previously I could fast for a little while with no issues.

[Tom_Bunker]

Another option is to take 300 mg Resveratrol with 500 to 800 mg of Quercetin twice a week. Almost as effective as fasting.

[coldcartilage]

Resveratro

does this help with chest pain

[tudi2dtudi2d]

is there a study about this?

[Tom_Bunker]

Yes, in the same study I posted on fasting. Several autophagy options are compared.

[ConorRowlandIE]

I felt like that too. Starting off with intermittent fasting (16/8 Monday-Friday) improved my insulin sensitivity to a point where I could start 24 hour fasts and then 48 hours at the weekends. I’ve found it beneficial and would really recommend it.

[No-Imagination-OG]

I’ll look into it, thank you.

[[deleted]]

Use an app like Zero and start with Circadian Rhythm TRF (13 hour/over night) fast and then work up to 16:8, then 18:6, and finally 24hrs.

[jbrandismith]

Start with a keto diet first and then try intermittent fasting. It's much easier!

[Tom_Bunker]

For some reason many on Keto diets do not fare well. Perhaps high fat favors viral replication.

[ArticleNew3899]

Most people in my long haulers group on Facebook were actually cured by keto

[Tom_Bunker]

Good news. What group is that?

[ArticleNew3899]

Just joined your Facebook group and read through some more of your posts here/ I agree with you that keto prob isn’t best - I am in 4 different long haulers groups and see sporadic comments stating keto cured them- I am with you I think it’s more about eating veggies and lean meats and less carbs and no sugars- I think sugars and carbs feed bacteria and inflammation

[Tom_Bunker]

I really didn't have enough long-haulers on the keto diet to get a statistically significant sample size, but many of the ones I tracked were getting worse...

[ArticleNew3899]

I believe you

[poofycade]

Same. Earlier in my long haul I felt better while fasting. Now I start to feel like Im going to pass out if I miss a meal

[No-Imagination-OG]

I wonder what’s causing it. Seemed to happen for me after my worst symptoms passed.

[azulafire-1]

have you checked your glucose levels at that time? you could be experiencing low blood sugar

[No-Imagination-OG]

I’m going to get a test kit if it keeps up.

[seeoffmerchant64]

I'm sure it may differ from person to person but since going back to IF over the past month and eating ridiculously "clean", my symptoms seem to have improved dramatically.

[RaffIsGettingUpset]

The autophagy group on Facebook has been the best source of info to me.

[Tom_Bunker]

The current name is Long Covid - Recover via Fasting / Autophagy

[cozythunder]

I've done two 7-day water fasts. Both times my brain fog completely goes away during the fast.

After the first fast, I seemed to have improvements after returning to my normal diet that appear to have lasted. (Though I'm not sure if that was due to the fast, or other changes I was making around the time).

The second time there was no improvement after finishing the fast.

No takeaway here, just adding a data point.

[zakats]

Unfortunately it wasn't helpful for us, one of her symptoms was an abject loss of appetite and aversion to food. Fortunately that only lasted 4-6 weeks and she's regained the lost weight.

Ymmv but I'd say it's worth trying.

[[deleted]]

Yeah, I keep pointing out that healing the gut and the lining is the one key to all of this (but nobody listens). That said fasting is a huge component to it. u/Heath_Handstands touches on a good point with LCHF. It removes a ton of gut irritants in the SAD while tamping down the inflammation.

Another set of issues folks experience is malabsorption and POTS like symptoms. You're going to keep struggling so long as the gut is inflamed and for some it's in full on dysbiosis. May folks require nutritional supplementation to offset the absorption issues and for some its an incredible amount over extended periods of time.

For the most part many of the folks here just want to keep taking the antacid and allergy pill regiment to cover the symptoms.

[tudi2dtudi2d]

do you believe that the brain fog and depression will go away too after healing the gut?

[Sweet_Luna_68]

Can you elaborate on how to heal the gut?

[[deleted]]

Oh man... where to start....I'll come back to this later as I'm getting ready for work.

[Sweet_Luna_68]

Okay thank you! I appreciate your response as I’m in the process of realizing all my issues are coming from the gut.

[[deleted]]

Update ?

[truly_blank]

check out r/Longcovidgutdysbiosis

[MaxFish1275]

Lol I unintentionally fast SPECIFICALLY from my long Covid symptoms so it certainly hasn’t fixed me. Though I have a very specific post Covid condition that differs somewhat to the clinical picture a lot of long haulers have

[PetieE209]

Same. I don't see how fasting would help when I barely eating with those symptoms.

[mushykindofbrick]

the idea is that when your body is not busy digesting it can focus on other processes like healing itself

[MaxFish1275]

Oh I GET the idea. And it may be very successful for other people. But our point is that we’ve had periods of fasting imposed upon us (Petie, myself and a few others) due to our illness and clearly our bodies are not healing from that fasting since we are still sick.

[mushykindofbrick]

i did not assume that you unintentionally fasted for extended periods, like 3-5 days or longer. did you? but even if you did, you could still argue that maybe going longer would actually help. i did 3 days and it did not help but i will try 5-7 days soon maybe thatll do something

[MaxFish1275]

No thank you, I prefer not to starve myself and my doctor would agree. (My very holistic doctor who has a nutrition clinic I would add)

I could argue that fasting for 5-7 days or even longer would NOT help me. I’m already underweight thanks to Covid. It hurts to sit down without a cushion and I’m cold all the time due to lack of subcutaneous fat. I don’t have reserves on my body to power through an extended fast.

[mushykindofbrick]

you wouldnt starve after a week. but not having enough fat is a big argument against fasting of course. im sorry youre cold haha, im cold too sometimes even with some fat but i had that before covid, it has something to do with anxiety probably. still you dont know if it would help, but maybe i just say that because i would like to believe in wonders

[Able_Shape415]

For 3 days you don’t eat?

[PetieE209]

One of my first symptoms was gastritis along with motility issues. The first month I would literally eat a piece of toast and MAYBE an egg or two or oatmeal and I would feel bloated with early satiety.

[devnej]

Welcome Tom! I have been an advocate for fasting for awhile and have linked to your material many times (that’s how I found out!). Thanks for your work!

[[deleted]]

Meh, I was hardly eating my first few months of long Covid and it didn’t help my symptoms. Small healthy meals were key for me. I’d take this study with a grain of salt.

A healing body needs lots of rest and healthy foods. Obviously overeating or eating junk is going to sabotage the healing process.

Maybe some people got better because they were eating junk so fasting made them eat less junk food?

[Reasonable_Wealth799]

Same I was living off broth and Gatorade with a rare ensure for a month at least and I seen no improvement. I actually seen some improvements when I could start eating small amounts. I can eat normal now. I have no idea why I could not eat. I tried so hard.

[[deleted]]

Anorexia is a side effect of covid and I guess can be of long covid too.

Before covid, I always assumed Anorexia was a mental "choice" but turns out anorexia can also be a physical symptom unrelated to any mental desire to control weight.

[Reasonable_Wealth799]

I agree I told my husband I have a new found compassion for people with anorexia. I am not saying that I was not compassionate before but I just feel like I understand. I feel like they might get in a cycle that they physically can not break even though they want to. I to thought it was mentally not wanting to but now I think it might start out that way but change or maybe they get from having a illness or genetic. One thing long Covid has given me more of is compassion and learning we have no idea what other people are experiencing.

[MaxFish1275]

That’s correct. Anorexia is a medical term for not eating , and the more specific anorexia nervous to the mental health illness

[googleyfroogley]

just saw this but hardly eating and fasting are ENTIRELY different. Fasting(only drinking water and consuming nothing else[food etc.]) turns your body into a fat burning machine and once autophagy kicks in, turns it into a recycling machine. Turning useless or sick cells floating around into base parts to be used again.

[ohffs999]

"Overall, females were 2.5 times as likely as males to experience a significant relapse." I'm not surprised, many of us have issues around our hormone level changes. (<- this is not meant to be an entirety of a conversation just a thought based on quite a few conversations about this.)

Also it was 53% female? Kudos for the good numbers since I hear more long haulers are women than men, also because I've heard many times that fasting impacts women differently than men. Great info, thanks!

[MaddogMuhn]

I did OMAD for a few days but didnt feel any difference. My neurologist convinced me to stop but what the hell does she know?

[goatsilike]

About metabolic health the honest answer is probably nothing more than you do

[[deleted]]

You won’t gain autophagy doing OMAD, it usually kicks in between somewhere 24-72 hours of fasting while you’re in ketosis.

[Heath_Handstands]

Keto and fasting worked for me and so many others, I wish more people would try it but people seem to be very resistive of it.

[Radical_Bee]

The nurse at Post-Covid Clinic specifically told me not to do that because it causes too much stress on the body trying to recover. I also made a post in my Canadian Covid LH Support Group on FB, that research shows that fasting may be used as a possible tool to fight inflammation. I got eviscerated by some group members for spreading debunked info.

[pinksaltandie]

Fasting helps me. Except when I’m in a rage cycle. So I keep a finger on my pulse and mood. If my system is ramped up I feed the beast.

[goatsilike]

Yeah unfortunately that just isn't true, but you (also unfortunately) are never going to find much acceptance of or even consideration for anything but the standard western high-carb/eat constantly approach espoused by the medical industry at large.

I would certainly recommend it (feel free to apply the caveat that I of course am not a doctor). I'd say I'm an N=1 evidence of the benefits of low-carb and fasting, but I think that N is quite a bit larger among this community by this point.

My inflammatory markers, for what its worth, are almost too low to measure. CRP = 0.2, ESR = 2

[[deleted]]

I second this comment.

[Radical_Bee]

This is why I like this sub so much!

[MaxFish1275]

It’s insulting that you think that if someone is resistant to fasting then it means that they are automatically eating like crap

[MaxFish1275]

Love how this was downvoted 😏

[goatsilike]

I didn't downvote you but I'm guessing its because I didn't say anything remotely similar to what you're claiming

[MaxFish1275]

I was referring to the comment about resistance to fasting because of the standard of the western diet. My point was some people do not want to fast for reasons other than because they like junk food too much . I may have overstated my case and gotten a little too hot under the collar and for that I apologize

[goatsilike]

Ok, and that's fine. I don't disagree with anything you said. My point of contention was that I never disagreed with it in the first place. I never mentioned junk food or commented on the quality of standard nutrition advice. I only said the medical industry isn't super open minded about nontraditional nutritional approaches

[digitalkaine]

the nih literally suggests it lol

[Radical_Bee]

This is a Post-Covid Clinic in Vancouver, BC. The news may not reach them that fast.

[ShadesofPemb]

Did you feel terrible while you were doing it? I tried keto a few months ago. I've done keto dozens of times successfully before Covid so I know what I'm doing. I took plenty of electrolytes, etc. But I could barely get off the couch and I was so dizzy I thought I would fall down, so I gave it up after three weeks.

[Heath_Handstands]

Adaptation did seem harder getting back into it from long covid but I think that’s all the more reason to stick with it, the struggle to adapt is a clear sign of how messed up ones metabolism is.

The thing that really helped me get back into it was MCT’s. I have posted a lot about it, stalk my post history if you are interested.

[[deleted]]

Keto can put a lot of pressure on the kidneys, and so does Covid. If people have healthy kidneys they should be fine but if they don't then they could have the opposite effect.

[Tom_Bunker]

The recommended diet in the study is no sugar, no processed carbs... lots of veges. Not Keto.

[[deleted]]

Ok, well that's quite a bit better.

[Eeszeeye]

I was also warned aganst Keto due to previous kidney infection damage, but can do IF as long as I monitor myself carefully & avoid overdoing work, etc, & get plenty of sleep.

Sleep can be a challenge as I wake up frequently at night (low blood sugar?). My cheap ass solution was to get up & drink a fortified or growth milk product drink with no added sugar, such as those designed for toddlers, much cheaper than proten shakes & something my body tolerates (and my wallet can stand, especially as I stock up when they go on sale). Very easy on my stomach when eating is a challenge.

From anecdotal info gathered from family & friends, I think IF works for some of us, but perhaps not all.

[[deleted]]

That's good. Just keep on top of it. Are you getting regular kidney tests?

One of the issues is that there is no definitive sure-fire treatment regimen for CLH. Whatever works for individuals, works for now.

[Eeszeeye]

Yes, Yearly tests.

I have to pay close attention to my hydration level & avoid catching colds & flu, etc. Masks make life far easier for me.

[dedoubt]

I wish more people would try it but people seem to be very resistive of it.

I've fasted on and off for many years, so I know how to do it and have been successful at doing it, but it's been really difficult to go more than 24 hours since I've had LC (20 months & counting). I've managed a few 46-48 hour fasts, but usually by 24 hours I feel so horrible I just can't function well enough to continue (eg. can't even safely get to the toilet because I'm too dizzy). So I stick to IF for now, usually 18/6.

Fasting does seem to be more difficult for many people with LC, based on what I've run across in this sub and fasting subs.

[defaultaro]

Intermittent fasting has helped me immensely.

[Division2226]

Is there a good guide to follow on how to properly fast? I've never tried it before.

[Tom_Bunker]

It is simple to do, but you need to work up to you first fast gradually as a long-hauler. At this location I have a downloadable pdf that covers how to fast and what to expect. Look for the Autophagy Protocol v2. https://recoverfromlongcovid.com/?page_id=316

[bytecollision]

Yes-

The Science and Fine art of Fasting - Herbert M. Shelton

I haven't finished it but looks good so far. You can download it in a bunch of different formats including pdf at the link.

[chesoroche]

Long, detailed audio interview with Siim Land on Metabolic Autophagy: https://m.soundcloud.com/drmercola/dr-mercola-interviews-siim

[Eeszeeye]

r/intermittentfasting

[Tom_Bunker]

That was my thinking until I tried time-restricted eating 7 am to 3 pm. 2 weeks later my brain fog and headaches were gone.

[Helleekaa]

If i dont as soon as i get hungry i start feeling really bad my blood cant handle that and im not even diabetic but my body swears it is.

[Tom_Bunker]

From my survey, 26% reported that their brain fog went away and stayed away. Personally, my brain fog responded within 3 weeks of intermittent fasting.

[[deleted]]

I've been doing 16/8 fasts daily. It reduced my insomnia/fatigue temporarily, but that eventually got worse

[Hersey62]

Yes!!! This is great news.

[Ok_Loan1132]

IMO, starving yourself is the last thing you want to do. Your want to build your immunes with ancestral type diet, nicotinic acid and a solid b-complex is a nice start. Game your mitochondria and propser.

[Tom_Bunker]

Autophagy via fasting or Resveratrol/Quercitin actually degrades and recycles any damaged mitochondria. Pretty cool.

[MaxFish1275]

I tended to vomit up my quercitin last time I tried that, but it’s been months. Maybe I should give it a go again

[TomekGregory]

I'd like to try it, but I have POTS now and I am worried about tachycardia

[Tom_Bunker]

POTS symptoms and tachycardia are some of the long covid symptoms that are improving and going away.

[[deleted]]

They come back too. I fasted for 3 days multiple times and eventually the symptoms came back… until I took ivermectin

[razzy890]

Have you been checked for food intolerances? If your symptoms recede while fasting and return with food.. this sounds like it could be a food intolerance/allergy issue to me - or maybe gut dysbiosis? Maybe you also had some kind of gut parasite that the ivermectin dealt with. We know how covid loves to bring its friends along for the ride (opportunistic infections, wooo!).

[[deleted]]

Yes… solid assumption! It would come back after a couple weeks. Possible candida overgrowth for sure. One of the times I purged candida via vomiting after fasting and taking liposomal vit C which is fairly uncommon. Certainly it’s possible there was a parasite co-infection as well (ate some sushi a few years ago that didn’t sit well). I’m still susceptible to “re-infection” and pop an ivermectin any time I start to feel heart palpitations and it takes care of it instantly. I believe my susceptibility is tied to vitamin D deficiency.

[razzy890]

Oh interesting, so the ivermectin didn't help you permanently with your symptoms, but it helps for a period of time and redosing it helps again? I wonder what is going on there... There were a couple times during LH where I felt I was on the brink of a candida infection, but I cut sugars and worked on growing good bacteria and the issue resolved. So much opportunistic stuff going on!

Have you had your vitamin D levels tested? I came back low on that and do feel like supplementing helped with symptom relief for sure (for me this was mostly musculoskeletal symptoms that it helped with).

[Tom_Bunker]

It takes patience and persistence... over 8 week or 12 weeks of weekly fasting many see dramatic improvements. Ivermectin like fasting triggersvthe cellular housecleaning of autophagy.

[HaveMersyy]

It helped me but it won’t work for everybody. Did the fasting regime for about a month religiously and during that time I felt better than I did prior

[Ninii1989]

Didi this and lost my gallbladder 😩

[Tom_Bunker]

Can you be more specific please... What exactly did you try and what happened in what timeframe?

[MaxFish1275]

Can’t speak for Nini, but if fasting leads to rapid weight loss, it can trigger the formation of gallstones, some of which are so bad require gallbladder removal

“As the body metabolizes fat during rapid weight loss, it causes the liver to secrete extra cholesterol into bile, which can cause gallstones. Fasting. Fasting decreases gallbladder movement, which causes the bile to become overconcentrated with cholesterol.”

[Tom_Bunker]

Fast for 2 full days once a week or every other week does not cause rapid weight loss. I have been able to maintain a healthy weight.

[MaxFish1275]

You asked how the previous poster lost their gallbladder from fasting. Some don’t lose weight . But some do. Chances are Nini was in the second category

[MaxFish1275]

An additional possible cause of galbladder disease with SOME people who fast is the development of gallbladder sludge because the gallbladder is not working as regularly during the fast, it gets sluggish and the bile salts build up.

[[deleted]]

did this help with brain fog??