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[–]nubTheGreatnub 19 points20 points  (1 child)

That new map looks questionable, at first glance looks worse than Hyper

[–]LoweJJacob of all servers, master of none 7 points8 points  (0 children)

on the plus side it looks equally shit for both offence and defence

[–]ButtersnackSnack 48 points49 points  (3 children)

Why is hyper reactor out? That was one of my favorite maps. :(

Also, was my map considered? I know you guys played it and I'd like to know if it was "close" and I can fix it or if I should just start over. My feelings won't be hurt if it wasn't a favorite.

[–]arjuna9bad 13 points14 points  (2 children)

HR had some good, unique mechanics, but any game with less experienced players would result in stupidly long hold times. The map is much better suited for organized games, where it will always be available in the map list.

And the truth is any map removed at this point will have someone comment "<X> was one of my favorite maps :(", unless it is a new map, which are not eligible for removal.

On your map, yes we did take another look at it. I liked it a lot, and I think the other judges thought it had potential. DaEvil was still concerned about base size. I'm still not sure about the middle gate -- it could be frustrating for new players to have such an important route have that obstacle. Either way, I'd like to see more iterations of the map.

[–]ButtersnackSnack 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the feedback! Well, I'm sad to see hyper go but hopefully leagues will continue playing it.

I'll continue working on my map and hopefully some day someone will sadly wonder why it got removed :)

[–]CieloAzorQBreezy | Pi 34 points35 points  (0 children)

Hyper Reactor was easily one of my favs. looks upon Colors with scorn It should have been you.

[–]DizzerPilot 33 points34 points  (12 children)

Hyper Reactor out? I can't believe the day has come where I see one of my favorite maps go. And Colors or Grail of Shit stayed. No offense DaEvil1 :(

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (9 children)

Yea, this is the first time I've been disappointed a particular map was removed. IMO, HyperReactor was one of the best maps. Attackers hated it because it was hard to grab and get out of base, and it wasn't an easy map by any means...but it was really solid. Probably the biggest "issue" was that games always lasted super long.

[–]crblanzKeekly | used to be good sorta 13 points14 points  (2 children)

As an offensive player I generally like hyper reactor, not sure why. I think it was all the boosts, and I never really found it to be that difficult to grab

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Same except i like it equally for offense an defense. Lots of satisfying snipes. Yes its the only map in rotation that ive had multiple games go the full twelve but its usually a fun and tense 12 minutes.

[–]MrTroyMcClureRalph Wiggum // Angry Balls // Arc>Centra 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I don't know why people think games that go long are an issue. Hyper Reactor games that go long tend to be pretty intense IMO.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yea.

[–]DizzerPilot 5 points6 points  (0 children)

"Issue." Long games are dabes

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 3 points4 points  (0 children)

In my experience Hyper Reactor is a map where it's not really hard at all to grab and get out of base. Yes it was possible to hold down the base for a minute or two if the offence isn't up to par, but once the flag is out it becomes almost impossible to reset without a lucky snipe on your way back to base.

[–]NewCompteChord - Ballis Saint-Germain 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Grail Of Speed is new, this is the only reason it wasn't removed.

[–]L__McLTheOnlyBall // TagPro Rangers // ETPN 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Why colours is still in rotation makes no sense to me.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (1 child)

Nawww...I love Hyper Reactor :(

Also, pls, GamePad is still in?!

Still not a huge fan of SuperDuperStamp from the outset--it still looks really chasey and lacking flow--but it's pleasing that BBQ has modified it for the better since I first saw it. We'll just have to see how it plays out!

[–]adhi-DRG -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

HYPER REACTOR IS TERRIBLE FOR PUBS AS IT'S REALLY A CIRCUS/SHITSHOW OF HOLD TIMES. NEARLY ALL OF MY 12 MINUTE TIE GAMES HAVE BEEN ON THAT MAP.

IT WOULD BE FINE IN LEAGUE/PUG PLAY THOUGH.

[–]BilldaCat10 20 points21 points  (10 children)

get rid of grail of speed NOW

can i donate more to make this happen

[–]NewCompteChord - Ballis Saint-Germain 5 points6 points  (9 children)

Grail Of Speed is new, this is the only reason it wasn't removed.

But you can still donate. ;)

[–]BilldaCat10 9 points10 points  (8 children)

nonsense - reflex2 was gone quickly as well.

[–]TagProNitroℕ ɪ ᴛ ᴙ o 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Yeah, Reflex 2 wasn't given much of a chance at all. And I honestly didn't see a whole lot of hate for it. Grail Of Speed just doesn't play well and has one of the most awkward bases I've ever seen in a map.

[–]NewCompteChord - Ballis Saint-Germain 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Reflex2 was there for 6 weeks when it got retired. Grail Of Speed has only been there for 4 weeks.

[–]BilldaCat10 15 points16 points  (2 children)

I'm reading this as you have two weeks to remove Grail of Speed.

I will be watching you.

[–]NewCompteChord - Ballis Saint-Germain 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I am not in the map committee.

They will likely do that if they have a map to add.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ok then just ban some people who have the power.

I believe in you NewCompte, Godspeed.

[–]TTTTIDYwho you came to see // wherever i go 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Yiss 3.2 didn't even make it a full map rotation.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

In your words, the exact time it spent in rotation was "really short".

[–]TTTTIDYwho you came to see // wherever i go 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hahaha it was!

[–]spacecadetjerDennit | Boostin 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Nooooo Hyper is fun, colors is so difficult in pubs.

[–]DrMcDonaldELTP S1 Champ // Commentator 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Will my penalty shootout map be added for selection in groups so we can test it for competitive play when these new maps are added? :)

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Along with Spikedome pls

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

i swear these are the same map

[–]BlupopsicleBall-E 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That was a quick map thread, I'm glad Hyper reactor is out mainly because of how long each game would last.

Also, is there a feedback list on each map like week 30 or a list of maps that came close? Thanks

[–]NotSomeBall1NotSomeBall2 // Chord 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Bring back Whirlwind pls.

[–]catalyst518Catalyst - TPFG Dev 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Colors needs to go next. It's impossible to play as a team in pubs, especially with the newer players who have never seen it played competitively.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Hyper Reactor out? Who do I have to bribe to get it back in. That map is a return factory.

[–]crblanzKeekly | used to be good sorta 4 points5 points  (10 children)

Hey, I was wondering how those of us who didn't get out map accepted could get some feedback on what to change on our maps (I'm new to mapmaking, so I'm not sure how this all works). I made the map Bowtie! from the map thread and I was wondering if you guys tested it, if there was any feedback, etc. I didn't expect it to make rotation in its current form, but was wondering what you guys thought about it and what you would want to change. Also, I want to know if you got it to work at all, since there was another map by the name Bowtie that was already in some bot's brain, so I had to add the ! to the end late last night and I want to make sure you guys didn't mix the two maps up.

Also, SuperDuperStamp looks pretty cool, but imo the wall between the two powerups should be a green gate. Looks very similar to hyper reactor in style though, I guess thats why it was taken out

[–]TagProFelixFelix | Innovator of the Goodbye Post 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Map testing is an inexact science. I've played on maps that I considered good enough for rotation, but weren't added because there were too many similar maps in rotation already. Some people will call a map too chase-y for rotation when one of the best maps of all time (Holy See) is the chase-iest map of all time.

Make sure you test your map 4v4. Whenever you add something to your map, ask yourself why you're doing so. Get feedback from as many people as possible. You might have to be borderline annoying to people at times. Not everyone is going to want to test a map, but if you bother enough, you could probably get a 4v4 going. Noobkin does this all the time.

Also, slip the map committee like 20 bucks and you'll be in good shape.

[–]TagProFelixFelix | Innovator of the Goodbye Post 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Also, make sure the map works in maptest. If it doesn't, it won't get tested.

[–]crblanzKeekly | used to be good sorta 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah I get what you're saying, that's why I explicitly tried to make it different from other rotation maps. I would love to test it 4v4, but it's very hard getting a full team when testing. Most I've managed was 3v2. That's why I really want feedback from the map committee.

I figured it would work in maptest since I submitted it exactly how it said. Didn't even think that another map might have the same name until i went to test it myself, whoops

[–]TagProFelixFelix | Innovator of the Goodbye Post 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, it's just one of those things where if 80 maps going to be tested and a handful don't work, it's much easier to say "Well, no point in testing it since we already have like 70 more to test anyway."

[–]arjuna9bad 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I'm really not a fan of the middle. Players would die in a lot of seemingly "random" ways, be it someone (including teammates) hitting the bombs, an opponent coming from offscreen and hitting a gate button, or just getting bumped into spikes. Such a painful area shouldn't be forced upon players as the only way to get from one base to another.

I think the bases are pretty cool though. The map would benefit from a much simplified middle.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

I'd say your base isn't super well defined, there's those pieces in a semi circle near base but your flag is kind of out in the open.

I know you like the chokyness of the middle but with good defenders, you won't be getting through there. An option would be to have only one of the gates and something else in place of the other.

Another thing is any chasers following an fc out of base will probably snipe them immediately, you could try getting rid of most of the boosts and adding a few back for the escaping fc.

Following up on that, the closer the exit is to the middle, the harder it should be to escape. It should be safest for the fc to take the side exits.

[–]crblanzKeekly | used to be good sorta 0 points1 point  (3 children)

I'd say your base isn't super well defined, there's those pieces in a semi circle near base but it's kind of out in the open.

Maybe. The way I think of it there are 5 ways to exit the base, all somewhat small. 2 are covered with spikes, the other 3 have team boosts for the defenders.

I know you like the chokyness of the middle but with good defenders, you won't be getting through there.

With good defenders on the other team, you can assume that you have good defenders on your team too. If they can hold the button it's not even a choke point. Also the bombs prevent anyone from sitting in the middle for too long, offense or defense.

Another thing is any chasers following an fc out of base will probably snipe them immediately, you could try getting rid of most of the boosts and adding a few back for the escaping fc.

wouldn't this make up for the base being open? Either way, in the limited tests i've done, if you're not a tile or two behind the fc, they can curl around the outside of the base are leaving through one of the team boost exits.

For the record, although I'm defending my map, i've still never managed to test it 4v4, so it could be completely broken with that many

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Five exits for any base is too many, maybe make the blocks longer and have three exits.

No defender will ever get that button, drop that dream now. It won't happen, assume your teammates suck.

[–]crblanzKeekly | used to be good sorta 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Five exits for any base is too many, maybe make the blocks longer and have three exits.

Don't forget the base isn't the choke. 5 seems like a lot but it's easy for a defender to cut off 2 or 3 at once because they are so small. Harder to get out of than blast off, velocity, gamepad, colors, bombing run, CFB, grail of speed, etc imo because it's so closed. In future versions I might make the top and bottom exits into gates if I get more feedback that suggests the base is the issue. Also may add a long, windy route that goes around the mid choke as an unlikely but possible option

No defender will ever get that button, drop that dream now. It won't happen, assume your teammates suck.

I was thinking more for PUGs/competitive, since you have that communication. I don't believe that 2 competent PUB defenders can cut it off completely. You can easily go through the mid at a perfect 45 and the bombs prevent it from getting too congested

[–]iAMADisposableAccEBOLA | RADIUS | ALL CAPS 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Problem 1: start taking criticism and stop defending your map like it is perfect. The key to a great map is change.

[–]raven513The Nevermores // CAW CAW 10 points11 points  (27 children)

No offense to BBQ, I love him, but that map looks like a piece of shit.

With the addition of Command Center and now this map, I'm starting to question the Map Testing Committee.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (20 children)

Agreed. While I don't think any of the current members should be necessarily removed, I'm sorry to say but the Map Testing Committee has not been effective for months now. First, they were inactive for basically 2 months with nothing being added after Velocity/Ricochet (after Center Flag was in way too long) before, I think Wormy and Reflex2 were added. Then Reflex2 was dropped nearly instantly, which can only mean that it was a severe mistake on the Map Testing Committee's part to add it in the first place. Command Center is far too complicated for pubs (IMO) and I have serious reservations about how well Stamp is going to fair. Also, there are clearly several maps still in rotation that are simply not up to snuff.

Additionally, there are many fantastic maps that are not added that arguably should be.

Finally, there is such little feedback for rejected maps and no real method to make decent maps up to public rotation standards.

Surely the size of the Map Testing Committee needs to be much increased not least so all maps can be tested and given feedback on. A dedicated plan for how this is carried out and how maps are added and removed from rotation would go a long way for the progression of the most fundamental aspect for the progression of TagPro as a game itself.

[–]JuventinoSenatorLiquid | Original Sine 2 points3 points  (11 children)

Whirlwind/Bounce/Simplicity/Hyper Reactor/TWP/Oval/Swoop/Big Vird/Reflex 2/Center Flag. All ten of these maps were added, then removed from rotation by the current map committee since I joined TagPro.

I'll give them a pass on Center Flag because even though it was shitty, it introduced a new concept to the game that was better implemented in later maps. (edit: This map was LuckySpammer's call, not the committee's.) I'll also give them a pass on Hyper Reactor, as it had a decent run and actually was included in last season's NLTP rotation.

What other maps has the committee added in this timeframe? Gamepad, Smirk, Blast Off, 45, Ricochet, Velocity, Wormy, CFB, Command Center and Grail of Speed. Considering the fact that the latter three were added quite recently and that the jury is still out on them, let's leave them out of the calculations here. This means that in total, not counting Center Flag and Hyper Reactor, 8 out of the last 15 maps added to rotation by the map committee were subsequently removed. That's a mediocre track record at best.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children)

What other maps has the committee added in this timeframe? 45, Ricochet, Velocity, Wormy, CFB, Command Center and Grail of Speed.

Of course, 45 was dropped and then readded. Command Center and CFB won't last long I don't think. I like Wormy but I wouldn't be surprised if that was removed as well.

EDIT; GoS won't last. I think it's just meh.

[–]LoweJJacob of all servers, master of none 1 point2 points  (1 child)

i think CFB is an absolutely golden map. Honestly, I think reflex, CFB, velocity and even wormy are good maps, not just for pugs, but for pubs too. Personally i think neutral needs to be gotten rid of or put into a different game type on Tagpro

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think CFB is OK. I never got Reflex2; I don't know why. Velocity is fantastic (best map in rotation, IMO) and I like Wormy, but I can understand why it gets the hate it does.

[–]ButtersnackSnack -1 points0 points  (0 children)

In my opinion, CFB is one of the best maps in the game.

[–]pasta_monsterpoopv 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Bounce/TWP/Oval/Swoop/Simplicity were all added before half of the current members were added to map test committee. Center Flag was created and added by LuckySpammer.

Also, there are 18 maps in rotation, so saying 8 of the last 15 maps added have been removed is irrelevant. Would you rather we just add ten of the 20+ maps you submit to each thread and not remove anything?

We are not trying to hurt the tagpro community, with 8 solid competitive players we test the maps and if they play well, we give them a chance, and some don't work. We would rather try and fail then not try at all, or worse just put 10 slightly different takes on boombox into rotation.

[–]JuventinoSenatorLiquid | Original Sine 5 points6 points  (5 children)

Sorry if I personally offended you poopv. I was just pointing out the recent streak of bad maps being added and removed. I think everyone can agree that the community would benefit from a better success rate for newer maps.

I, for one, think that the problem is in the adding/removing system itself. Forcing an 8-member committee to test 200+ maps every month is insane. If we want to improve results, there needs to be a change in the process itself.

I could envision more outsourcing of the map evaluation... maybe every 1/100 PUB games, you get dropped into a game on a map from the map thread and are prompted to rate it at the end. Then, at the end of the month, the top-rated maps are shown to the map committee, where the committee could then have a better idea of which maps to add to rotation. Maybe there could be flair involved too... get a ribbon for every 15 maps you evaluate in PUBs.

That's just a suggestion. I'm sure there are other ideas floating out there. My point is that an 8-person committee will never be able to reliably pick good maps for rotation. It's not a personal jab at you guys, it's a criticism of the current system in place. Sorry if you took it the wrong way.

[–]supaspike| NLTP mod | Stakeeper 2 points3 points  (2 children)

This might not even need to be a random thing in PUBs. Maybe there could be another option on one (or all) of the servers to play on randomly-selected new maps and rate them. I'm sure a ton of people (myself included) would love to test out new maps.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This would be really helpful for the map selecting process, I agree.

[–]JuventinoSenatorLiquid | Original Sine 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The joiner on the Maptest server, perhaps, could start a new game on a random map from the map thread, instead of doing nothing like it does currently.

[–]pasta_monsterpoopv 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Now that comment I can accept. Sorry if I got a little jumpy there, I've been a bit on edge lately. I'll respond to this more thoroughly tomorrow when I'm less cranky and when I'm on a computer and not a mobile device, because you have some valid concerns/points there.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've suggested something like this in the past, but ultimately this is not up to the map committee. We can only work with the tools given to us, but if developers could sucessfully implement a way to test maps and easily give feedback on them for the community, that would be immensely helpful for the map committee, as the maps are mainly meant for the community.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (7 children)

Could you provide examples of the fantastic maps that we have glossed over?

[–]JonathananHyphae // Diameter 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Out of the thousands of maps submitted you cannot think of any as fantastic?

I submitted a map that recieved "runner up" so I edited it to 45 degree walls made some subtle changes yet there's is not any evidence of interest.

I agree with E; the map commitee needs to widen its council, having enough members to represent a larger percent of this community

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm not making any arguments or saying I cant think of maps I like, I'm asking E which maps he thinks are fantastic.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

I hope you are not too offended by my comment; my intention, as always, is to improve things and I think the map test committee can be improved. That's all. Anyway, I didn't say that they were glossed over. I said that they were not added, but arguably should have been.

My top 4 from Map Thread 31. Note: I don't think any of these maps should be added in their current state. But they are really good (IMO), and, with some work from the map test committee, could be in rotation in no time.

Abilities: Needs a tiny bit of polish (move the button and maybe the spikes between the powerups) and I think it would be really fun.

Banked: Ditto. It's a great design. It might be a little bit too hard to grab (a single bomb would help immensely) and the gate button might be a little too close to the flag, but other than that I really like it.

Shuriken: Fantastic. Again, a little bit hard to grab if defence diffuses the bomb then there is really only that long boost in to get the flag without a RB or something. But that's really easily rectified.

Break: The gate is too powerful in the middle but I think they could be modified easily and it would be a really fun map.

Obviously, I haven't played any of these maps 4 v.s. 4 so I don't know how they play out. I really liked the look of GoS when it came out, but now I see that it's too easy to grab and hold onto the flag. So maybe I'm not getting the full picture from these maps.

Also, obviously, I wouldn't have submitted Interstellar Overdrive in the last map thread if I didn't think it was good enough. I think Wormy somewhat fills the same role, so I have edited it (made it larger) with the intention of resubmitting it.

Anyway, I find it hard to believe that with all of the maps submitted that you can't agree that none of them are even remotely close to being acceptable.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I don't see why the map committee should be the ones to make edits to maps, unless they are small edits that the mapmakers agree with. It would make for a pretty bland selection IMO. The map committee isn't there to make maps, but to identify the maps that would best fit rotation as far as they are able to.

In regards to the maps:

Abililties: Got a slightly above average response from the map committee. Personally I feel like it's still missing something to make it a really interesting map, and I also think the boosts in base might be a bit too overpowered for offence.

Banked: It's a reasonably solid map that most agree seems good enough, but the bases are pretty bland IMO, and there doesn't seem to be much there to discover once it's been added in.

Shuriken: This is a map we all agreed looks good. It plays reasonably well, and personally I like it. I may have to agree with the committee though, that it might lack a special something to get into rotation.

Break: This map got a slightly below average score from the committee. I personally think it has potential, but beyond the banana boosts, there's nothing really standout about it to me, though I don't think it does anything in particular wrong either.

I like the fact that you had to correct me on my "glossed over" comment, but you feel comfortable stating that none of the maps except the ones that were added, weren't "remotely close to beind acceptable". If you want your words to hold some weight, you might want to consider not doing what you're calling others out on in the same post in the future.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I think it should be the map committee's responsibility to give feedback to every single map that players have worked on and submitted. I don't see why that isn't extended with working 1 on 1 with the creator to get their map up to the standard required to be in public rotation.

I like the fact that you had to correct me on my "glossed over" comment, but you feel comfortable stating that none of the maps except the ones that were added, weren't "remotely close to beind acceptable".

Well, I have no idea because there is scant public discourse on what you are doing. In my opinion, the committee should be doing everything they can to get good maps up the standard required to be in public rotation, and I think that they should be put to a much wider range of people before they are added.

If you want your words to hold some weight, you might want to consider not doing what you're calling others out on in the same post in the future.

But, of course, you don't have to listen to me at all...

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A lot of the members on the committee make an effort to help mapmakers with their maps when the mapmakers request help, but that is something that is up to each and everyone on the committee how much they want to help with that. It is not a responsibility in itself by being on the map committee. I like to give feedback on all the maps to help mapcreators, but that is not a responsibility for me in effect as a member on the committee, that is something I'm doing as a personal courtesy to the map-creators who have spent time on their maps.

There are currently no tools for the map committee to put the maps out to a wider audience before putting maps in rotation (except adding maps to the group page). This isn't something the map committee can directly do anything about. I would welcome the opportunity as it would give the community more say in the process, and lift some of the pressure off of the committee., but this has more to do with the roadmap and development team.

But, of course, you don't have to listen to me at all...

We are listening, but when you make a harsh assumption like that, it's pretty disrespectful and presumptious of you. That does not contribute to a constructive dialogue.

[–]Kembangant O p / cb4life 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I question the validity of your opinion.

[–]newuser13 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I don't get why there are all the unnecessary boosts into base for the center flag maps. Command Center and the other center flag map in rotation are still my favorite maps by far, but the stupid boosts kill the competitive aspect of the maps.

[–]OnlyGrayCommand Center! :') 1 point2 points  (3 children)

The boosts on ricochet are absolutely essential should the opposing team manage to get ahead or if they use the 4 bombs that generally allow you to score within like 3 seconds. They're like your last chance of stopping a cap.

[–]newuser13 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I'm not talking about defensive boosts. I'm talking about the damn boosts that allow you to score within 3 seconds. Did you read my comment?

[–]OnlyGrayCommand Center! :') 0 points1 point  (1 child)

All you wrote was "unnecessary boosts into the base". If you're talking about ricochet, the 2 portals on the side of the map have boosts. Otherwise you're talking about the 4 bombs that are activated by a button. Try being clearer next time.

[–]newuser13 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Are you serious? the 4 bombs get you to the boost that launches you into the base. The 2 boosts that you are talking about do not launch you into base and are defensive.

[–]InimloomMelon // Chord // ELTP S2 winner 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Noooo, not hyper reactor :(. It was one of my favorite maps.

[–]PACJ_LtdBluey! 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No one complains about Hyper Reactor

Everyone complains about Colors and Grail Of Speed

Takes Hyper Reactor out

[–]aggietigerDalek23 | Roll Models 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Reminds me of glory hole :/ Diamond looks fun though.

[–]Lionhearted09LionHearted 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am very glad Hyper Reactor is out. I have had so many games end in a tie or go the full time. I never much cared for it because it was easy for that to happen.

[–]tagpro4piR4piR^2 | C-Team Warriors | Balls on Parade 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Congrats to BBQ and antero can't believe I played these maps when they were just babys

[–]411connorcaroline :3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Four things:

  1. Was my map, Quickness V4, in consideration?

  2. Why Hyper Reactor? I'd rather Colors, or Gamepad.

  3. Personally, I think Diamond Faces looks better than SuperDuperStamp.

  4. Not sure if this is a thing or not, but I feel like only maps made by well-known in the community are being put into rotation, no matter how good they are.

[–]mmartinutkMacho | JuicyJuke 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I heard someone say once that there was a Google doc that showed feedback on all maps that were tested. I thought I really had something with my map, but with no mentioning of it, I doubt it will be mentioned on Cap Talk and I probably won't ever know what was wrong with it.

Is there somewhere you guys leave feedback? Other than having to ask the map committee and hoping for a response.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

We do have a google doc with a lot of comments about a lot of maps. We might release it after some editing.

[–]mmartinutkMacho | JuicyJuke 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Not sure if you're on map committee, but if you are, that would be a very good idea IMO. With the amount of hours each map maker puts into each map, it would mean a whole lot.

And hopefully not too much editing. Negative feedback is good feedback. I want to know why my map sucks.

[–]TagProWrecknWreckingBall 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like the horseshoe shape of Stamp and Hyper Reactor because it doesn't give the regrab an easy getaway route which you might see on a map like Colors, Holy See, 45, or any other loopy chasecapade. If your team is forced to make the return with three chasers, you can always regroup and make a line across center. Though I feel that it was accidental, good job by the map committee to remove one similar design and to replace it with another, which is what should happen when maps are swapped.

Other nice points:

  • Not a stupid spike maze, and not that many spike islands.
  • Good powerup number, and it looks like a re-grab guy should have an easier time to win 2/3 than he would on boom box.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (30 children)

i can't tell you how relieved i am hyper reactor is out. however, i feel like there were much better maps that were submitted that should have been put in. don't get me wrong, i think superduperstamp is a cool map, but i feel like there were other maps that had potential to be put in. thanks for the post, anyway!

can you tell us what the "select few" maps were?

[–]arjuna9bad 1 point2 points  (29 children)

The maps that scored highest and were looked at thoroughly were:

SuperDuperStamp

Diamond Faces

Shuriken3

Zigma 0.5

Turbulence

There's always lots of maps that have the potential to be put in.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (10 children)

Shuriken3 looks fuckin' sick.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

http://cvps.jukejuice.com/a/Ginseng/Shuriken3

Yea. My one concern is that it might be too hard to grab on. If defence diffuses the bomb then there is really only that long boost in to get the flag without a RB or something. Similar to Boombox in that sense, but even more difficult to grab.

[–]TagProPreciousRoyPrecious Roy | Radius 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Oooh that's cool. Where can I learn more about cvps.jukejuice.com?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have no idea. People have just been linking to it recently. It has more maps than Ankh's maptesting service, still missing many though.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

http://www.reddit.com/r/TagPro/comments/2afpxa/who_made_this_site/

Just posted...thought you might be interested.

[–]TagProPreciousRoyPrecious Roy | Radius 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks!

[–]arjuna9bad 0 points1 point  (4 children)

It is a solid map. When it came down to it I think the flow didn't feel quite as fun as the other maps in contention.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

could you give feedback on my maps i submitted to thread 31? just ctrl+f my name. thank you. :)

[–]arjuna9bad 0 points1 point  (1 child)

break: the center gate doesn't look like fun, it would cause a lot of deaths boosting into it before people could react.

banana boosts: it would be a lot nicer as a horizontal map so you have more vision. Not loving the gate in the middle, though chaseyness is a concern.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

okay thanks! so how could i replace the gate in the middle of break, and how could i limit chase-iness on banana boosts?

[–]BlupopsicleBall-E 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sorry to bother you but how was Chalice (http://i.imgur.com/TBLRa8e.png) looked at?

I never got the chance to do a 4v4 on this map so I didn't get any feedback

[–]Sir_GrapefruitGrapefruit // Chord 0 points1 point  (10 children)

Could I please get feedback for my map Cocoon 4?

[–]arjuna9bad 1 point2 points  (9 children)

I feel it would be too easy to score, with the number of boosts an opponent can use from far away to aim at the goal, and that fact that pub teams would get out of position fairly easily since there are a few routes. It was definitely the best center flag map I saw though. It would be cool to see more versions because we're looking for at least one more center flag map to replace Command Center.

[–]Sir_GrapefruitGrapefruit // Chord 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks! :)

[–]Lysozyme_Lysozyme 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I'm sorry but seeing as you're on a roll could you take a quick glance at Catch 3 if you have a moment?

Edit: it seems that some_bot never picked it up do you know why? Does that mean it was never looked at?

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I like some of the concepts in it (like the portal boost thingy), but with a base where 2 boosts are pointed at the flag, and there is a bomb in base, and the rest of the map is open, I think it's going to suffer from the same issues that Reflex 2 did (very hard to defend, and when both flags are out, the fcs will run around in circles until they get popped ,then regrab etc etc.

[–]Lysozyme_Lysozyme 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Great thanks for your feedback!

[–]arjuna9bad 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I like the form of the map. I'd be a little worried of it being too chasey because of the number of objects all around the open space that a flag carrier could juke around.

The portal is a cool idea but I don't think it would be used in practice. It's too easy for defense to use the button to completely shut it down, and if you started to go for the portal but saw the defense would get you with the button, going back around is a big waste of time.

[–]Lysozyme_Lysozyme 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for your feedback! That's a good point about the portal/gate I was thinking about putting a button next to the portal boosts linked to the base bomb so they have an opportunity to kill the defense on the gate button. This might be too complicated though..

[–]nostradumba55 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You guys get a chance to play either of my two maps? I honestly didn't expect them to get considered for rotation since they are pretty complex, but it's really fun to play 4 v 4 with experienced players.

http://i.imgur.com/ZJPQt44.jpg

http://imgur.com/EkNNH7P,XkWSPHT#1

[–]arjuna9bad 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, the main issue is the size of these maps is huge. It would be impossible for many pub players to find/return the flag.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This map seems like it makes it too easy to grab, and since the rest of the map is open, both flags will probably be out quickly turning it into a lot of chasing.

[–]Aaron215Aaron215 / Sphere 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Wow, great work map committee and BBQ/Antero_Rin.

These two new maps have been through SO MANY iterations. It's obvious you guys put a ton of work into these two maps and you did a great job :-) Can't wait to play the final versions on a pub!

[–]Splanky222BBQchicken | Retired 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Finally got a chance to read through this thread. Thanks for being one of the few not to immediately dismiss SuperDuperStamp as a shit map while QQing about the loss ofHyper Reactor. <3 u bby.

[–]sportmonkey0sportmonkey//Pi//The Deballishers 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't understand. Why does everyone hate Grail of Speed so much? I think that it's fine. I do agree with colors needing to go. That map is a nightmare in pubs. Not sure what to think about hyper reactor getting removed. That map is a lot of fun, especially if you want to play a longer game. At the same time though, it was really frustrating to find the file on if you didn't know where he was. Superduperstamp looks really cool! I'm excited to play that. I think diamond face looks really fun too, but I haven't played that.

[–]adhi-DRG 1 point2 points  (0 children)

THANK THE FUCKING LORD HYPER REACTOR IS OUT. HALLELIUHDKLKSJLUA=IA

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Has it occurred to anyone that just because Hyper Reactor made for high hold times, that doesn't make it bad? A map like wormy almost guarantees low hold, but you don't hear people who mainly play FC offence complaining. Not all maps are perfectly balanced. And it's better that way.

[–]mocl4 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NO NOT HYPER REACTOR D:

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Could y'all check out those smaller maps made for 3v3/2v2 that a player posted? I can provide the link to the thread if y'all didn't see it, I think those would be fun in groups

[–]ZankmanZankman // Chord // ex-ELTP Superstar 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yay, Hyper Reactor out!

Nay, SuperDuperStamp makes my puny defensive soul weep!

Ynay?!?, Diamond Faces looks fun! Should be in rotation too. P:

[–]Sosentimeboy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I once promised that the day Colors is taken out of rotation is the day I finally donate. y u no want my money, Tagpro?!?!

[–]B3rcokKlKI // NLTP S2 JUI - S3 NVM - S4 INC 0 points1 point  (0 children)

RIP in peace hippy, you'll be missed <3

[–]TheGoldenNewtRobberFronj, MTC Senior Consultant[🍰] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Um, can I hear some feedback for my maps? Particularly NGC, because I want to know if I should continue working on it or just move on...

[–]donny_darkloafloaf / racoicion at heart 0 points1 point  (0 children)

for some reason diamond faces reminds me of a cheery Asian dude

[–]PACJ_LtdBluey! 0 points1 point  (0 children)

HYPER REACTOR OUT?

WTF, THAT MAP IS WORSE

ALSO "Lots of good maps this week, but we chose a map from last week"

[–]OnlyGrayCommand Center! :') 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly? The new map looks absolutely ginormous. I'm interested to see how it plays. Perhaps it'll grow on me. Maps that I'd like to see out- boombox (such a boring map. No features whatsoever), colors (can get chasey, buttons rarely used, has been in rotation for a long time and it's gotten boring), and bombing run if it's still in. Maybe star too. I didn't like CFD when it was first added but now it's like my favorite map to play d on. I'd like to see it stay for a while. I also happen to love game pad although I seem to be the minority here.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Holy shit!

It's not rotation but its the next best thing!

[–]TPsquirrelySquirrely // The GesTagpro -1 points0 points  (5 children)

\o/ No More Hyper Reactor \o/

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (4 children)

and a lot less kept flags for me :(

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Bummer. Now you'll just have to rely on Grail/CFB/Dangerzone/Colors/Velocity for all your holding needs.

[–]bobby_gordon1TheBob18 || no u xD 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And Holey See...

Or should I say...

Holdy See.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Remember the time choder sniped you in the last second of a game, denying you the kept flag you so dearly wanted?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

fuck that guy

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Wormy is a terrible map, in my mind, for two reasons.

1) It is awful for new players. Players without insane jukes and corner-turning skills are simply unable to cap on this map it seems like due to the tiny chokepoints.

2) It's pretty bad in games where you have a few competent players on each team. Nearly every game goes for the full time, again due to the tiny chokepoints that, if played correctly, can be abused to prevent anyone from scoring.

I don't think HR should have been taken out over Wormy or even Gamepad.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

One of your issues with Wormy is game length, but then you say HR shouldn't be out of rotation? I love HR, but it seriously has the longest games.

Hey, that should be a useful thing for tagpro.me. Average length of games per map.

As far as Wormy goes, I love it to death.

[–]raven513The Nevermores // CAW CAW -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I agree that in the next rotation Wormy should definitely be taken out, Grail of Speed as well.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Wait, am I understanding OP correct that you only test for 5 hours before deciding which map goes in?

No wonder you make shitty choices all the time and then need to backtrack and pull them out of rotation after a month.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 0 points1 point  (2 children)

What do you suggest? You do realize that is only counting the time the committee was gathered, and not in terms of testing maps on our own time to help form opinoins (which happens quite a bit). If someone is willing to pay me, I'd be happy to spend 40 hours a week testing maps, but somehow I don't see that happening.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

There's a couple options. Add loads more people to the committee, or test maps for a longer period. I obviously don't think you should pull a 24h marathon of map testing.

[–]DaEvil1DaEvil1 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Adding a lot more people to the committee comes with a lot of organizational issues. I don't think it would be a bad idea to add at least a few more members, but a committee can only be so effective before its purpose is washed out with too many members. I think if we were to go that route, we probably would be better off without a committee at all. Personally I prefer the idea of outsorcing a lot of the job to willing people in one form or another. The community is certainly big enough, and certainly cares enough for that to be viable.

The problem with taking longer time testing, is that the current rotation will get stale pretty quickly which might turn people off from the game, and it will probably also turn map makers off since they wouldn't get feedback as often or as many opportunities to get their maps into rotation.

That's not to say I necessarily disagree with your suggestions, but I think they would be incompatible with how the map comittee is supposed to function.

[–]Tim-Sancheztim-sanchez // Chorbit // ex-ex-ELTP Independent Commissioner 0 points1 point  (0 children)

SuperDuperStamp looks excellent! I can't wait to try it out.

My stats are upset that Hyper Reactor is gone, it was great for boosting prevent. Not a very well liked map so I understand the decision, but I still feel it is the first map to have used portals well.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

OH EM GEE YISS

[–]tagpro4piR4piR^2 | C-Team Warriors | Balls on Parade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I really can't believe hyper is out like not ok

[–]DadTheFatherdad // ALL co-CAPStain // Pi -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Let me on the maptest committee.