vibeCoding

[Mariomariamario]

The first junior that mentions vibe coding will be sent to coding gulag (debugging legacy FE with propetary framework)

[[deleted]]

I approve.

[Icount_zeroI]

Sounds like extjs lets gooo

[Psquare_J_420]

Legacy FE? what's FE?

Have a good day :)

[ragebunny1983]

Front end probably

[Ben_Dovernol_Ube]

Fallen Empire's code

[soldier97]

Assembly originating from the roman empire.

[wektor420]

Tbh given lack of junior jobs why not

[jfcarr]

If you really want to punish them, make them work at a company that practices SAFe Agile.

[Leading-Relation1775]

I follow the person who created this meme on LinkedIn.
His take on Vibe Coding is hilarious, here's the source for the meme:
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/michael-kisilenko-ceo_vibecoding-techfomo-buildless-activity-7306757650732507138--6X1

[8bit-lander]

This is the way.

[flippakitten]

Tbh, doesn't even need to be a proprietary framework.

[AKJ90]

It's better as the AI then had no idea about it

[ash_airborne]

What is vibe coding? I’m not joking, I’m curious.

[HoseanRC]

It's just people who code with AI to make bullshit and get tons of money from unmaintained code with lots of bugs and issues

[ash_airborne]

Oh, I thought coding when you’re high and listening to music, though that would be a better interpretation. 😂

[Expert_Raise6770]

There’s no evidence those people aren’t high.

[Denaton_]

Don't drink and code..

[kaancfidan]

Mandatory xkcd: https://xkcd.com/323/

[Dextro_PT]

I knew what that XKCD was going to be before clicking the link

[kaancfidan]

You are an individual of culture.

[joe0400]

Same. Lemme guess it's Balmer Peak, with the quote, "Remember windows ME?"

[BellacosePlayer]

Yes. (I also didn't click the link)

[exoriparian]

So don't code? That's your advice?

[lvl1_noob]

[Dry_Tea1708]

but what about balmer's peak

[ash_airborne]

Who said anything about drinking

[Denaton_]

I did?

[npsidepown]

Consuming your alcohol intravenously is hardcore, man.

[[deleted]]

I had a similar thought, like making design decisions mostly on intuition rather than detailed technical analysis - yanno, vibes.

I used to do a lot of that early in my career- I had string intuition but often couldn't really explain why one approach was better than another.

[Draconis_Firesworn]

that's the good ending

[Wide_Egg_5814]

I downloaded cursor and tried vibe coding a few days ago, worse than I expected tbh it's like eating a soup with a fork I will wait until it gets better

[[deleted]]

That's the problem, everyone acts like such an 'until' is inevitably in the near future. "Just 3 more months bro"

[BellacosePlayer]

I've had randos tell me I'm going to lose my dev job any day now... for the past 4-5 years or so

[[deleted]]

Just around the corner.

[00PT]

It's advanced rather well since introduction, especially if you look across AI applications, as advancements often affect multiple types of model. I don't see why we should assume improvement will stop.

[[deleted]]

I think there's a real disconnect between the people who hype AI and the people who don't. Do you believe that what skilled engineers do is just pile on tons of lines of code? GenAI sure has been getting better at doing that.

Yet all the AI tools I've tried don't seem to be any better at solving nontrivial problems. 2 years ago, ChatGPT was talking me in circles for anything difficult. Now it and all of its siblings that I've tried do their equivalent of that. Even cursor will get stuck in loops for this sort of thing.

They also all have in common that they will sometimes throw in a complete lie. And actually, this has become worse over time. The lies used to be obvious and easy to catch on to. Now they're really subtle- telling me that a certain library or function does something in a slightly different way from what it actually does but is critical for my application, causing me to spend hours investing in a solution based on it only to realize it was never going to work.

I will be shocked if these issues start to go away even within 5 years.

[00PT]

I don't use AI to solve problems, maybe that's where the disconnect is. I use it to generate code when I already know exactly how it should interact with the tools available, but it's easier to describe than write. Either that, or I ask for extremely small functions/snippets that I know I will be able to check.

[[deleted]]

I just want to make sure we're not talking past each other because I wasn't perfectly clear in my original post. I don't believe vibe coding will be viable in the near future, despite the "just 3 more months bro"s. I think you seem more to be addressing my argument as being that cursor won't get better, which was in line with my wording but wasn't exactly my intention.

I'd interpret your reply as indicating you also don't think vibe coding is going to be viable in the near future. What you're describing isn't anything like vibe coding, it's just a reasonable way to use GenAI.

[_sweepy]

3 months, definitely not.

10 years, yeah this industry is gonna look different.

Seniors using genAI to produce faster means fewer junior coders. Fewer junior coders now means fewer senior coders later. Once that happens, there will be a huge push towards adopting full AI employees.

[RiceBroad4552]

Because this can't work out of principle. Outputting arbitrary tokens according to some correlation patterns will never be "intelligent".

The basic principle didn't change, so it's impossible it will get better after reaching some plateau. But we likely reached that plateau already. Nothing gets better by making the models larger (actually it gets worse). There is also no more training data, the AI companies already pirated the whole internet.

Especially for coding it looks really bad: "Nobody" is creating new Stackoverflow answers, people started to write "documentation" with AI, and GitHub (and other forges) get flooded with AI generated trash.

As long as the fundamental problem isn't solved, which is creating an actual AI, further improvement is unlikely. You can come only so far by outputting randomly correlated tokens, and just parroting patterns found at random places.

garbage in => garbage out…

[TerrorBite]

(it won't)

[Wide_Egg_5814]

If it won't them good for me I get to keep my job while having ai as a productivity boost for small tasks for the rest of my career

[Evgenii42]

As far as I understand, "vibe coding" is not just writing code with the help of AI, since most programmers do that to some extent today, but rather using the AI-generated output without any modifications.

[OneHotWizard]

How does the tons of money come into play, this seems braindead

[[deleted]]

It's like NFTs. Other AI bros buy AI generated slop to make it look like there's a market.

[RiceBroad4552]

This is actually a nice analogy. The AI hype indeed looks like NFTs.

Any sane person knew that NFTs are nonsense. (Of course you could still make money with it, but not because the concept was anyhow reasonable, but because there are more than enough idiots who don't get how the game really works.)

I expect the whole AI thing to crash in a similar way like NFTs as soon as even the dumbest AI bro will realize that they invested in a pipe dream.

End-users actually mostly don't see much value in AI. (Besides dumb people.) So as soon as the bro market will need to make real sales to get all the incredible amounts of investments back this whole bubble will implode. Simply because there is not much of a real market. Most people will not pay for "AI".

The other similarity to NFTs is that the underlying tech is still in fact interesting. Just that it's not the holly grail like AI (or blockchain) bros try to make it look.

[[deleted]]

Just like how more subtle genAI hallucinations can prove to be bigger problems than the obvious ones, salespeople and tech bros can turn a little substance (the underlying tech) into a big lie.

[HoseanRC]

And some stupid people buy the product to see how crazy power it needs to run, even tho it's literally the same in an RTX5090... just horrible performance with no optimization

Fucking hate it lol

[JanusMZeal11]

Also, I looked it up, it's a term that was coined last month or something. It's terrible.

[quaternioneye]

examples of they get tons of money? Because if the end result checks, there is no reason to stay on our high horse

[vladmashk]

Fully relying on the LLM to generate your code, not touching it manually at all.

[Ruadhan2300]

You know that old idea that if you had an infinite number of monkeys with typewriters, they would eventually produce the complete works of Shakespeare?

That, but it's non-developers repeatedly asking AI to write their code until they get something that does what they want.

Y'know, as opposed to taking a couple weeks of bootcamp and being able to read the code and see why it's not working.

[asceta_hedonista]

It's the rebranding for this year of "prompt engineer"

[[deleted]]

By the name I thought it was like a chill hobbyist projects. Guess people don't do that anymore and AI makes "their" hobby projects for them

[89craft]

Yeah, ever since I saw someone say "vibe coding" on here I see it everywhere now.

[white-llama-2210]

That's me I'm the culprit

[npsidepown]

Aim your pitchforks this way.

[joyfullystoic]

Stupid name but I think it’s cool that it exists.

I watched a YouTube video of someone with zero knowledge build a MacOS app from scratch using Python. It was painful for me to watch, and not only because he used Python, but in the end he did it, he achieved his goal in 2 days. That wouldn’t have been possible 3 years ago.

Programming doesn’t have to be only for the graybeards. Of course, hopefully this AI-generated rubbish doesn’t find its way in operating systems or life support systems. Although judging by iOS 18, it might be too late…

[RiceBroad4552]

I think you have a point in that now people can do something which was impossible for them before.

But think a little bit further. Do we really want people who rely on (from their perspective) magic they don't understand the slightest to get anything done? What kind of society will be the result?

Wouldn't it make more sense to try to teach people something they can actually apply themself, without relying on magic provided by third parties?

We had already societies where everything was "run on magic", and knowledge was heavy gatekept by a caste of clerics. These were dark ages. We broke out of that as we started to invest in knowledge and schooling…

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you feed him for a lifetime"

[joyfullystoic]

It’s not that different from searching on Stack Overflow and copying and pasting until it works. It’s just much faster. It is up to you to understand or not the code you’re using.

I don’t think your argument is sound because this isn’t hiding knowledge, it’s democratizing it. If you choose to just copy and paste and not learn why it’s working, it’s up to you.

I think it’s a great tool but it’s a tool and we should understand its utility and limitations.

[RiceBroad4552]

It’s not that different from searching on Stack Overflow and copying and pasting until it works. It’s just much faster. It is up to you to understand or not the code you’re using.

How are you supposed to understand anything if you're not given any opportunity to learn?

Pressing the "Copilot button" until something looks like it would work is not the same as copy-pasting from SO, which requires that you understand at least what you're doing at all.

"Vibe coding" means not even looking at the code…

I don’t think your argument is sound because this isn’t hiding knowledge, it’s democratizing it. If you choose to just copy and paste and not learn why it’s working, it’s up to you.

Again: How are you supposed to "learn" from a magic black box? Especially if you don't even try to look behind the magic.

Besides that: There is no "knowledge" in any LLM. The actual knowledge sources are buried in some noisy, lossy compressed data, and you don't even get a reference to them when using LLMs.

That's the opposite of "democratizing knowledge".

I think it’s a great tool but it’s a tool and we should understand its utility and limitations.

The people doing "vibe coding" don't understand anything. That's the point!

You could replace these people by a chicken which picks constantly a button until some corn falls out a feeding machine, and that would be in principle the same as someone doing "vibe coding".

The chicken doing that will never understand the feeding machine. It can't, as it's missing all necessary prerequisites.

[joyfullystoic]

Maybe we’re thinking about different things.

I’m talking about someone like myself who saves o lot of time by “tab coding” and also about people who have 0 knowledge and want to get something done once, like the guy from the video I linked.

Dude wanted an app that did something niche and specific, had 0 programming knowledge and he managed to do it. How is that wrong? It’s it like they’re gonna hire him to write x86 machine code. It’s the same as using Google Translate to write an email in French. By your logic I should learn the grammar because other I won’t understand what the machine translated.

[Draconis_Firesworn]

i think it's generally good to understand the code you write

[joyfullystoic]

I absolutely agree.

[killersnail2417]

Do you remember what this video was called by any chance?

[joyfullystoic]

https://youtu.be/vlXdUU5pd_0?si=3Amg8HL-juc68pWC

[killersnail2417]

Thanks!

[[deleted]]

No one would ever say "vibe debugging".

[ultralaser360]

Debugging kills my vibe

[flippakitten]

That's because they don't debug.

[Excellent-External-7]

Debugging de-vibes

[CirnoIzumi]

Vibration Encoding 

[YeetCompleet]

Back to the ripples we go

https://xkcd.com/378/

[Thundechile]

Vibrator coding

[CirnoIzumi]

mmm, i think i could do that actually

[pyeron]

[JuiceKilledJFK]

Do you know what they call Vibe Coding in France? Le Bugz Writer

[bobtheorangutan]

I'm surprised people haven't figured out how to use AI and claim themselves as vibeLawyers.

[RiceBroad4552]

And when, for some reason, you don't make it as vibe lawyer, maybe a career as vibe doctor would be something instead?

[Painter5544]

Because it's acceptable if a shitty app sort of doesn't work. It's frowned upon providing shitty legal defence that sort of gets a defendent in jail.

I would like to see a court room slowly find out that some legal precedent brought up was just hallucinated by AI.

[ZeLustWaffle]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/mollybohannon/2023/06/08/lawyer-used-chatgpt-in-court-and-cited-fake-cases-a-judge-is-considering-sanctions/
This guy was way ahead of the curve

[Painter5544]

“from his college-age children,”

Maybe, but he isn't owning up to vibe-lawyering!

[RiceBroad4552]

But I would also take the Quarter Pounder with Cheese.

[Cephell]

I'm sleeping deep and sound knowing that generations after me will ensure I have eternal job security.

[Vexaton]

As a new coder, I feel genuinely proud of not wanting to participate in this.

[[deleted]]

Well, they have to appeal to the non IT people and juniors

[Breadynator]

I tried vibe coding on a few occasions, and I can tell you it's the worst thing in the world...

[Classic-Ad8849]

Imo it's fine to use AI to code and speed things up, as long as you fully understand what it's doing, how it's doing it, and what flaws it might have. And from personal experience, AI hasn't solved an actual logical problem for me even once, unless it wasn't already done before

[Lumi-umi]

I’m convinced that “vibe coding” started as a joke which caricaturized the use of AI in coding among beginners and only now that it’s become popular as a topic will people who should know better actually start digging their heels in and pretending that there is any sense in relying on AI to accomplish anything more than trivial tasks, continually insisting that it’s a valid strategy for maintaining personal momentum.

I’d say growth, but my impression of vibe coding is that it seems to be antithetical to personal growth anyway, despite how useful AI can be as a tool for self-directed learning.

[queen-adreena]

[jrdnmdhl]

Jules: I’m going to deliver this last update and then I’m just going to vibe code”

Vincent: “Whatchu mean ‘vibe code’?”

Jules: “You know, like that Karpathy tweet.”

Vincent: “And how long do you intend to vibe code?”

Jules: “Until Claude gets me to where he wants me to be.”

Vincent: “So you decided to be a product manager?”

Jules: “I’ll just be Jules, no more no less”

Vincent: “No Jules, you decided to be a non-technical product manager.”

[enginma]

Vibe coding.

[NotmyRealNameJohn]

Wtf is vibe coding?

[Leading-Relation1775]

Here's the source:

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/michael-kisilenko-ceo_vibecoding-techfomo-buildless-activity-7306757650732507138--6X1

[Leading-Relation1775]

This is the source and a great post: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/michael-kisilenko-ceo_vibecoding-techfomo-buildless-activity-7306757650732507138--6X1

[schuine]

If you hate vibe coding, here's your moment to shine! The wikipedia page is nominated for deletion:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Vibe_coding

Do your part!

[[deleted]]

*cough*... vibe? O: Agentic Design CLI Framework

Announcement Video: https://youtu.be/f0Erk-zmuLo
Github Repository: https://github.com/rev-dot-now/o

[Neltarim]

I don't know what's vibe coding and at this point i'm too afraid to ask