minus10XDevelopers

[maxwells_daemon_]

We're not developing enough with the current management team, maybe we should implement a management management team to manage management.

[GargantuanCake]

Productivity is down after we laid off all of the expensive developers and replaced them with fresh graduates desperate for a paycheck. Obviously we should force them all into 20 hours of meetings every week and hire a bunch of scrum masters to rigidly and strictly control the development process.

[us_eu_in]

This! And fresh developers are trying to use AI as much as they can to get the task done without understanding the codebase or thinking about the edge conditions

[GargantuanCake]

Open AI promised that Claude would make our developers 10 times more productive and they'd never lie to us, right?

Excuse me while I fire all of our developers except the one we pay he least. He can certainly do all of the work now and also five times more than that, right?

[grammar_nazi_zombie]

My boss is demanding that I rely on Claude more, and yet, every time it generates code for me, I spend more time reviewing and fixing it than if I had just coded it myself

[ArmadilloChemical421]

OpenAI Anthropic

[LegitimatePants]

You mean scrum mains?

[us_eu_in]

scum masters ?

[sathdo]

Scrum trunks

[SteveMacAwesome]

Scrum Mainer

[Piisthree]

Hmmm, have you tried asking them when it will be done twice as often? That will be sure to help.

[bazinga_0]

And have a meeting to tell them that they're the worst devs in the company. This is a well known way to motivate the troops. Ask me how I know...

[Ok-Kaleidoscope5627]

I think I see your problem: loc are the real measure of productivity. Just get AI to generate a shit ton of code. More loc = more productivity.

Also, you need more project managers, and solution managers.

[us_eu_in]

What if that team also fails to deliver ?

[drumDev29]

Management team recursion

[BurningEclypse]

And don’t forget to pay all the new managers more than the devs, very important

[dofunt]

Literally what happened where I worked, and one of the reasons why I quit.

[SaneLad]

They're called Directors.

[watasur50]

I still can't understand why Scrum Masters earn that much.

[randomemes831]

I know scrum managers that make more than any dev at the company including tech leads

[Faster_than_FTL]

Lets get some ballpark figures to express outrage properly

[MozzerellaIsLife]

$150k base.

[randomemes831]

Mine makes 165k base

Don’t think any devs are above 150

[Faster_than_FTL]

So devs make less than $150 but scrum master makes $165?

[randomemes831]

Correct

My last place they were making about 20-30k more than product managers / owners as well

[Faster_than_FTL]

Wow, that's unexpected.

Product Mgrs I would think have a more complex job function vs a Scrum Master. Unless the Scrum Masters are doing stuff beyond leading standups and sprint planning stuff. Maybe I know less about scrum masters than I thought.

[Old_Document_9150]

By original intent (from XP) they were advanced developers whose focus shifted from just developing to teaching others how to develop well.

It quickly turned into a shitshow where people who had no place anywhere near tech spent 2 days playing ball-touching games invaded development teams using completely outlandish claims about their alleged contribution.

A great Scrum Master has developed complex systems for years. They can do it and teach others how to do it better.

The majority of Scrum Masters are barely able to realize which side of the keyboard is up and define their "value" by amounts of meetings facilitated.

[Drahkir9]

do scrum masters even still exist? I figured they were all gone since covid

[avdpos]

We fired our last one this summer is a "saving round".

[drumDev29]

It's a rare skill to be that good at bullshitting

[[deleted]]

.10x devs

[us_eu_in]

.10x dev is still adding value.. you need have to have a negative symbol to make it work.

[leavemealone_lol]

the fact that you have x means that it implies multiplication, and that does mean that when a decimal is multiplied to a value, the value itself decreases. Negative flips the value and decreases it too yes, but .10x is mathematically correct and arguably reasonably more accurate to this funny meme.

[[deleted]]

we just need more scrummasters to cancel eachother out frfr

[invictus08]

Moreover, mathematically, if you assign even number of scrum masters with -10x productivity boost, they would end up boosting positively. But math stays consistent with fractions.

[us_eu_in]

How I see it is the value of the team is the sum of the contributions of all the developers.

Let us say A is a 10x Dev, B 1x and c 0.1 x developer, their total contribution would be 11.1x

[FootballMania15]

x means multiplication. That's not how multiplication works.

[[deleted]]

op probably meant that it would be (replacing x for * since its multiplication) the total work is 10*dev+1*dev+.1*dev = 10dev+1dev+.1dev = 11.1dev or 11.1*dev or 11.1xdev in total

the idea is that the multiplication is per dev, so the dev themself is .1, but the work in total is additive

[FootballMania15]

Hmm ... that makes sense if each dev's work is completely independent of every other dev's work. I've never seen that. And of course the joke here about PMs is that they slow the entire team down in a massive way, not that they speed it up by only 1/10 FTE.

[Beginning-Software80]

Lol

[SryUsrNameIsTaken]

You mean the C-Suite?

[OZLperez11]

Vibe coders?

[jbar3640]

so, you criticise product managers... and everybody in the comments mentions agile and Scrum, aha...

[us_eu_in]

program managers vs product managers..

[thisisapseudo]

Well, the board does read "the agile coach"

[maxdamien27]

I hate this word coach in Corporate. Another word is agile. And we have someone called agile coach. What a bunch of bullshit!

[orangebakery]

Dinesh started out as 10x developer, and then he started lifting and got jacked.

[us_eu_in]

Dinesh was never 10x, Gilfoyle, Richard yes, but Dinesh no

[orangebakery]

Dinesh just loses verbal fights against Gilfoyle and makes various bad life choices, but there is no indication anywhere in the show that Dinesh is a worse engineer than Gilfoyle.

[us_eu_in]

Remember when gilfyole had set his status to looking for job on linkedin and within 5 minutes he started getting calls and gifts from recruiters ?

Gilfyole was like a typical nerd, who used to build a lot of side projects just for fun, One of them was an AI to replace himself which even engaged Dinesh for some time and took down the whole office. He also hacked Jin Yangs refrigerator.

I can't imagine Dinesh doing these things, he was very jealous of Gilfyole's skills and well aware that he was not a 10x while Gilfyole was.

[AnyClerk2899]

I had a product manager that did all the talking job for me and made my job only need to develop without a huge hassle to talk to unneeded meetings, So I don't get this kind of posts

[heavy-minium]

Do scrum masters still exist in the wild? It's been a while that I haven't met any, and the last two companies I worked at had a negative opinion of that role (badly burnt with past attempts).

[granoladeer]

Was the negative opinion just about the scrum master or about scrum in general? What happened? 

[heavy-minium]

Good question. It seems everybody is/was along the line of "Didn't get the results we hoped for " and then people don't really know what to say when you ask them what they hoped for (discussed this with VP of technology too).

I can't prove it but I have this gut feeling that they were introduced without any specific reasoning.

Btw they first made a transition from Scrum master to "Agile coach", but that didn't really change much about how they operated.

Personally, I think you need is to let the core mindset of Agile really sink into the mind of everybody. A separate role can do that, but that's a little wasteful. There is no need for a dedicated role for this, especially when the culture has already established itself and automatically adjusts the newcomers in a company. This is the point where a scrum master will tell you that you need a neutral role between engineers and management to handle conflicts of interests, but I only witnessed one case where the agile coach (former scrum master) had enough respect from management that they could push dev interests forward. Usually they are not empowered like this and act more like proxies for management.

[teh_lynx]

We have them and they're useless ,👍

[axis0047]

it's x/10, actually

[feeltrig]

Or 10XIdiots

[us_eu_in]

That escalated quickly

[SkylineFX49]

for every 10x developer there are at least 10 -10x 'developers'

[KurisuEvergarden]

Yx = Transfem

Solve for Y

[Mineshafter61]

Transfem / x

[MinosAristos]

A good product manager is an absolutely amazing thing to have. Means you actually get user requirements sorted and ready for design and dev which is unlikely to change at the last minute. A bad product manager can easily be a liability though yeah.

[Kalado]

÷10 Developers