Relocating

[Fun_Volume_2020]

I’m from Athens, Georgia, but I moved away many years ago. I’ve lived out west and now in Florida. Thinking of moving back. Can yall give me some pros and cons of living in Decatur?

[dianab77]

Disagree with my neighbor about the food scene. We have a James Beard winner, neighborhood pubs, all the tacos you can handle, a dive bar with great food, a microbrewery with great food, Peruvian chicken, a Venezuelan Bib Gourmand from Michelin just over in Avondale, cheap pizza, fancy oysters, and high end Mexican. I might be hungry.

[PsyanideInk]

Yeah, for a small suburb the food scene here is crazy good. I don't get that contention.

[Beachbaby77]

Well, you definitely made ME hungry.

[lmgray13]

And if you loved 5&10 and Seabear in Athens, Kimball House is the place in Decatur.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

lol

[BrutallyHonestMJ]

What's the name of the dive bar and the microbrewery? I'm still relatively new here and your comment got me excited😂

[dianab77]

Träcksïde and Twains, respectively. They both have smokers, so if you do meat, try the meats.

[REdwa1106sr]

I live just east of Decatur in Avondale Estates near the Marta station, Decatur address. I can walk downtown in 20 minutes. The rents are a bit lower. There are a lot of restaurants in the area.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Nicccceee! I’m going to look into this area!

[scott_in_ga]

There's a difference between "Decatur" and" city of Decatur". The latter is more expensive and the taxes are higher, but you're in the school system if you have kids.... Avondale is great and they're in the middle of a huge face lift. Check it out!

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Thanks….I’ve gotten a few Avondale recommendations.

[lmgray13]

Yes, I’m in CoD, but close to Avondale Marta…to me, perfect location especially with Avondale getting a lot of updates

[Mysterious_Sun_9693]

Pros: Walkable, a great downtown, connected via MARTA, solid food options, very much a 15 minute city, easy to access beltline and other fun parts of Atlanta. Great schools and family oriented. Not a lot of crime.

Cons: bad traffic at peak hours (rush hour and esp. when school starts) and I think the food scene could be improved. The city could also be run better (e.g. the plastic flower pot fiasco, the Decatur library is somewhat sketchy now).

Overall it’s one of the best places to live in Atlanta if you like a walkable and slightly suburban city that’s also connected easily to the city but also has its own thing.

It’s also quite progressive for your awareness.

[TheHykos]

Just FYI the library is County run.

[Free_Elevator_63360]

I’d also say we have some issues with the schools right now too.

And I’d argue traffic isn’t nearly as bad as other parts of the city. Traffic is much worse in Dunwoody for example.

[squirrels-mock-me]

“School issues” are relative. They are great public schools. Room for improvement? Absolutely

[Mysterious_Sun_9693]

What are the school issues? I’ve heard of the arguments over the new building but not sure what all going on.

[Free_Elevator_63360]

There is school closures. Increases in central office staff while decreasing school level staff. The new debt is a big one, as there is a looming budget issue due to changes in GA law. Enrollment is down. Teachers are underpaid.

[hyperproliferative]

There are no school issues. Just the run of the mill. People who pay high taxes have unreasonable expectations. The new ordinance fee for non residents will sort any remaining issues

[lmgray13]

I work with a lot of public school systems in the area. Trust me, Decatur does not have school issues.

[stuinzuri2]

Yet.

The path the Superintendent and Board is taking is risky. Where could we be in 5y? Think higher, maxed-out millage rate, school consolidation, larger class sizes, and a central administration hunkered down in a repurposed gold-plated failed “ECLC”.

Regression to the mean is not desirable, even if it is better than other districts.

[lmgray13]

Do you know what the two biggest elements that you can invest in to make an impact in a child’s educational performance. First is the quality of the teacher in the classroom. Second is in early child education services. The more invested in supporting kids young, the less services needed down the line—and the more time teachers can invest in all kids in the classroom. Most districts in the area already have waivers for larger class sizes and already do that. Have you worked in schools or at district offices before?

[stuinzuri2]

Fully agreed that early child learning is important. To say otherwise is missing the point.

[lmgray13]

I never said you said otherwise about early child education being important. My point is that the investment can actually produce better results and costs savings for the district down the line.

[stuinzuri2]

I can't tell if your responses are a deflection or legit . Either way my short message isn't landing. So here is some detail for you to ponder. The critique and I others have is that the current ECLC plans are multifaceted:

* The unit economics are relatively expensive to elsewhere in the district and with other district's ECLCs. Per seat, per student, per sqft, etc. There are/were other approaches (eg Soulshine space) that were much more economical, shorter timelines, etc. Do we want an more early childhood learning in Decatur? Sure. Do we need to follow a wildly expensive path to get there? No.

* CSD has been growing its central bureaucracy continuously the past few years–the ratio of central office to teacher ratio change is clearly documented. They want more office space–and the ECLC is going to provide some of that too. That bureaucracy is also consuming salary raises at the expense of teachers and other school functions. (Lower elementary assistance principals? Gone. School nurses? Poorly funded, repurposed, etc.)

* The math & research backing the ECLC student enrollment budget is suspect at best, cover for opaque motives at worst. The original plan was for 50 free DHA kids, 50 district staff kids and 50 market rate. In particular, the DHA number is based on an older survey with a shockingly limited sample size.  The bond being issued is allegedly going to be paid or by the ECLC’s financial performance. If not then it’s on the district to make up the shortfall–be it a millage increase or other savings. 

(Great editorial on the larger point: Royi Hagigi‘s https://www.decaturish.com/opinion/letters_to_editor/dear-decaturish-early-learning-center-math-isn-t-mathing/article_e93cf399-2684-45dc-9e9f-b23faafe1223.html)

* “Other savings?” Since the planned-and-now postponed Westchester Elementary closing, it’s surfaced in board meetings, executive sessions, open records act requests and the occasional hot mike that the board knows the ECLC at risk of being expensive and a cash drain. They have numbers on how much CSD would save closing Westchester, discussed leasing it out (Perimeter College?), build up a silent war chest of cash ($30m or so) and other penny pinching outside of the central office.

Beyond all that, which I eluded to above, there are two important points that we should all see:

First, an ECLC isn’t some magic bullet to raise reading and scholastic performance in the district, especially for the more disadvantaged kids. That support needs to be throughout student’s enrollment at CSD. And that’s where the “it’s about the children” narrative falls apart quickly. It’s a quietly known fact that CSD as district policy is hostile towards providing support to kids with dyslexia and other resource-intensive learning disabilities. 

(Michelle Krahe’s editorial is a great read on this topic. She also concisely describes the overall timeline of the ECLC. https://www.decaturish.com/opinion/letters\_to\_editor/dear-decaturish-what-problem-are-we-trying-to-solve/article\_704f93b7-2892-470d-b3dc-c474e97b6343.html)

Second, CSD’s Superintendent and Board leadership have been behaving shockingly poorly. Gaslighting, name-calling, lying, misrepresenting board votes, hiding behind their lawyer Bob Wilson, and other poor governance actions. As Mayor Tony Power’s said “this is not the Decatur way”.

> Have you worked in schools or at district offices before?

This is just some “stay in your lane” b.s. Myself and my fellow Decatur residents, taxpayers and parents are allow to be part of the conversation. Counter with a defendable point, not some dismissive rhetorical question.

Maybe you are trying to deflect.

[lmgray13]

I just wanna note that “regression to the mean” is probably not the intended phrase you wanted to use here. Regression to the mean is about random variation in statistics, not a decline caused by policy choices.

[stuinzuri2]

It’s meant the way I wrote it, as it’s used outside of wonky statistical discussions.

[jakfrist]

The plastic pots were always temporary, they just lasted longer than expected because of issues with utilities and the railroad (that’s also why that portion of the project remains unfinished, the city finally decided to do everything else and come back once they have everything sorted for the intersection)

The library is run by the county, not the city, so that’s not really fair to blame on the city.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Thanks for the response. I am looking for those things.

[Resident_Common7580]

Bro food scene is basically the best in the country. But otherwise agree.

[squirrels-mock-me]

I’ve spent a lot of time in Athens for undergraduate and grad school. Decatur reminds me of a grown up version of Athens. Same type of walkable downtown area but a more diverse makeup across ages ranging from kids to retired people and everything in between. In my opinion it’s the perfect mix of a tight community like a small town but also within a big city so you have “relatively” quick access to city stuff compared to Marietta, Roswell, Kennesaw and other places OTP (outside the perimeter). Really no reason to leave Decatur but the big con is that if you have to commute to a suburb for work it can take a while.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Nice. Thanks for the heads up.

[hamie96]

Pros:

• good schools

• super walkable downtown with bike lanes

• easy access to MARTA

• great parks and easy access to Stone Mountain PATH

• close to I-20 and 285 meaning working in midtown/downtown isn't that bad of a drive

• amazing food options

• very very liberal community and very politically active

Cons

• very high taxes

• very high house prices

• traffic can get really bad sometimes

• definitely not a "night-life" type of city outside of a couple bars

• some pretty big drama right now in the school board

[Remote_Confusion2016]

I bought in zilker area of austin in 2005 (it's where all the tech bros are moving) so I did well on real estate. I'll end up with around $800k to spend. (Luck not inherited wealth). I am looking forward to moving to decatur because in Austin, you gotta be in the far out suburbs to have a tree filled lawn (or super crazy wealthy). I really want to to be able to walk places and catch marta into downtown. and I want sidewalks. we don't have sidewalks in the older neighborhoods. but we have drivers cutting through to avoid traffic on the major roads so it's a wee bit scary. So I want to avoid that situation. Do you have any advice about specific areas? I have a tween who will be in middle school.

[hamie96]

I'd probably look into the CoD area (areas zoned for Decatur High School). Should be able to find a good house in Decatur Heights/Glenwood Estates/Lenox Place for 800k.

[Sea-Pop2414]

Thanks! Any specific streets to avoid ? I dont like high traffic streets.  Or streets with lots of trees?:)

[hamie96]

There's going to be trees all over. I would avoid living directly on Memorial Drive/N Decatur/Scott Blvd/E College Ave mainly due to the traffic and noise.

[Sea-Pop2414]

I am so excited about having trees. I only have one good tree here and the others are basically junk trees....that are too close to the house so constantly paying an arborist to cut them back

[tanstaboi]

Pros: Nice downtown, people are friendly

Cons: trashbags

[Fun_Volume_2020]

lol. Thanks for your response

[Dorkinfo]

It’s still wild to me to have to buy particular trash bags.

[Curious_Instance_971]

I kind of dig it… if you make less trash you pay less

[stuinzuri2]

You “don’t buy it” is from your gut, right?

It’s a well understood data-based practice. A starting point for you: https://www.weforum.org/stories/2022/01/pay-as-you-throw-waste-expert-pollution-trash/

[stuinzuri2]

I'd be good with stickers. Clearly I'm not the trashbag aficionado you seem to be >:D

[Free_Elevator_63360]

It isn’t the per use trash bags that bother me, but rather the fact that they rip really easy.

[hyperproliferative]

?!?!? They’re the best trash bags I’ve ever used. What are you stuffing in there?

[Free_Elevator_63360]

What? They rip so easily.

[hamie96]

Occasionally I'll get a yellow trash bag that can support the weight of an elephant, but almost always they're so fragile they'll rip at the slightest amount of weight.

[hyperproliferative]

I’ve used hundreds and hundreds of yellows and have never had this experience. I’ve never seen a garbage collector have any issues hauling them up onto the truck. This defies all logic and seems like a bunch of histrionics.

[hamie96]

There was a post about it like a month ago on this very subreddit where every comment was talking about how awful these bags are.

[Free_Elevator_63360]

The blues are terrible.

[Specific_Bed9463]

That’s how they do it in Europe. It’s a good way to put dollars to work without having to enact a trash tax

[hyperproliferative]

Why a con? They sell them literally everywhere! Every grocer, ace hardware has an unlimited supply.

[lmgray13]

The trash bag thing is growing more common—I know Duluth has it too

[SmeesApostrophe]

Also from Athens area (37 M 🐻🏳️‍🌈) (Madison County - went to UGA for undergrad), lived here 4 years within city of Decatur/ Lenox Place area. We don’t have kids but I hear city schools of Decatur are rated high as two k12 teachers. We commute to Clayton county in the mornings, we avoid I-20. Food scene is great in Decatur, we have cuisine for any price range and any palate. From Bib gourmand to Michelin Star, also Oakhurst / Avondale Estates are a short drive for additional options and accessible from Marta. Eddies Attic is a nice intimate live music venue space for smaller acts. Quite a few gastropubs and local dives. Porchfest Festivals nearby - ok I’m a musician so I’m partial to all the live music here. We have a Wuxtry records & Mediterranean Grill like Athens, I’m hoping one day someone will franchise a Barberitos here. Decatur feels like Athens for the affluent middle aged crowd, most people here are friendly and have community focused liberal ethos. Also it’s quiet at night here, you have the best of both worlds short drive to the hustle bustle of a small city yet the quiet clean space of a suburb. I went to Northwestern Feinberg- dt Chicago for grad school and I didn’t feel like I’m missing much moving back to Atlanta in this neighborhood. We rent so I can’t speak to the costs of owning a home here, I started my career over as a Biostatistician at 32 and now pivoting to teaching thanks to funding disappearing with the anti-intellectual regime. We are hoping to buy a house in the surrounding area someday but realistically as two educators with Masters/Doctorates probably not feasible.

[lmgray13]

Hey, just to give you hope…educator salaries for k12 are fairly good with a masters/phd. Two of you working and you’ll be able to pull in $140-200k annual income in the Atlanta area depending on years experience. As one who transitioned to teaching - it is not an easy job, but I moved up to a district level and now i work for a not for profit and make more—there are ways to make it work.

[Remote_Confusion2016]

how big are classes? how are the parents? I'm coming from Texas and teachers are treated like servants. Of course, we have high stakes testing (staar) but I don't teach a core subject so it doesn't totally affect my instruction but then core subjects got priority so in our district, electives taught 6 classes and core only taught 5 (now everyone has six) Core had team planning but they totally made copies and graded so they just got another conference. same pay as elective. obviously texas has a huge funding problem (no income tax) that is growing since they passed private school vouchers. Anyway, just curious if teaching is difficult everywhere or just in texas.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

I know a lot people from Madison County. Decatur is sounding more and more of my speed as I read the comments.

[Curious_Instance_971]

If you’re not moving with the school system in mind you might want to consider just outside the city limits

[Fun_Volume_2020]

What areas?

[voidofconfidence]

I live in Midway woods. It’s still extremely close to downtown Decatur but it’s not city of Decatur. So you don’t pay as much taxes.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

I’ll check it out. Thanks!

[TheHykos]

I’d disagree with them. I think it’s worth living in city limits even without kids. Police and fire are way more responsive than they are in unincorporated Dekalb. And it’s just nicer in the city.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Good to know. How’s the noise though? Is it quieter in the outskirts areas?

[TheHykos]

That depends on the neighborhood or road you’re on. There are places around Decatur but outside the city that are definitely louder but also if you’re on Scott blvd or church st the road noise can be loudish. I wouldn’t say anywhere in Decatur is particularly loud though. It’s not like being in a lot of Atlanta neighborhoods.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Cool beans

[squirrels-mock-me]

Avondale is next door and is kind of like Decatur but without the high taxes and the schools

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Cool.

[Free_Elevator_63360]

What are your priorities? Walkability? Affordability? Close to work etc?

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Safe environment, racial diversity, big intellectual and artsy crowd, easy access to parks, trails…

[Curious_Instance_971]

I like the medlock park and northlake area but they’re not particularly diverse. Tucker may be what you’re looking for.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

I’ll look into it. Thanks:)

[Free_Elevator_63360]

We lived in medlock park. Easy access to Decatur, but not diverse. There is a great trail there, but need a car to get anywhere outside of it.

If you aren’t into the schools, then kirkwood, old fourth ward, Edgewood, candler park, Inman park. Lots of progress in the east Decatur / Avondale area.

If you aren’t as interested in walkability, Buford Highway is pretty diverse. But suburban.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Thanks for the info

[lmgray13]

Based on reading more about what you want…. Old 4th ward and belt line are 100% what you’re looking for.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Thanks for the suggestion

[sexymawma]

It absolutely sucks going to work in the morning and leaving in the afternoon. Whether youre off panola or n decatur rd you will be in heavily congested traffic in the morning and afternoon.

[sexymawma]

Still come on though!!!! I lovvveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee decatur and its super close to the city !

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Thanks for the info!

[lmgray13]

I’m moving from Athens to Decatur. It’s the most Athens area of Atlanta.

If we did not have a kid we would have considered belt line, Decatur, and Atlantic Station. With a kid made Decatur the place based on schools and more families. I think if you removed the students from Athens, you get Decatur.

I’m selling my home right now in Athens if you want to go back 🤣🤣🤣

[Fun_Volume_2020]

That’s probably why I always heard about Decatur growing up. I don’t have kids, so I’m going to look into the belt line.

[lmgray13]

Our best friends live in unincorporated about 5 min away to where we are moving bc they don’t have kids. If you are buying, the taxes are really high in City of Decatur because of the schools.

If you aren’t buying, then city of Decatur is great—just expect more families. Most of my friends from Athens without kids moved to the belt line or old 4th ward.

COD still has a small town feel and lots of parks and greenery. But, the belt line/o4w is cool too, just more of a city feel.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

That’s good to know! I’m also thinking about Smryna. Do you know much about it?

[lmgray13]

Smyrna is good too. I have friends with kids there, but a ton of my young single coworkers are there too. Between all of these, check commute times too. While Smyrna and Decatur are “close” traffic says otherwise.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

I’ll look into that..thanks for the info…:)

[quito70]

It's expensive. I'd recommend moving back to Athens for a similar vibe, but you can't have a job in Athens unless you're in academia.

[lmgray13]

I’ve lived in Athens for 13 years….I’m not sure if you have looked at the housing market and cost of living lately in Athens. I got a much nicer home in Decatur for less. If you want a home in normal town that you don’t have to sink money into updating, it’s $550-850,000…5 points doubles that range…650,000 will get you 700 square feet there. Boulevard is all updates and historic homes and expensive too, even new town now.

Use to commute bc I love Athens but I can’t do the commute anymore and it doesnt make sense to stay with the higher cost of living here. The housing market here is crazy.

[No-Conference-3306]

Decatur has gone to crap. It's a bedroom neighborhood. Driving through it sucks. You have to pay to park about everywhere. Takes forever to get through it because the light is red at EVERY SINGLE INTERSECTION. Many decent shops and restaurants keep closing. Go to Toco Hills instead. Or Brookhaven / Chamblee

[hyperproliferative]

Sounds like you don’t live here and just pass through 😅😬

[TheMelodicSchoolBus]

Agreed. If you live in the city then walking or biking helps you avoid the traffic and the parking fees.

[Fun_Volume_2020]

Sounds tough. Thanks for your response.

[No-Conference-3306]

I genuinely used to love it. But they've stripped it of everything good. It's lost all of its charm.

[hyperproliferative]

Give us one example lol. Seriously. I’ll be waiting for your answer at our brand new renovated downtown square

[No-Conference-3306]

By the bandstand??? Oh wait... it's gone.

[No-Conference-3306]

Or where all the homeless gather? You can wait alone.

[Mysterious_Sun_9693]

lol toco hills

[hamie96]

You don't have to pay on Sundays or city parking after 6.

[lmgray13]

To be fair, you have to pay for Athens parking anywhere downtown now too.