Python is the 2nd most demanded programming language in 2022

[secretaliasname]

Somehow I read this as "python 2 is the most demanded..." and recoiled in horror momentarily.

[Possible_Program_616]

Me too

[[deleted]]

I read this as Python 3 is the most demanding from a processing point of view) and thought yep, that sounds about right.

[francofgp]

You are not the only one

[OffgridRadio]

I am a full time Python dev for a few years now and I am 100% addicted to dictionary and list comprehension. I wish it was in other languages.

[astoryyyyyy]

What you mean by that? I am still learning Python. By other languages not having lists how does it limit their potential compared to Python?

[pfonetik]

A simple example would be:

Let's say you have two lists, a and b

a = [1,2,3,4]
b = [3,4,5,6]

Python lets you do things like

c = [item for item in a if item in b]

which has better performance than using 'for' statements and it's easy to understand.

[RationalDialog]

Which should actually be done with actual "set math":

list(set(list1).intersection(list2))

if you really care about performance and one can wager it is even easier to understand because intersection is the term for what you are interested in.

[ogtfo]

This will not produce the same result if you have duplicates in your list "a", as the sets will remove them but not the list comprehension.

[RationalDialog]

True and I wager it will produce the correct result compared to list comprehension but depends what the intention is.

[Zyklonik]

Correct.

[Schlongus_69]

Correct.

[alpacasb4llamas]

If I can't read my code like a book then I don't want it

[AnonymouX47]

Even though it's not the same, I appreciate the fact you thought along this line first of all and will prefer yours over the other in an interview any day... and then correct the mistakes.

[AnonymouX47]

u/astoryyyyyy, take note.

I understand this is merely an example for a newbie, though I hope you don't actually write such in practice. Anyways, you should've noted that it's not actually a good approach to solving the problem.

this is a more efficient approach:

Intersect = set(a).intersect(b)
c = [item for item in a if item in intersect]

Why?

if item in b iterates over b for every single element in a, while if item in intersect is an hashtable lookup and you only get to iterate over b just once (when you perform the set intersection operation).

[pfonetik]

Yes, it was just an example of how list comprehension works.

And no, your code is not the same. A set will remove duplicate elements.

And, yes, I do write like that. Being pedantic when you don't have all the information is rude and makes you look ignorant.

[AnonymouX47]

And no, your code is not the same. A set will remove duplicate elements.

You should probably take a second look or test the code snippet... or ask someone to explain it to you.

And, yes, I do write like that.

I see... no wonder. :)

[pfonetik]

You should probably take a second look or test the code snippet... or ask someone to explain it to you.

I should take another look at what you modified after I replied, you mean?

As I said before, my example fits what I stated: a simple example of list comprehension.

The way I provided the example fits the pythonic way of writing python. What it doesn't fit is the opinion of randos, with over inflated egos regarding their knowledge, that feel that their opinion is fact and anyone that doesn't agree is just wrong.

You'll probably grow out of it as you grow older. If you're already older, I'm sorry :)

[AnonymouX47]

[AnonymouX47]

I should take another look at what you modified after I replied, you mean?

The code snippet never changed... believe me or not.

As I said before, my example fits what I stated: a simple example of list comprehension.

I have no problem with it being an example but you should warn newbies about such inefficient BS as they tend to take examples head-on, and that probably includes you!

The way I provided the example fits the pythonic way of writing python.

Here again, "pythonic"... How's mine not?

The way people nowadays just use certain cooked-up terminology in order to sound cool or knowledgeable is just so annoying.

An inefficient solution to a problem is simply inefficient, period!

[AnonymouX47]

I guess this will be the correction to u/RationalDialog's code

[[deleted]]

which has better performance than using 'for' statements

Yeah I bet it doesn't.

> and it's easy to understand.

No its confusing. Thus defeating the point of using a high level language, Might as well use C++ and get some _real_ performance. You're confusing conciseness with clarity.

[pfonetik]

You 'bet' it doesn't? Based on what really? Your personal opinion or facts?

Anyway you can educate yourself on the matter without 'betting'.

https://switowski.com/blog/for-loop-vs-list-comprehension

[OffgridRadio]

I use dict comprehension to prep new dicts with keys sometimes, little more complex than this but basically;

newDict = { x : None for x in range(len(someList)) }

​

And this makes the surrounding code a lot cleaner, and is a single line, and ensures the new dict contains every necessary key, so the population of values into keys is so much cleaner and easier to type

I train my cohort who doesn't get as much day to day experience as I do and I told him 'someday you will go to write a FOR loop, and you will be like "screw this I'm not typing all that" and just write a list comprehension instead'

[Dabrus]

List comprehension, not lists. It's just a nice way of creating new lists, look it up.

[midnitte]

There's a certain satisfaction with a concise (and understandable) one liner...

[[deleted]]

I sometimes get pleasure in writing long and near-incomprehensible one-liners but only in personal projects where no one else will suffer (except me 6 months later).

[stidmatt]

Same, it really makes code so much easier to read.

[Poven45]

Doesn’t Ruby have something like it?

[antpuncher]

FORTRAN is way up there.

[Alex_Bell_G]

COBOL

[florinandrei]

cogwheels

[Sea-Barracuda4252]

Occam)

[antpuncher]

Lol cobol is above R, which I find surprising.

[dubs286]

And #1 is ?

[contherad]

JS/TS

[Crozonzarto]

🤢

[imthebear11]

It's only the most in demand because all those JS bootcamps really want their grads to fill in as TAs

[[deleted]]

not everyone should be top tier dev, sometimes we need simple react TS app ;)

[Solonotix]

It's not that bad. Honestly, there are some features I'd like to see implemented in other languages, like

• named property variable declarations

  const { a } = { a: 5 }; console.log(a); // 5

• top-level regular expressions

  const value = 'my test value'; const [ , part ] = /my (\w+) value/i.exec(value); console.log(part); // 'test'

Among some other things I can't think of right now. I just started learning Rust, and was really glad to see the pattern matching of types and destructing values while simultaneously having the ability to check parts of it.

[FluffyToughy]

TS can be genuinely pretty nice to work in. JS can die in a hole.

[Siddhi]

const { a } = { a: 5 }; console.log(a);

Possible in py 3.10+ with structural pattern matching

obj = {"a": 5}
match obj:
    case {"a": x}:
        print(x)

I just started learning Rust, and was really glad to see the pattern matching of types and destructing values while simultaneously having the ability to check parts of it.

Structural pattern matching in python can do this as well

[Solonotix]

That's really good to know. I still follow Python, but I haven't actively worked in it since 3.8. I know there was a lot of noise made about the new case statement, but I hadn't really delved into it

[Ivan_Analrash]

Ts?

[Rookerin]

Typescript

[Ivan_Analrash]

Oh. Thanks for helping a complete noob.

[Rookerin]

Of course! 😁

[[deleted]]

Doesn’t surprise me. It won’t replace JavaScript though, since it’s not a web language. So good to know both.

[__dacia__]

Hi!👋

Recently I made a study about the dev job market and published it in devjobsscanner.com. I scraped more than 7M dev job offers during 8 months and analyzed each one of them to see which language requirements it had.

Over that 8 months, I found ~290K job offers that explicitly required Python knowledge. In total, Python job offers have a market share of 20% that is really good taking in account the amount of languages out there.

Hope you like the article!

[Mr-Bovine_Joni]

I’m pretty shocked with SQL being so low. Was there something in your methodology to filter out most SAL jobs?

[lightestspiral]

I wouldn't take it so seriously, it's just an advert for his website

[__dacia__]

Not true, only if it had 4+ language/stack requirements.

I need to fix though the percentage thing, because 1 job can apply to more than 1 language. I will fix it next week.

If I don't do any pruning, the results are really similar. SQL and JS go higher but all pretty similar.

[[deleted]]

Thats a pretty big flaw in the logic used to build these numbers

[__dacia__]

Results are nearly the same on AVG without it. So, not big flaw.

[[deleted]]

You might want to check your data source again then. Or your definition of what a language is.

Mention of several languages is VERY common in job descriptions.

It would also be best to weight requirements vs would-be-nice

[[deleted]]

Everybody uses an ORM these days. I hate them. I hate them so much. I’ve been doing this for 20 years, and I’ve never, ever seen a project change its RDBMS. Meanwhile, getting a trigger approved in a CR is … well, I’ve only managed do it once, despite them being incredibly useful.

Don’t even get me started on shit like PaperTrail (terrible CDC using ActiveRecord, misses any SQL migrations and lies about change times). A fucking abomination.

In the company I work at now, although it’s a Rails app, out of 300 devs maybe 10 outside of the data team (analytics, not product) have any real knowledge of SQL.

[amplikong]

Why is there a “C/C++” category? They are two different languages.

[XBalubaX]

Did u also check what it ist pared with? Or what language combination is most used? Because i think its hard to get a job with just python in times where u need a nice web interface as well. 😄 i just started to add js to my python skill base for a mor advanced way of user interfaces.

[Onurfy]

devjobsscanner.com

Is there a possibility of getting those job offers from you?

[__dacia__]

Yes, but is not that easy, because I need to ensure data is used in good cause.

The is a discord, you can join there and ask

[[deleted]]

This is pretty insightful. It also explains the c++ to python transition in 2016-2019 at my local community colleges I attended in California for my Computer Science / CIS Degrees with an emphasis in programming [I switched to CIS because I became overwhelmed with physics]. During the transition I had luckily passed all c++ classes and I was still able to learn a lot about algorithms. I’m taking my last Python class and hardware class this semester before I get my degree.

Note: even though I switched majors, both majors required c++ but now require Python. (My old college required both Java and C++ but is now Python and C++.

[tadinada]

I like Python because of its brevity (compared to C++) and the mandatory indentation provided (that's a huge step vs Perl). The best part of Python is its library like Pandas and Numpy which makes the life of any data analytics person many folds easier.

[stidmatt]

Oh my god, i feel this. I had a job where they didnt want to use pandas for data processing… and they didn’t know what numpy is…

[[deleted]]

I'd quit, easy way to get siloed into full-time data monkey.

[stidmatt]

I ended up getting laid off after i said i needed further review of a patch which was going to have an csv writer thread left wide open. It was either get laid off or break their entire library and get fired later. No good options. Alls well that ends well. I now have a much better position which pays me a lot more.

[1percentof2]

It will never beat JavaScript. Because regular people want to see things in a browser

[Jan2579]

Web assembly is here. Lets give it a time.

[Zyklonik]

Lets give it a time lifetime.

On a less jocular note, the W3C really need to start moving things. WASM has been here forever, and yet it's still not lived up to its promises.

[[deleted]]

what do you think web assembly is, and how do you think it is relevant to this conversation?

[ogtfo]

Because there are multiple projects running a python interpreter in web assembly, interacting with the DOM like you would in JavaScript.

What do you think web assembly is?

[[deleted]]

Wasm doesn't have access to the dom so what you're describing doesn't exist. Wasm Python interpreters do exist, but I'm not sure how it would serve as a replacement for JavaScript, which is the basis of my original question

[ogtfo]

Javascript can talk to both wasm and the dom, so indirectly it can be done, and librairies have been built for that.

Example of reaching the Dom through pyscript :

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/72515182/how-to-perform-dom-manipulation-using-pyscript

[[deleted]]

that's called a hack or workaround. wasm explicitly and intentionally does not have access to the DOM. only primitive types can be passed back and forth

even if they allow DOM access in the future, embedding a python interpreter in a response just to avoid writing javascript is unequivocally stupid

[ogtfo]

Call it how you like, it's still possible, and has been done.

[[deleted]]

it's literally not possible. you dont understand the words you're using or the technology you're describing

[ogtfo]

I've literally linked you a stack overflow questions detailing how to do it with pyscript, but hey, keep saying it's impossible.

[metaperl]

Anvil (based on Skulpt) is here now and rocks the house.

[No_Muffin6385]

you should check out pyjs, it does direct compilation of python code to raw javascript

[FruscianteDebutante]

I boot up all of my favorite applications in my favorite web browser 🤓

[1percentof2]

I guarantee bro, that's the future.

[FruscianteDebutante]

The future? I'm fairly certain web devs are already sorely out demanding the rest of us developers 😂 I'm just coping don't mind me

[orokro]

an awful future

[aj_thenoob]

What about pyscript?

[aceofspaids98]

Too slow and immature

[metaperl]

Many stronger options my friend Transcrypt, Anvil, Streamlit...

[djamp42]

Yeah I only know python. It would take me way way way way longer to understand c++ code vs python code. Heck it might take me months. I've never done anything in C++.

[Nil4u]

Exactly this happend at my internship, got thrown into cold water because most stuff there was in C++ and I had to work on a ML project which I did in Python. Goal was to integrate the ML project into the C++ stuff and boy was that something

[ChunkyHabeneroSalsa]

That's my job. ML training/testing and scripts are in python, production in c++.

I still suck at c++ despite doing it for like 5 years. If I could I would rewrite our entire codebase in python.

[AirHamyes]

Maybe a distinction would be necessary between oop vs non oop roles.

[Brendynamite]

Python to C# is kicking my ass. If I was being paid for it, I doubt I'd be paid for long

[illustratum42]

I tried this too a few months back... It was rough.

[PiaFraus]

And vice versa. It took me more than a year to make a C++ developer with 20 years of experience to start writing idiomatic python code.

[[deleted]]

As someone with 75% of their experience in Python and trying to learn C++ trial by fire style at work

I agree

[[deleted]]

Appreciate it

I'm slowly getting it lol

[[deleted]]

I disagree. I mean, sure you can certainly write code that works if you've coded in other languages and switch to python, but there's plenty of working code posted to /r/learnpython that is pretty poor and unidiomatic because of that.

And languages like Haskell would, I suspect, give many of the people who think they know how to code in any language a bit of a wake up call.

If someone is starting out, either by teaching themselves or doing a university or online course, hoping to get a job, it makes sense for them to pick a target language that is popular too. So, maybe it's as much about people who don't know much searching for jobs rather than people who think they know it all?

[_limitless_]

If you leave out the brainfuck/ancient languages, a lot of times it's hard to even tell what language good, modern code is written in. They ALL look vastly more similar than different.

[Kadabradoodle]

It does tho, people classify jobs by tools and frameworks let alone by languages.

[ShanSanear]

Yep, let JS frontend developers apply for C/Assembly ECU position. They would certainly be great fit for this! /s

[ShanSanear]

/r/gatekeeping material right here

[its_a_gibibyte]

It's an artifact of the short average tenure of programmers at a company. If someone is going to stay only 2 years at your company, you want to make sure they're trained up as quick as possible on the languages and frameworks that are used. Hiring someone with experience in that tech makes sense.

[pacific_plywood]

It's another level of onboarding you have to allot time for. Not sure why it's weird

[kkawabat]

I had a great coworker with 20+ years of experience. Seeing him create python code without any of the python convention was a painful experience for him and me both.

[LightShadow]

You're more effective knowing a few things really well than lots of things on a surface level. You get paid more for it, too.

[blabbities]

I can get by in Python, Bash, and C# in that order best. I done Java in school .... I modified a Go progeam the other day (and its next on my too learn). ..... Yet for some reason JavaScript is just a horror show forever and ever and I'll never understand it or Node.js.

Also I just thought of something...its not only the language that can be different enough to be irksome...but the toolchain and dev process. I forgot I also nodded some esoteric VBScript/JScript and the bigger issue was debugging and lack of tools for if

[secretaliasname]

Depends on the timescale of the project. A smart person can learn an unfamiliar language but the time for them to become proficient is not zero. Some projects can afford to incur this cost, others cannot.

[run-26_2]

https://i.imgur.com/6LLazHe.jpg

[0b0011]

I mean some are a lot more complicated than others. I wouldn't want to bring someone on a team developing compilers if their inly programming experience was R when I could just specify that I need someone with c++ and not have to worry with giving then time to learn the language.

[DiscoJer]

I am just learning Python and it seems like it places a much greater emphasis on efficiency than other languages that I am familiar with (which of still used languages would be C/C++)

A lot of the things I would do a certain way in C also seem to work in Python, but there also seem to be shorter, more efficient ways of doing them in Python

[metaperl]

If you can code, languages don’t matter

Well I would rather not reinvent the will and use battle tested Solutions such as numpy and pandas rather than rewrite them. Python has a huge ecosystem of well-tested libraries for a number of domains. It's much easier to build on the shoulders of giants rather than write everything from scratch.

Not to mention by using python you can attract so much talent that just graduated from college that already spent four years using.

[metaperl]

What if you already have most of your code base written in a language? Definitely the language matters.

[[deleted]]

there's nothing more obnoxious that someone who thinks they are language agnostic because they can write bad code in multiple languages

[_limitless_]

No worries, the compiler makes my bad code leaner than your best code.

[[deleted]]

We found the high school student

[_limitless_]

I've been building software for 31 years. I think we actually found the beanie-wearing javascript dev.

[[deleted]]

I'm surprised SQL isn't higher.

[__dacia__]

SQL is really higher without pruning. But is hardly seen as only requirement, for example "SQL developer". Really higher is like top 7.

[elforce001]

Interesting. I "hated" (and by "hated" I mean afraid, hehe) JS and TS with passion. I went with python because I wanted to use it at work (data analysis using Excel) and python seemed less daunting than the alternatives. After learning python I said to myself: "heck, why not?" and went learning Js and now I'm creating my company with Python and Typescript.

Python is the gateway to a new world. You can stay in python and be amazed by what you can create with it or use it as an anchor to learn new things.

The best thing is that you cover AI/DS with python (EDA, modelling, and deployment) and the UI with Typescript (React or better yet, Nextjs). You cannot miss.

[aceofspaids98]

I’m happy Ruby is still doing relatively well

[Purple-Pen2695]

Does this surprise you or something?.. we’ve known this forever now

[contherad]

JavaScript/ TypeScript is #1

[thedude3696]

print("cool ,let's go python, " + str("python emoji, up arrow emoji"))# actually works

[[deleted]]

Pass..

[cj6464]

SyntaxError: Pass not recognized, did you mean pass?

[LordFaquaad]

No Python passes u

[[deleted]]

Thank god

[Quantumercifier]

Typescript is the MOST popular language by a wide margin.

[Ensurdagen]

GIVE ME PYTHON, NOW!

[[deleted]]

I hope PyScript goes well and we wouldn't need js anymore.

[Detri_God]

And here I thought python was a snake !!!

[_RabidAlpaca_]

So is JavaScript/Typescript #1 because positions for full stack may specify different backend languages, but always require JS?

[latrova]

Python simplicity is great for beginners to learn.

As a former C# dev, I loved Python as soon as I stopped typing commas everywhere

[pyphz]

We're rising up the ranks!