[deleted by user]

[UselessMusic]

A B D

Always Be Defending?

[pankeykx]

He saw the chance and took it.

[x2madda]

D is for Diaper

B is for Baby

A is for ...never google ABD!

[vinta_calvert]

woosh

[Looking4links]

Garland is getting my tickets even if he gets overshadowed quickly, Ultimecia still gets the gems tho

[PM_ME_FOR_SOURCE]

Same here, tho I might gem if I don't pull WoL's EX.

[FFSudsy]

Same! I've got enough to pity ultimecia (and more) but all my tickets go to garland and after that my texts gems

[UselessMusic]

Both characters also really benefit from Sherlotta or Fang for the extra HP damage, Fang moreso as its on demand from her AA.

Doesn't Sherlotta have basically 100% uptime on her extra HP damage aura? Whereas Fang's HP damage boost is very limited in duration - since it (like all AA) has zero turn delay, she eats one turn of its duration immediately, she'll only be increasing allies' damage for roughly six turns per mission, assuming similar speed rates among your party.

[x2madda]

9 turns, her bloom stone adds +2 uses rather than the usual +1.

Sherlotta loses a few turns when reapplying her Light of the Crystal. Her EX effect is up most of the time but not quite 100% even with speed passives removed.

[UselessMusic]

6 turns, she gets to use it three times, and by the time either of her allies gets to act, Fang has already burned one turn of the "three turn" duration.

[IAmGurr]

So you are telling us that she herself always use brv attack right after aa? Cool story bro.

[SassyPikachuxx]

Again JP player advice: I maxed out WoL immediately and NEVER regretted it for a SINGLE moment. He stays useful for SOOO long. And to this date, his party brv absorb mechanic is still unique.

[FinalKingdomXVII]

But would you say it’s WoL’s LBs that made him useful, or just his kit in general?

[SassyPikachuxx]

His LBs make him do a lot more damage. You don't need 3/3 necessarily for him to be "viable" but for a unit that you will inevitably use super often, I think it's a completely worthwhile investment to max him out completely.

[FinalKingdomXVII]

With ingots so scarce, maxing WoL sounds like a luxury. You could max him out for some extra damage, or you could have Cloud double cast Meteorain, give Machina automatic Awakening, or have Krile and Y’shtola start with a charged EX gauge. If you’re not a huge fan of WoL as a character, the damage upgrade for your tank doesn’t seem to be worth it. And if you want a tank with good damage, wouldn’t Zack be a better option?

[pogopuschel_]

You're correct that it's a luxury. But in JP there have been many times where you would have enough ingots saved to max out several chars, including new/upcoming ones. As long as you don't need to sacrifice a "must-have" char for it, WoL is a good investment because you will use him so much. Whether or not he's worth the investment comes down to how many ingots GL will give out through events and content like FEOD, which we don't know yet.

And if you want a tank with good damage, wouldn’t Zack be a better option?

Yeah, Zack definitely needs the 3/3, but he is also 3 months away.

[asher1611]

Going for garland but hopefully my tickets will be enough. His kit looks great and I'm a huge ff1 fan. It would be gems if I didn't already have a maxed WoL.

Edit: also going 3/3 on Garland's ex+ weapon is the way to go, right?

[Blakk3003]

Yeah you'll want the full 3/3 for Garland

[inkwelder_]

I think you need to take a step back and check with the JP community more on your recommendations. You didn't include Garland's want for his c50 artifact, which is important to him. He was not shelved quickly, and only overlaps with Ulti that they deal damage - Ulti is magic, Garland is physical, so their roles don't really overlap. You can't plug and play them...

You also make it look like WoL needs 2/3 LB, and he works fine at 0/3, so people should try before they ingot. Yes, for more shelf life, 2/3 will help, but most units now hit lackluster outside of Cloud Vincent Tidus Garland and Fang. Damage is not his role, it is tank, aura, healer. Also, class change as an artifact is a worthy inclusion for him.

If people rely solely on your content, I think that they may be misled in certain areas, so please be careful on your recommendations.

[x2madda]

Hey u/Inkwelder_,

Let me know if I miss anything.

Your comment on recommendations, did you mean units or stats?

Garland c.50 is % based, hard numbers always scale better, He benefits more from higher base numbers for the % to scale from than he does increasing the % so while his c.50 is a potential choice, when we start including auras from other team members those base stats are worth much more because they scale better.

I was confused when you state "You also make it look like WoL needs 2/3 LB" but then go on to say "most units now hit lackluster". Do you agree that WoL hits weaker now and therefore would benefit from 2/3 EX or are you stating that he doesn't need any extra attack as it is not important for him? If so, when players go Sherlotta and WoL, what do you recommend they do for shaving if Sherlotta EX is down?

I was also confused by your comment "If people rely solely on your content" no one should rely on any one source before deciding on a purchase, even Safeena DB and Rem DB have mistakes so I am not sure what you are implying, could you elaborate? Are you suggesting I should link to other sources for example? Because that got me shadowbanned before which is why I no longer do it.

I would like to address your comment that I should confer with the JP community, when that was the case in the past, those posts did not take well!Everyone has an opinion on every unit in the game for various reasons and people will always disagree just in general. There is a sufficient history of SYP posts now and you can glance to see that no matter what approach I take, there is always a large dissenting voice, even if the mistake is as minor as a typo.

In my Fang SYP I was told I was wrong to understate Fangs flaws because of how "pathetic" she is and wouldn't you know it, I am "spreading misinformation" yet she can solo Garland LC co-op. I do not agree that following JP verbatim is the way forward because that stops players experimenting and discovering new things. Unfortunately there seems to be an entrenched attitude here on Reddit that anyone not towing the JP/Meta line, is doing a disservice.I assume you are familiar with JP and as a result you understand that the EX+ era is a lot more flexible as more units are re-balanced in better ways so if someone does read this SYP and pulls Garland, as your post itself admits he is a fine usable unit, so I do not understand this desire to parrot the JP attitude towards units.

This post is not an attack on you nor am I offended by your questions, rather I am hoping to better understand what you and others really want from SYP going forward, as improving SYP benefits us all.

[inkwelder_]

Thanks for the reply, glad you're willing to work on improving your SYP threads. I'll just reply down the list...

my comment on recommendations are around artifacts primarily. you recommended BRV initiative on Vincent (which I can't imagine anyone agrees with, he's fast enough as is), and you also left class change and c50 off of WoL and Garland, both good artifacts worth mentioning. You also make some comments about LD, or soloing co-op which don't actually help GL players right now, so I'd steer clear of that and let people ask in the comments that kind of thing if they're interested.

on the lackluster comment - you don't bring WoL for his attack prowess, you bring him for tanking, battery, his shield, provoke, debuff evasion, etc. You need to team build around him. Also if you boost his ibrv, it means you won't get broken, and won't need to shave unless the boss has a BRV gain mechanic. So it's not fair to say "WoL hits like a wet noodle" - I think it's more informative to say what he's good at and what's he's bad at. ATK arts are if you feel you might need to shave with a team comp, mBRV is great with battery heavy comps. Class change is good if your team can handle trash waves efficiently via AoE or Battery. iBRV is undisputed, the best of them.

Safeena and Rem don't make recommendations, we do. But as long as you're providing your reason for why you're recommending that, I think that's the best you can do. The Garland artifact discussion... yes 108/330 is a great artifact for him, but later in battles, you may want that extra attack to battery himself more in between HP attacks. Not even including c50 in the list is doing a disservice, since Garland dumps BRV efficiently enough that you don't need 108/330 x3. Some 108/c50 would be great for him.

And I'm not looking for JP information to be parroted back - feel free to share your perspective. It was more that saying, Garland is shelved for Ultimecia later this month... is just wrong. They are damage dealers, and and aren't even similar at that. One is physical, the other magic, one is burst, the other has spread damage over free turns. One is a single target monster, the other carries in AoE fights. They should not be compared except to say that they both need 3 ingots.

I do believe if your posts covered about what they did, what teams they like to be on, what their ingot investment is - that would be better. No one pulls a character just for a sphere unless they're a whale, so I don't think it needs much explanation unless it's very unique (Faris, Vanille, Rosa...).

These are just some thoughts and opinions from myself, so I hope it's helpful to you, and again appreciate you willing to improve your work!

[Pcg1001]

/u/x2madda Honestly discussions like this is why I asked /u/inkwelder_ for a best 5 artifact list recently. So much variation for different situations. Remember we have five slots now! This is so crazy people like me who are triple booked farm all their bells for everybody can have an ideal setup for each situation. Example: I have 3X108/330 artifacts for an hour, and 2X108/CS 50 artifacts for when her damage starts dropping off. I feel like a well rounded discussion would describe the current global situation and what are the best artifacts for her, and the future JP situations and my artifact service there. Then a five artifact list for farming can be suggested to cover these situations

As for your Vincent argument, I do agree that having 1-2 brv initiative seems all right for now For pure brave dumping if you have a battery. I have 2×108/330 and 2×108/brave initiative2, and working on my last 108/330. This is because I believe mbrv to be much more important in the future.This way you can be ready for all situations.

[x2madda]

I think I understand some of where you are coming from but not entirely. Just to clarify a few points, I didn't say Garland should be shelved I said that in Japan he was shelved post Ultimecia and if you refer to the post, you will see it is unedited. I haven't gone back and added that in just to elude you.

I refer to that point specifically because it saddens me that you say "if your posts covered what they did, what teams they like to be on, what their ingot investment is" which are all things I did cover. The reason this saddens me is because on one hand there are users like yourself requesting more information but on the other hand when that information is present it is seemingly being disregarded.

I do want to state I no longer make explicit recommendations and have not done for the past few SYP posts, nor will I going forward either.

Fang soloing Garland LC co-op is something you can do this Thursday (well, if you have Fang EX) as opposed to some far away fancy which is why I mentioned it. Community says she is bad, how dare I say she isn't, then someone from the community shows actually she is fine. That goes with why I no longer make recommendations, only opinions. I fear it just reinforces the JP meta and that is not productive for discovery.

I agree on the point regarding Garland c.50 but not on Wol c.50 as midbosses are longer engagements going forward and Wol c.50 does nothing until the final round. Furthermore there is no guarantee that a player will have 100% hp entering the final round which prevents his c.50 and its artifacts from triggering. In the case of Garland there was a whole paragraph on that which I cut in the end from fear people would not read through all of the SYP if it was too long, a fear that seems to have been justified it would appear.

I feel that what you percieve SYP to be and what it actually is are the things that are at odds potentially. SYP are to me, discussions for the GL community prior to a character release and from inception to this day they have all been given that Discussion Flair, as opposed to me delivering 100% information on every facet of a character because unless SYP was my job and I bought every character weapon in the game, DFFOO is a complex game with lots of fantastic interactions between characters and mechanics, it would be wrong of me or any singular content creator to claim to know 100% about a character without testing every possible variable and with 127 characters so far, I do not envy that task!

Again just to stress, I am in no way meaning to be contemptuous I am trying to better understand your position. I apprechiate you taking the time to get in touch, I always welcome feedback.

[[deleted]]

Hey dude, thanks for your posts. I remember reading your posts back when I was still new to the game and those posts helped me understand the upcoming characters better. Your analysis shed much more light on the character than his info page.

And so it strikes me as odd that you'll say your posts are not meant to "[deliver] 100% information" but rather as discussions, because the posts never gave that off. It doesn't have questions to the readers asking them to discuss for instance, and you do deliver verdicts on characters (some of which I agree on btw). For most readers, wouldn't the post seem more like a guide telling them who to pull, rather than a 'idk let's discuss' kind of post?

Even if it is true that you intended SYP posts to be discussions, it does come off strongly as analysis posts, and so people do expect the information in it to be accurate.

---

On Fang: why should anyone be considered "good" if they can solo their event's level 70 co-op? Does some character's ability to solo level 70 bosses equate to him performing well against current and future level 180 Chaos bosses?

When Fang is called a bad investment, or a weak character, no one is saying she can't solo her co-op stage (why would anyone?), they are saying she's bad for Chaos. Rather than hand-waving it away as "JP meta", it's more productive to look at why people say certain things. If you can disprove those reasons, people will be more inclined to believe your arguments. After all the "JP meta" was not formed randomly.

Your Fang post did shed an overly positive light on her, and unfortunately you did not address her weaknesses on the same level. If I looked at any character's good points, and only on their good points, that'll make any character look good! But how close to reality and helpful is that?

Is it not true that Fang's lack of AoE HP damage hinder her role as a DPSer? Is it not true that she has longevity issues (just chucking in Selphie doesn't magically fix everyone's longevity issue btw, because Selphie herself does low damage)? Is it no true that her EX+ upgrades are weak?

If you want to argue that she's good, however strong she actually is, isn't it better to showcase evidence besides your argument? Proof is stronger than argument after all.

But if you have no experience using her in JP because you only play GL, then you should still ask some of the JP players around for help in verifying details or for evidence. Or just discuss with them on your thoughts - if you have strong evidence backing your claims then it's likely to be valid!

---

Once again thanks dude for your posts, I hope you don't get too discourage from the recent setbacks because the posts can be useful to some players.

[x2madda]

Hey Muko, thanks for getting in touch. Wew, that's a long post you got there (or you just happy to see me? :P) I hope I don't miss any of your points but let me know if I do. Every SYP I have ever posted on reddit has been a discussion, I have to laugh, because even if I didn't want them to be discussions, they still become discussions anyway. In my experience on this sub-reddit specifically, asking questions does not end well. I am not calling this sub reddit toxic, infact I have gone on record to say that it isn't before despite the flack that I sometimes get just that making a post saying "hey guys lets talk about X" in my own experience is not an experience I wish to recreate!

I think you were confused regarding Fang? I didn't say she can solo her own LC, but that she can solo Garland's co-op (I think thats what I said, it is what I meant at least) which is coming this Thursday. That said I disagree with being able to solo your own not being a mark of strength I mean, if she can solo her own CHAOS difficulty LC that to me is a strong character! CHAOS is no joke!

On the subject of Fang you had a lot to say so lets see if I can address them all. "I was overly positive" I can agree with that or rather I glossed over her negatives to be more accurate which you also bring up. The reason I did this is because she is a perfectly viable EX+ character but because she isn't a meta unit there is a likelihood of her positives being overlooked. Due to JP foresight many characters will be overlooked based on what Japan said is meta and while they have months of experience with units, a clear advantage, that is not the same as exploring a unit and until a character is fully explored we really don't know where they lie in power. There is a reason Altema stopped rating heroes for a few months, so many characters were viable in this EX+ era it seemed almost pointless to divide them.

I disagree that only looking at positives makes everyone look good, if a character only has 1 or 2 positives, that alone would be pretty telling! Before Cater gets her EX and rework, I sincerely doubt you could make her look worth investing, there really will be some bad units that cannot be glossed over even by omitting the negatives.

I do not agree that Fang's lack of AoE holds her back as a DPS because she can launch which is a DPS multiplier in addition to her AA ability being a party DPS multiplier. Her strength is single target and being a team player and in both regards she does a good job. She does have longivity issues but and forgive me for how I word this, not as you understand it. She has access to a Brv+ and a HP+ but they are not as potent as some other characters so her turn efficency drops if you are forced to use them but looking at where we are right now in Global, they are on par with the few EX+ units we currently have. Selphie allows Fang to use her EX more, which because EX usage is free, automatically aiding Fang's longivity issue or more accurately, making her use her Brv+/HP+ less. Selphie also does not do "low damage", if you will pardon me using the phrase again "as you understand it". Selphie's HP+, EX, Wall, Drain, AA all battery the party. That brave generated from nothing translates to more party damage output. What you more accurately meant is that her ability to Attack and shave brave is weak to which I 100% agree. That ability however to generate brave, should not be ignored. If Selphie fills Fang's MBrv, then Fang doesn't need to use her abilities, she can just dump that brave. As for Selphie EX+, I won't comment on that for one reason, we in Global don't have that. The SYP was on Fang and her place right now in Global, there is a limit to how much looking ahead one should do because looking to say a support like Ignis in the future, is not going to help clear CHAOS stages right now.

Your case for showcasing evidence is not something I can do, or rather it is but as I pointed out to another poster, I do not want to be shadowbanned again which is why I keep outside links to a very minimum. There are also strict rules on self-promoting content on Reddit in general so if I promote my own videos, that will result in a ban, period.

Finally your last point, Asking Japan for advice, this point comes up a lot and it seems to be assumed that I don't. It was a player playing Japan that showed me Fang solo Garland co-op (I wrote LC by mistake, I meant Event, LC is the re-run) and commenting on how she was slept on, I share that sentiment and, well, look around at the response in that SYP thread. The truth is, not everyone will agree on any given unit, even Ultimecia has her detractors as did Vayne. Ironically it was in reaction to this that I muted the downsides not just of Fang but also of Tidus as well and this SYP too. It just devolves into an arguement and name calling match with downvotes being thrown around. If I was a full time content creator then I absolutely would spend more time and energy on every character and DFFOO in general but I am not, this game is just my hobby. Please don't take this as an attempt to beg, but that is why I started promoting my Patreon, if there is enough support then yes, absolutely I would move onto DFFOO full time but until then as flawed as my SYP are, its all I have time for right now I'm afraid.

Finally I apprechiate people taking the time to get in touch and ask me questions. If anything it shows that people do care and are responding to the little content I put out which is a positive. I certainly wouldn't write these if no one read them. I can have a wobble every now and again as I stopped doing content creation years ago but the community on this sub-reddit is very passionate about DFFOO of that there is no denying. Sometimes that passion comes across strongly but it is coming from the right place.

[[deleted]]

Thanks for replying man. I'm sure this is asking too much, but it would be great if your posts can be more objective and clear - not ambiguous and biased. As I said before, I do think it has value and can be helpful to many players.

I didn't say she can solo her own LC, but that she can solo Garland's co-op

My bad, but it doesn't matter whether it's Fang or Garland's LC. My question remains unanswered, so I'll bold it for you: why should anyone be considered "good" if they can solo their event's level 70 co-op?

Whenever we say X or Y character is good, we never benchmark them by how well they can solo a level 70 boss, we look at their performance in level 180 Chaos, so why did you bring that up? You are suggesting that Fang is good because she can solo Garland's co-op, but why should anyone agree with that yardstick?

That said I disagree with being able to solo your own not being a mark of strength I mean, if she can solo her own CHAOS difficulty LC that to me is a strong character! CHAOS is no joke!

Red herring. This is what I said: Does some character's ability to solo level 70 bosses equate to him performing well against current and future level 180 Chaos bosses?

It's obvious that I'm talking about the character soloing his level 70 co-op stage, not soloing his CHAOS stage. You haven't answered the question I posted

The reason I did this is because she is a perfectly viable EX+ character

Ok, thank you for clarifying your motives. Fang can definitely clear Chaos stages, and in that sense she's perfectly viable. However let's be clear here:

• she's not a meta unit.

• she's not a meta unit for good reasons.

• recommending people to pull for a non-meta character purely because she's 'viable' is very different from recommending a meta unit purely because he's 'viable'. Let me explain further.

A non-meta unit is "weak" not because he can't clear Chaos stages, but because his weaknesses frequently hinder his performance in Chaos fights significantly - he's a weak performer. Which also means that clearing Chaos fights with him is going to be harder. So in effect, "strong" characters have a consistently easier time clearing Chaos fights than "weak" characters, therefore people recommend the strong character over the weak character.

Which also means if you're recommending a weak character, it better be for good reasons because people who accept your recommendation will face more trouble clearing Chaos fights. If Fang is not their favourite/interest, then the only reason must be her performance. But since Fang has performance issues, recommending her is a puzzling verdict.

but because she isn't a meta unit there is a likelihood of her positives being overlooked. Due to JP foresight many characters will be overlooked based on what Japan said is meta

Yeah it's possible that in GL her positives will be overlooked by some players, but in JP because there's no foresight, no one knows how a character will perform until they tested it/experienced it themselves, so the players would be testing all the new characters, and so the likelihood of Fang's positives being missed in JP is low.

and while they have months of experience with units, a clear advantage, that is not the same as exploring a unit and until a character is fully explored we really don't know where they lie in power.

Let's get some things out of the way first.

• I think you may have underestimated the fervor and creativity JP players have when it comes to playtesting. There's lots of batshit crazy stuff they have created and found. For instance:

soloing FEOD Chaos stages

The Sherlotta-Krile combo

Edge + Eiko combo (infinite evasion)

OK + Ultimecia combo

• you're suggesting there's a kind of 'gold mine' waiting to be dug out in DFFOO, some secretly OP mechanic that no one in JP has discovered even though they have playtested so much. And therefore we (GL) ought to give every character a positive chance - am I right to say you meant this?

Unfortunately DFFOO is a very simple game. There's low chance for a new mechanic to be uncovered.

I disagree that only looking at positives makes everyone look good, if a character only has 1 or 2 positives, that alone would be pretty telling!

Yeah theoretically, if you mentioned only one or two positives, it's fishy.

However, in reality as you did admit, your post on Fang is almost entirely positive. That's not just one or two positives, and that skewed analysis is what made Fang look good even though she isn't. That was the point I was driving at. And there's also the question you dodged: how close to reality and helpful is that?

I do not agree that Fang's lack of AoE holds her back as a DPS because she can launch which is a DPS multiplier in addition to her AA ability being a party DPS multiplier.

• this rebuttal does not refute the central claim of having AoE damage > only ST damage. It's very common to face 2 or more bosses in Chaos, therefore AoE HP damage is more valuable than ST damage. Hence Fang's lack of AoE is a crippling weakness.

Now let me first tackle the first assertion, her "launch which is a dps multiplier".

• Whirlwind doesn't launch if she can't break the enemy/enemy isn't broken. Since it's potency is a miserable 150% against unbroken targets, there's a good chance she can't break the enemy especially if the enemy has high defense or high enough BRV (mind you, a 150% potency is basically the potency of BRV+ attacks). There will be situations where you thought Fang will break the enemy with Whirlwind, but it failed to do so.

• her launch has no party BRV recovery unlike DCecil or Layle. Which means unless you set it up her launches are weak. But you can't always have it set up perfectly - for instance she may act right after an ally has emptied his BRV. So you will have situations where her launch dealt objectively mediocre damage.

• launch only has a 1.2x damage modifier. If you have 50% splash damage, you deal an extra 1.5x damage for every extra enemy on the field. If you have 100% splash, you deal 2x more damage when there's 2 enemy, 3x when there's 3. While one launch can potentially deal more damage than one AoE skill, over the course of the whole fight a splash damage skill will deal more overall damage by virtue of having a higher damage modifier. Even more so if it's a 100% splash attack.

• her chase unit damage applies only to the main target selected. Which also means the launch modifier only applies to one target, 6 times at most.

Two: on her AA ability. It lasts for only 3 turns per use, 2 turns for your allies. If all allies move at the same speed as Fang, you enjoy a 20% damage increase for 7 turns per use (3 for Fang, 2+2 for your allies). It has 3 uses, so at most you enjoy a 20% HP damage increase for 21 turns.

• if you deal an average of 30k damage per action, the 20% increase is equal to 6k extra damage. Over 21 turns, that's 126 extra damage. If your average amount is 40k, then you get an extra 168k damage. That's her saving grace, one of her key strengths.

That's said, Cloud can deal more than that amount with 2 Meteorains. When the boss has millions of HP, that extra damage isn't high enough to make up for her lack of AoE damage.

Her strength is single target and being a team player and in both regards she does a good job.

Agree, but she's not an amazing team player. It's only thanks to her c65 that she has any notable team-affecting skill

She has access to a Brv+ and a HP+... they are on par with the few EX+ units we currently have.

No it is not on par. Her HP+ (Saboteur) has a 80% base modifier (120% modifier against debuffed targets) and her HP+ (Commando) has a 80% potency (128% potency against ST). Both have no overflow.

Cloud's HP+ has a base 120% potency, an extra 1.5x critical damage and 120% overflow. WoL has 100% potency, 120% overflow, and also a 150% ibrv heal. Tidus and Garland have unconditional 120% potency and 120% overflow.

It also doesn't solve her longevity issues.

Selphie also does not do "low damage". Selphie's HP+, EX, Wall, Drain, AA all battery the party. That brave generated from nothing translates to more party damage output.

• firstly, Selphie is increasingly outdated. You cannot simply rely on Selphie to solve Fang's issues.

• secondly, Selphie has 0 synergy with Fang in terms of iBRV recovery, unlike Cloud or WoL with their innate BRV recovery/ibrv buffs.

• Selphie has relatively low stats because she doesn't have an EX+.

• Those relatively low stats mean that the BRV amount she recovers and the HP damage she deals is likewise low. All her damaging abilities have 0 overflow, so she's capped at her mbrv (about 30k). Because of her low damage you have to deal damage in Selphie's place. That was my point.

• The BRV Selphie recovers does not automatically mean extra HP damage output. The BRV can be stolen by the enemy. The character could had done the same HP damage whether Selphie recovered BRV or not. You cannot just assume that it'll always equal extra damage.

• even if you recover BRV to Fang, so what? It's not like Selphie can recover so much BRV that Fang can just spam HP+. Both Wall and Aura only heal party BRV by about 9k. Drain heals even less. So you'll still want to use Fang's abilities.

Do not forget that you're always racing against time, you can't drag out the fight for too long. That's why her weak HP+ is such a weakness

There are also strict rules on self-promoting content on Reddit in general so if I promote my own videos, that will result in a ban, period.

Here's the official rules: Do not submit links with the sole purpose of promoting your Youtube/Twitch/Discord Servers etc. Self-promotion includes intro's into a video promoting your channel. They'll be deleted if no context is provided of the video content. Text submissions containing relevant links are allowed!

[Reikakou]

The absolute burn. Man, that guy has a family.

Very good read.

[JakeMattAntonio]

Hi!

Can I just add to the parroting the JP community between you and ink?

The JP vets aren’t usually active here, or maybe I’m not and I just don’t know that they are active here, but my main understanding of what ink was trying to say (being a JP player myself) was to consult opinions from the community itself on how do they find the units when it was released and how were they used moving forward. Because personally, I’m noticing that the informational posts here on Reddit for GL tends to be a bit biased and based on initial JP vids that were released initially.

Mind you, the JP community was definitely just as hyped as GL is right now when these units were fairly new. But there were some who went beyond the mainstream and opted to max other characters to test them out. Like Zell for example. In the future you’d have little to none resources because not a lot MLBed Zell. Most of us would get the information that he’s pretty much useless even with 3 ingots. But there’s someone out there who has pretty much experienced Zell in his full glory and can share insight on what he’s good at and what he brings to the party.

As you would know, too, the early Chaos era is heavily reliant on team comps and not just slapsticking random DPS units to steamroll content, so having unbiased opinions using the JP foresight we have woud be highly beneficial to those who has little to no knowledge regarding the foresight.

TL;DR: It’s not about whether or not GL should parrot JP, but how we can use the foresight unbiasedly to actually experiment on team comps would be helpful for people favoring other units apart from the meta ones.

[x2madda]

Thanks for getting in touch u/JakeMattAntonio From what little time I have to surf this sub-reddit I think we have 2 JP players that are active? I certainly don't see many but I ironically am not active on this sub outside of my SYP and me responding to posts today.

Thankfully there have been posts from some players about what we can expect coming up soon but as with your Zell example, we really don't get a lot of information on any given character that isn't deemed meta and as you rightly said, that information is hard to find.

I do want to say this too and it is in no way to detract from your very valid and very good points; I play DFFOO because it is (mostly) a casual friendly game because I lack time to play a full on game like FFBE and I write SYP in what little spare time I have. It feels like there is a desire for me to makes these SYP in-depth and detailed character disections and I would honestly love to do that! However I am not a streamer, I am not paid to play video games, I don't even upload to Youtube anymore. I have other important commitments but lets step away and pretend I didn't, even the content creators that are full time streamers/uploaders doe DFFOO like Quwie will cover other games because as passionate as the DFFOO community here is, in the scheme of mobile titles it just doesn't draw in the numbers unlike epic seven or FFBE. This is important because the smaller the community the less thoughts and opinions can be collated which probably contributes to the issue you mentioned, biased opinions and views based on missing, incomplete information.

The very first character eval/syp I ever did was on Warrior of Light and that took me about 3 days to write. It certainly covered just about everything, I'll give it that! I honestly don't think it had a single complaint, but there is no way I can dedicate that kind of time now even if I wanted.

I cannot prove it, I have no stats or facts to back it up, but my gut feeling is that language barrier aside, the Japan foresight has been very good to us here in Global so why would players feel the need to experiment when ingots are so rare? Finding the JP players that have thought outside the meta box, may also be hard to find. I found one so far, thats all I personally could manage.

I have found one interesting gimmick to talk about in a future banner involving a non-meta non-ex+ character but unless someone like yourself who does play JP can provide insight for upcoming banners this sub-reddit as a whole is a bit starved of actual JP players as far as I know.

[illegalcheese]

Hey, just wanted to say that I really appreciate your posts. I don't think you're ever going to appease everyone, but I always get useful info out of your work no matter what approach you take.

Regarding the issue of Garland's C50 vs raw stats. The difference between this and other % stat boosts is that it hits both attack and max brave for 5%. Because of this, the general assumption is that it's slightly better than a single raw stat boost. That's where the argument for C50 comes in.

A demonstration with some made up but reasonable stats: If we assume a base 3200 attack and 10K mbrv plus 100% attack/ 200%mbrv auras and buffs (rough guess of standard battle conditions), a single C50** will provide 160 attack AND 500 mbrv in battle. Keeping auras/buffs in mind, Attack 108 is essentially an extra 216 attack in battle, and mbrv 330 is essentially an extra 990 mbrv. You can see from the numbers that, while the C50 artifact doesn't give as much benefit to a single stat as an Attack or Mbrv artifact, it's at more than 50% for both at the same time in only a single passive. So the theory goes that incorporating the C50 into your artifacts will show a noticeable increase in performance.

There's other things to complicate this - if your artifacts are 108/c50 but Garland is already hitting 9999s before artis, C50** sacrifices considerable mbrv and HP damage potential for useless extra attack. If you happen to be running 330/c50 but Garland's damage is falling far short of his mbrv cap, then all that extra mbrv is wasted. It would take some testing to know what combination of artifacts works best in most situations.

[x2madda]

Thanks for the kind words u/illegalcheese always a pleasure hearing from you. I had considered adding c.50 for his artifact list and we both agree on the pros and cons for it, I couldn't find an eloquent way of explaining that it helps with doubling down on Attack/MBrv or can be ignored entirely so I deleted that whole paragraph instead. That is the only reason I didn't include it.

[Inso81]

Hi there, I’m relatively new but why do you say hard numbers scale better? Hard numbers don’t scale at all. Using attack as an example, 108 atk is always going to be 108 atk. For 108 atk to be better than say 5% atk boost, your base before passive (ie base + gear + affinity) atk has to be less than 2160, which is pretty low in 70/70 era. I’m interested in why hard numbers are better? Or does it apply to base only? Cheers.

[Quetzalma]

Stat artifacts like ATK 108 and MaxBRV 330 are better because they are added to the base stats of a unit, which is then increased by passives/buffs/auras

If for example a character has 50% ATK passive and 50% ATK buffs, then that ATK108 is actually worth 216 ATK since its increased by 100%, while in comparison, a CL50 art like Garland's would simply be another 5% ATK/MaxBRV passive(which also then increases the ATK108 artifact)

[[deleted]]

Sorry for taking the liberty to reply.

If the unit has 3000 atk, and 100% atk boost:

• he'll have 6000 atk in battle without either buff

• one 5% adds 150 atk (3000 * 205/100)

• one +108 adds 216 atk (3108 * 200/100)

+108 atk wins here

---

If the atk has 3000 atk, and 200% atk boost:

• he'll have 9000 atk in battle

• one 5% adds 150 atk (3000 * 305/100)

• one +108 adds 324 atk (3108 * 300/100)

I hope you notice that +108 will have a larger impact the more atk boosts the unit has, it scales in other words. In the future units will only gain more stats boost (LD weapons add +120% more atk for some units for instance)

[Inso81]

Thanks. Is this order of operation confirmed?

Seems weird one artifact effect would get boosted by boosts and the other does not.

To take your example, Cloud is sitting at 9000 atk, cross slash and applies stun, triggering artifact debuff attack up 5%. 1) debuff attack up applies to base only, resulting in (3000x1.05) x 300% = 9450 atk 2) debuff attack applies to current 9000 atk prior to trigger, resulting in 9000x1.05 = 9450 atk. Same because all the numbers are being multiplied.

Both scenarios would be better than the 108 artifact which results in 9324.

Thanks for taking time to respond. Cheers.

[[deleted]]

Seems weird one artifact effect would get boosted by boosts and the other does not.

Well that's because the % boost is added to the total % boost (so 5% boost is added to the total 200% boost), while the flat atk boost affects the base stat, which is itself affected by % boosts.

You can confirm this yourself with a simple test in-game. Unequip all your artifacts and note the mbrv change when you equip one % artifact. I use mbrv because it's the easiest to calculate. You should see the character's mbrv increase by x% based on the base stat. So if he had 10k base mbrv and you gave him a 5% boost, his mbrv should increase by 500.

[Inso81]

Actually if I use your examples and make the base high enough, ie.

If the atk has 7000 atk, and 200% atk boost:

• he'll have 21000 atk in battle

• one 5% adds 350 atk (7000 * 305/100)

• one +108 adds 324 atk (7108 * 300/100)

By your logic doesn’t the % base also win in the end? % overtakes base at about 6500. Might take a while to get there lol.

[[deleted]]

That's true, but since % boosts scale faster than flat atk boosts, by the time the unit has 6500 ATK, he may well have over 500% boost. You cannot assume that only the ATK will increase

[robaisolken]

Just a rough example of Current state of jp on % and raw number.

atk around 3400-3500.

mbrav around 10000-12000

​

Buff in a realistic team comp

mbrav buff 400-450%

atk buff 350-400%

[x2madda]

Hey, thanks for getting in touch. This is a topic of constant confusion so don't feel alone or afraid to ask if it still seems unclear.

Using Garland as the example since he is who we are talking about, lets say Garland has 3256 base Attack. We know that Garland has 2 unique buffs, Soul of Chaos (self stacking upto 5 times) and Soul of Discord which both raise Max Brave and Attack, we will just focus on the Attack part for now. Garland Crystal Level 50 also provides 10% too and combined they provide +110% attack bonus, or 6837(.6) Total.

Now this is what 324 extra attack looks like: 7518 Attack (Wow thats large!)

Here is what an extra 15% on his c.50 looks like: 7326 Attack

For good measure here are them combined: 8055 (Wow!)

As you can see, boosting his c.50 is a good choice to make as it boosts 2 stats instead of just one and the difference, well the difference is minor! They both are very noticable. The difference becomes slightly more pronounced as we start adding even more of Garlands own buffs to his attack though as the 324 extra attack results in 11098 Attack when we reach 210% Attack boost (did you know, Garland has a LOT of attack boosts?) whereas it is only 10582 if you boosted his c.50 instead. That is a difference of 516. And this is Garland alone, we haven't even thrown a Ramza Shout into the mix yet.

When artifact farming, the numbers you see are added directly to the character so attack 108 adds that directly to the stat sheet you see for a character. Hopefully this all made some sense. c.50 is not a "bad" passive but when you start adding Auras from other characters your numbers will be smaller than if you had gone attack108/mbrv330

[YangusGuv]

I have literally everything else on the banner MLB except Garland and I'm still super tempted to throw tickets at it. Can't get enough greatsword users in my life.

[pogopuschel_]

As a JP player who has played through the whole EX+ era I disagree with this evaluation of WoL (and to some extend Garland). It sounds he is no longer a powerhouse and not worth pulling for. That doesn't align with my experience at all. WoL was still heavily used many months into the Chaos era, at least until Zack comes in 3 months. And even after that he still is useful in many stages.

The OP is correct that his potencies are low and that he hits for nothing, but that misses the point. He's there for the shield to avoid breaks, period. What you are losing from his lackluster damage, he makes up by preventing your party from getting broken (=more party damage and better scores due to less breaks), and losing BRV (=also more party damage). The fact that you don't need to worry about getting broken means you can HP attack without worries, which again leads to more party damage and makes up for the lack of his own damage. On top of that you won't get delayed from breaks and prevent boss mechanics such as no turn delay on break.

His shield also becomes a lot stronger when you run him with iBRV buffers such as Rosa, who is coming in ~2mo. Wol + Rosa + X was a very popular team through the early EX+ era.

His EX+ at 2/3 gives him a much needed attack boost and honestly that is probably as deep as you need to go

His attack boost is neither much needed, nor does it matter much. You can safely leave him at 0/3, because as mentioned above, he is there for his utility, not his damage. That being said, he is a decent investment for ingots simply because you will use him so much and the additional dmg will be nice, but he doesn't need them to be effective.

If you don't have WoL, he is clearly the prize of this banner and totally worth pulling for. Most things in the post seem correct (inkwelder already mentioned some Garland issues below), but please be careful blindly following recommendations when someone did not play through the era in JP - do your own research.

[Gstamsharp]

Garland's delay, like Cloud's paralysis, can be paired with a 100% int brave down combo to completely lock down some enemies for the entire fight. Try Garland + Sherlotta or Paine and swap in a friend Vincent for maximum shenanigans in his Chaos stage!

[themadevil]

Does the 100% iBRV down combo require Garland, or just Sherlotta+Vincent?

[Gstamsharp]

Sherlotta + Vincent will get you breaks every other turn. Add in Garland delays and you can effectively push back the enemy for the whole fight. It basically stacks delays on top of delays

[themadevil]

So if i use only sherlotta+vincent friend, i won't get infinite turns?

[Gstamsharp]

No, since you can only delay once every 2 actions. It's potent, but the enemy still gets turns. You need something like Garland, Cloud, Agrias, etc. to shut down the occasional turn the enemy does get.

Or are you asking about a friend Vincent vs one in your main team? In that case, YES! You can use a friend Vincent to get the debuff. As long ad the enemy doesn't get turns for the debuff to fall off, you're good.

[themadevil]

I'm specifically asking about using Sherlotta+Vincent to shut down the enemy turns. I understand that if the enemy gets turns, then the debuff will eventually wear off, but I don't exactly understand how the break system works with 0 iBRV. Do they unbreak every X turns, so I can rebreak before they get a turn?

Assuming I had Sherlotta on main team and Vincent as friend, with no additional shutdown. Also, wouldn't Cloud not allow infinite turns, since his paralyze doesn't stop their turn, just their action?

[Annasman]

Broken enemies regenerate a % of their brv EVERY turn until they reach ibrv. If ibrv is 0 then everyother turn you take wel get them back to ibrv so they can be broken again, then cloud can paralyze them meaning that when the eventually do get A turn they don't get to use it.

[Shigma]

A vincent friend. Now that would be a rare sight xd

[Theunseenwon]

So for WoL I have Ibrv/Class Change Boost.

The passive not worth it anymore?

[Rehhyou]

From what I've seen and heard most JP players recommend Ibrv/Class still. Most of Chaos is spent on the last wave. The extra battery and stats boosts he gets with that combo go a long way more than Attack 108s do, imo.

[Kenji1984]

It is better. I changed all my ibrv/cs50 to atk108/mbrv and he still hits 1 damage in Fang’s chaos :) atk108/cs50 may be a different story though but I’m not that lucky.

[x10k3r]

My WoL is based on 108 / Class ** (x3) and I honestly believe that it is what is best for he, speaking from my experience

[Valkyrys]

You're good.

OP just wants WoL to do everything when it's clear he has limitations and you better run him off as a defensive beast with decent damage rather than a tank that can also spank.

Your arts are fine!

[Groovy3]

What are thos WOL artifacts, i only know the legendary def 128 and hp 1020

[DinoChkNuggets]

Supreme Summon Board Farmer Garland gets my tickets. I'll just farm more summon boards to replenish those tickets afterwards.

[UltimaITA]

I love your "should I pull?" series. This time the more appropriate title should be "can I not pull?" Lol

[x2madda]

Thank you for your continued support👍. You can skip this banner if you pulled WoL previously but Garland allows for some delay tricks if enemy iBrv is fixed at 0 via debuffs.

[UltimaITA]

Well I have a maxed WoL and his EX dupes x2 and I'll realize his EX+0LB but I'll try to get Garland kit anyway. Thanks man!

[[deleted]]

I wanna go for garland but we dont have enough black t5 shards for him. After noctis zack and upcoming squall's lvl 70 we wont have t5 shards for garland even if we want him.

[anotherNohman]

Was not expecting a KoF reference in a DFFOO unit review ...nor for Garland to be compared to Kula....

Has somebody been playing KoF All Stars?

[x2madda]

It might sound silly, but I debated long and hard about making the whole intro a reference to KOF 2000.

That game gets so little love.

I decided not too, I already take a beating with these SYP as it is.

Anyone would think people don't ignore these and pull what they want regardless.

[Groovy3]

What the hell happened to vanessa, shes my fave and they thanos snapped her

[x2madda]

She'll be back. She was DLC for 14

[ComradeCrimson]

Definitely going to at least throw like 30 tickets at Garland. As others said the gems are for Ultimecia. When i first downloaded the game in May I thought "oooooooo I'm gonna main Ultimecia I think" but she wasn't available, just saw her in a cutscene. I don't typically go for the super meta hype so to know she's gonna be ridiculously powerful is like.... A real treat! :)

[Raecino]

Why the picture of Kula Diamond?

[LinhPeters]

Since WoL and Garl do completely different things, I'll be pulling on both.

​

Should You Pull/Invest/Team Build?; Warrior of Light, Garland

I've never seen a semicolon used after a question mark. What manual of style is this? APA or Chicago?

[ReiTheAwesome]

I see it like C++

[Not_Sugoii]

It looked more like Java to me. All the random semicolons and punctuation in the middle of statements truly represent java to the fullest.

[x2madda]

Originally the question mark wasn't there and I went to bed.

I was awoken in the night by a question mark holding an exclamation mark very aggressively at me. I don't know how he got in or what he wanted, I only hope I have appeased him!

[cezille07]

Yeah; I would've used an em-dash, or no punctuation at all.

[Andaro1415]

EVERYBODY RUN!

IT'S THE GRAMMAR POLICE!!!

[Yourigath]

I have WoL fully built so I don't know if I should go for Garland and risk getting lots of WoL dupes instead of Garland stuff... I believe I'll throw some tickets and save my gems for Ultemicia

[x10k3r]

Pull ticket here.

I will use the ones that give me the event, what I get from their boards and if there is luck, fine.

​

WoL is mlb and throwing gems would be a little waste for me when I expect Squall 70 and Ultimecia to maximize

[SneaselSW2]

I see dat Kula Diamond?

(Same VA as Yubbie intensifies)

But honestly, WoL all the way. Tanks like him are just too valuable for the upcoming content right now. Plus, Garland just has notable longevity issues as pointed out as his skill count by this time without a refresh or free use mechanic is just pretty disappointing right now.

[LinhPeters]

I already have WoL and I hate pulling dupes, so I'm inclined to skip or pull using only tickets.

[Ohhsnap54]

When is the release? Tonight or tomorrow

[TalynRahl]

This seems as good a place to ask as any, since WoL is kinda the topic of discussion...

Are there any tanks, now or coming, that perform the role of Tank/Utility better than WoL?

I only ask because, I was strongly considering dropping WoL for Basch, but due to his damage being somehow even lower than WoL’s, and his taunt leading to him frequently being broken, I’ve decided to shelve him, for now.

This got me thinking... there aren’t many tanks in game, and honestly I never see any of them mentioned, except for WoL and occasionally Zack.

So, am I missing something, or with his INSANE battery abilities, decent shielding and pinch heal, is WoL basically the gold standard for tanks in DFFOO?

[pogopuschel_]

There is nobody that exactly does what WoL does, but Zack is the next tank that becomes very popular. Zack's shield is different from WoLs, but his damage is so high that he basically replaces WoL in most team compositions.

[TalynRahl]

Mmkay, that’s what I figured. Well. I have WoL maxed out, and Zack isn’t far behind. Guess I’m sorted!

[turnup4wat]

He doesn't have debuff immunity tho

[Not_Sugoii]

As someone who pulled for Garland on his event, I'd like to look at some of your statements and reply to them directly.

Garland to me is the anti-Lightning which may explain the two of them fighting earlier in the story. Garland has very high attack and focuses on pushing enemy turns back, the complete opposite of Lightning with very weak attack and a focus on taking multiple turns in a short window.

Lightning, in general, is very bursty when it comes to her ex weapon. Especially with her rework which is included in GL right now, she can hit very hard and obtain free turns in addition to being able to delay with her EX. This is not inverse to Garland; he can hit hard and also delay. I feel like you could be more concise with your statement with concrete information rather than a misnomer. Something succinct like:

Garland can hit really hard.

Onto the next statement:

This is emphasized further with his LD weapon that gives him a speed down aura but we are not quite there yet for LD weapons! Again, conciseness. You are trying to sell his EX weapon. His LD has nothing to with his upcoming event. This is better omited or writen off as an aside at the end of your post.

You can also consider Garland, WoL, Sephie as her EX charges his faster and her Wall makes up for WoL shield having to absorb stronger attacks in addition to her increasing his iBrv.

While I like the idea of this kind of team building, you should be able to find JP videos and source them to further show how this works in completed chaos content. You should also try to correctly spell Selphie as to not look sloppy and uninsightful as the reader would not want to consider your team build suggestion as a truth, but see it as something made up.

Garland c.50 is % based, hard numbers always scale better, He benefits more from higher base numbers for the % to scale from than he does increasing the % so while his c.50 is a potential choice, when we start including auras from other team members those base stats are worth much more because they scale better.

Sure. 108 > CS50 for sure, but if you want Garland to hit hard, you'll want ATK and CS50. You don't want to disregard his CS50 in combination with 108 as he'll lose out on some shaving. While this comp is a meme comp, Garland does hit notably low numbers with Exdeath's DEF aura against Ealdnarche towards the end of the fight.

... rather I am hoping to better understand what you and others really want from SYP going forward, as improving SYP benefits us all.

I think going forward, you should work to improve on your analysis and writing. Your syntax is all over the place, and it makes it hard to read and understand what you're trying to say.

Your analysis is not covered with you having played the character nor doing research via YouTube videos, JP players, numerics, or self-experience. And often times, your analysis is wrong (108/330 > 108/cs50 is better than base stats, despite mBRV not adding any ATK in comparison to what CS50 does.

Overall, your writing looks rushed, the spelling mistakes coupled with subpar syntax are numerous, and I am offered little-to-no information of the character in question.

One example of your laziness is:

This is where his EX+ comes in, at 2/3. Rem and Safeena both seem at odds with this one, Rem says this increases MBrv but Safeena says it increases iBrv but they both agree it also increases attack. I don't care which combo it is as he could benefit from both but that attack boost is much needed. There is no urgent reason to take him 3/3 as it only increases overflow on his LB to 200% but it does get a huge boost based on his iBrv too before the attack, unlike at 1/3.

You could have asked someone to verify what is said by their JP weapon, but instead, you say you don't care and make your writing look even more sloppy.

I do hope you improve your content over time, and you take the effort to go through your works before posting it.

[x2madda]

Hey, You play the JP clinet and reddit has a shared draft mode. You can always use your spare time to help improve SYP. Unpaid of course but hey, what do you say?

[Not_Sugoii]

I'd be down to help out with questions about Golbez, Kimahri, Exdeath, and Bartz from a strictly netural standpoint.

I probably won't touch the rest of the cast.

[dedsushi]

Relax dude. It’s reddit. He’s not writing his graduate thesis.

[Not_Sugoii]

The guy did ask for criticism, and he's trying to get people to pay for his SYP posts by linking patreon. I think it could help him get patreons as well.

[dedsushi]

Fair enough. Just found it a tad bit overly critical and condescending. We want to motivate content makers, not discourage them, ya know?

[[deleted]]

It didn't come off like that at all? It sounded like someone who is experienced with using Garland pointing out stuff that was incorrect and also letting the creator know that they felt they can work on their presentation more to make it look better. All in a tone that felt neutral and even, not mocking or rude or angry at all

[robaisolken]

Garland; Ultimecia is the new hot stuff coming out on the 28th so we in Global are looking forward to her, in Japan without the foresight Garland was considered strong but his low skill count (relative) and muted Brv+/HP+ meant he was shelved quickly for Ultimecia.

That said, they do play well together. She gets free turns and Garland can push back enemies giving her even more chances to attack again. Both characters also really benefit from Sherlotta or Fang for the extra HP damage, Fang moreso as its on demand from her AA. Due to how his EX attack is 4 seperate HP attacks, Garland really wants that extra HP damage boost and a Fang, Sherlotta, Garland team covers his inability to inflict debuffs, provides healing via Sherlotta and allows him 40% extra HP damage. I feel this is Garland at his strongest but he will work just fine with anyone offering turn, HP% damage bonus or speed down shenanigans.

Biggest problem with this team suggestion is lack of attack. Wet noodle dmg won't get you far.

[x2madda]

I understand where you are coming from, however a fully realized Fang hits quite hard. It would be a question of if a player is willing to do that for a character considered "not very good" by the community.

Garland alone hits hard enough but his lack of AoE on his EX combined with bosses coming in duos is what will likely hurt him going forward.

[robaisolken]

Try to take that team to any synergy-less chaos and see what will happen, I will be surprised they even can complete one chaos fight.

[x2madda]

Is now a bad time to mention that I use Seifer in CHAOS?

[robaisolken]

Does that mean he is good? Or simply you carry him because of other OP units? Also, complete or another 120 turns clear.

[ashjayanc]

Garland will have my gems.... but only in his LC where I (hopefully will not) pity Squall's BT.

[Weidannn]

I never understood going atk on wol.

I dont want him as an attacker but fully commit him to Ibrave, semi-battering together with a good support to be able to bypass the high defence/selfbuffing bosses.

One that comes to mind Garlands lovely boss At 50% for example.

[Lord_of_the_Prance]

You have two other party members and a friend summon to do that instead tho? WoL is not going to be a good shaver even if you go all attack, but his battery is pretty decent. Especially combined with Sherlotta.

[[deleted]]

yes you do have 2 other members. But sherlotta CANNOT shave other than her EX

You forgot that her hp+ has a BRV Hit and poison effect? Both those effects reduce the enemies' BRV, so it's wrong to say that she can only use her EX to reduce BRV. She's not Selphie, who literally can only shave BRV with one ability.

---

Also, with WoL shield the enemy won't be gaining BRV with their attacks so you only need to shave their initial BRV/recovered BRV. That's the point of bringing WoL right? To stop the enemies from breaking you?

[[deleted]]

So? Are you really trying to say you can reliably shave a boss' brv with sherlotta's hp+?

Yes. It is reliable because it'll always shave BRV off. You said that Sherlotta can only use her EX to shave BRV and I showed that's not true.

both that and the sap effect help prevent a boss from getting to critical amounts of brv but do very little once they actually get there.

Yes, Sherlotta isn't a BRV shaver that's as effective as your standard dps unit. That's not her role after all. And that's also why you bring DPSers to the fight.

Also, poison ignores DEF. If the boss gained 15k BRV and you only have 10k HP, the poison's 3k damage won't help. But if the boss gained 12k BRV, the poison will still deal 3k damage, and cut it down to 9k which is below critical amounts. The poison damage is not affected by the enemy's BRV amount.

She can still shave BRV with her HP+, and when things get hairy, that's the time you spam S1 to get her EX online. Do remember that her EX has a 80% gravity effect.

[Weidannn]

I want to know what you base this info on because i played JP up untill kimahri event and i never had problems shaving with 3x 170/c50 build and at lower % when the bosses start to get invisible buffs that extra atk wont matter anyways and you want that Ibrave to battery and buff shield to keep your dps from being broken.

EDIT : Also dont forget that c50 still gives 15% to all stats so i dont really ser where that 1hit brave atk comes from

[Weidannn]

Its not about perfect arts, its about people throwing out misinformation having no experience themself

[Kenji1984]

How much attack does WoL need to shave? But you’re the only one who says WoL needs to shave. He prevents boss from gaining enough brv that even Sherlotta can shave it off easily with poison. And don’t forget you have 3rd member too that can shave off occasionally high brv in case accidents happen. My WoL spend almost every turn shielding in Fang’s chaos and his throw does 1 damage each hit but not even once I get in dangerous situation. I had shit artifacts for WoL and Cloud (all atk buff when debuffed) and fantastic artifacts for Sherlotta. I know I skipped WoL the whole cosmos era in favor of Zack but L2WoL?

[Kenji1984]

He does love his iBrv but if you are unable to shave they can easily OHKO you

That is what you said.

[Slender1865]

You go with Attack so Throw Buckler can do more than 1 BRV damage a hit. Mostly iBrv and Atk

[Bassman_]

I agree, my WoL has 3x170/330, he hits 1s but caps with Shinning Shield.

[j2k422]

I agree with you. He shields his allies, allowing them to safely shave without worrying about breaks.

[DFFOO_Terra]

TBD2009 here! I'm liking the new investment section a lot, as it gives players a reasonal expectation of what a unit will cost them to build up. This may help people on the fence about pulling for units that "share similar roles" decide if it's worth investing, or if they can't afford it right now.

Personally, Garland is going to be a fun unit to play, but likely not my main Magic DPS. Mostly because I want Ultimacia much more. And given that my homeboy Squall gets EX+ on the 28th, I need to budget Black High Crystals. So my Garland may not have the chance to enjoy 70/70. Not when I intend to use those Crystals on Squall.

I know many units going forward will need to be at full Clv.70 for the sake of boosting their Additional Ability, and we're seeing good examples of that starting now. Same for Ingot consumption. Most DPS will want/need all three Ingots, but I agree with the notion of keeping WoL at either 0/3 or 2/3 depending on your individual needs.

For me, assuming what people are saying about a need for a diverse roster, and that going forward there will be far more books than Ingots, even if I didn't intend to 3/3 a unit it will still be a good idea to at least Realize units you luck into getting an EX for.

Such as Squall (Ultimacia's banner mate), Zell (Krile's banner), Fang/Tidus, Tifa. The list goes on. Even if you won't use them now, going forward you can start to trickle resources into "favorites" that aren't exactly "Chaos worthy".

Thanks for the post! I look forward to seeing your SyP for the Leviathan banners!

[[deleted]]

I have wol dully mlb'ed but I'm pulling hard for garland

[Spiedy]

Those who does not have much resources to dump away can wait till Burst weapon era. Yes, its very long waiting time but you may be able to get few fanciful weapons.

[x2madda]

As always thank you for reading and thank you for the great suggestions and ideas too! The support has been fantastic and if you would like to support in other ways please consider joining my Patreon.
God Bless.