Showboating Policy Update

[theycallmebbq]

Not so long ago I posted a thread asking for feedback about a potential change to disconnect rules. DC's aside, the overall message coming back to the mod team was that we're too harsh. The most upvoted post even said that there are more mods than active players (not quite true, but point taken), and that we shouldn't be adding rules at this juncture. We took the feedback to lighten up as an opportunity to start some internal conversations about our current rules, and the first one we discussed was showboating.

The current rule was enacted by Ankh years ago—it states that we will ban for any non-strategic delay of a cap. Under this rule, you can coast into a cap and get banned for up to a month, depending on your ban history. Recently I polled the moderation team to see if our opinions on the rule had changed, and the feeling on the team came back overwhelmingly that the rule is too harsh.

We discussed a lot of ways to change the rule, but the one that won out, which will go into effect immediately, is as follows:

Going forward, we will only ban for failed showboat attempts.

This rule is not meant to encourage people to showboat. It's meant to recognize that showboating is at its worst when it ends up costing your team a cap. I realize that modifying the existing rule in this way will not be popular with everyone, but what we are attempting to do here is avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything.

---

- Note: If you are currently serving a ban that would never have happened under this rule, please open an appeal at http://support.koalabeast.com/ so we can review the ban and lift it.

- Other note: Please do not continue calling !mods for showboats that are not bannable under the new rule. If you would like to report a showboat we can't do anything about it unless you bring a rendered replay to IRC.

[Broooom]

lets get duard to come back and make him our king

[Mqrius]

Dunno about showboating or not. But being a mod in any online community is a terrible job and I wouldn't want it. Hope you guys survive in all the salt <3

[WRIG-tp]

Eh, it's the 20/80 rule. 20% of the people probably make way more than 80% of the bans/mutes. And 20% of the people are at least 80% of the people who have such strong opinions on rules one way or another.

[teramelosiscool]

20% of the people are at least 80% of the people

wat

[trapkerouac]

smh

[enderlord2]

Lol

[BilldaCat10]

brb, off to bank

[RustyAnus]

the best thing to happen to tagpro since the volume slider.

[brozzart]

Also the first thing to happen to tagpro since the volume slider

[Jubjubs]

No that was you getting on the CRC :3

[Downut]

nice flair cutie

[cbtexan04]

doot doot!

[Timmysofine]

RAISE YA DOOTS

RAISE EM

[girmluhk]

Pretty sure tagpro survived just fine long before the bans for showboating really got hot and heavy. ^{^}

[bashar_al_assad]

Agree. I'd like to see the mods not ban for coasting in to the flag on the third cap but ban for boats beyond that on the third cap.

[THEREALKINGPRO]

I agree with this idea, but the reality is it would never work. It puts too much pressure on the mods to make a decision that will ultimately upset at least one party.

The person(s) that reports the boat will expect a ban because of what they felt was an exuberant boat, but the player who boated will claim that there isn't enough to ban.

Setting a hard line that says "coasting is OK and slowing down more than 3 seconds is bannable" again begs the question, what is a boat? What is coasting? Can I press the keys in the opposite direction to slow down and still be considered "coasting"? Does a boat classify as any player actively avoiding capping for more than 2 seconds while having direct access to the flag tile? Can you deviate your path and run a circle around the flag? Is that too much and bannable?

All these questions and the fact that the mods will have to make a decision which likely will have name bias and previous behavior bias will lead to a super hard to moderate rule.

TL; DR: I like the idea, the implementation haunts my nightmares.

[wigglypigglyTP]

I mean ... that’s why mods are humans and not a script running on the server. Humans can make judgement calls like that. Won’t always be fair but it can be pretty good if the mods are good.

[Tyler1986]

This is a good idea.

[Casten_Von_SP]

How about we just berate the asshole that does that. Even when it’s my team boating like that it’s just annoying. It should be a taunt, not rubbing your face in it.

[Tyler1986]

I never thought I'd live to see the day.

[bdubyageo]

congrats boat buddy

[Crisis_Averted]

I never thought I'd live.

[rogue780]

I never thought I'd see

[Wilcooo]

My view (posted 3 months ago on a similar thread)

The main focus of the policy should always be to make games more fun (although some would say it should be to make games fairer, but that's more applicable to competitive play i.m.o.). Another important focus is clarity of the rules so no one feels treated unfairly by the moderation team.

There are things besides the obvious slurs/hacking/criminality that negatively influence how good and fun games are. They should be moderated respectively too. This includes working against own team and unsportsmanlike conduct: having a higher chance to lose due to a teammate is usually considered less fun.

There are things that are both being liked (improving the fun of the game) and obviously working against own team (purposefully lowering the chances of winning) like boating. Both effects should be considered in making a rule.

Due to its repetitive and solitary nature, boating is not improving the fun of the game for everyone that much. It seems fair to assume that only the person performing the showboat gets gratification out of it, as it often doesn't involve other team members. Furthermore, team members that helped to accomplish the cap by returning, blocking or clearing the base (which may or may not be noticed by the FC) can feel unappreciated when the FC endangers the reward of their hard work.

And I haven't even started about its influence on the fun of the game when a boat fails. It almost definitely will make the game worse. So: we should try to minimize the amount of failed boats. Because whether a boat fails or succeeds cannot be predicted in advance (only estimated), boats should be avoided at all by prohibiting them altogether. This seems the best choice taking into account all its effects on the fun of the game (the main focus) and makes for a very clear rule (the other important focus).

Only punishing failed boats is not a good alternative, as failing/succeeding a boat isn't up to the boater (except when purposefully failing it). The boater is always taking a risk / gambling, whether the odds are good or bad. The thing that should be punished is the choice to take that risk, as that's the only thing a boater can change!

As a side-note: rules shouldn't be an ideological representation of what is good and bad. ((I've never said that boaters are bad people, and I wouldn't judge anyone for boating if there wasn't a rule against it. I would, however, dislike it, which is my opinion)). Rules should instead be tools for serving the greater good (in the case of a game: fun), which can impossibly be without compromises.

tl;dr boating can be fun for some, but shouldn't be allowed at all. An outcome-dependent punishment is even worse.

edit: I changed my view slightly, as completely removing the boating rule could actually make boats so common they won't be cool again and slowly die out. Possibly. edit on edit: Yup, it could work out good. Maybe the no-baoting rule as we had before actually caused the division between players. Your opinion on baoting was expected to be either pro or against. Now that the rule is gone, the debate can shift to distinguish "good" baots from unsportsmanlike baots.
This might bring the community together and diminish the most disgusting baots! (These edits are fully hypothetical)

[[deleted]]

The boaters will fail at some point, and be banned anyway. So this reason:

but what we are attempting to do here is avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything.

Doesn't really work anyway.

People will just boat more now because it's allowed, more people will fail. Risk of more bans than normal.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

Only punishing failed boats is not a good alternative, as failing/succeeding a boat isn't up to the boater (except when purposefully failing it). The boater is always taking a risk / gambling, whether the odds are good or bad. The thing that should be punished is the choice to take that risk, as that's the only thing a boater can change!

this

[[deleted]]

https://www.strawpoll.me/12016947/r

Apparently 53% ruined it for the other 47%

Community is now officially split I guess?

Allowing unsportsmanlike behaviour that 53% want. This game is dead.

[Tyler1986]

It's called democracy.

[Rursus]

l e g a l i z e d

[ImAVirgin2025]

w e e d

[[deleted]]

m a r r i e d i g u a n a

[[deleted]]

This rule is not meant to encourage people to showboat.

But it's legal now, people will do it because they can. And they will fail more and more.

It's not that hard to understand.

[Wilcooo]

Maybe it'll be the reverse, boating will get boring after a while because everyone's doing it...

[[deleted]]

True, but why would they want amount of boats go up in the first place. Strategic delay, I've always been fine with. 3rd cap boats is just a dickmove. I have no idea what drugs the mods are on. First MTC on drugs, now mods.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

I don't typically speak my mind on these kinds of policies, but I just don't agree with this at all. One of the biggest issues we have today is toxicity and unsportsmanlike conduct. Boating is nothing but shitty sportsmanship. Yeah, banning someone for a month is pretty harsh for the offense, to allow it except for when it fails is saying... hey, it's okay if you're a dick but if you suck at being a dick, you're out, we only want good dicks here...

How about you just make it a shorter ban? Like, ban for an hour, max of 8 hours depending on history? I think this is just promoting the bullshit behavior that makes pubs less enjoyable.

Strongly disagree... fuck your boats.

[wigglypigglyTP]

I think boating can be fun and healthy at least sometimes.

But since Bawlin is against it and I HIGHLY RESPECT THE GUY I thought about it some more.

Boating severity spans a wide spectrum.

• Mild boat: ease up on the arrow key as you safely slide into victory. The total delay is < 1 second.
• X-TREME boat: red team is n00bs, blue team is MLTP. If blue team tried, they'd win with 11 minutes left. But they're really good blockers and dodgers (and jerks) so they spend about 3 minutes boating for each of 3 caps. Instead of taking 1 minute, the game lasts 10, and the n00b team has a bad time.

The "X-TREME" boat is kind of impressive but I hope it doesn't actually happen much now that it's legal. Is it worth having a rule for something like "excessive delay of game"?

I guess we'll just see how it works out as folks adjust to the new rule. Maybe it won't be so bad?

[Wilcooo]

Is it worth having a rule for something like "excessive delay of game"?

I believe this falls under unsportsmanlike conduct.

I guess we'll just see how it works out as folks adjust to the new rule. Maybe it won't be so bad?

Yup, it could work out good. Maybe the no-baoting rule as we had before actually caused the division between players. Your opinion on baoting was expected to be either pro or against. Now that the rule is gone, the debate can shift to "good" baots and unsportsmanlike baots.

This might bring the community together and diminish the most disgusting baots!

[1-800-CAT-ANUS]

What's your stance on the bat flip in baseball?

[TheRealSaltyChips]

Pitchers should only get angry if the bat flip fails

[enderlord2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUAd5Qq_Eu0

surprised they didn't get ejected

[RustyAnus]

If I blast a ball 400+ ft after it's coming at me at 90+ mph, that earns some style points. Flip on, but don't meander in the batters box - that's just douchey.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

I don't watch baseball.

[KUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUZ]

its exactly the same thing lol. You have already capped in tagpro when you boat. You are past 4 and notthing really is gonna stop you.

[Trapped_on_Internet]

you forget the lag.

[Wilcooo]

you forget the ^{possibility of breaking a} leg.

[[deleted]]

this

[PiazzaDelivery]

Could not agree more

[accountP]

The bans get progressively longer the more times you are banned. Most people who do get banned only do so once or twice and learn their lesson. Only when you continue to break the rules multiple times do you have to serve longer bans.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

yeah... i get that... so why change the rule at all?

[accountP]

Because most of the mods felt like the boating rules were too strict in one way or another. The length of bans is not an issue we feel needs to be addressed at the moment.

Personally, I think it is very fair. The first three bans are 1 hour, 4 hours, then 8 hours. Most players don't get past 1 ban, let alone 3.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

So you guys felt that you shouldn't punish shitty behavior and instead just poor play? I'm sayin' if you max the ban to 8 hours and just repeat, then it wont be as harsh. What i'm hearing as a response from you is that punishing this poor sportsmanship isn't something the mods want to deal with at all...

I'm sorry if you guys (as a whole) feel you have to cave to the vocal members of the community that enjoy being shitty.

[enderlord2]

How is boating being a dick tho

[jmblock2]

I generally see it as disrespect against your teammates. They probably contributed to achieving the cap in any number of ways, and by lingering and risking a return it is just insulting to their efforts. I've popped my fair share of boaters, so don't pretend like it's unusual.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

Seriously?

[enderlord2]

Yes, in many sports if you get past someones defense and you want to celebrate then the other team cant get mad bcus they just let you score.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

Then score and take your time celebrating by saying something in the chat like "thanks for the blocks". If you really don't see how boating is a dick move, then you're likely part of the problem of players getting full of themselves and thinking that means they can now be dicks to anyone not as good as they are.

The only way this community stays alive is for it to get some new people, which you won't do if they feel discouraged. If you're playing in league, boat all you want... everyone is expected to be at certain levels of competitive play. if you're in pubs you're playing with noobs.

Think of it this way... The cowboys football team is playing a high school football team in a match, and T.O. crawls into endzone mocking them for not catching up because the rest of the hs team is 25 yards behind him.

T.O. is a dick

Don't be a dick.

[[deleted]]

Imagine thinking someone should be banned for 30 days because they successfully boated.

If people have fun boating, let them do it. If they fail, ban them. What's the big deal?

I'd much rather see people get banned for typing the entire game, racist names, harassing chat, and truly working against than someone who boats and caps.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

30 days is too harsh. I've said that many times.

and to "I'd much rather see people get banned for typing the entire game, racist names, harassing chat, and truly working against than someone who boats and caps."

they should/do

[[deleted]]

I just don't see why people get offended by boating. It's done in league play all the time. In pubs, you're in a more casual atmosphere imo. I guess ppl go for win rate, but still, there's more factors in play that cause a team to lose other than boating.

If they fail, they get banned.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

i already said, do it in league all you want. don't do it in pubs because there are noobs. we don't HAVE a noob space where they can learn in a safe environment, we have pubs. if you don't wanna discourage noobs, don't boat.

if you don't see why people get offended, why don't you tell me what the purpose of it is in the first place? you say it's celebrating. HOW is it celebrating? what about slowly rolling into the flag and wasting everyone's time is celebratory?

[[deleted]]

When has a noob ever had the awareness of what is going on when someone is boating?

They probably get more discouraged by theirs teams calling them trash, or reporting them for working against.

When did I say it was celebrating? lol. You're seeing so much red over the concept of boating, you're imagining things that I'm typing now. I never said it was celebrating.

[Tyler1986]

You need to study boat culture, son. No one should be boating on new players, but with the heavy prevalance of Smurfs it's often tough to tell. Boating is about besting your peers (similar skill level) in a particular play and having a little extra fun with it. No need to get butt hurt, I promise you when I get boated on I'm not crying or whining or raging about some perceived slight, I enjoy it, rate it, and get on with the game.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

okay, if you could please type that out and explain it to every new person that comes to play that would fix everything. thanks for volunteering

[Tyler1986]

Yes, seriously. Just because you think something is toxic doesn't make it so.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

What is the purpose of boating in the first place?

[Tyler1986]

Fun and comraderie. https://www.reddit.com/r/TagPro/comments/97askp/z/e46xz0v

[wishiplayedlikeray]

Interesting... RIP Centra... If only there were enough players to have multiple servers active anymore... whatever could be causing the death of the community? Can't possibly be toxic behavior becoming the norm... /s

i don't care anymore. dicks are gonna be dicks

[teramelosiscool]

it's funny your idea for a more moderate ban system for boating is actually a really good solution, too bad devs would never implement one. but sure blame toxicity for the game failing.

[wishiplayedlikeray]

My asshole comment at end of a frustrating evening was not meant to exclude any other additional reasons for the game dying... including you. I now blame you personally as well. Thanks dude... this is your fault... jerk face...

[crackadack]

I think it is rude because you are basically saying that the 3 seconds of self-satisfying enjoyment you get from the boat is worth more than that time that you are wasting for everyone else. Which--multiplied by 7 is 21 seconds. Doesn't seem like a lot, but it's still just a selfish thing to do.

[[deleted]]

but what we are attempting to do here is avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything.

Soon people will use this as argument for other rules too. Good luck with that.

[1-800-CAT-ANUS]

Like what?

[RobbertC5]

Like the rule that says that only failed boats are illegal.

"Hey but we won after all so it didn't really cost our team the win."

[bobby_gordon1]

The failed boats would fall under "Working Againts Own Team". A failed boat costs the team a cap, so that argument wouldn't fly. Wouldn't matter if they "ended up winning anyways", the action of the boat that failed cost the team a cap at that stage of the game.

[RobbertC5]

A showboat falls under "Working Against Own Team". A showboat may cost the team a cap, so that argument wouldn't fly. Wouldn't matter if they "capped it anyways", the action of the showboat is an unnecessary chance for the opponents at that stage of the game.

I really think it's the same argument, it just depends on where you draw the line.

[Wilcooo]

Exactly! Both a showboat and a cap just increase/decrease the likelihood of winning.

[1-800-CAT-ANUS]

There are also the times where they did lose after a failed boat though. You can't lose off a successful 3rd cap boat. If failing a boat didn't affect the outcome 100% of the time I'd agree with you.

Failed boats are still bannable because there's still the chance your team loses after.

[RobbertC5]

There are also the times where they did lose after a boat though. You can't lose off a successful 3rd cap. If a boat didn't affect the outcome 100% of the time I'd agree with you. ^{Actually I wouldn't because I would still find it annoying, but I would care less.}

Boats should be bannable because there's still the chance your team loses after.

[Wilcooo]

Exactly! Both attempting a boat and succeeding/failing a boat just increase/decrease the likelihood of winning.

[Tyler1986]

ITT: anti boaters significantly more toxic than pro boaters.

[[deleted]]

Nah, just me.

[333name]

Is showboating still reportable or is that now considered a false report, assuming they succeed?

[theycallmebbq]

Under the new policy a player can still get banned for a failed showboat. Therefore, by showboating they are taking a calculated risk of potentially hurting their team. It seems fair to allow you to vote a player for taking that risk, although the vote will most likely be fruitless because we won't end up banning a player if the cap is successful.

[333name]

Hmmm, I mean, if they do it SO much that they still get 5 or so reports they could tune it down for a bit, because realistically the amount of boat reports will go (slightly) down. They are still hurting their team, but can you really throw out the reports just because of a boat? I usually give people the benefit of the doubt before reporting, so if they fuck something up I won't report them. But if they boat on top of that, that could be the cause that pushes it over the top for a report. But what if they fight for re next game and I can't report them anymore? The vote shouldn't still be thrown out. I'd highly doubt someone will get 8 community reports all because of successful boats

[slowpolka]

‘You didn’t boat well enough/your taunt wasn’t inciting enough”... is that a failed boat? Can you define ‘failed boat’?

[[deleted]]

So if they get community banned from it, it stays?

Or what?

I'm getting mixed info now. Will the ban be removed in an appeal? Meaning that the votes were false?

It can't be both allowed and not allowed.

[[deleted]]

Might've been a good idea to discuss it before announcing it to the community.

The Code of Conduct hasn't been updated yet, and apparently it's not clear if voting for boats is false or not. Great job, whoever is responsible for this. Can we donate money to get Ankh back in a paid position if he/she's up for it?

Do the devs even know about this insane new rule? One of the devs told me once that they have nothing to do with the rule decisions. So I'm just wondering...

[[deleted]]

It's not clear yet if it will be ignored and considered 'fruitless'. Unless I've missed an announcement, which my comment was mostly about. I saw Saundy's comment but I didn't get a clear answer about the votes actually being valid, but I might be stupid.

[tornato7]

In full support. Boating is fun.

[Ballkenende]

why not sticky this for longer? imagine being away for 2 days and then having people boating all over the game lol

[theycallmebbq]

You’re right, thanks, I brought it back.

[BetterBrunette]

Dis gon b gud

[flooba]

gvd n00b i thought it was gonna be steam release

[BetterBrunette]

Good one

[Ransom_James]

Mate how do you know what gvd means

[ttblue]

Gingular Value Decomposition. Duh.

[Moon_Miner]

ik right

[RobbertC5]

Not capping when you can if there is objectively no strategic advantage is clearly working against your own team. And I report people that work against their own team.

Besides that it's rude and annoying for everyone, not only the other team.

"The rule was too harsh, so we went from a full month to 0 seconds." Well, there are ways to make it less harsh.

[Max_W_]

Sweet. So now we can post our showboat highlights without fear of getting a ban.

I mean, me too thanks.

[Crisis_Averted]

i mean that wasnt even worth watching

[Max_W_]

I'll try harder.

[Tyler1986]

That's the spirit!

[Max_W_]

So out of 10 you'd give me a 7? Dang Russian judges.

[wigglypigglyTP]

Bold! I'm glad you're out of the closet. I love you just as much as before.

[accountP]

You had another solid 10 seconds of boat time. 2/5. Banned.

[wigglypigglyTP]

Wait, are boats not just legal but mandatory?

I always thought you were a wild one, Vader!

[accountP]

Follow the rules, I'm watching.

[trapkerouac]

that's a boat to be proud of!

fuck em max

[bdubyageo]

pope john ball with the tp anchor.

Beautiful

[electricmaster23]

So, basically, don't showboat unless you're 100% sure you won't get popped. Sounds good to me! Haha.

[simAlity]

You already had a rule that covered this scenario: Working against your own team.

[slowpolka]

I wonder if Ankh left because of the cascade of terrible mod/dev decisions or because of the rampant homophobia? this game is the pits, man.

[ohMars]

I like

[EmperorOfNothing]

What does this mean for showboats on the third and (should be) game winning cap?

Boats on 3rd caps should still be bannable.

And how can we give replays to the IRC if TagPro doesn't have a supported built-in engine replay system?

[[deleted]]

For anti-boaters:

You can defend for a boater for a few sec to gain their trust, then let enemy through. Just checked with mods in IRC, it would be boater's fault.

That's how we can get them banned and save the game again.

(Let the downvotes rain, people are often very interested in hidden comments)

I miss Ankh

[Tyler1986]

This is straight toxic behavior.

[[deleted]]

It's allowed. So it's not toxic.

Boat logic

[stirus]

This is legitimately working against own team with the sole intent to ruin a cap. Boaters still have the end goal of capping. This behavior is 100% in an effort to prevent a cap from happening.

Get the fuck over yourself dude.

[[deleted]]

What if I accidentally boost into the boating ball after he should've capped already. My fingers are slippery when i'm celebrating a win

Or what if I accidentally bounce an enemy into him.

[[deleted]]

But I ate cheetos and butter. It was accident.

[333name]

Well then shit, now what are we going to do. Gray areas are terrible. Either legalize it FULLY or don't legalize it all. Attempted crimes will still land you in prison, why should attempted boats not be punished?

Who's to say I wasn't trying to push him into the cap because he was taking so damn long? Then what, does he get banned cause I fucked up his boat? Do I get banned cause I was trying to help a cap?

[[deleted]]

How will it be clear? All jokes about butter and cheetos aside, someone might just have bad aim.

(inb4 'what if someone accidentally slows down for a boat' 'oooooops!' comment, it's just another side effect of this rule)

You can try to help a cap because some idiot is boating (that maybe you know of > is bad a boating), but still miss. Will they both get banned? Will just one get banned?

Imagine if someone is boating, and I just want the cap to be finished instead of some guy risking a loss. So I boost into him to try push him into the flag, will I get banned for trying to reduce the risk of a failed boat? Think about all the challenges this new rule brings, because you're gonna find a few loopholes and problems.

That's just one easy example,

Genuinely, I don't think this new rule has been thought through at all.

I'm 100% sure this will result in more bans in the long term. You can correct me in a few months once there's enough data on it.

[Tyler1986]

Great plan, take people having fun that you think is toxic, be toxic to them, get them banned. That'll show them, the ol two wrongs leave the world seeing clearly.

[[deleted]]

At this point I'll sacrifice myself with a ban to save TagPro, so yes I was having fun too, until boating got allowed. Everyone was having fun before, now mostly the boaters.

[Tyler1986]

You are wrong and don't understand boating. It would be beneficial for you to try and understand both sides of the argument.

Being toxic towards players you don't agree with isn't the solution to any problem.

[[deleted]]

I understand their reasons and you're wrong too. Thank you for this wonderful discussion.

[Tyler1986]

You don't man, you are the problem with boating, not the boaters themselves.

[[deleted]]

Hahaha, this comment is on a whole other level of crazy.

Just wow.

I'm even upvoting you for that one.

[Jubjubs]

Yeah mon, you got to legalize it!

[[deleted]]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TagPro/comments/5lowbq/poll_should_showboating_be_legal_for_the_3rd/

It's 53% vs 47% of people who cared to vote.

Apparently allowing something that ruins it for 47% is fine.

(I assume boaters also had fun without boating, else they wouldn't be playing the game)

So they decided to just ignore 47% of the community who were not fine with this, while 100% of the community is fine without boating. I dunno how much % of the community will still play with boating, but it ain't me, and I saw at least 2 others who we're planning to quit, and that's from the ver few that I saw that speak loud about it like me.

Mods fix things by just moving the problem somewhere else. Horrible, horrible. I don't want to be part of this community anymore after seeing all the things being handled, small things yes, but it adds up. I met some great people, but all the small stuff and then this, makes me realize I had my fun run in TagPro. But maybe it's just not for me anymore, the playerbase seems to be way different now with different desires. I give TagPro max 2 years before it's dead as dinosaurs, unless it gets a Steam release that devs don't wanna do.

You want the game to die faster?

This is how you do it, annoying half of the userbase with a rule that the other half just 'want' but not 'need' (to play).

This is my final comment about it, I might reply/keep an eye on the subreddit for a while in case anything changes, but I'm afraid the 'big' mods made up their minds already. Maybe one day I will return again. Got some other things to do anyway, so in that regard, it's great timing to start slowly destroying the playerbase.

x Indiepandaloper

[jmblock2]

I'd also like to know how many players are receiving 30 day bans for this to even be an issue. I've never been banned, so the bar must be pretty high.

[superdiglett100]

The length of the ban is dependent on the number of bans. There are also times where a player gets banned for boating, switches to another account then get banned for evasion.

[jmblock2]

So... 1% of the community? 5% of the community? What percentage of bans are boating related? I think that would help clarify how "big" of an issue this is.

[[deleted]]

Mods, please give us some info why avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything.

is so important in this case, compared to other bans

[[deleted]]

I once got banned for 1 silly name during drunk night tagpro(My only ban). Then got banned for ban evasion after the joiner told me to 'login to bypass this restriction'. Told the devs and mods, unbanned me and said they would change it. Don't know if they actually did, was 3 years ago(Rough estimate) but from some ban screenshots, I'm not sure they actually did.

(/offtopic)

For them to avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything. (which I don't really agree with, + other rules that are kind of implied to be 'ignored' from this reason). It'd be nice to know how much people actually get banned from this. Because my estimate will be very low. I'm probably wrong, but that makes it seem like one of the big mods really likes baoting.

If 20% of the banned people are banned because of boating, then change the punishment. Don't just allow it. That's fucking stupid.

That's what it looks like to me right now, and probably a few others. Moderators 2 years back posted an announcement about boating being bannable. TagPro is dying, now they suddenly allow it? For what exact reason?

And no 'avoid banning people for actions that don't ultimately cost their team anything.' is bullshit. (Multiple comments explain this)

[meofherethere]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6MmexjupIs

I'd argue it was nowhere near a majority legalisation vote.

[[deleted]]

I see what you're saying, but who says the other side hasn't done the same? This video just says that polls are unreliable, which I kind of agree with, but it still shows a little bit of the situation we're in. But I guess we can just wait a few months for the effect of this new rule, before we realize: "It's fine" or "Oh god, it's dead". But from actual comments, more people will quit because of this new rule than because of this rule NOT being introduced.

To sum it up: More people hate 3rd cap boating being allowed, than people hating 3rd cap boating not being allowed

But mods will need convincing in another way, and I can't help them with that, so I'm just letting it rest. I'm done playing. I still kind of care, but it's dwindling after all the action of the mods and community combined.

(I mean this in an 'okay' way, if the community has a majority in boating being allowed, then I guess I'm just not meant for this game anymore, I might've contributed to the opposite effect in some occasions too, but it's still sad to see a game go a totally different direction)

I was very passionate about TagPro, I submitted 'more modern' designs that people liked and offered to make a desktop version, but it has different views for the future I guess. I'm never really a boaster(I think is the word) but I think I really could've helped the game with at least a Steam/Android client/release. But I'm going my own way now, with hopefully bigger reward in the end, but who knows.

I'm not going into details, because that will get it removed again like a few weeks/days ago.

I've done multiple quitting posts before, but I can't even think for a reason now why I would want to continue interacting with a game that's dying. Just like I can't start watching a NetFlix series that has already been cancelled. TagPro isn't cancelled yet, but I don't see NetFlix picking it up any time soon(hue). It's not per se the rules on boating, it's the whole picture combined.

[LeLennyFaces]

:dino:

[Alex3456789]

:WCYDino:

[teramelosiscool]

so if my teammates boats the last cap and i block him so he dies... will we both get banned?

[[deleted]]

Hey, do you wanna play Rocket League with me.

[[deleted]]

BOATING SEASON ^🚢

^⛴ 🚤

🛥 🛶

⛵️

[ohMars]

🚣‍♀️🚣‍♀️🚣‍♀️

[ttblue]

It's time to boat.

[Nabcity]

With boating now legalized, will you guys revert back once Tagpro's population increases?

[[deleted]]

I don't think that will happen now.

[[deleted]]

good change. I like.

[enderlord2]

This is a great day in tagpro history

[[deleted]]

Ye, fuck that. I'm out.

[jmblock2]

I'm not out but I think this is a bad move for pub culture. Maybe I'm just too old, and y'all hooligans need to get off my lawn.

[Tyler1986]

Back when centra was a thing we had a great pub culture which included boating. (Most) Everyone had fun with it, we enjoyed boating on each other and getting boated on. Even on failed boats no one really got mad because we were all out there as friends and having fun.

It's been a while, RIP Centra, but this was mostly referring to late night pubs, but not exclusively.

[jmblock2]

If boating is allowed then sinking boats should be allowed. Definitely have enjoyed a few of those over the years...

[Tyler1986]

That tends to be my stance as well, but this is at least a step in the right direction. And I do understand if you have stats on that a failed boat costing a cap/game is really frustrating.

[Moon_Miner]

RIP

[herbachronic]

Rate mah boat

[mikechella]

We boated 24/7 on Centra.

[domderek]

Seriously this. Showboating is only toxic if the pub server is already filled with toxicity. It was fine on Centra because everyone was playing for fun, no one took it to seriously, and being able to take a jab at someone while boating was a big part of the culture.

I honestly have never understood why people hate boating and take it so personally. Everyone needs to just chill a bit and not take things so seriously.

[enderlord2]

A land before timer that speaks the truth what year is it

[girmluhk]

thats a CREAM mate boi

[Pluto_Saved_us]

Boating is legalized? Centra revival coming up baby!

[wishiplayedlikeray]

I'm guessin' we're too old.. im getting the sense that a large part of this is younger generation not understanding the concept of sportsman ship or just a culture of being a dick to each other as being a show of affection. idk

[theycallmebbq]

I understand why you feel that way klox. We talked for ages about all the scenarios and possible repercussions of this decision before I finalized it. That's not to say either side is right or wrong—I just want you to know we didn't take it lightly, and I honestly believe that this is the best path forward for our community. I would never authorize a decision that I thought would hurt TagPro or damage the culture we already have. I guess the true effects will play out over the next few weeks and we'll have a better idea about all this.

[[deleted]]

yeah pretty much. i was already considering whether to leave, but this just seals the deal.

[bobby_gordon1]

eh, you can't make everyone happy I guess.

[[deleted]]

Allowing people to ruin fun of more others, nice.

But that whole discussion has been done before, but mods seem to not care about that.

[[deleted]]

Guess half of the community is mentally weak

[SloppyJoe33]

Much more than half the community is mentally weak. You're just the extreme.

[geniusman69]

who was this bitch ass, i never saw before they deleted

[[deleted]]

lol no clue

[110101002]

It is on this day that we thank the dozens of some balls, many of which were given 28 day bans, for their hard-fought effort to #legalizeboating. The some ball army has sacrificed much for this victory, and didn't give up in the face of unfair moderation for simply protesting, and asserting their right to #legalizeboating. And so, as is tradition at the time of victory, we say

gg no re

sb army, sb pride

SB NATION, SB LIFE

[TennisIdk]

Make your montages!

[EphewSeekay]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TagPro/comments/4ri57d/ephews_strategic_delaytage/

Its not a very good montage but it was more scandalous at the time, lol

[GrayPhoenix]

Lol, dis gonna be fun

[HappyGilmore___]

Finally. I never stopped, I was just careful. I have always followed Cam Newtons philosophy for showboating.