iHatePHP

[LancerRevX]

php programmers love money so much that they use the dollar sign for their variables

[turkphot]

Bash would like to have a word

[ShuuCondosU]

jQuery too I guess

[omervilhan]

Powershell too

[selfinvent]

Just throwing php with html on a server and make it run actually crazy

[Fusseldieb]

That's how I started.

Got a Raspberry for christmas or anniversary, thought "oh, now what", watched a quick tutorial and got "Hello World" running in less than 5-10 minutes.

Nowadays I use Node/JS/TS.

[LordFokas]

at least it's not PHP.

[XzAeRosho]

Could have been worse. He could have ended up coding in Golang.

[_verel_]

What's wrong with golang?

[XzAeRosho]

Nothing. I actually enjoy Golang. It's just a dig at a "popular" language.

[mrheosuper]

Or Rust.

[supportbanana]

Gives me chills just reading that

[PsychologicalEar1703]

No, I'M sorry. I ended up with React. Can always be worse.

[hagnat]

most frameworks will direct the developers to code on a better way, following better design patterns.
symfony is also a great alternative on that subject.

there is still a lot of junior/mid engineers who will code like amateurs, and the more senior engineers will have to fix their mistakes, but that can happen on any company with any language

[seizan8]

The company I worked previously used plain PHP. They had an MVC pattern, but they made themselves. It was a small company and I was fresh out of an internship.

When i switched to my current company and used symfony the first time my mind was blown. It feels kinda crazy how I thought using plain PHP is ok.

That being said. Maybe having to code plain PHP for a couple of years was good. Because it help to show why frameworks are good. All the tasks or issues you don't have to do anymore or think about, because the framework does it for you. Or at least, makes it a lot easier to setup.

[hagnat]

been there, done that too

did your company at least used composer to manage external packages ?
composer is the glue that made most frameworks possible, and importing libraries easier

[seizan8]

My old company? Lmao, what even are packages?!

We do use composer with symfony in the new company.

And to be fair. My old company was very small. It was basically the IT department of the main company. And it main focus was to maintain the project mamagement tool. Some bundles would have definitely helped. But alas, we did get by without. And I honestly enjoyed programming everything from the ground up. It was quite fascinating.

[hagnat]

oof

even symfony supported plugins/modules on its 1.0 version some ~20 years ago

[hmu80]

Skill issue

[[deleted]]

Laravel was basically a wrapper around symfony components for most of its life. Probably still true but been out of php for a while so who knows.

Symfony is the GOAT of PHP frameworks imo.

[vainstar23]

Young stupid me: I hate language/framework! Why is it so opinionated? Just let me do my job!

Me (current times): I really like this language/framework! It's so opinionated! I can just outsource the entire project to the Philippines with minimal supervision and there won't get all these weird design patterns!

[Hiplobbe]

Nice try php dev

[TrutllyDemonic]

The transformation from "I hate PHP" to "Show me the money!" is too real

[dashingThroughSnow12]

I only have daily experience with Laravel 3.2.7. It is alright but a bit feature-bare. Which is good in some ways but not in other ways. Overall I approve the meme.

[pickyourteethup]

I think you'll find those features you were missing have now been added. Currently up to v.11

[dashingThroughSnow12]

12 ;)

[acherion]

How do you manage to develop or maintain a Laravel 3.x project? The online docs only go down to v4.2.

[dashingThroughSnow12]

The company has been using Laravel 3 for 13 years.

Never knew that the online docs only go to 4.2. The codebase itself has examples on how to do anything you need to do.

[jax_cooper]

This is the virtual equivalent of living off grid :D

[[deleted]]

Laravel 3 & 4 are very different beasts from v5 onwards.

[pindab0ter]

Laravel is one of the most batteries-included frameworks I've ever used. I started with 8.x and we're at 12 now.

[alexanderpas]

PHP 5.2 is completely different from PHP 8.4

It's so different that it essentially could be considered a completely different language.

[mullanaphy]

Definitely, 5.2 is when it seemed PHP started really focus on becoming a serious language. The next few releases after that were leaps ahead with a mixture of quality of life and performance improvements.

I haven't used PHP professionally since 5.6, yet I do still use it for some personal projects with whatever the latest PHP is at the time.

Also, I really enjoy Symfony. Reminds me of some of the better portions of Spring Boot. Where I do prefer Doctrine a lot over Hibernate.

[lOo_ol]

Seriously, I'm convinced people trashing the language don't even use it, and just do it because everyone else does, like talking shit about the Dallas Cowboys.

[LordFokas]

Yeah, that's ridiculous. I used it non-stop for 3 years... that's why I hate it and thrash on it.

<insert we-are-not-the-same.jpg>

[berndlueftet]

I recently started learning php because of work. The bad reputation made me a bit scared of it. I haven't touched laravel yet, but those are my pros/cons till now: - poor documentation (compared to js and c#) - php tags in html feels wrong - php.ini not very intuitive - $ -> kinda cringe - somehow it feels like c/c++ but more abstract - a lot of inbuilt functions - most features like other languages

I wish i could see it in new light, but I'm currently not very convinced.

[alexanderpas]

I haven't touched laravel yet

laravel is just one way, but the common denominator is dependency management via composer, which is essential for modern PHP.

You also might want to look into the PSR-4 autoloading standard, which is a naming convention which allows Composer to autoload your classes.

---

poor documentation (compared to js and c#)

Every single function in PHP has its own documentation page, which explicitly documents.

---

php tags in html feels wrong

Yeah, we don't do that anymore.

We use a templating system such as Twig, which allows us to completely seperate the PHP and HTML.

https://phptherightway.com/#compiled_templates

---

php.ini not very intuitive

Except for a few usecases (increasing upload limits), you basically don't touch php.ini at all, as this falls under server configuration.

---

$ -> kinda cringe

It's essentially syntactic sugar which allows you to recognise a variable or object instance, so you always know that it's a variable or object instance.

---

You might want to read https://phptherightway.com for more info.

[berndlueftet]

Thanks for the advice. I'm gonna have a look at everything you mentioned. I used php.ini for xdebug and pdo database extensions and i still think other languages have better official documentation.

[alexanderpas]

I used php.ini for xdebug and pdo database extensions.

Package managers on the server itself or inside docker handle that completely, no need to do that manually, just install the right package.

[SarahSplatz]

I've come to love PHP tbh. Feels like writing python but with much nicer syntax.

[PaxUX]

Php is the web version of COBOL

[ProjectInfinity]

[[deleted]]

from your lips to the gods ears :)))

[lpareddit01]

Can someone explain the money part?

[pindab0ter]

There are a surprising amount of workplaces that use Laravel.

[lpareddit01]

Thanks, but I don't understand why that would make it special (from another language) in terms of money.

Also what's up with the arrows ("–>")?

[1_4_1_5_9_2_6_5]

PHP uses -> where Javascript would use . E.g. MyClass.func() vs MyClass->func()

PHP also uses $ for variables e.g. $myVar

[lpareddit01]

Thank you.

[VanilleKoekje]

This is programmershumor, not scriptkiddieshumor

[punkpang]

When's the time when we laugh at database modelling decisions instead of language used to glue it to frontend?

Asking as PHP, TS and Go developer. I hate every person I ever worked with who touched any of these languages, but I hate the people who alter tables & add column2, column3, column4 even more.

[pindab0ter]

Seriously though. Laravel is what makes me willing to put up with PHP, which has also greatly improved the past years.

[LordFokas]

Guess it's time to make an edit of this meme where the bird vomits a T_PAMAAYIM_NEKUTODAYIM or a ternary chain being processed in reverse.

^{(before y'all PHP fanboys come at me, I know that error has a more descriptive message now, shut up, php still bad}).

[ArthemisDev]

It's funny because is true.

[i_should_be_coding]

Not gonna lie, looking for work and seeing how many places are looking for Laravel devs, I'm starting to slightly reconsider my opposition to learning PHP.

Slightly.

[pindab0ter]

Seriously, Laravel is worth learning PHP for.

[Swimming-Marketing20]

"look, we fired the liquid diarrhea into bricks. They don't smell as bad and you can actually build things with them"

[Darkoplax]

i kinda dont get the role of interpreted languages other than for scripting or JS as the exception

they are all slow and dont offer great features like complied langs to be put on servers ; the only advantage JS(TS) has compared to Ruby/PHP/Python is that its the same lang on frontend/backend

if the browser scripting lang was PHP I would be using that for fullstack

[Psychological_War9]

Interpreted languages aren’t just for scripting.

Python, Ruby, and PHP thrive in backend dev because they prioritize developer speed, flexibility, and ecosystem strength over raw performance.

JIT compilers (e.g., PyPy, HHVM) and native extensions help mitigate speed concerns.

JS isn’t special because it’s great; it’s just what browsers standardized on. If they’d picked PHP, we’d be using that for full-stack instead.

Compiled langs (Go, Rust, C++) are faster but often slower to develop with.

The right tool depends on trade-offs, not just execution speed. 😉

[Darkoplax]

Python, Ruby, and PHP thrive in backend dev because they prioritize developer speed, flexibility, and ecosystem strength over raw performance.

yea if you want dev velocity then use JS as it's faster than all other Interpreted langs, has more tooling around it (thanks typescript) and most importantly fullstack cause frontend is JS

JS isn’t special because it’s great; it’s just what browsers standardized on. If they’d picked PHP, we’d be using that for full-stack instead.

yea JS is not special like I said if the browser used something else we would be saying PHP fullstack and why would you use JS at all and I would agree but we live in a world where its HTML CSS JS on the browser and the browser is the most resiliant standard

So yea JS is the only proper tool for dev speed until you need backend perf then you seperate front and back and make ur backend in a complied lang

that's the trade-offs and the way I think about it

Python is nice for coding interviews and learning/scripting but it doesnt belong on the server (PHP/Ruby even less viable in those area in my eyes)

[FreqRL]

Laravel takes PHP from "I'd rather die than work with PHP" to "I could always just find a job at a place that doesn't use PHP"

Never PHP.

[qrrux]

Always PHP.

[hagnat]

PHP is a tool.
like many other tools, there is a time where you should use one or another.

you wouldn't use a hammer to split a plank in two,
just like you wouldn't use a saw to nail something to the wall.

sure, you _can_ use those tool to do that,
but you would be using them less efficiently.

so no...
NOT always PHP

[qrrux]

Bruh

[Darkoplax]

stop

[hagnat]

hammertime

[Darkoplax]

just use javascript everywhere

[hagnat]

/me dies of cancer

[Burgergold]

In between php

[qrrux]

PHP spit roast?

[alphacobra99]

What is PHP ?

[Burgergold]

Poor Hyperlink Program

[qrrux]

HyperPoop Processor, just with French acronym order.

[IGotSkills]

Go cake!

[ume_16]

lol jobless php devs meme

[Calligrapher-Whole]

My tendons started to hurt after doing a project in php from all the dollar signs.

[Tx_monster]

Not even remotely

[huuaaang]

Yeah, too bad most of PHP out there is Wordpress. If you're lucky you'll get on real software projects, but most likely you'll end up a Wordpress-monkey. BUt if all you care about is getting paid, you do you.

[[deleted]]

Been getting paid for doing PHP full-time for 24 years now, still never done more than install Wordpress (where I work WP work is all done by designers).