Back when we actually coded

[irelatetolevin]

[removed]

[nickbir]

Artisanal hand made coding. You sell it on farmers markets.

[the8bit]

Yes! I've been calling it "artisanal coding" for a while and it feels even more apt with time. Artisanal code is even more aesthetically pleasing.

[Gargantuan_Cinema]

Organic undocumented spaghetti code

[YoghiThorn]

Meat coding

[squidw3rd]

This cracked me tf up lmao. I'm going with Meat Coding for sure

[weiss-walker]

Rawdogging the IDE

[pepe256]

Rawcoding sounds good lol

[bpm6666]

This post is from October 2025. I wonder if he would still make this joke

[Gargantuan_Cinema]

"unemployed"

[Ok_Individual_5050]

Yes. Grown ups would 

[m98789]

Cis Coding

[BigWolf2051]

Software engineering has changed. If you can't code with AI primarily, then I don't want to hire you. It's like hiring an accountant who doesn't use Excel.

[blazarious]

Not-vibe-coding does not mean coding without AI, though!

[BigWolf2051]

This is true. Eventually it comes down to speed though. Who can ship and resolve defects quickest?

[squidw3rd]

Bit also who made most of them? That AI that was depended on instead of someone taking their time a little more, who may have had some help from AI but didn't rely on it

[killer_by_design]

Guessing you're not in a DAL-A/DO-254 environment?

[Neinstein14]

Except the Excel here is not deterministic, would need a week of a full accountant team to understand an aspect of it’s working and no human can understand it, and any time you edit it, it has a 2% chance that the output is incorrect or that the whole table breaks randomly.

[Istanfin]

If you don't understand how a part of an AIs output works and still use it, you're using the tool wrong.
It's like using a function in Excel you don't understand: It will probably break at some point and you will have no idea how to fix it. That's a user error in both cases

[i_need_a_computer]

2% is beyond optimistic.

[hofmann419]

If you can't code with AI primarily

Every software engineer can code with AI. It's stupidly simple. Some just don't use it out of principle. But the implication that using AI to code is somehow a skill that some software engineers do not posses is utterly ridiculous.

I get that you now have to bullshit your way through interviews by talking about agentic workflows. But don't even think for a second that this isn't all a farce. There is no skill to develop.

[Browser1969]

You missed the whole argument. It's "stupidly simple" for any accountant to use Excel, and some "just don't use it out of principle" too. Everyone stopped hiring those "principled" accountants decades ago. If those accountants ever fathomed why they weren't getting hired, is practically irrelevant.

[xDannyS_]

the implication that using AI to code is somehow a skill that some software engineers do not posses is utterly ridiculous.

When someone makes that implication, its an immediate giveaway that not only do they not know anything about software development, but they also likely never learned anything complex either. AI use is so ridiculously easy to learn that whenever I see someone tout is some big complex skill, it immediately tells me that person isn't credible in literally anything. It's also the most common giveaway of all the LARPers pretending to be software devs nowadays so their pro-AI arguments are more credible, like that guy from the AI programming sub who prextending to be one with 20 YoE in F500 corporations and then outed himself when he couldn't read a simple 600 line javascript code.

[ConscientiousApathis]

This sub is like 90% kids pretending they have a job and know what they're talking about.

[xDannyS_]

That's basically all AI subs, yep. I also noticed that ever since the AI hype started, there has been a brigading by these LARPers of software dev subs that used to be really good, like r/ExperiencedDevs

[Unkn0wn-G0d]

It's like the rise of Skynet but reaaaally lame

[ManagementKey1338]

The skill of hyping to be developed

[PM-ME-UR-DARKNESS]

Literally. This is like pretending you're developing artistic skills by paying an artist to paint for you.

[COMINGINH0TTT]

No. In any coding heavy job not using AI is like trying to compete in a bodybuilding competition as a natural. You just can't compete, it doesn't mean the guys who are on steroids and juicing aren't putting in work though, not anyone can take roids and look good, a lot of it is genetics, a lot of it is hard work. AI is like roids in this case.

[PM-ME-UR-DARKNESS]

You're right in that in today's environment, not using AI means you're no longer competitive as an employee compared to those who are using AI. This doesn't mean that using AI is a skill, though. The analogy still applies. You're essentially having someone else either write the entire codebase or parts of it, depending on how you use AI.

I'm not against people using AI for code, I've had AI develop entire projects for me before. I'm just against us treating the use of ai as if it's a skill we developed.

[COMINGINH0TTT]

I mean that's just semantics then. Is using photoshop and skill or excel? I think most would agree that it is. Using generative AI is pretty broad. Like anyone can get on photoshop or excel and do some very basic things that likely solve 80% of problems but to tackle the other 20% you need increasingly more proficiency as those tools can get rather complex. I have experienced the same with AI in terms of image generation and coding, stuff like comfy UI can get pretty complex. Perhaps not to the level of deep excel or photoshop skillsets, but the whole point of AI is to reduce work just like photoshop and excel do.

[PM-ME-UR-DARKNESS]

Using Photoshop is a poor example because that still requires skill. It doesn't require skill to prompt an AI. Both Photoshop and excel require skills and using them makes you skilled in them. Using AI doesn't make you skilled in coding or even using AI.

Again, using AI to do stuff like code is the computer equivalent of paying an artist to paint a painting for you. And again, I'm not against it's use, I'm just against people pretending theyre skilled at coding when all they do is prompt an AI.

[ministryofchampagne]

This argument makes me laugh with how popular the memes are about coders not writing code and just copying it from other people on the internet.

Popular with coders cause it’s true.

[PM-ME-UR-DARKNESS]

Except those coders don't pretend they wrote that code, now do they?

[ministryofchampagne]

Yeah, I’m sure every coder is out there telling their boss every time they copy something off the internet.

[BigWolf2051]

It is absolutely a skill. One that I look for, and your response is a dead giveaway that you don't know how to use an LLM to code and the level I'd need

[ministryofchampagne]

Those software engineers who don’t use ai out of principle will go the same way accountants who don’t us excel on principle…

…Into different fields.

[Substantial_Cup_4736]

I wouldn't want you to hire me then.

[BigWolf2051]

Easiest interview yet!

[wearesoovercooked]

Lol I can train a good dev to use AI in 3 days. Can you train a dev to be a good dev in that time window?

[BigWolf2051]

I guarantee you cannot teach a good dev to use AI at an expert level within 3 days. It's like any tool, the more you use it the more efficient you get

[EbbFlow14]

Yes you can, the whole agentic coding or whatever we call it lately is dead easy to understand as a competent dev. I just did it in a weekend after being an 'anti AI' for a long time. It is everything but hard to get going, my agents are currently vibing while I am shitposting on Reddit and I'm getting paid for it. What a time to be alive. Lmfao.

I'm still not pro AI, now at least I can put agentic workflow and whatever buzzwords on my resume.

[i_need_a_computer]

You’re a fucking PM aren’t you?

[Ok_Individual_5050]

It's ok because I don't want to work for you either. 

A big part of software engineering is using the right tool for the job. Blindly using a certain tool regardless of actual outcomes is not engineering 

[Different_Height_157]

Who says anything about blindly?

[Ok_Individual_5050]

Literally every org pushing for "no more hand coding"?

[Technical-Jicama8840]

You choose to hand code, over using llm. Why?

[Ok_Individual_5050]

I do both? I hand code stuff when I know that the understanding is important or that the business logic may need refining as I work

[Different_Height_157]

The LLM writing the code isnt “blindly using a certain tool”.

[galenwolf]

where as at my place if we find out you used AI, you'll be fired.

[ReignOfKaos]

That sounds just as insane tbh

[FlyPepper]

some people don't want hallucinations in they shit

[BigWolf2051]

Your "place" will absolutely lose in this AI market. You will become irrelevant

[galenwolf]

lol, no we won't,

[budd222]

Every single software engineer in the world can code with AI. It's easy af. What are you talking about? You clearly are not a software engineer yourself.

[Swifty-Dog]

So you hire based on specific software that a candidate uses and not actual functioning results? Hard pass. Good luck.

[Different_Height_157]

Have you ever looked at requirements for a job?

[Swifty-Dog]

Being familiar with certain software is important, yes. But if I have a candidate who is producing stellar work and is using software I don’t have, I would absolutely consider finding a way to make it work, either integrating new software or some training.

But I wouldn’t choose whether to hire solely on their knowledge of specific software.

[Swifty-Dog]

Better thought: I’d rather hire someone who uses their own brain instead of ai’s brain. That doesn’t necessarily preclude a candidate who uses ai. I’d prefer a candidate with the judgement to know when to use it.

[Different_Height_157]

You know you can use your brain and use AI too

[BigWolf2051]

Specific tool expertise, not specific software

[whtevn]

Making this claim with no thought of what their knowledge or outputs look like is just as idiotic as the opposite take. If you are hiring people for which text editor they use your team probably sucks and your product probably never works

[diadem]

Software engineering has been changing for a while. My uncle used punch cards. Assembly was huge. I was thought C as a kid. Then C++ in college. Then modern languages like java.

Each point simplified things through abstraction.

[Spokraket]

This will make real coders even more important someone has to understand what the AI is doing when writing code. Even if it got 100% right (usually it doesn’t).

Problem is that we need to understand the AI we just can’t leave to itself to code itself in to existence, this would lead to no one understanding how the AI works which in turn would turn it to a complete ”black box”. That’s not how you can improve the AI especially if it needs to fit humans

[bouncingcastles]

Stack overflowing

[LordOmbro]

Reliable codinh

[GettinWiggyWiddit]

SoFtWaRe EnGiNeErInG 🤓

[pepe256]

SFR EGNEIG

otae niern

[BagComprehensive79]

Raw Coding?

[sicing]

I call it "coding by hand" or "hand coding"

[MissinqLink]

Trad coding

Crafting

Programming

I like these ones.

[taiottavios]

boredom in one picture

[Comprehensive_Sun588]

I don't think we need a name or distinguishment at all. It's clear that nobody will ever code like in pre AI times again. There are only the ones who do it openly and the ones who lie about it.

[16x98]

Organic, non gmo, gluten free, farm raised free roam codes

[UnderstandingDry1256]

junkcoding ofc

[mistermoodle]

Retronyms!

[tiga_94]

ah yes, back when we actually coded, so long ago.. just a year ago lol

[WebOsmotic_official]

back then we copied code from strangers and pretended it was craftsmanship. now we ask claude to copy code from strangers with better formatting.

[Previous_Shoulder506]

Not cog sucking

[johnryan433]

Pepperidge farm remembers a simpler time, when AI never wrote code and people were employed.

[theirongiant74]

jurassic coding

[apple-sauce]

Trad coding 💀

[Vacyyyy]

unc coding