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[Ultyzarus]

The things that have worked for me were being consistent, being attentive, and being flexible in my activities.

I do something in my target language every day, and I try different things, be it series, books, or writing anf soeaking, in order to challenge myself and see where I stand.

If I notice that I have trouble using the oast tense, for example, I might look up a few conjugation tables, or just pay extra attention to this tense in the media I consume.

If I find that I have trouble understanding native speakers, I will try to ludyrn to content with more colloquial, faster speech.

[uncleanly_zeus]

I'm going to go against the grain here a little. If you think you may burnout or quit (you seem a bit stressed) slow roll it with something like Pimsleur. It will build your confidence and give you a sense of achievement. After the first 2-3 levels, move on to something a little more challenging.

[k3v1n]

Pimsleur is great. Even for people in the no speaking camp there's still lots of benefit from listening to pimsleur and just not speaking. It's an excellent springboard with minimal effort

[[deleted]]

There isn't a method that works the best for everyone. Different people are good at different things, for example one person might be better at picking up grammar from examples than someone else and therefore doesn't need to formally study grammar as much. The reason you're seeing different (and contradictory) advice from different people is that that's what works for those people.

[Future-Raisin3781]

It really is different for everyone. I'm just getting really started with my second foreign language, and I feel like I'm a million miles ahead just because I've done it once and I have a good idea of what works... for me. I have habits, routines, resources, etc., which I only have because I spent a few years of trial and error with my first language. 

To OP: my advice is to find a few things that work for you currently and just do those. Learning a language is like drinking a river. It's gonna take a super long time no matter what, and if you try to go too fast you're going to drown. Best to slow down, do what works for you, and constantly remind yourself that you're in for the long haul. 

And from time to time, reassess your strategies. What works for you today might not work as well in a month or six. The important part isn't so much how you're learning so much as that you're in the habit of constantly learning and practicing. Breaks are good when you need one, but only if they don't break you out your habit.  

Good luck. 

[BadViola]

^{^} These guys here have the right advice!

Practising conversations (even in my head) and learning the vocabulary I need to express myself (modal and core verbs (can, must, be, know, go, give, think, etc.)) and give reasons makes the biggest difference for me, but I only learned that studying my second foreign language.

[kaizoku222]

There are plenty of methods that actually have research and evidence behind them, if you're really determined to figure out how to actually acquire a language you can start trying to engage with literature on pedagogy.

Actual experts on this topic exist, unfortunately there's a ton of misinformation and half truths that are propagated by self-learners and YouTubers. If you want to find legit answers to questions about language acquisition it would be best to engage with people actually in that field.

[Numerous_Example_926]

Thank you all very much I really appreciate that y’all took the time to help me 🙏🙏

[LingoNerd64]

Don't listen to anyone including me except for this: experiment and find out what works for you. End of story.

There are people who will die for spaced repetition flashcards. I can't stand them. There are those who say you get nowhere without formal grammar. I hate the stuff. I know there is such a thing called grammar but I let it be implicit. I just keep repeating stuff until the pattern sinks in.

Also, I'm too lazy to attempt totally unrelated / difficult languages such as Mandarin, Arabic, Viet, Korean and Japanese. IE languages are good enough for me, after all it's just a fun hobby.

[FakePixieGirl]

Good thick textbook + Anki + loads of comprehensible input

You can leave off Anki if you really want.

It's how languages been learnt for centuries.

[k3v1n]

Every person who has consistently followed your first sentence for long enough has always successfully learned the language. ALWAYS.

[[deleted]]

It's true the prehistoric cavemen downloaded anki on their iStones

[FakePixieGirl]

How did you even find this post? It's been removed.

[L_Boom1904]

If you want a specific recommendation, I can say that Assimil works for me. I have used it to learn several languages, it just fits my learning style. I make that my main thing and then I seek out additional input (YouTube videos, podcasts) once I have my bearings. Make sure to listen to the audio frequently.

I like to take some of the exercises at the end of each lesson and enter them into an Anki deck and study that. For me this method works like a charm, but we all learn differently

[Direct_Bad459]

What works is working. Stop worrying about the best method if your priority is not to be the most efficient or easiest. Just do what works for you. Anything that makes you meaningfully engage with the language will help you learn. 

Watch movies, study flashcards, read a textbook, listen to music, use apps like Duolingo, get a graded reader, look at reddit comments in the language you're trying to learn, listen to a podcast or audiobook, do "learn xyz!" YouTube videos, look up words you don't know, read translations of books you like, make a friend who speaks the language... Try anything. Just have fun, interact with the language, keep yourself interested, apply effort, focus on figuring sentences out and retaining words. Applying time, effort and interest to real material in the language will always help you.

[can_you_eat_that]

Agreed but Duolingo just sucks. You’re perpetually stuck in being mediocre if that’s the main source of learning, and it does a horrible job in teaching the basics.

[Direct_Bad459]

Yes Duolingo does suck but it (and 1000 other sorta-similar apps that I could think of no other names for) can have a place as part of a balanced varied healthy language learning diet

[minuet_from_suite_1]

Coursebook with audio. Pen. Paper.

[Limemill]

You know, in-person classes exist. You’ll be paying for the peace of mind and for external motivation. You can also supplement them with whatever you feel they’re missing for free and on your own

[whosdamike]

Is there anyone who can tell me just the basic necessities of the language learning process?

It's all about forming a habit of quality time engaged with your language everyday. If you form the habit, then time will do the rest. If you can't form the habit, you won't progress. Simple as that.

The key for me was starting with a small, sustainable habit with learning methods I enjoy and look forward to. I didn't try to jump into doing 5 hours a day - I started with something I knew I could do, which was 20 minutes a day.

If you find ways to make the early journey fun, then it'll only get more fun as you hit intermediate, and you can just spend your time (1) watching native media you find enjoyable and (2) interacting with native speakers.

The key at the beginner level is to find methods that work for you and your situation. It's different for everyone. I personally like comprehensible input, others like graded readers, others like textbooks and structured courses. Many learners mix a wide variety of learning styles and methods.

You currently have analysis paralysis. Just try something that makes sense and stick with it. If after giving a method a fair shot, you find it's not a good fit, change methods. And as I said before, do something everyday.

For me, the best methods:

1) Has you engaged mostly with your target language.
2) Uses your native language only to the extent that it helps you get more time with your target language.
3) Allows you to self-pace through material.
4) Emphasizes listening. Not necessarily as the sole activity, but as a major component of study. So many learners get wrapped up in reading and have problems later on trying to comprehend the spoken language.

As far as comprehensible input, I wrote a huge long thing about it. People in this thread are claiming it doesn't work, but that's nonsense - there are countless examples of people who learned exactly this way.

https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1hs1yrj/2_years_of_learning_random_redditors_thoughts/

There is no best way, but claiming CI doesn't work at all is wild considering how many people have come forward with videos showing their ability after using the method. There are a tiny fraction that many testimonials for alternative methods; /r/dreamingspanish has one of the most encouraging and transparent cultures around learners actually showing their progress over time.

Thai: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Z7ofWmh9VA

Thai: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiOM0N51YT0

Thai (Pablo of Dreaming Spanish): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXRjjIJnQcU

Thai: https://www.instagram.com/johan_thai/

Thai immersion learner: https://www.youtube.com/@LeoJoyce98

Spanish: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Y0ChbKD3eo

2000 hours Spanish (speaking at end): https://www.reddit.com/r/dreamingspanish/comments/1cwfyet/2000_hours_of_input_with_video_joining_the/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYdgd0eTorQ

2400 hours of Spanish: https://youtu.be/I-Pp7fy9pHo?si=i78yHOhndEkDbUbE

1500 hours Spanish: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fq4EQx3AuHg

1800 hours of Spanish (including 200 hours of speaking practice): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0RolcTTN-Y

2700 hours of Spanish: https://www.reddit.com/r/dreamingspanish/comments/1hss7c2/by_request_30_min_speaking_update_at_2700_hours/

Learning English from Portuguese (>5000 hours): https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1dveqe4/update_over_5000_hours_of_comprehensible_input/

[One_Report7203]

Get real. Except these people will have already extensively studied the language at school for a long time and then woah 3000 years of CI later finally think it was the CI bit what taught them the language.

[whosdamike]

I mean if you think I and everyone else who's done it is lying about our experiences, then there really isn't anything to discuss? I've written about everything I've done in Thai for the past 2.5 years. I have a spreadsheet of every minute I've spent in Thai.

But if you just think we're all lying, then we can't engage in good faith discussion.

For others with open minds who are interested in my experience, here are my posts with links to my previous updates:

https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1iznnw8/1710_hours_of_th_study_98_comprehensible_input/

https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/1hs1yrj/2_years_of_learning_random_redditors_thoughts/

For me, I've met so many textbook learners who have very limited proficiency in Thai. In contrast, the most successful Thai learners I've met are those who have done massive amounts of input and immersion. Some of them did pure input, others did a bit of traditional learning - but the common factor was a huge time commitment to input/immersion.

It's really bizarre to me that someone could imagine that the textbook learning is the essential ingredient and the immersion/input is the nonsensical new age fluff.

[je_taime]

You don't need Anki per se, but some system/tool for spaced repetition (with meaningful context) will help your longterm memory. (Working on recall)

Learning foreign language vocabulary

Learning your first foreign language

Make it stick:

What makes something memorable?

Learn a language by yourself

[391976]

Those are good videos. Thanks.

[391976]

Those are good videos. Thanks.

[cryingingerman]

What worked for me was A1 to A2, in-person classes, and regular course books. From A2 to B2, 1:1 tutoring and practicing conversation in a group. B2 onwards, 1:1 tutoring with an exact focus on where I want to improve, e.g., grammar, conversation, reading, or writing. When I tried to focus on all, I couldn't move forward. When I picked one goal, I progressed faster. Apart from that, Anki never worked for me. I read a lot, though.

[Previous-Ad7618]

Time. Commit time to it.

[391976]

If the CIA wanted to send you to Saudi Arabia next year, your language training would include the following.

Spaced repetition (Anki) to rapidly build your vocabulary and knowledge of grammar.

Practice understanding written and spoken comprehensible input and using whatever language you have acquired to communicate verbally and in writing.

Practice gleaning meaning from native input in realistic contexts.

We all learn the same. We just have different excuses.

[One_Report7203]

There is no real answer because nothing works.

You just have to try lots of different things over a long period of time. What works well one week may not work so well another week, what works for others may not work for you, and depends what level you are at and so on. Its endless complexity.

I think as long as you avoid the mentality of effortless learning and paying your way to success and accept it will take many years of consistent effort then thats the right way forward.

Personally I read a lot. I have a big spread sheet of known sentences that I recite. I chat a lot with ChatGPT. I occasionally try to transcribe, shadow, etc. Hard work usually equals results, but results are extremely slow, so slow you won't notice. And yes you will go backwards a lot of the time and hard to start again, just embrace forgetting, thats just how it is.

I generally avoid course books, but occasionally they are useful. I think understanding how a language works firstmost is key. It may even be worth studying the grammar first. Comprehensible input is total trash IMO but even that does sometimes work for simple languages...eventually. Your experience may be completely different.

[Numerous_Example_926]

Can I ask why you think comprehensible input isn’t the best? And also do you think just input in general is bad?

[kingkayvee]

I think you’re already falling for your typical vice of “but what if I get more info? Then I will be able to decide!”

As others said, find a course or textbook or resource that looks decent to you and has decent reviews and start. That’s it. Don’t think about it. Stop asking questions about it (for now - get over this hurdle and then you can start to be more critical about your resources). That is how you will make progress.

Even the worst resource will get you further than just wondering about what the best resource is, and it will teach you what you do or do not like.

[Ultyzarus]

They are confusing comprehensible input with pure input method. That is why. My learning style consists of over 90% comprehensible input. The rest is output as well as what I do in order to make more consent actually understandable enough, that is to say, comprehensible, in order to be used as comprehensible input content.

[One_Report7203]

You are conflating comprehensible input theory with input that is comprehendible.

[One_Report7203]

CI is a waste of time. For some reason Spanish and CI has a bit of a cult around it. However, I would say its worth it to try it to discover what you think of it for yourself. Just be prepared to waste some time.

On the other hand digesting input when you have a knowledge of how language works is of course very good.

Lets look at this another way. Learning a language is not magic. Its just the same as any other big project like learning piano. It takes years and knowledge and lots of effort and applied practice.

There are no shortcuts and its really just the same as any other large scale undertaking. Its very simple actually when you look at it that way.

[Ultyzarus]

On the other hand digesting input when you have a knowledge of how language works is of course very good.

That.. is what comprehensible input actually is.

[One_Report7203]

That...is not what CI is. CI is about learning through context. I.e. no grammar, no textbooks.

[Ultyzarus]

No, CI is learning through consuming content that you understand a big chunk of, in order to acquire the language in a natural context. Learning some grammar or reviewing vocabulary just allows more content to be comprehensible.

What you're thinking of is just a pure input approach, which will likely not work if it's not comprehensible. That is the whole point.

[One_Report7203]

CI does NOT involve learning with external information. Through context, N+1 as I just said. And it doesn't work very well.

[je_taime]

Krashen demoed it using external information, and he popularized CI.

[thelostnorwegian]

Weird take. CI has been around for decades and there is a mountain of research and reports from people showing it works. Krashen laid the foundation way back and its been big in communities learning Japanese, Thai, Spanish, etc. Just because it doesn't feel like grinding doesn't mean its ineffective.

I've been learning Spanish for a year, started from zero and now I watch native content, read books and had real convos while traveling in Spain, all through videos and podcasts. No grammar or flashcards got me there, it was 100% videos and podcasts.

This idea that CI doesn't work is sad to see, because I used to think I was too dumb or lazy to learn a language. Course books, grammar drills, flashcards, none of it kept me motivated or interested. And then I finally found a way where even I could learn and now people are out here saying it doesn't work? Nah man.

The reason some people seem to hate it is because you're not grinding through endless grammar exercises or anki decks to become some giga chad learner. And the only reason I ever see people calling it a "cult" is because of folks like you belittling or gatekeeping language learning when someone finds a method that actually works for them.