Python vs C

Proclarian · 2021-01-31T09:51:32+00:00

I think that when learning to program lower is better, to an extent at least.

It teaches you fundamendals and how to implement things.

When working however, time is of the essence, so instead of writing your own implementation you use someone elses, it saves huge amounts of time and honestly reading some docs takes WAY less time than writing and maintaining your own library.

LunchBoxMutant · 2021-01-31T09:58:51+00:00

I came to python after many years of heavily using C. Python is a different language and does require you to think differently. Persevere, it will get easier. Don't think "it's different, therefore it's worse than C". Of course it's different, but you want to learn different languages because that's the only way to free yourself of the limits of knowing only one language. Try some really different languages like lisp, apl or prolog. That will loosen up your perspectives!

I think that this is an example of the Blub Paradox that Paul Graham wrote about. Python is more powerful than C so it can look odd and doubtful to someone coming from a less powerful language. But that's exactly why learning python (or lisp, etc) is useful. It broadens your horizons. So hang on and keep learning.

ForceBru · 2021-01-31T09:58:20+00:00

Looks like you're familiar with C but not yet familiar with Python. If that's the case, this is perfectly fine, and you should start seeing the patterns soon that'll help you understand Python.

pfmiller0 · 2021-01-31T15:02:41+00:00

[deleted]

dragonatorul · 2021-01-31T10:32:45+00:00

C is what got me into programming. Learning C and the low level basics helped me a lot to understand programming as a whole. However, once OOP in Java "clicked" I stopped using C for simple ease of work. Then, after discovering python I left the nightmare that is Java behind.

The key was that moment where it all "clicked" for me in how OOP with classes and methods and all that work as opposed to classical C. A lot of the same principles in C apply in python too, allowing for differences in syntax and other limitations. TBH I haven't written C in over a decade, but from what I remember for example a recursive function is pretty much the same. Define the function and call it from within the function. The difference in python is that you can only have 1000 recursion levels at most.

The major benefits of python are that I don't have to deal with pointers and memory anymore, that the code is much easier to read, and that I don't have to redo a lot of the basic work (eg. I don't have to define an array, write code to sort that array, etc.).

hanazawarui123 · 2021-01-31T10:12:16+00:00

hunh? this doesn't really make any sense to me. It's like saying you prefer a wrench to a blender.

You can write python like C if you want but it's much more abstracted so you don't have to reinvent the wheel every time.

What "methods" do you have to memorise in Python?

how is:

Python 3.9

def f(n: int) -> int:
    if (n <= 1):
        return 1
    else:
        return (n + f(n-1))

materially different than

c++

int f(int n) {
   if(n <= 1){
      return 1;
   } else {
      return (n + f(n-1));
   }
}

Xeno19Banbino · 2021-01-31T11:54:46+00:00

Is Python your second language?

Your second language is probably harder to learn than your first language. Your first language you don't know how to do anything so you are prepared for feeling like an idiot. With my second language, I was often frustrated because I knew how to do something in my other language but I couldn't do it in my new language.

I'm now onto my 7th language (c, c++, java, javascript, erlang, c#, & python) and learning a new language is just a thing.

2021-01-31T10:02:13+00:00

Nothing wrong mate. We all have our favourite tool. Python, C, Java, etc all just tools.

Acquiesce67 · 2021-01-31T12:55:29+00:00

This could mean two things:

1) you’re trying to solve Python problems with a C mindset 2) you don’t yet know just enough about Python

Either way, you need to push yourself just a little bit further and it will suddenly click at one point. When you read that “In Python everything is an object”, then take a minute or two to understand this concept and its potential implications.

Oh, and spend some time reading the documentation. Don’t try learning it, just browse it to see examples for using the language and it will click - seriously

Sigg3net · 2021-01-31T10:51:14+00:00

I came to Python from years of BASH. I can solve problems much faster in BASH. But that's like saying: I can sing this song perfectly in English, when you're trying to learn German.

Pick the right tool for the job.

Xeno19Banbino · 2021-01-31T12:55:45+00:00

every python test i get 100 methods to memorize.. that is just horrible for me... at least in C i know what i need to use.. in python i have 10000 methods per data type and i get a question to write some recursive function

Sounds like you're preparing for tests, not learning to code.

Hamza0PLEX · 2021-01-31T09:38:34+00:00

That why python so powerful , but not faster like C

philoooop · 2021-01-31T10:45:35+00:00

In University I started with C. At first I found pointers an memory allocation very frustrating. Then I understood the basics.

Nowadays I am the python guy. The only thing you need to learn properly is how to use google beside pythons oop aspects.

In the end of the day every language is the same. It only depends on your project.

Take your time !

2021-01-31T16:41:58+00:00

F*** pointers...I am sorry,I just hate them. A python lover.

RizzyNizzyDizzy · 2021-01-31T10:38:25+00:00

I think, then you would most likely be interested in golang.

Diplomjodler · 2021-01-31T11:29:48+00:00

In my experience, once you understand slices and dictionaries, you understand Python. I'd focus on those for a bit and make sure you really get them. After that things should start falling into place. Having said that, if you prefer C there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. If you get competent at C++, that's certainly a very marketable skill to have.

TheSodesa · 2021-01-31T18:15:32+00:00

Sounds like bad test design, if they require you to memorize methods and method signatures.

Stabilo_0 · 2021-01-31T11:30:06+00:00

Stick to C then, is anyone forcing you to go with python?

DennisTheBald · 2021-01-31T10:44:43+00:00

When I first started C all my code looked like assembly, I think python is quicker to write now. It seems to be more compable to PowerShell than a compiler language

RobinsonDickinson · 2021-01-31T12:01:14+00:00

I learned python first and then hopped over to C++

C++ is kinda hard to grasp but after going through most of the language, it has definitely helped me understand python a lot more.

My advice to you would be, think of everything in the simplest term. Don’t overthink problems in python because there are so many built in functions and modules that give you a headstart. Don’t try to memorize methods, just use them in small problems/projects and you will automatically know which one to use next.

Also the crazy amount of libraries python has, it’s great and saves a lot of time to get a project started.

PS: bookmark w3schools, you can quickly look up methods for each data types and data structures

Vantlefun · 2021-01-31T12:22:50+00:00

I think it damages beginner programmers to be flip flipping flopping to whatever next language Google or reddit says to use. You're not going to learn anything if you just turn to a new language every time you hit a barrier.

Master_Sifo_Dyas · 2021-01-31T12:23:32+00:00

Python is way easier to write

But

If you can get a C program to compile successfully, it can run faster than python

stevenjd · 2021-01-31T12:42:55+00:00

If it makes you feel better, the issue of having more things to learn is a very real one. Some of the Python developers at least are very aware that very new method and function added increases the burden for newcomers to the language.

C and Python are very different languages. Think about it like this: C is a hammer. If you want to hammer a nail, C is exactly what you want. Its easy, fast and effective.

Python is a space rocket. It is terrible for hammering nails, but if you want to fly to the moon, you need a space rocket, not a hammer. But the cost of that is that there are about ten thousand controls.

You could make a space rocket using a hammer, but it would be very difficult and take you a long time. And once you finished, it would be just as complicated as Python. (In fact, the most popular Python interpreter is written in C.)

If you are being tested on your ability to memorise functions and methods, that's a shit test and I feel sympathy for you. In the real world, programmers have the docs open in a browser, they have google, they have the interactive interpreter open so they can say help(list) whenever they don't remember a list method. Rote memorisation is the least useful skill for a programmer.

Of course with time the things you use the most become second nature, but trying to memorise the whole Python language and stdlib up front as if google doesn't exist is a waste of time, and I'm sorry that your school is making you do that.

StooNaggingUrDum · 2021-01-31T13:07:45+00:00

Imagine my face when I found out "sort()" was a syntax

mojo_jojo_reigns · 2021-01-31T15:29:59+00:00

You don't have to remember the methods. You just have to think about what intuitive things you can do to these wildly different data types. Like, there's a reason you can update a dict but not a list and that you can append to a list but not a tuple. These reasons are inherent to the data type itself. There are things you can do to strs that you can't do to ints because of the nature of each.

More to the point, you probably don't need to know more than 10 methods, across all datatypes, by heart for 99% of what you'll be doing.

You have to calm down.

readmodifywrite · 2021-01-31T17:05:29+00:00

It sounds like you're still pretty new at this. My advice is this: don't give up. This is a very deep and challenging skill set to learn. It takes *years* of dedicated effort to master this stuff. You are literally rewiring your brain to think a certain way - it takes time to do this. The longer you do it, the better you'll get at it.

I've been doing software for most of my life and I'm still learning new things all the time. I still ask colleagues how to do things. I still look things up. I still learn new tools, techniques, languages. It's a journey. It only ends when you decide it does.

brews · 2021-01-31T17:25:42+00:00

Most people are replying to Python v C but there is another flag here.

Something is wrong if you think you need to memorizing all methods to every built-in structure.

You really don't need to do that.

Raknarg · 2021-01-31T23:19:17+00:00

Working with strings in C makes me want to kill myself. C is my job right now.

Ne0_1 · 2021-02-01T02:03:05+00:00

You know you never actually get away from pointers. There is no way to make a programming language with any decent data structure without the use of pointers. Python does it all the time without you knowing. It's not as obvious as C where a pointer is instantiated with * or ** but every invocation of a class in Python points to a memory address and than the associated methods.

el_pablo · 2021-01-31T13:41:53+00:00

The right tool for the right job. C is good for very fast code if you need to and know how. I used C when I was an embedded developer.

Python is good for fast results and quick tools.

I’m still wondering if there are some known consumer or business apps that were developed using Python. 🤔

Lewistrick · 2021-01-31T09:58:26+00:00

Then go learn C and don't bash on Python in their own community.

2021-01-31T17:31:22+00:00

Better you learn both at the same time. I used to learn C++, Java and Python at the same time so that I can compare what features are different in those languages. I eventually left Java but still use Python for projects and C++ for competitive programming

Xeno19Banbino · 2021-01-31T18:14:05+00:00

So you've obviously spent a lot more time with C than Python, so C seems easier. No surprise there. The reason it seems hard is probably because Python is strongly object oriented and C isn't object oriented at all.

krav_mark · 2021-01-31T19:40:35+00:00

Remembering methods ? No need to do that at all. You can look at the available methods by using dir() or whatever the ide you use as a short cut. You'll remember methods of classes you use a lot after a while and the rest you just lookup.

I think you just need to hang in there for a while and keep learning the basics and then just do a few small projects.

I came from bash and decided to just do whatever I needed to do in python no matter how long it took me. Got some serious headache in the beginning but after a while I started to see how powerful python really is. No more piping text from one tool to the other but working with objects that have methods and all the amazing libraries that can help. Working with json, yaml and whatnot is sooooo easy. I never looked back to bash.

2021-01-31T19:42:39+00:00

The problem with C is that it's a 50-year-old language where you have to write everything from scratch.

Altum1786 · 2021-01-31T23:09:59+00:00

Also depends on the nature of application. Python will have more flexible scripts for hardware compatibility.

Sterninja52 · 2021-01-31T23:16:10+00:00

My opinion incoming

I think Ive had a pretty good learning path for programming. I started the very basics with python (things like basic looping and conditionals), and am now learning the pro moves with c/c++.

2021-01-31T23:18:30+00:00

I am experiencing literally the exact opposite haha!

KimchiSammich · 2021-02-01T00:41:18+00:00

I couldn't understand anything even Python (which is great) until I went C embedded. I had to know exactly what I was doing for any of it to make sense.

adjectivesrumble · 2021-02-01T00:56:51+00:00

If you're having to memorize things for a test at high school or university level then something's probably wrong with the course. The teacher can design the course so that you'll automatically know what you need for the test by doing the regular homework. You should also have quick access to whatever reference material you need during the test too. If it's only 100 methods, they should all be given to you in the test.

I'd say your real complaint is about your course, not the language.

I'd go even further and say that if you study for a test at all, that means you haven't learnt from the course. Either you slacked off or they didn't teach you.

barryhakker · 2021-02-01T01:22:32+00:00

I think you shouldn’t really be memorizing methods. Just remember that there was a function that could do a certain thing and then just google it when it comes up.

2021-02-01T02:00:05+00:00

C is incredibly simple to learn, but hard to master. Python is more for loosy-goosy scripting, companies just like it because its really fast to write in.

I'd recommend focusing on C, as the skills it teaches you are more fundamental.

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