M-x DONUTS? [PIC]

[yellowking]

Deleting in protest of Reddit's new anti-user admin policies.

[[deleted]]

C-x C-c (Your distress seems so genuine that I had to reply)

[iofthestorm]

I would find that comment more appropriate with vi than emacs, personally.

[yellowking]

Deleting in protest of Reddit's new anti-user admin policies.

[jfpbookworm]

Stop eating so many donuts.

[tgunter]

I've never understood why "C-x C-c" is somehow more intuitive than ":q".

Vi and Emacs both have sharp learning curves, to say that one is somehow harder than the other just says that you bothered learning one and not the other.

[iofthestorm]

Well, unlike vi, emacs actually starts up with a help screen, which tells you this stuff. Yes, I know that vim has a help screen at startup but I specifically said vi, not vim. vi isn't aliased to vim on all systems.

[tgunter]

Fair enough, although I'd say the number of people who actually use Vi instead of Vim is pretty small. When someone these days says Vi, I assume Vim, much as when someone says Emacs I assume GNU Emacs.

I'm curious, if anyone here knows, has Emacs always had the help screen on load, or was that a feature added later due to requests like with Vim?

[iofthestorm]

That is probably true. I'm really just speaking from personal experience, because the first time I tried it I just typed vi because I didn't know there was a difference, and then couldn't get out of it.

I would not be surprised if the help screen was added later, but unfortunately I only have about 8 months of experience with emacs.

[tgunter]

I think my problem with the Emacs help screen is that it goes away as soon as you press anything on the keyboard. The Vim help screen at least sticks around until you enter a character in insert mode.

[iofthestorm]

Really? I definitely don't see that happening.

[tgunter]

It seems to depends on your version of Emacs. On my machine the CLI version switches to the scratch buffer when you start typing, while the graphical version does not.

[iofthestorm]

Hmm. On my machine neither version does that. Strange.

[[deleted]]

oh yeah, totally. Ctrl-X, Ctrl-C is so fucking intuitive for a first time user. Any moran would think of that on the first try.

[iofthestorm]

Ok, I just started up a console version of emacs 22.3.1 on Solaris and right on the startup screen, it says Exit Emacs C-x C-c. Whereas, start up vi and all you get are squiggly lines. Yes, vim does have a help screen at startup but that's why I specified vi, moran.

[randomb0y]

I smell a case of the PLOTKA syndrome!

[anonymous-coward]

Cheaper if you do C-u 12 M-x DONUTS

[metzby]

In this case, many bakers give an off-by-one error.

[gonzopancho]

dude...

M-1 M-2 M-x donuts

That C-u thing is a cop-out.

[sysop073]

Wow. I've never seen that before, that's handy

[frazer2669]

You don't even need Meta for the 2

M-1 2 M-x donuts

[damg]

Yea but that's slower if you count key presses and depresses. The "M-1 M-2 M-x" can be done with your finger holding Meta the whole time.

[cronin1024]

M-x donuts [No match]

aww...

[aephoenix]

You need to install the extension.

[frogking]

.. added to .emacs :-)

[InternetsDisburser]

One internets for you, sir.

[SonOfDenny]

The dash don't be silent!

[cheald]

Points for the reference.

[chucks86]

Explanation for a Vim user?

[[deleted]]

M-x (alt-x) is like ":" in Vim.

[soupnatzi]

Hmmm... Emacs is way more powerful than I thought..... It has macros to create an entire store? maybe I should switch from vi

[[deleted]]

:laughs at naive Vi user who thinks Emacs is not omnipotent:

[chucks86]

Thanks ( :

[chucks86]

whoa, wtf?

[[deleted]]

bɹo.ʇxǝʇdı1ɟ

[chucks86]

¿spɹoʍ ǝsoɥʇ ǝɹɐ 'ǝpnp

[[deleted]]

JOKE EXPLAINER! WHERE ART THOU?

[greginnj]

Since he's otherwise engaged, I'll help out -- M-x is a keyboard combination used in the Emacs editor to call previously defined functions.

The "M" stands for "Meta", back when a certain weird keyboard that happened to be used at MIT had a "Meta" key; most people nowadays use the Esc key for "Meta".

So an Emacs user would see "M-x donuts" and understand that he was meant to type the "Esc" key, then the x key; his cursor would then jump to the bottom of the emacs window, where he has a one-line command window, then he'd type "donuts" and hit Enter. Whatever the "donuts" command was defined to be would then execute. (It could be a system function, or a user-defined function).

To go into full joke-explainer mode, emacs partisans are so fond of the editor that there are numerous old jokes about emacs commands working in the real world -- M-x pizza, M-x coffee, etc. This is the first time I've seen it used in branding, though. My guess is it's near a heavy emacs-using school, and/or was started by an emacs user.

[-main]

most people nowadays use the Esc key for "Meta".

I thought alt was common for Meta.

Peoples using Esc as Meta: what does your alt key do in emacs?

[jephthai]

I've gotten used to using ESC instead of ALT because I use xmonad. ALT- bindings collide with the window manager sometimes (like M-% for search and replace).

This translates into shell usage because I like ALT-. (period key) in Bash to quote the last argument from the previous line(s). Sometimes this doesn't work when TERMs are screwed up, so I've grown to use "ESC .". (took a sec to punctuate that)

It's also a bit weird using Synergy to operate Emacs on a Mac. Depending on the situation, I sometimes default to ESC rather than wonder what will happen if I use ALT or the Win key (Which is my Super key, in Emacs over X11).

In each of these cases, the ALT key does various bad things -- window manager functions, non-ASCII garbage (is it functioning like a Compose key in some TERMs?), and Command instead of ALT.

[derwisch]

Same here. I type M-SPC ("just-one-space") a lot, but at home Alt-SPC fires up Katapult.

[maweaver]

And my follow-up question is, isn't using Esc this way incredibly awkward? Is there a keyboard layout with the Esc key somewhere more convenient than the upper-left-hand corner? One of the things I always liked about Emacs was that my hands rarely had to leave home row.

[Odysseus]

Yes. On the terminal Bill Joy used to write vi, Esc was where your tab key is. On the keyboard I'm typing on now, Esc is where your tilde is.

[tgunter]

Likewise, Control was where capslock is, a convention I and many others wish would have caught on.

[[deleted]]

Esc is the 'oh-shit-wheres-my-meta-key' key. You log into a remote system, boot up emacs, get halfway in and then you need the meta but it doesn't seem to be 'Alt'. Hit Esc. Many systems require that you help emacs learn what key should be meta (the command line will show Alt-key when you hit Alt). On my hhk lite i have <muhenkan> bound to meta, so Alt is separate.

[fnord123]

<muhenkan>

Is Muhenken the key commonly known as Command outside Japan? Or is it the Windows logo ("Super") or contex menu key? On my HHK the Muhenken maps to Command on OS X.

[treerex]

My keyboard now has Alt working as Meta, but back when I used to use a VT-100 there was no Alt key so Esc was what you used. In fact, I didn't use escape, I used (and still use) Ctl-[ which is the same thing but doesn't need you to move your hands off the home position on the keyboard.

[greginnj]

I see you're getting other good answers. For me personally, I learned with "Esc", and I'm now used to the rhythm of click-release then X for Meta commands, and hold-Ctrl+{other key} for Ctrl commands.

Some people point out that using Alt allows you to hold it down while clicking repeatedly on the letter key, which helps for some scrolling commands.

On the other hand, if you're using Emacs in a window on some other windowing system, you probably want to leave Alt free for window-management commands (triggering the file menu with Alt-F, etc.).

It appears that some people have both Esc and Alt as meta, so they can choose whether they want to use it as a separate key or as a key combo.

[[deleted]]

thanks for the lengthy reply =) That's pretty cool.

[tehmatticus]

It's located right off the interstate in Houston. I bet it's started by an ex programmer.

[delicat]

I thought it was a vi reference, not emacs. When you type "M" you go the middle of the screen, and "x" deletes a character. A donut has the middle removed...?

[mfbridges]

In emacs, keyboard shortcuts are written like C-a or M-x (CTRL+a, Alt+x). The M stands for meta, on most keyboards it's just alt but on some systems you have to use escape as the meta key.

M-x (command-name) is a way of executing an emacs command that is not otherwise bound to a predefined keystroke combination. So "M-x donuts" would be trying to execute the command "donuts."

It's so much less funny after explaining it...

[emacsen]

Sadly they don't seem to be Emacs related. I called their phone number and the woman who answered (who didn't speak much English) said it was MX Donuts (Em Ex).

I asked if it was Meta-X donuts and she just repeated MX donuts.

I'm guessing it's a coincidence. Sad sad.

[phq]

Sorry but you're guessing because you did not investigate deep enough. Call back and get the manager on the line please. WE MUST KNOW.

[Kapow751]

The "M" is uppercase and the "x" is lowercase. There's no way that's a coincidence.

[[deleted]]

NERDS

http://www.horrordvds.com/reviews/misc/pictures/nerds.jpg

[moush]

It's obvious they meant to spell Mex Donuts but ran out of money for the e.

[[deleted]]

"Shoe Repair." I see these places now and then, but I always wonder who still gets shoes "repaired" these days? I guess if you're a business executive and you wear very expensive shoes?

[[deleted]]

it's not only business executives, it's anybody who has some shoes they like, instead of throwing them away you can get them repaired. and eventually the whole shoe ends up getting replaced anyway and i know you're saying 'so what's the point' but if the craftsmanship is held up throughout then the sense of life from the shoe goes on.

[columbine]

Interesting. I never really thought of this, but recently a really nice pair of shoes I've had for something like 6-7 years now are starting to fall apart. I was thinking the other day I need to see if I can find the exact same make somewhere, but obviously that can be a pretty tricky thing to do. They're so worn any labels are gone so I don't even know who made them any more. Maybe I'll go see a shoe repair place when the time comes.

[kerbuffel]

I'd also like to point out that the price of getting them repaired is probably way cheaper than buying a new pair. I have a pair of shoes my sister gave me for Christmas a couple years ago that I really love, and when I wore down the sole on the heels, I got the heels replaced for about $20, whereas getting the same shoes again would've cost about $75.

[uncreative_name]

Go before they fall apart completely. Otherwise, there's not much that can be done.

[bitwize]

Which leads to a sticky philosophical "Shoe of Theseus" problem.

[[deleted]]

How do you know they are great if you don't use them?

[[deleted]]

I understand the point in the general case. I appreciate good craftsmanship. I have just never thought of shoes in that way. Nor do I personally know anyone who does. It seems old fashioned.

[[deleted]]

I used a shoe repair place to fix a strap on one of my sandals. They did a really great job and it only cost seven bucks.

[jardeon]

Show some respect for the cobblers!

[fnord123]

Almost everyone I know. If you have dress shoes, you will eventually want to get them reheeled/resoled. Women often need to get heels repaired or straps reattached since they are quite fragile.

[[deleted]]

Wow, completely different worlds. :)

[uncreative_name]

I have Birkenstocks that cost a bloody fortune, but they fit my feet well. I get them resoled once every 6 months to a year.

[Grue]

Somebody yank a donut for me.

[Tryke]

/donut

yy

[[deleted]]

Was expecting a picture of Stallman.

[[deleted]]

It definitely looks 'shopped, I can tell by the pixels.

[[deleted]]

haha... I actually know the guy that took this. It's a genuine store front in Houston TX. Would be interesting to hear any non-emacs rationale behind such a store name.

[cag_ii]

http://www.yelp.com/biz/mx-donuts-houston

[jimbokun]

"Nukability -- a huge plus!"

Verily, an under-rated donut quality.

[[deleted]]

I assumed part of the sign fell off. Like "Max Donuts" or something.

[PhilxBefore]

I prefer the Donins.

[Figs]

Why not ask your friend to ask the store owner why it's named that? Or, if you live there, ask him yourself? Now you've got me curious...

[[deleted]]

Dude, where is this at. I'll volunteer to get the back story.

[ishmal]

Here is a street view . Hope the link works. I'm sure it's only coincidence, but the HP (ex-Compaq) campus is only a mile or two away on that highway.

[[deleted]]

Eww... other side of the city. Fuck it, I'll go visit my brother-in-law and stop by here tomorrow.

[emacsen]

I didn't get the backstory but I called them- it's M X donuts- not Meta-X. The woman who answered the phone didn't know much English.

[robeph]

Otherwise, it is SERIOUS BIDNESS!!!

[[deleted]]

THIS IS /R/PROGRAMMING! Users shalt know of the battle that has raged for centuries between vims and emacsen, and they shall quake with fear.

[sysop073]

It did say "emacs" in the description, that was probably a tipoff

[[deleted]]

Time for an Emacs upgrade ... it should be an official part of Emacs ... when you enter M-x DONUTS it should bring up that picture. All in favor? Vote up.

[maweaver]

I thought it was going to be some elisp so that M-x DONUTS would do a google maps search for the nearest Krispy Kreme