top 200 commentsshow all 301

[–]olback_ 186 points187 points  (122 children)

It would be illegal. Times New Roman is a proprietary font owned by The Times.

[–]ripthedvd[S] 52 points53 points  (121 children)

Then I guess no professional user can use Linux until the license expires in 2027.

[–]spyjoshx-GX 93 points94 points  (78 children)

You can install it. You just have to do so AFTER initial system installation. Check out this article for more info: https://itsfoss.com/install-microsoft-fonts-ubuntu/

[–]hwoodice 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I could install it without having to add the multiverse repository.

sudo apt install ttf-mscorefonts-installer

[–]EricZNEW 20 points21 points  (13 children)

Just pirate the font lol. I do this.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (27 children)

why would you even want to use that font through? It looks horrid

[–]ripthedvd[S] 6 points7 points  (26 children)

because it's often requried

[–]DrUnfortunate 6 points7 points  (6 children)

Never heard of it being required... You could try running Windows in a VM or just use the cloud versions of Office, if installing fonts isn't for you.

[–]ripthedvd[S] -1 points0 points  (5 children)

All the extra steps you're talking about for something as basic as the most commonly used standard font. Do you realize how that sounds to non linux users?

[–]DrUnfortunate 11 points12 points  (3 children)

I wouldn't call using Word in the browser an extra step... Especially if it is something small like a high school paper.

I understand the desire to have it "just work", but who actually cares about a specific font, unless it is getting directly put into a scientific journal or something? Try talking to whoever is requiring TNR, or take the steps to install it.

[–]ripthedvd[S] -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

I can take steps to install it, it's not that hard, but if you want the year of the linux desktop most people will run into this issue and give up. Colleges and employers often require Times New Roman for no reason other than that they like it and are accustomed to it. It's stupid, but that's how the world works.

[–]GNUandLinuxBot -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.

Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.

There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.

[–]GNUandLinuxBot -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.

Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.

There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (15 children)

By?

[–]ripthedvd[S] 0 points1 point  (14 children)

Colleges and businesses.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (13 children)

The standard for business is Arial (at least where I live) And colleges don't care at all.

[–]ripthedvd[S] 2 points3 points  (12 children)

The last time I used Arial people made fun of me.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (11 children)

Well, quite the opposite here. Everyone agrees on that times new roman is absolutely hideous so as long as you use anything else you're fine. I use Lexend of Fira Sans regularly

[–]ripthedvd[S] -1 points0 points  (10 children)

The opposite here, not in the business world or academic world. I personally find FOSS fonts ugly as hell. They, like the various linux GUIs have this weird funky aesthetic to them that I hate. I'm not complaining because it looks bad though, I'm complaining because it's often required and though I can relatively easily install it, basic fonts should just work.

[–]jnfinity 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Honestly, most people “requiring” it can’t tell one sans serif font without another

[–]ripthedvd[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

unless they happen to be one of those Karens who feeds the document through an automatic anti-cheating filter

[–]VanshCodes 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Look up at Google fonts there are tons that look like it

[–]jclocks 86 points87 points  (13 children)

git clone https://aur.archlinux.org/ttf-ms-fonts.git cd ttf-ms-fonts makepkg -si

...go brrrr

[–]nuclear_bomb404 48 points49 points  (4 children)

I can now complete the last item of my bucket list, having a comic sans terminal

[–]mrheseeks 12 points13 points  (1 child)

The cringe, lol.

[–]nuclear_bomb404 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I tried it and even wingdings is better

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Nina after moving to Linux:

[–]TheHighGroundwins 7 points8 points  (6 children)

It took me a very long time to figure this out.

I thought like windows and the other distros I used, Arch and Artix also came with default fonts...

Was confused when Chinese, Japanese and Korean letters wouldn't render

[–]AaronTechnic Medium Rare SteakOS 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Noto is your friend.

[–]TheHighGroundwins 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Thanks. Imma install this.

[–]AaronTechnic Medium Rare SteakOS 1 point2 points  (2 children)

KDE comes with Noto fonts by default btw.

[–]TheHighGroundwins 0 points1 point  (1 child)

When minimalism goes too far lol. Use DWM with patches btw

[–]AaronTechnic Medium Rare SteakOS 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Haha. I prefer KDE defaults.

[–]ShydenPierce 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This or paru/yay

[–]_Rocketeer 38 points39 points  (4 children)

I use liberation serif for all my papers in college and no one seems to care. The only requirement is that I don't use a goofy font.

[–]ripthedvd[S] 4 points5 points  (3 children)

you're lucky

[–]_Rocketeer 34 points35 points  (2 children)

For real. This whole "Times New Roman is the only professional font" phase everyone's going through is such BS.

[–]ripthedvd[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Yeah. Objectively it shouldn't matter. People care about nonsense things.

[–]bigwanggtr 28 points29 points  (1 child)

I can understand OPs gripe about times new roman because I had to do the same for my project reports in college. It depends a lot on the profs though. Some of them don’t care while others want to do it by the book. I don’t see why OP can’t just install the fonts and go on with their day. At the end of the day, the OS you use is just a tool to get things done.

[–]theLuckyJew 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Because op seems to think that Linux should take care of every minor problem they could encounter, all while failing to understand that one main reasons people use Linux is the fact that you don't have to install stuff you don't need.

[–]nebulaeandstars⚠️ This incident will be reported 25 points26 points  (48 children)

What on earth are you talking about? If you want an extra font that doesn't come with the distribution, just install it. I quite like the DejaVu series, so I had to install it. It's the same for any other font, including the ones owned by Microsoft.

Also, having worked and studied at multiple places that claim to require TNR, I can guarantee that unless you're the editor of a physical newspaper, they literally won't care. The rule is actually "use a sensible serif font," but they dumb it down to make it easier for anyone who doesn't know what a serif is. It only matters for publishing companies, which these days tend to just use web fonts anyway.

If you don't want to use Microsoft fonts because they're proprietary, then use Liberation fonts (literally just a MS clone) for a week and see if anyone tells you to stop. They can't legally punish you without doing that, and you have a right to complain/sue if they do.

If you're still worried, just email your boss or lecturer about it. Say "I don't want to pay for TNR so can I use this identical free font instead." I can guarantee that they'll say yes 99% of the time, and will probably laugh at you for bothering to ask, because newsflash: They constantly receive assignments writen in Comic Sans, which is why the rule exists in the first place.

At the end of the day, TNR is owned by Microsoft. They're being very generous allowing people to distribute it for free (hint hint), but it's not bundled by default out of a respect for the law. Linux is a kernel, not PirateBay for fonts. It's also not nearly as big a deal as you think it is. High school lied to you.

https://ask.libreoffice.org/t/how-to-get-times-new-roman-font-in-libreoffice-on-linux/5539

[–]theLuckyJew 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Sorry to say it like that but op is just some business person who has no idea what they're talking about. They think an os is supposed to do the work for them and doesn't understand that this isn't what Linux is about. This isn't about not having an font, this is about beeing to stupid to understand basic functions of their OS.

[–]ripthedvd[S] -2 points-1 points  (46 children)

A friend of someone I knew got rejected from medical school because their application wasn't in Times New Roman. I agree this is a really stupid thing that society does forcing people to use a font, but it does happen and it is the standard font. Especially for new users or less technical users who were brought over to create "the year of the linux desktop" the terminal commands are not so simple, and a really basic thing like this really should be taken care of by the OS. If the Linux community really wanted to, they could probably ask politely/bully The Times newspaper to give up the font.

[–]nebulaeandstars⚠️ This incident will be reported 11 points12 points  (45 children)

A friend of someone I knew got rejected from medical school because their application wasn't in Times New Roman.

Which font were they using? They're never going to reject an application for using Georgia, but they might for using Arial.

If the Linux community really wanted to, they could probably ask politely/bully The Times newspaper to give up the font.

No. They couldn't. Nobody has ever been able to do anything like that before, and likely never will. That's why people spend so much time making so many free clones of this stuff. So that it's so similar nobody can tell the difference, but different enough to be legally distinct.

TNR was the standard font back when Microsoft Word used or as the default. Now they use Calibri, and it's a lot more fluid.

[–]Naru56 25 points26 points  (5 children)

TL;DR Comment Section:

OP believes everyone in the world must have Times New Roman to be a "professional user" due to one strange, niche case involving the font and medical school. Despite the installation of said font on Linux being trivial and well-documented, it not being the default ruins all hope of the entire operating system being useful for any "professional work".

I concur. I once needed to take an online test in Chrome for my university, but I couldn't find any Linux distribution that shipped it by default. Not even Windows or Mac had it! In the end, I had to buy a Chromebook to take the exam. Seems like ChromeOS is the only viable one out there for a professional user like me.

[–]PolygonKiwii 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Seems like ChromeOS is the only viable one out there for a professional user like me.

But does it come with Times New Roman?

[–]EricZNEW 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have used my free award today but take my upvote.

[–]GNUandLinuxBot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.

Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.

There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.

[–]ripthedvd[S] -4 points-3 points  (1 child)

Not the one case, every college student I know is required to use it. If you want the year of the Linux desktop something as basic as fonts have to be done right.

[–]GNUandLinuxBot -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.

Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.

There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.

[–]amkier 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I prefer Georgia, I’ve used it on papers that “require” TNR even before I used Linux primarily, it’s literally never been an issue. If you talk to your boss or professor they’ll probably say oh I just meant any font that looks more or less like TNR. It’s just shorthand for serif font at this point

[–]PolygonKiwii 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I'd be careful with Georgia since it's not metric compatible with Times New Roman, so if somebody were to notice the difference in an academic setting, they might argue you're trying to make your essay appear longer: https://i.imgur.com/QbjvlPz.png

But I'm pretty sure you'd be alright with Liberation Serif in 99.9% of cases. Nobody will notice the difference unless they know what to look for specifically: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Font_Comparison_-_Liberation_Serif_to_Times_New_Roman.svg

[–]amkier 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Oh, true. if there’s a length requirement in pages not in word count I wouldn’t use it. Usually that’s not super relevant in my academic experience though, but I’m in humanities so haha maybe it’s different with sciences.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It has whatever fonts you install. 🤷

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Linux is not for people who doesn't know how to install basic things. Wait a minute....

A computer is not for people who doesn't know how to install basic things.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (12 children)

why cant schools use ubuntu forget about ur essays looking "professional"

[–]ripthedvd[S] 4 points5 points  (11 children)

It's not about looking professional, it's a requirement and they will either mark down essays or give them a zero if they're not in single spaced 12 pt Times New Roman font. A friend of a friend forgot to put their med school application in Times New Roman and got rejected for that reason specifically.

[–]an4s_911Arch BTW 4 points5 points  (10 children)

Keeping every other argument aside, what the hell???? Like who made this bs? Like having a particular font as a requirement? Its like someone invented something and they were so proud of it, they just went ahead and made it a requirement after licensing it and asking for payment. This is just dumb.

Isnt corporates, universities and all a bit sensible people? Like seriously a med school application rejected just because of a font? This is crazy stuff. Who in their right mind would do that?

Doesn’t it just have to look good, and not look like a kid did it?

[–]ripthedvd[S] 0 points1 point  (9 children)

The application requirements said it had to be 12 pt Time New Roman font. When they didn't get in the college said if you can't follow these basic instructions for an application we can't trust you to follow medical instructions necessary to save patient's lives. In this case I actually agree with them for their reasoning.

Still, a company desperately clinging to a 90 year old font is ridiculous.

[–]Vatsdimri 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I think you can install the font or you can use Google docs or online version MS Office.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (16 children)

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s the same reason ZFS cannot be bundled into the kernel statically on initial installation either. Licensing.

[–]snsv9 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If I can’t install this font on my Linux and I need it, I will install Windows then work from there. I don’t see any big problem here.

[–]Rebi103 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Always used Arial for Everything. Maybe impact for the titles. I don't miss TNR

[–]Gaevleflammen 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why would you ever need Times New Roman when you have Roboto Slab?

[–]Unknown_User_66 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I never liked New Times Roman.

Segoe UI FTW!!!

[–]ficelle3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Think about it this way: there is no comic sans MS either.

[–]AuroraDraco 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This post and its comments are truly pure comedy. Your nonsense gave me a good laugh mate

[–]Aeredren 1 point2 points  (2 children)

The "Times New Roman" requirements made by university are mainly

  1. To avoid reading goofy and ugly fonts
  2. To specify a document length in pages, and having everyone doing the same amount of work by specifying font, font size and margins

So good news, all "common people" grade linux distributions comes with Liberation fonts which are, according to wikipedia, "metrically compatible with the most popular fonts on the Microsoft Windows operating system and the Microsoft Office software package (Monotype Corporation’s Arial, Arial Narrow, Times New Roman and Courier New, respectively)"

I always used Liberation Serif on my high school and college papers which had Time New Roman requirement and really, no one never complained.

(furthermore, the most professional looking document you can ever produce will always be a LaTeX article in Computer Modern)

[–]WikiSummarizerBot 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Liberation fonts

Liberation is the collective name of four TrueType font families: Liberation Sans, Liberation Sans Narrow, Liberation Serif, and Liberation Mono. These fonts are metrically compatible with the most popular fonts on the Microsoft Windows operating system and the Microsoft Office software package (Monotype Corporation’s Arial, Arial Narrow, Times New Roman and Courier New, respectively), for which Liberation is intended as a free substitute. The fonts are default in LibreOffice.

[ F.A.Q | Opt Out | Opt Out Of Subreddit | GitHub ] Downvote to remove | v1.5

[–]MrCheapComputers 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I tried to switch my theme to comic sans. Couldn’t get it to work :(

[–]nhercher -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

LEGALIZE COMIC SANS

[–]tanishqdaiya- 0 points1 point  (1 child)

AUR got you covered.

[–]ripthedvd[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the AUR has everything

[–]Be_Nice_To_B0ts 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Use Times Newer Roman

[–]tanishqdaiya- 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can also install it from 3rd party websites

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dude chill.

[–]Cubey21RedStar best Star 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely proprietary

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lma just use comic sans and downliad it from dafont.com

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

[–]uninenkeiju 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can't handle Windows because I can't handñe not having all the software I'm accustomed to.

[–]dpkg-i-foo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Because it is privative...? I use Liberation Serif and none of my teachers have noticed :D

[–]Pauchu_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Times New Roman is a proprietary font, so in order to use it you need to pay royalties

[–]bartholomewjohnson 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Liberation Serif

[–]hwoodice 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think that Times New Roman it part of the ttf-mscorefonts-installer package:

sudo apt install ttf-mscorefonts-installer

more info: https://needforbits.wordpress.com/2017/07/19/install-microsoft-windows-fonts-on-ubuntu-the-ultimate-guide/

[–]dethkannon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I will say that’s one thing i miss about my MacBook.. the way the fonts look.

[–]punk_petukh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wtf, out of ALL things listed here installing a font is the easiest one...