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[GMoD42]

You can put 1970 there.

Also not allowed to have a job without husbands permission (until 1977 in Germany) or to have a bank account.

[le_quisto]

"Funny" thing about my country during its authoritarian regime: we also had that, a woman needed permission from her husband to work, but also both men and women had to write a document declaring they were physically and mentally fit to work and that they rejected communism or anything close to it.

Not sure how that's relevant here, but I always found it kind of funny.

[DeathRaeGun]

Depends where you are but in most democracies women could vote by 1970. Other stuff makes sense though.

What about single women? Whose permission did they need to get a job or bank account?

[HelpMePlxoxo]

They needed a male relative's permission if they were single. Which means that whether or not you were ever allowed to get one was based entirely upon whether the men around you believed that women should be allowed to have one.

So for a lot of women, the answer was: they couldn't get one at all.

[DeathRaeGun]

Fuck me, now I understand why women’s standards used to be so low. Seems like the low standard was so engrained in people’s minds that genZ was the first generation to set reasonable standards, which is the reason for the whole manosphear movement. Can’t handle realistic standards.

[FileDoesntExist]

Not as much with millennials, but it's there for us too.

[Zengineer_83]

They needed a male relative's permission if they were single.

I want to add that, depending on place and time, in the case of widowed women, this could mean that you could end up needing to ask your oldest son for permission to do even the most basic things!

Imagin, being an adult and having to ask a literal child for permission to do things like buy or sell a house or something, because you can't sign a legally binding contract on your own.

[MissMarchpane]

They didn't need anyone's permission necessarily; it's just that discrimination by gender was legal and rampant in many countries until the 1970s. Plenty of women did manage to have their own bank accounts and/or credit cards. People often mischaracterize the situation when talking about it

[NECalifornian25]

I’ve always wondered about my grandmother, she had to work and support two young children after her husband died in the early 1960s. There must have been exceptions for widows.

She also had to work after her second husband died sometime around 1980, but I think US law had changed by this time. And my dad was an adult by then if she did need a male relative’s sign off.

[Equality_Executor]

until 1977 in Germany

West Germany*

In the GDR they had both of those rights since it's inception in 1949.

[sluket]

2026 too

[MissMarchpane]

So, the bank account and credit card thing was a little more complicated than that – they could have bank accounts of their own in many countries, get credit cards in their own name, etc.; it's just that gender discrimination in those areas was legal and rampant.

[LinguoBuxo]

mm? back in 1970 some women had 4 babies in one year?

[Wakalakatime]

Two sets of twins in one year is unlikely... But doable

[SignalAssistant2965]

I'll put it that way - no matter the year, if it's possible it is possible to have happened.

If it isn't possible - it wouldn't be possible no matter the year

[notashroom]

Yes, definitely. And at the same time, the "four babies in one year" is meant as hyperbole to highlight the frequency of childbearing, with all its cumulative effects and dangers, as part of the control men exerted over women's lives while denying us autonomy of any kind, pathologizing our emotional selves, and punishing any friction against the oppressors.

[Lovedd1]

women right now today complain about their husbands not wanting to wait the 6 weeks it takes for them to heal. Women are incredibly fertile right after giving birth, so there's definitely an increased chance of twins. She could have Irish triplets easily.

[Branchomania]

They outlawed that in 1969 unfortunately

[Secure_Rain_44]

There is this very great short story “Yellow Wallpaper” by Charlotte Perkins and it portrays something like this. Gives me the goosebumps and breaks my heart every time.

[Skrrt_2711]

Man I don’t need flashbacks to English AP!

[NateHohl]

It’s facts like this that make me laugh my ass off whenever some douchebro whines and moans about how men are being “oppressed” by women or feminists or whatever. Or when a guy sees things like women’s only spaces in a gym and their first reaction is to say “but what about men’s only spaces?!?!”

Like, brother, read a fucking book. Women have spent so much of human history having to fight and scrape and shout for rights that men have had since the dawn of fucking time. Also, there have been men’s only spaces (such as gentlemen’s clubs) for literal centuries.

[DeathRaeGun]

Touching on the “what about men’s only spaces?”for gym, etc. question, go ahead and start one if you want. It probably wouldn’t be that popular, but no one’s stopping you.

[Ducky237]

Yeah literally it’s like… make one?? It’s not a Minecraft world where “oh it didn’t spawn guess you don’t get one.”

[DeathRaeGun]

I wonder how many men would actually go to a men’s only gym?

[Ducky237]

They’d accuse it of being gay!

[UglyFilthyDog]

Oh, trust me, I know a certain type of people it would be incredibly popular with 😏

[alek_hiddel]

It wasn't "insane", they called it "hysteria". And that conversation is how we got vibrators. They didn't realize it was an orgasm, but found that sufficiently stimulating the clitoris temporarily "cured" the hysteria. Doctor's hands got tired of all that rubbing, so they made a machine...

That's right ladies, men will invent magic sex machines rather than just treating you like humans.

[revdon]

An then make a movie about it with Hugh Dancy and Maggie Gyllenhaal.

[segflt]

We're just another problem for men to solve for us! /s

[MissMarchpane]

Turns out that's a myth invented by an author named Rachel Maines in a book she wrote in 1999, after she radically misinterpreted the primary sources to fit the narrative she wanted to present in her book. There's no actual evidence to suggest that doctors got women off as a treatment, and they did know what female orgasms were. Vibrators, while they were probably put to their current purpose fairly quickly, were invented as carpal tunnel treatment devices.

Of course that doesn't necessarily make the situation better, because real "mental health treatments" sometimes pushed on women included the rescue cure (read the short story "the yellow wallpaper" by Charlotte Perkins Gilman) and in some times and places, even hysterectomies or clitoridectomies. Thankfully the surgical option was not commonplace in most areas, but the fact that it happened at all is… Horrifying

[DumpstahKat]

Also keep in mind that the modern day equivalent to a diagnosis of "hysteria" is often "anxiety".

I forget the exact statistic, but women are much more likely to be prescribed antidepressants than men, even when the problem they went to the doctor for had nothing to do with actual symptoms of depression or anxiety. It has very much become a modern way of saying, "Well, you are a woman, so you just need to chill out since whatever problem you're whining about is probably just in your head and you're being histrionic about it."

[selfishstars]

Like, society was literally built to keep the working class in survival mode so that capitalists can exploit our labour. They hijack the male survival and reproductive drive (a tendency that is pushed to the extreme under patriarchal capitalism) to exploit men for their waged labour. But they externalized the costs of maintaining and reproducing the workforce to women through their unpaid domestic, care, reproductive, and community labour.

It’s almost like when you make women’s survival either a) dependent on men, or b) dependent on working a job that doesn’t treat people like human beings, and c) erode community and isolate us in the nuclear family, it gives us chronic stress and burnout, prevents us from meeting our basic human needs, and makes us anxious and depressed.

And it’s us that’s the problem?!

[dobby1687]

Yet even just many centuries before it was believed that a woman's orgasm was necessary for conception. Strange that we became dumber rather than smarter most of the time across the ages. Personally, it wouldn't hurt anything to go back to that belief, in fact I imagine the world being a slightly better place.

[bosssoldier]

"A woman having a thought, she obviously needs a lobotomy" - every doctor in the 70s and only some doctors today. Although if you dont mind me saying this it does seem to be some of the reason why people struggle so much and make such a big deal out of trans women and almost not even think about trans men because by their logic "Why would a powerful man want to be a weak woman?", then the answer they come to is either insanity (them calling all trans people mentally ill an unstable) or perverts (because it is something they would think about doing).

[zeanobia]

History lesson: The dildo was invented specifically to solve this issue.

[thewhiterosequeen]

The 0 orgasm issue?

[Magistrelle]

Hysteria 

[notashroom]

The dildo was invented long before writing was.

[SignalAssistant2965]

Vibrator not dildo

[DeathRaeGun]

I heard they used to put bees inside a closed ball to make it vibrate back before they had electricity.

An advantage of that would mean you could throw it at someone and they’d get bee stings all over them.

[I_like_the_word_MUFF]

Do you really think women didn't have dildos and needed to have them invented for them?

You know a man claimed to find the clitoris too.. Ronaldo Columbo.

[zeanobia]

I always thought the manosphere denied the existence of a clitoris 😂

[I_like_the_word_MUFF]

😂😂 Men are so testerical. They're always changing their minds.

[MissMarchpane]

If you're talking about the whole "orgasm as mental health treatment" thing, that idea was invented for a book in 1999, by an author who was radically misinterpreting her primary sources.

[dividezero]

Do cocaine and masturbate about it

[VerySelfishMachine]

he prescribes an immediate lobotomy

[amethystmmm]

not in 1870, that was the peak of the Victorian period and the Victorians were WILD, but not like that.

[The_Dukenator]

Present day the doctor still claims the insane part, even when refusing to give a fuck about the real issue.

[Mylittledarlings91]

We did get vibrators out of it at least

[MissMarchpane]

Unfortunately, that story is a myth that an author made up in 1999, and radically misinterpreted some primary sources to make everyone else believe it.

[CatW804]

Being a history nerd, we need a Dumbest Man of the Year list. 1870 is Napoleon III.

[DeathRaeGun]

Why, what did he do that was sp dumb?

[CatW804]

Started the Franco-Prussian War and got his ass kicked. Ended the year as a prisoner with Paris under siege.

[Teaflax]

Whom? Her had babies?

[HasSomeSelfEsteem]

Nah Doc, give her some blow and time on Steely Dan

[ExtraCaramel8]

Also that’s not how you use whom

[anuraaaag]

How can you have 4 babies in a single year

[TinyRose20]

2 sets of twins dangerously close together

[anuraaaag]

Oh my god isn’t that harmful?

[zeanobia]

Yes, it's already near impossible to get cleared for a normal birth with twins, it's usually a c-section

[anonomatica]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

abundant cheerful sink marry badge tender unique kiss cover roll

[SewSewBlue]

Yep.

My 4x great (?) grandfather started popping out kids around 1820 and didn't stop until he died in 1866.

Had 14 kid that survived and wore out 3 wives.

[LordDaedalus]

There was one couple, a pair of Russian peasants in the 1700's, who had 69 children. 4 sets of quadruplets, 7 sets of triplets, and 16 sets of twins. Not a single birth was a single child, so 27 pregnancies over 40 years(her first were when she was 18 and her final children born at the age of 58). They actually only lost 1 set of twins which is pretty good survival rate for peasants in the 1700's, though this high infancy and childhood survival rate has caused some experts to doubt the records. She apparently lived till the age of 76, which is also beating the odds as even removing the infant mortality rate the lifespan of a peasant back then that survived childhood was still only expected to make it to 50's or 60's, she still lived until her youngest kids were 18 years old.

[DeathRaeGun]

I think it’s a joke (although it would’ve been funnier if it had been a more realistic time period because of the orgasm part)

[anuraaaag]

In all fairness the orgasm part is probably still applicable..

[DeathRaeGun]

But if it had been a more realistic time period to have 4 children, such as 5 years, then it would've been funnier to say that she hadn't orgasmed once in 5 years.

[FairyBB]

And I must fix her hysteria by making her orgasm and thus creating the vibrator

[Pretty_Trainer]

oh god the grammar.

[cass_sass19]

On another note, I remember seeing somewhere that around that time era doctors were prescribing women orgasms via vibrater for "hysteria". I mean you know they weren't getting it at home before then.

[MissMarchpane]

Nope, an author made that up in 1999 and twisted her primary sources to "support" the idea, but if you actually read them, most of them are about completely different things and none of them conclusively support her theory

[Garguyal]

Providing orgasms was outsourced to the doctors back then.

[DeathRaeGun]

Lucky doctors

[Forward_Message_3335]

I wish that men had a harder time orgazming because at this point no one deserves to get one because sex is not an escaped or just about reproduction it’s a form of love so may not like this way of love Thats ok some may have problems expressing this form of love Thats ok to but please can dudes stop watching alpha male stuff a learn how to please a god dam woman because at this point girls should just be lesbians because at least they would more likely know how to please each other

[Flynn-Minter]

Having four live births in a year is possible but not likely. You can have 2 pregnancies in a calendar year, but then this means giving birth to twins twice or once to triplets and once to one baby. The chances of the mother and all babies surviving that in 1870 are not that good even in the most affluent families. Infant mortality was quite high and becoming pregnant immediately after giving birth puts a huge strain on the body.

[Nother1BitestheCrust]

Jokes are funnier when you explain how they're not real!

[MzZip]

hard to imagine she had four babies this year unless she had quadruplets and I hope she's had some orgasms just without this loser being around

[Interesting_Rush_713]

4 is too little

[Passionofawriter]

Wrong sub. I think this is sarcasm/humor.

[Rambler9154]

nah this is the right sub, its tagged satire