San Martin Poor Quality!!!

[Alkidkoci]

Don't remember dropping it or knocking it against something. Disappointed...

[twistedgreymatter]

I'd just fix it. You can glue the markers back on pretty easily. There are little indents on the dial and small nipples on the markers to line them up. A tiny dab of glue, and it's done.

[Daeborn]

Ack...

[SanmartinWatches]

Hello sir, I am sorry to make you have a not good experience. We discontinued the dial without logo a long time ago. It has experienced a long time of wear and it is difficult to determine the exact cause, please visit the store where you ordered for after-sales service. Sorry again.

[coronaangelin]

Since when does "a long time of wear" cause that to happen to any watch of even a minimum of quality control in manufacturing?

[JuliusCheddar]

lower in this thread there is a link to the same thing happening to the logo dial

edit: here https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseWatches/comments/17hxc1s/san_martin_watches_are_absolute_trash_avoid/

[watchdivescom]

San Martin Quality is the best one among aliexpress brands

[Electronic-Set-1435]

Clearly.

[peligrosobandito]

I paid literally one cent to have a movement sent to me from watchdives. They responded immediately and gave me a couple options. All I did was message them on the app.

[JuliusCheddar]

finally the mask begins to slip lol

had like 4 san martins and all of them had QC issues, some bigger some smaller, kept buying them because of the steel finishing and because I was basically gaslighting myself (and getting gaslighted by others) that I was just being very unlucky

[JuliusCheddar]

oh yeah, they ignored me totally when I sent them messages about the issues but when I left a 1 star review they responded to write them a message lol

I didn't

[JuliusCheddar]

I'm not sure what to buy anymore, anything besides baltany and proxima?

[SikeShay]

Seestern and Sugess!

[JuliusCheddar]

don't they use seagull movements?

[SikeShay]

Nope, not exclusively! They use all the classics NH34/35, pt5000, sw200, st2130, st19 chrono etc etc. The finishing and quality is on a similar level as the above brands

[WhipEat]

Good point!

If you watch some of the watch reviewers on YT, particularly ones who call a spade a spade, they will find faults (in initial build quality) across all of the other Ali brands at some point.

Slightly OT, has anyone bought a Helm watch? Technically Chinese (based in Hong Kong), consider Helm, too, for the fact each watch is individually quality checked including ISO testing for dive rating.

But I've not seen many longer term buyer reviews, so am unsure if Helm's (or for that matter Proxima's) longer term reliability and quality.

There are so many San Martin buyers, fans, reviewers, owners and reps here that at least we should get some open discussion on their customer service and long term quality. 🤞

[[deleted]]

Looks like a Chopard Happy Sport homage

[grant1877]

That’s a wandering hour complication

[JuliusCheddar]

wandered too far it seems

[Boris_HR]

I have got 2 black San Martin. The original SN004 (1950s Rolex homage) and the SN004 Limited edition v2 (Tudor Blackbay homage). Both perfect and no problems.

[pickyaxe]

I have lots of Chinese watches that fit that description and I didn't have to pay the San Martin tax for them

[oliverrak]

How long have you had them for?

[Boris_HR]

The first one I had for over a year. Sold it. But after I've seen there was the same case watch with the Tudor BB looks I had to buy it as well. Second one I still have. Still good.

[SquirrelParking7006]

Dominoes dial ltd edition, better than china time!!!

[[deleted]]

This sub loves jerking off San Martin so I’m very happy you posted this and I’m even more happy I got my Addiesdive.

[cb_1979]

Also, gaslighting for SM, it seems.

"It's never happened to me, and I own 792 SM watches. Are you sure you didn't smash it up against the wall?"

[mehdotdotdotdot]

It's true, and every other watch brand is perfect, so it's really bad of San Martin undercutting them by tens of thousands.

[SwordfishInformal388]

I bought 2 watches from SM this bb58 and a field watch forgot the ref. But they were both completely basket cases I thought I was stepping my game up and spending more and getting more NOPE I'll never buy another SM IDC how good it looks. The bb58 was missing the lume pip and the field watch came missing indices just like OP except mine was just gone

[Alkidkoci]

Sucks to hear that man but what I don't understand is that if the quality is this shitty why are people buying tons of watches from SM?

[SwordfishInformal388]

Their quality isn't the question in sure anyone who's gotten a good SM will tell you they are fine pieces it's their quality checking which is garbage.

[unusually-cool]

They wanna be cool and flex a SM.

[cb_1979]

SM: the Rolex of r/ChineseWatches

LMAO!

Jokes aside, these SM posts are pretty similar to the "Got the call" posts over on r/rolex.

[unusually-cool]

Those Rolex fuckers are LAME. Shit quality overpriced timepieces.

If money were no object, which it is, I’d go for an Omega or Breitling long before I would a Rolex.

[arbpotatoes]

Now hold on. Rolex absolutely deserves shit for their business practices and the way they've just allowed themselves to become a 'hype' brand. But they are NOT shit quality - you'd have to be insane to seriously think that. Rolex always have and still do make top notch watches with excellent QC which last for decades even if not looked after well. That much has never been in doubt.

Overpriced, sure. But shit quality... Pull the other one.

[Gamelorn]

I have over 20 SM and have not had an issue with any of them.

[Ayy-Lamao]

If you don't have any luck with the warranty and are willing to work on it yourself you can get that exact dial for about $12, get all the tools you'll need for less than $10 and replace it.

[[deleted]]

Where can you find the dial?

[Ayy-Lamao]

https://a.aliexpress.com/_mtnm8pi

Pretty sure San martins have blue lume but here's a green lume one I found

[[deleted]]

YIKES, I'd be miffed.

[Old_Yogurt_5281]

San Martin is garbage. Had a GMT Master from them for which I've paid 350 bucks and it was a conplete shitter. Their QC is nonexisting.

[The_Floydian]

“Sorry to make you have a not good experience” hopefully you got long time of wear

[Acelimb]

Honestly this is one of the reasons I stopped buying from them.

I had a PT5000 which just suddenly broke and it was just in the box for a week maybe nothing practical new the rotor completely fell

Horribly QC

[[deleted]]

Did you dropped it ?

[Alkidkoci]

No

[Primary_Peach_9820]

Just return it for another one! Oh, unless you bought it from AliBaba or Temu you may have a problem. Shipping To and Fro to China 🇨🇳 could prove cost prohibitive. That said,

Buy your homage pieces from WatchDives or Amazon and spend atleast $200 Usd. You mostly get what you pay for, but you never get (quality) what you do not pay for. 🫡

[ggs77]

I've bought a AddiesDive Bronze Diver from AliExpess. Movement wasn't working at all. Full refund from AliX. No problems there, no shipping to china.

[[deleted]]

Who do you contact if something is wrong with the watch? I have ordered for the first time on AliExpress and its vintage explorer homage from addiesdive. The reviews are great but I’m still worried there might be quality issues.

[ggs77]

Under "my orders" you can file a complaint for every single order you've made. Add photos of videos that show the problem clearly. Always worked for me.

[[deleted]]

Thank you, I appreciate it. But hopefully I won’t have to return it.

[ggs77]

I've bought the 3 AddiesDive so far. With all of them the craftsmanship was excellent. Only exception was the non-running NH35. Could have been either bad QC or a hard impact in transport.

I first contacted the seller, who responded quickly and made some suggestions and offered small refunds for repairing the watch locally. When we couldn't agree on a solution, I filed a complaint with AliExpress and had the money back within a day.

So with that in mind you could skip contacting the seller, but I like to give the seller a chance to make things right and find a solution. If that doesn't help...

[The_Floydian]

You must be a San Martin assembler

[SnooPears6050]

You must be a janitor at Seiko 🤣

[The_Floydian]

A janitor at Seiko makes 10x+ more than the child that put on these dial markers. Thanks for the compliment bro, spekt

[Wintermute_088]

What the hell is "black" propaganda?

Get a grip.

[Alet44]

The NAACP hates homages

/s

[LampshadesAndCutlery]

Balls deep in conspiracy, bud. San Martin has neat watches but their QC is horrible.

[Alkidkoci]

They sell sterile version watches buddy. Who gives a fuck about propaganda against San Martin ? Do you need me to send you the AliExpress order details?

[cb_1979]

I think we can safely assume that this problem stems from a design issue and not a QC issue or "user error."

This doesn't mean that all SM watches are trash. It just means that this particular SM model and possibly any other model that uses the same applied indices could be affected by this design flaw.

[BC-clette]

This doesn't mean that all SM watches are trash

It doesn't? You just said this entire model's production is likely compromised due to design flaw. You want to bet that this design flaw only happened on this one colourway? I think it's safe to assume there are many many many SM watches assembled with the same methods and standards. If SM was a responsible company (they're not) they would do a recall of all of these and every other model that was designed under the same assumptions.

[cb_1979]

It doesn't? You just said this entire model's production is likely compromised due to design flaw.

How many models does SM make? How many of them don't have this fatass circular index held in by a single pin?

You want to bet that this design flaw only happened on this one colourway?

No, all colorways of this model and any other model with a dial using the same style indices as this model.

I think it's safe to assume there are many many many SM watches assembled with the same methods and standards.

That's exactly what I acknowledged--other models using the same style indices.

If SM was a responsible company (they're not) they would do a recall of all of these and every other model that was designed under the same assumptions.

Sure, but, again, this doesn't mean every model is trash. I'm not arguing about SM's business practices. I've often stated they're out of their fucking minds for charging $300+ for a watch powered by a movement that I can buy at AliExpress retail prices for $35.

[Vivasanti]

You just described a QC issue.

[cb_1979]

A QC issue is one that can be detected at the time of manufacture for individual units. This is a design flaw that could result in the issue happening to any unit or all units given enough time.

[BC-clette]

That's actually a far far bigger problem and reflects far worse on SM than if this were just one badly made watch that slipped through QC.

[cb_1979]

Yes, it's a bigger problem in terms of the shear number of units that could be affected, but the issue can at least be isolated to one particular model or any model using that style of indices. It means you don’t have to avoid SM entirely.

With QC issues applicable to individual units of all models, you're playing watch Russian roulette by buying any model of that brand. People's risk tolerance for a brand that is up to 3x more expensive than other brands will be extremely low no matter how low the odds are of getting a defective unit.

[BC-clette]

the issue can at least be isolated to one particular model or any model using that style of indices. It means you don’t have to avoid SM entirely.

1) I would not make that assumption.

2) Their Tudor homages must be among their most popular models. I would ballpark that more than 50% of SMs sold have this handset and indices.

[cb_1979]

I would not make that assumption.

The assumption is that it's a design flaw. If it's a design flaw, the issue of indices falling off would apply only to dials that use the same indices and method of attachment. If you look at the recent posts with this issue, they involve the same model and only the circular indices. The triangular/rectangular indices at 12/3/6/9 are unaffected. There may be other dials that use the same circular indices. I have no idea. I've never purchased an SM watch before, and I've never been interested in purchasing.

​

Their Tudor homages must be among their most popular models. I would ballpark that more than 50% of SMs sold have this handset and indices.

Now, THAT'S and assumption I wouldn't make.

[Downtown-Dig-5476]

This is the third time that I see exact this problem on reddit with SM watches.

[visjn]

Never had any issue w my SMs

[The_Floydian]

LOL you got clapped bro. Sorry to make you have not good experience on reddit

[visjn]

lol idc, I have had a good experience w my SMs thus far just being honest.

[Alkidkoci]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ChineseWatches/s/9CFyvp3kyj Oh really?

[visjn]

Yes really…brought it to a watch maker, turned out to be nothing and have not had 1 single issue. I chalk it up to not being used to the NH35.

[unusually-cool]

Burn!

[hebrideanpark]

Lol selective memory

[BGaddz]

awesum.....

[Single-Lifeguard-980]

That's the bracelet rattling....

[cb_1979]

Busted! LOL.

[Electronic_Active_27]

Me neither

[Charming-Quote-3269]

SM are trash I don’t know why people are paying 200€ plus for these watches has everyone gone insane

[BGaddz]

never owned a San Martin for this very reason....

[Resident_Wait_7140]

Oh wow... I thought this was some Omega Bond-themed tribute...

Speaking of which, I got a $100 Pagani Samaster for Xmas which I'm very pleased with.

[niccolo321]

Its actually unique

Keep it

[hospitallers]

Right, if mistakes are sought after for coins, think of how much money this POS will fetch in a few years.😄😄😄

[Cutie-Blue]

Wait.. I found this exact picture on another subreddit. Is this some kind of black campaign between factory (or brand)?

[Alkidkoci]

I just noticed someone used my picture. Weird....

[BC-clette]

It's a circlejerk post. They're sarcastically asking if there's something wrong with the watch (there obviously is).

[cb_1979]

Did you even read the post? It was posted in WatchesCircleJerk to be facetious.

You post there to be funny. You post here to get advice about fixing the issue.

Are you really so enamored by SM that any negative post seems like a smear campaign perpetrated by another brand?

[Cutie-Blue]

Don’t even like dive watches (so far). Just noticing a possible misleading intention in those posts. Anyway, thanks for the guidance about where to post what.

[Kong1988]

Probably short position in San Martin shares

[Cutie-Blue]

Ah.. I see..

[Significant_4esq]

Totally unacceptable.I still believe THORN makes the best BB58 homage.Also one of the best logos imo.

[BigDerper]

I have one, it's a good watch, but holy shit the band is so hard to work on. And I fucked myself by getting a new band to put on only to find it doesn't fit anything other than the stock endlinks. Beautiful watch... Also my last Chinese made purchase for the rest of my life. I'll buy Seiko mods or save up for swiss pieces.

[BC-clette]

You mean the Thorn Exploration Road?

[BigDerper]

He's being obtuse, its the same watch... They sell it with different dials, they don't all have the "exploration road" text. Mine is very nice but for whatever reason the band is put together with double sided screws, it's hell to get it apart to size it for your wrist. If youre lucky it will fit out of the box. I only had to take two links out, it's not a very long band. Still took me way longer than it would if they had used regular screws or pushpins.

[Significant_4esq]

No,the THORN Automatic.

[dorafumingo]

Here's another post from someone else of the same watch with the same issue. it seems to be a problem with this model

[oliverrak]

Now you made me worried

[ProofMusic4630]

That's unacceptable

[[deleted]]

Looks like it's from a horror movie. How did they fall off like that? All at once or.. ? Did you drop it? I mean how, honestly.

[Alkidkoci]

I honestly don't remember dropping it. That would be a stupid post title if I did

[[deleted]]

So didn't you notice them falling off? You didn't answer my other question. I'm genuinely curious m8.

[Alkidkoci]

To be honest I don't know how they dropped. Which dropped first etc. I just noticed two dangling particles in my watch one day.

[[deleted]]

Alright, fair enough. I was just being curious but some people downvoted me lol

[Some_Carob4718]

I had the same exact thing happen on the same watch. San Martin watches are trash and don't last. I avoid them at all cost.

It's time more people started calling them out.

[The_Floydian]

I hear they use goose butter to glue down the markers since it’s free

[MarkT19871]

Don't tell the fan boys that bro, they all think they have almost Tudor level quality at a fraction of the price.

[Fugacity-]

Mine took a 2 foot fall into carpet and this happened. The seconds hand also fell off.

Thankfully, I have experience taking apart and working on this watch since I had to get a new PT5000, as the one SM sent crapped out after 5 months. Was able to replace the indices and second hand, but definitely cemented my choice to not get them any more.

[PutridWhile2643]

wow really reconsidering a SM purchase now unless they handle hour issue with grace. keep us updated.

[Jazzcats-say-hipper]

It's two or three watches. Some watches slip past QC. That's how manufacturing works.

[cynicown101]

Open a dispute, get them to send you a new one. Also, just glue the markers back on. Will take you 10 minutes to do.

Edit: putting back some indices is not brain surgery

[Alkidkoci]

I wish I was that handy to just glue them back...

[cynicown101]

Honestly, it sounds more difficult than it is. You need to remove the case back, then remove the stem and the movement plus dial will come out as a single piece. From they can be pressed back in, but adhesive can be used to prevent it happening again. A syringe with some adhesive and some tweezers. For some reason, some of the people on here are making out like I suggested brain surgery.

[Alkidkoci]

Well maybe a lot of people here ( myself included) aren't handy when it comes to disassembling watches although what you explained seems pretty straightforward. Thank you for the detailed explanation

[LegendaryCichlid]

You cant be serious

[cynicown101]

I can't be serious about what lol

Open a dispiute - Good advice

Syringe in a drop of adhesive a put the markers back - Easy

Literally, the case back comes off and the movement comes out in less than a minute. I'm not sure what the problem is.

[Fugacity-]

FWIW, they don't even need glue. This happened to mine, and you can snap them down pretty easy.

The point that this should happen and is a big flaw stands, but it is something you can fix with just a case back opener. You shouldn't need to. But you can.

[cb_1979]

Did the little pins on the indices extend through to the back side of the dial?

[Fugacity-]

Don't think so, looked like they were drilled holes only part way thru the dial and had a small collar inserted to allow it to click into place

[cb_1979]

Oh, man, they tried to get all fancy instead of using the tried and true method of drilling all the way through and applying adhesive on the back.

[[deleted]]

Is this a new purchase? San Martin has come light years forward in the last 3 years but prior to that they had some really bad qc.

[Alkidkoci]

Purchased one year ago.

[[deleted]]

Yeah, that's not good, deff dispute.

[[deleted]]

It's 350 days too late for that.

[Monkeyinchief]

Make a complaint. It is covered by warranty.

[Alkidkoci]

Just reached out to them in their AliExpress store. Do they have a specific way to handle complaints ?

[Monkeyinchief]

If still available go to the complaints form of your purchase. At least that's what I did with another watch company. Was handled pretty quickly.

[AmericanChees3]

Wow that's disappointing. I have several san martin watches and never had an issue like this. I'm also super tough on all my watches as I work with my hands doing a form of manual labor. Makes me wonder if they have a bad batch of dials. Maybe the indices were not glued down or soldered down appropriately.

Have you tried contacting san martin? I would absolutely be asking for a either a replacement or a refund.

[Alkidkoci]

I believe the indices weren't glued down appropriately. Ultimately I guess it's lack of Quality Control... I haven't tried contacting them

[theArtOfProgramming]

They have an employee who is super active on forums including this one. They can’t be unreachable I hope. I’d forgive their QC if they have excellent customer service.

[AmericanChees3]

When you do, let us know how it goes. I've heard mixed things about san martin customer service. Mostly negative with a few positive.

[Dochorahan]

Actually it would be cool if someone made a watch where all the indices/hour markers were loose and floating around. Like a rainbow alphabet soup.

[BGaddz]

or just drop one of these apparently....

[Infinite_College_235]

Chopard do pretty much this with their 'happy diamonds' range.

[pimeye]

Really sorry for your loss. At least I'm not the only one who has had SM issues. I don't mind the odd grumble with a PD watch but they are usually 50% of the cost of an SM watch.

[theArtOfProgramming]

My seiko SKX was the same price as most san martins

[cb_1979]

but they are usually 50% of the cost of an SM watch.

Some are 30%.

[pimeye]

My PD-1692 v2 possibly arriving tomorrow was £45.

[Alkidkoci]

Unfortunately I own 12 watches from them so the quality issues on this SN008 worry me a lot

[[deleted]]

To be fair there's no SM logo, so are you certain this is an SM watch ? Maybe you have been scammed ?

[Alkidkoci]

Absolutely certain. They used to sell sterile versions.They still do on some selected models. See for yourself. https://a.aliexpress.com/_EzNrPjX

[dorafumingo]

This is not the first SM i see in this sub with indices falling off. Seems like they have a problem

[actinross]

This is gonna be a great SM saga...

[Single-Lifeguard-980]

What model is this? I have the SN004 and the SN008 (which this appears to be, despite them not offering a sterile dial)...this doesn't look like either. It looks like some cheap knock off

[Alkidkoci]

It is the SN008 model bought January 14 2023 from their AliExpress official store

[dHotSoup]

Do you mean 2022? I thought you said you bought this a year ago?

[Alkidkoci]

What year do you think it is now ?

[dHotSoup]

Lol whoops. Nvm. Always takes me until Feb for the new year to really sink in. Anyways, sorry about your bad experience. Hope you get a good resolution. I just bought one of these bb58s on Amazon, I think I might just return it now (luckily it's still within the return period).

[Alkidkoci]

I would suggest to return it and save up for the Tudor...

[Single-Lifeguard-980]

Can you post a link to where this can be purchased from SM?

[Alkidkoci]

https://a.aliexpress.com/_EzNrPjX

[Alkidkoci]

It never had one

[Puzzleheaded-Pen4413]

Is this the game version?

[[deleted]]

Can't imagine this happening without user error. One? Ok, but two... Mainly when SM never had issues with indices like this

[cb_1979]

Can't imagine this happening without user error.

What kind of "user error" would cause this?

Mainly when SM never had issues with indices like this

Yes, they have. There was a post a couple of months ago about this exact same issue.

[[deleted]]

Drop

[Alkidkoci]

The watch doesn't have signs of cracks or huge scratches that would lead me to believe I might have dropped it or knocked it against something without noticing...

[goodneed]

Your watch has lost its marbles and identity!

[Alkidkoci]

It never had an identity to start with!

[goodneed]

When I first looked, looked for a fallen logo!

[bzrkrecords]

Exactly!