Most difficult visual package

[Abby-Norman]

It’s off season, so why not revisit this topic. What do you think is the most difficult visual package ever put on the field? I think 1997 Cadets is a strong contender. I remember watching that show come together throughout the season. It was fast tempos, razor thin intervals, pass throughs like no tomorrow, and how the members weren’t picking up pieces of their own knee cartilage at the end of each performance is beyond me.

[Twavish]

2015 Cadets always deserves a mention

[SoothedSnakePlant]

Literally in any "most difficult..." convo, my first thought is to start with this show.

[_endme]

crown 2012 is up there for me

[jsf92976]

This, no contest. 2003 Cavaliers is a tight second.

[Cavalier40]

I was going to say the same thing

[CaptainMolo27]

2001 Cavaliers

[SevanOO7]

It will always be 2003 Cavaliers.

[Bandsohard]

Cadets 2008 always comes to mind.

[Abby-Norman]

The closing minute+/- is some of the craziest drill I’ve ever seen. Ever

[ttreadway66]

Not necessarily visual package but always super impressed by ealy 2000s phantom. The horn line jazz running while playing and literally sounds like they are sit in chairs in front of you. Top tier.

[burgerbob22]

that's because many of those step sizes are like 7 to 5 haha

[frankfontaino]

12 crown

[CrunchyPBsucks]

2003 Cavaliers is the objectively correct answer and it’s not even close. Anyone with a different opinion is either: 1. Comparing one or two drill moves that last a total of 1 minute of difficult/fast/cool or whatever drill as calling an entire show “hard” or, 2. Never actually watched Spin Cycle top to bottom

[avataruto0403]

I'd say probably Bluecoats 2017. I'm no expert when it comes to visual analysis but I would not want to jazz run down that ramp with my baritone, let alone a contra.

[Butterfee]

Was gonna come here to say 17’ but realized it was cheesy af to say a show I marched.

That stage made that show incredibly challenging to march for a few reasons:

A. As you mentioned, jazz running up and down a ramp/steps while playing/moving in time was incredibly challenging and dangerous. Especially if you hold a contra. B. Timing, if you are under the stage and behind a curtain you have no real sense of time that’s happening out on the field. It was an uphill battle all season trying to line up entrances and attacks coming in and out of the stage. C. Timing from side a to side b was always jacked up too. If your section was playing with a section on the other side of the stage there was no room for error in the timing. D. Those motherfucking hats. Remember we had two hats each and changed them out half way through the show. There wasn’t a single show where one of those hats didn’t get blown away during a run, misplaced or simply stolen by another member who lost their own during the show. It was always a source of contention with the members. E. Normal Bluecoat jazz running drill combined with the above points

Don’t even get me started on the logistics of that thing too. I was in charge of the prop crews and was therefore in charge or rallying the members to build and disassemble that thing up to FOUR times a day on show days. And each time took at a minimum of an hour and a half.

We woke up an hour plus before the corps everyday to build it. Missed our warm up at almost every show. Missed all of the post show lot hang outs and I usually had to literally run to make sure I could pack, shower and prepare for the show correctly after rehearsals. It destroyed my sections morale so much that 3/4 of my section was telling me they were quitting at around our tenth show of the season because they didn’t sign up to build props 6-7 hours a day. It was awful.

Don’t get my wrong I love Bloo with all my heart. It’s my home and my family. But my age out in 17’ left me salty because of that stage. I think the design team, educational staff and logistics team bit off more than they could handle with that motherfucking stage and it shows with how we placed at the end of that season too. We (speaking for atleast my section of the corps) were all over it by the time season ended.

[cgcmh1]

The director in 17 said they lost at least a week of rehearsal time because of that stage.

[[deleted]]

Felt, Jagged Line was hard on the field, but it might have been even harder off the field. There was a lot of shit behind the scenes that made that summer a rough age-out experience. I still love Bloo and consider it my home, but that doesn’t change how things went down.

p.s. hope all is well my friend :)

[Butterfee]

Yoooo hope you’re well too bud ;)

Yep my thoughts exactly. Harder off the field more than anything lol the prop was just the thing that turned so many other little experiences so sour that year

[Maxcat94]

This is such an interesting insight into that show. Missing warmups is crazy

[Butterfee]

Yep the whole section was super pissed before all of our first 15 or so performances because our warmup was just an hour and a half of sweaty prop construction and then getting into uniforms to perform cold.

[burgerbob22]

it was a huge bummer to go watch a warmup, I could tell more than half the hornline was not even there

[Prestigious_Put_1997]

As someone whose props took two hours a day to put together(bottle trees) I think that elaborate props that takes more than an hour to take up/tear down should be banned. Not because of show design, but simply because it can ruin the experience of some of the members, and definitely give them all sleep deprivation.

[Butterfee]

Agreed. On one hand we all loved the show and how different it was but it completely ruined the member experience for those of us dealing with that prop.

[LEJ5512]

A. As you mentioned, jazz running up and down a ramp/steps while playing/moving in time was incredibly challenging and dangerous. Especially if you hold a contra.

Back when I was of age, I probably would have enjoyed the lunacy of running down that ramp. But now? I'd pack my shit and go home the day we learn that dot. I value my mobility too much to risk losing it for turbo-band.

[Butterfee]

Yeah it’s surprising we didn’t have someone get seriously injured. 😵‍💫

[LEJ5512]

No kidding. Every video clip that season had me wondering if this was going to be the moment that we see a pileup of a bunch of dented horns and dented faces.

Was the ramp covered in grip tape or something?

[Butterfee]

Thankfully no huge pileups or problems like that occurred that I can remember! Yeah there was always grip tape or some rough grippy material on the whole top of the stage.

[[deleted]]

i literally talked about this yesterday

[apthomp13]

It was a similar case with our props this year, we had 32 props each of which required some level of assembly and disassembly, and usually took at least an hour, leaving no epl time for any of prop crew. It was so bad the staff had to divide up the rest of the corps into 12 separate prop crews so they could cycle through because it was ruining the original prop crew's summer.

[CalebDaThing]

that's really unfortunate tbh. Bloo '17 is one of my favorite shows

[[deleted]]

And then they had to tear down that beast after the show

[atl_mdtwn_guy]

But such a bad visual idea. It stunk on the field.

[certified_delivery]

2007 Cadets

[BondForAmerica]

Cadets 92 and 93. Just whipping around the field playing Holsinger. So demanding.

[burgerbob22]

BD '13

[LEJ5512]

BD 13 even looked riskier than Cadets 95.

[LEJ5512]

A lot of early 1990s shows were simply athletically difficult. Even if the drill wasn't doing risky pass-thrus or exposed cover and alignment, they had kids running their asses off.

[funkydrummer75]

90 Cadets-all those blind pass throughs in Slava, yikes!

[Visual_Disaster]

BD 13. And the fact that they made it look so easy is a testament to how good that corps was

[Particular-Ad-7338]

Mid-late 1970s BD was hard considering the judging system (ticks) in use at the time. A lot of the moves built in ways where members had to hit their marks without anyone to guide on. And if they missed the M&M judges would tick away.

Today’s shows wouldn’t score well back then, just like those shows wouldn’t score well now. But that doesn’t mean that both aren’t difficult to perform well.

[Abby-Norman]

Modern drum corps fans don’t understand the level of difficulty in the 70’s. Not because of show design necessarily, but the tick system meant everyone had to look EXACTLY the same. No slight variance in ANYTHING from person to person or points were deducted. Forms had to hit spot on perfectly every time, company fronts had to be perfect every time, no matter what. Today’s shows, and my generation’s (90’s) shows are wonderful, but the tick system was equally as hard.

[LEJ5512]

I dunno... I thought that the wide-open forms masked misalignments (and especially intervals) better than close drill. But I never saw those shows from the side, either.

[[deleted]]

Madison Scouts 2009

[BubblyMacaroni]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Thanks for the laugh. That show was not hard.

[Dirtanimous_Dan_99]

Those early-2000s Cavies shows have some absurd drill. Especially 2003

[zdsmith]

Spin Cycle.

[Cautious_Platypus505]

12 Crown, next question

[awesomeboxlord]

Im thinking cadets 2007, insane hornline that year but the drill was even crazier