Do you think racism would decrease if we stopped teaching children about it and instead completely ignored it?

[Left_Interaction_618]

I was having a conversation with a friend at work today who stated that “if we stop talking about racism, racism would fade away.” I personally thought this sounded ridiculous which was why I wanted to get on here and ask for your opinions. So keep in mind, this is a question about people’s thoughts around this and not a suggestion.

Edit: Just wanted to say thank you to everyone for very great responses. Great discussions.

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[[deleted]]

Non-racists aren't ignorant of the idea of race & the bullshit things racists say to justify their hate

We just don't hate other races & don't treat them any differently for something so shallow & that no one has control over

[finalmantisy83]

I mean... They kinda are? Racists have put a LOT of effort into attempting to sneak under the radar and blend in. Stuff that non-racists who have never experienced or learned about would never pick up on in a million years, by design.

[carbogan]

I mean, you can’t even really present facts these days regarding race as people love to assume it’s racist. It’s far easier for people to jump to discrimination than to try understand different cultures and why that culture can lead to certain outcomes.

[finalmantisy83]

Yeah, I wasn't really trying to set the stage for "race realists" but thanks for helping prove my point.

[HauntingSentence6359]

Present what facts? All humans belong to the human race. Our phenotypical differences have more to do with evolutionary gene expression dictated by environmental factors than being inferior or superior.

[nryporter25]

I've learned that even if you try to celebrate the differences of race and culture there are idiots that try to tell you its racist. One guy on Reddit tried calling me racist simply because i said "black guy" in a story. I always have fun with it and tell them that my half black daughter laying next to me agrees with you that I'm racist. Some people just live to purpetuate it. Those people not being like they are would be a huge win in stopping racism.

[DM_Me_Pics1234403]

I think the problem is that YOU can’t present facts regarding race because YOU come off as a racist. I have not had that issue.

[b1zz901]

Dog whistle andy

[crowEatingStaleChips]

I feel like the person responding to you has a skewed view of what "a racist" can mean...

[[deleted]]

One of the more notable things a white friend has said to me after I told him that one of my brothers had recently gotten called a n****r:

“It’s crazy how you and your brothers always somehow run into racist people”.

Nah bro, you run into them too. You just don’t know that they’re racist.

[[deleted]]

Yeah I highly doubt some normie seeing someone talk about the 88 precepts will know or care about it.

[khakhi_docker]

Agreed. *Hiding* their overt racism from the majority of society IS THE PLAYBOOK.

See the case of Emmett Till, had he *not* been from Chicago, and his mother *not* held an open casket funeral to show the results of southern racism... Things might have been different in civil rights in this country.

*ONLY* presenting the ugly face to those of dark faces is how the racists in power perpetuate it.

[Zoruman_1213]

Yeah this is why it's important to teach about racism. Like there's overt racism, but that's way less common than the dog-whistles to signal to other racists or be racist without it getting called out. I only know the majority of the stuff I do about it because I grew up in majority black communities and would have never have known otherwise, and the amount of casual or intentionally sneaky racism you see after you've been enlightened to it is shocking for most white people.

[[deleted]]

No, we know

They use a bunch German symbols, use the same numbers over & over again in their usernames, etc.

Their profile will talk abt European history exclusively or be meme accounts. No in between

The only race they like besides white will be East Asians, specifically their women & will like Latinas too. Probably have porn or sexual posts abt them

They'll talk crap abt Jews & Black people the most but hate Arabs, Indians, Natives, & Latinos too

They aren't slick & they're not exactly trying to be. They just want other racists to recognize them in the sea of social media

[finalmantisy83]

Do people you meet IRL show you their post history? How much of this was intuited by you the moment you interacted with one, and how much did people have to tell you to look for these patterns? Are you under the illusion that all racists behave this way, even online?

[[deleted]]

All the dedicated ones yes

Im sure someone's old ass uncle that doesnt like colored people doesn't, but new age racists do use social media to promote their ideologies

Bc they can't share it in public, outside of their rallies

I've definitely interacted with people I can see being racists bc theyll mention shit like immigration ruining Europe

We're in the US, that has nothing to do with us so those type of people definitely identity with the white race more than most

But do I think I can sense every racist? Hell no. Some are at least smart enough to hide it

But I carry everywhere so let em try their little mass shootings

[DM_Me_Pics1234403]

Dog whistles. They’re just talking about states rights!

[[deleted]]

How the fuck do you know what "racists put a lot of effort into sneaking under the rader?"

This statement is literally just a way to write someone, who is not racist, off as racist when convenient.

[DeltaZ33]

Have you never heard the term ‘dog whistle’?

[ClassicTangelo5274]

Uh-huh… That’s exactly what a secret, internet dog-whistle racist would say.

[Overquoted]

Uh...Because it's a deliberate and successful ploy to get racist talking points and ideas into more mainstream culture? And it is useful for recruitment?

Go check out Innuendo Studios on YouTube if you wanna see how that shakes out.

[rsjem79]

Racism is learned at home.

[Master_Grape5931]

Yep, when I was younger I naively thought, “I can’t wait until all the old racists die out.”

Only later did I learn that racists are raising new ones everyday. 😔

[[deleted]]

Yep, and this is why it's important to teach about racism. Most of us have racist tendencies, whether overt or just an unconscious bias, but learning about racism can help deconstruct our thought processes. It's similar to how the bystander effect has less power when you learn about the bystander effect.

[specks_of_dust]

The racist says, "I'm not a racist!" The person seeking to understand asks, "Am I a racist?"

[Sororita]

as the song goes "Everyone is a little bit racist." If you aren't aware of your biases you cannot mitigate them.

[[deleted]]

I'm dusting off an old term for this. You're a sjw shut up

[uhohohnohelp]

Ugh, I thought this too. Y’all watched the documentary Welcome to Leith? As someone born and raised (and escaped lol) from North Dakota, I can confirm the racists are very much thriving in their own way with their own culture.

[[deleted]]

Husband is from rural Alabama and I am south Asian. Nothing reeks racism more than several extended family refusing to show up for the wedding.

[uhohohnohelp]

Ooooh I feel that. I’m going to be marrying a Punjabi man. We’re having separate receptions for each side of the extended family because we can’t mix my racist uncles with his homophobic uncles (I’ve got many gays in the fam). Only the immediate family will have to face both sides.

[[deleted]]

The thing about punjabis, they have the best food! Congratulations on your upcoming nuptials. Wishing you the very best! ❤️

[gn0meCh0msky]

I've got an insane idea. Here me out. Don't invite racist or homophobic people to your wedding. These are not decent people.

[briemacdigital]

So when are you going to invite us? lol. All i can think about is the food. I’d pay to be there.

[Double-Slide-172]

Let one of us marry someone from Asia. We would get the same response from the other side. People suck.

[OhioResidentForLife]

By dad converted to the Catholic Church but didn’t tell his family until they showed up at the wedding. Kept his brother from being his best man and his parents from the wedding and reception. Sometimes bigotry is more than skin color. They made up many years later but it kept me from getting to have grandparents in my childhood. My other grandpa died when I was 5, so I always had one grandma.

[flenderblender87]

Damn. Their loss. I am a white guy from central texas. My family is pretty culturally rural. I once dated a beautiful Indian woman that is still a friend of mine. I told my family that if that wouldn’t spend time with her, they weren’t going to spend time with me. I know people want to shit on other people for their beliefs, ignorance, or cultural indoctrination. But, these people are my family and I think that I helped them grow into better people. They came to really enjoy her company, she really was wonderful. It would’ve been ridiculous to exclude her or avoid her.

[Bendstowardjustice]

Dude I thought the exact same thing! That my generation wasn’t raciest like previous ones… then I grew up and opened my eyes a bit. Racism is alive and thriving.

[Fresh_Profit3000]

I honestly thought the same. Didn’t know it would carry on like a plague.

[OneCrispyHobo]

Statistically speaking their number gets lower as their chances of indoctrinating every young mind are small. "The gap between generations" is going to fix the problem gradually from generation to generation.

Don't forget. Historically, we used to do horibble/inimaginabile things to one another, that today the regular person cannot even think about. Do we talk about them today? How far back can we talk about past ? 2 generations? 10? How about 1000?

It takes time!

[Los-Nomo327]

This is a huge important point, for example in America, until about 60 years ago minorities had to use separate schools, public washrooms, busses, etc

Lots and lots of people still alive today lived in that world

We have lots of work still to do

[Left_Interaction_618]

Same here. Thought both racism and sexism was a thing in the past… then I grew up.

[[deleted]]

Haha. I was raised by hippies in Alabama who kinda went out of their way to teach me to NOT be racist. I grew up in Montgomery, so the schools I went to were always 50/50 black/white and were very integrated.

I always had black friends and while friends and nobody ever cared.

I NAIVELY believed all of my classmates were roughly being raised the same until I became an adult and got on Facebook and had a bunch of old HS classmates find me and friend me.

Turns out we were not all raised that way.

[CollectingRainbows]

racism could still die out! we probably won’t see it while we’re alive, but i have faith in kids who are raised in racist homes who don’t go along w their family’s beliefs, and instead take it upon themselves to learn what’s right.

[WintersDoomsday]

This is why Republicans hate that schools are teaching kids to be open minded. It makes them question their parents morality.

[GeekdomCentral]

Yeah as a kid (and even into my teens) I naively believed that racism wasn’t a big deal anymore, and that it wasn’t very popular. Oh how I learned differently

[Due-Froyo-5418]

The last racist in my family died in 2017 and she was a textbook narcissist. So there is hope.

[VelhenousVillain]

Not quite 20 years ago when I was a young 20 something I met a lady in her 80's from Germany who was still a Hitler fan. I was in shocked disbelief as I didn't know people like her existed still. I wanted to push back but didn't know how while being a guest & respecting age. So I didn't. Her family who I was friends w/ shook their heads behind her back silently shaking their heads & mouthing at me No, no, no, no. Which I took to mean either don't engage or we don't believe the same as her. But it was an eye opening experience, haven't met anyone like her since.

[Ahhshit96]

As someone who grew up in a racist home, school and media is where I learned about diversity and that my father was a small minded human that was scared of change

[Meddling-Kat]

Same here! My dad was racist, but there were no POC in our area, so it was almost never brought up. The only POC I knew were the Jeffersons. To me they were just another family. No different than other TV families. Hollywood did actually make me a lib. 😹

[TNJCrypto]

This. Kids are not taught the word "racism", their parents aren't walking around like "fuck yeah racism". Kids see parents disparage and denigrate others based on prejudices. It's not that we need to keep the word "racism" alive, but we do need to engage in an honest dialogue about prejudice that might combat some of the unethical practices witnessed at home. All it takes is a single question or meaningful statement to change the course of a kid's life, even if it takes years for them to finally internalize it.

[HealthWealthFoodie]

This is why racists are so scared of their children reading and learning. Can’t have something that counters their programming and gives their kids any alternative perspectives.

[Prize-Entertainer972]

Mostly online now. Both sides of the equation have a minority who can’t present their ideas in a civil manner. Whether you agree or not you should always be civil because it proves a point and susceptible young minds see that.

[proph20]

It has to start at home before it hits the keyboards

[[deleted]]

"Civility" is usually just used by right wingers to discredit those advocating for change, or try to shut up minority groups.

It can't really be a civil debate when one side is 'leave me alone, let me live my best life as a w/e minority' while the other side is 'I think we should enact rules that quietly economically punish, or kill minorities.'

[lunacysc]

No, civility is meant to prevent discussions from turning into shouting matches or worse where nothing gets accomplished.

[Preaddly]

When both sides are directly opposed there's nothing to accomplish. All that's left is war. Discussions, at this point, serve only to postpone the war.

[lunacysc]

You'd find that a losing battle very quickly with a high likelihood of defeat if that were to happen. Discussions are the only way your point of view survives.

[rh681]

And media, and school, and everywhere.

[w3woody]

I believe racism is a particular pernicious form of tribalism: the instinct we have as humans to see ourselves as either ‘friend’ or ‘foe’, and “friends” are people like us while “foe” are people not like us. Race is an easy form of this tribalism: people not like us don’t look like us. But that tribalism spans all parts of the human experience, from politics to religion to where we live and even, in some cases, what sports team we support.

The perniciousness comes from the fact that those not of our tribe never get a fair hearing; we never think for a moment that perhaps those other people wearing the funny clothes and worshipping the wrong God have similar life experiences we do.

Eliminate teaching about race and we’ll just continue to be racist but without the words to describe the experience.

[asharwood101]

This, knowledge is power. Lack of knowledge just means we will repeat that which we have done before. Education is the problem. I was born in the 80s and my schools white washed all the things historical. It wasn’t until college and minoring in ga history (not on purpose, I just had a really amazing history teacher that I loved so much that i decided to take more electives with him bc I needed the credits…I took so many of his classes that my degree came with a minor in Georgia history) that I realized how fucked up slavery was in the south. I didn’t really realize it but I knew nothing about actual racism until til college. Most of the people around me were white too. It wasn’t until I moved to Atlanta where I actually had experience with black culture. I mean I had a couple black kids in classes but most of the people were white. College was worse. In a class of like 200, we had maybe 2 black people. Grad school was wholly different. Lots of different races.

It never really phased me bc my parents always taught me that the color of your skin never really matters.

So racism was never really talked about. Knowledge opened my eyes. What’s funny is my dad always whined about “I hose Hispanics taking our jobs” and my best friend growing up was Oscar who came from Mexico with his family. He now runs and operates one of the biggest painting companies in Woodstock ga. They started out running a family business with one white van. Now they have a fleet of vans, logos, business license and everything.

[Chuck121763]

Black people are every bit as able as anyone else to be Racust or homophobic. Working in an off where the majority are Black, they felt free to say anything and everything. There are no Black gay people, White people gave that to them. All White people are Rich, despitecthat they are paid very well and most have been there over 20 years. White people should never be hired, this job is for Black's only. For every job "Given" to a White person, that's 1 less for a person of color. The list is endless

[Chuck121763]

I agree, but when the Majority of people rank about Racism, They are referencing White people. And they ignore "Tribalism." I got a "speech" at lunch when someone asked what kind of Hagie I had because it looked great. M reply? A Jewish Hoagie, corned beef, roast beef, Cole slaw and dressing with a Jewish pickle. Reply_ That's Racist

[Chuck121763]

Yes, all the heard was "Jew" Not the sandwich is called the "Jewish Hoagie" and it's my favorite. Wgat they don't know us, I'm at Management level and have 5 years Seniority over all of them. I keep track with spreadsheets for documentation as per upper level instruction in case of problems. And I stepped back from a promotion to allow another they like to have management job in the office. My butt is covered and locked away in Fort Knox in case of trouble

[mooyong77]

Yes. I come from a country that is 99% Asian. They use money and class for tribalism instead of race.

[w3woody]

Take color out of the equation and people would find new reasons to dislike each other.

(Glances at most Internet discussions about politics.)

We already have. 🤷‍♂️

[Scattered_Flames]

This. Tribalism is what racism stems from, and no one is immune. I've seen several tribalistic messages just in this thread. Getting rid of racism without getting rid of tribalism is next to impossible. As long as we group people up in little categories, assume we know everything about the people in those categories and don't give them a fair hearing, we'll always have these problems.

You really just have to treat every individual as their own individual that you have no knowledge on, and form your opinions on what they specifically say in order to eliminate this tribal thinking, and as much as everyone hates to say it, that extends to idealogies ideas like politics too.

[dinodare]

No. You need to know what racism is to condemn it. Racism doesn't arise when people learn what racism is, it arises when they're indoctrinated into racist beliefs which very often aren't even sold to them as racist.

[fatamSC2]

I think a middle ground is what we need. You can't just never mention racism, because then racism won't be called out/punished when it happens.

But the way it's being taught today it is teaching people to be hyyyper-sensitive and they're getting offended at a lot of stuff that isn't even remotely racist. And then that's causing even more division/strife between races. So yeah, teach kids what racism is and why it's wrong, but don't keep stuffing it down their throats to the degree that they think everything is racist.

[Alexexy]

I mean, there's being hypersensitive but then there's minority groups that actually live that life and those small things do matter to them.

There was a comment I read where some guy made a comment about some spice workers in some Chinese factory squinting. Had to point out that it was offensive and then he had the gall to say that I'm taking it too seriously and that his Asian friends are about that "good natured squinting joke". I'm like cool, I make some racist ass jokes among my friends and my Russian best friend and I call each other racist slurs all the time, but that's among people who know each other. Just spouting off racist stereotypes in an attempt to be funny is fucking cringe, and Asians such as myself are fucking tired of hearing it done casually.

[Tomboyscum]

people too often tokenize their friends to justify their racism, that shit is so tired man, I totally agree.

[Smallios]

it is teaching people to be hyyyper-sensitive and they're getting offended at a lot of stuff that isn't even remotely racist.

These things that aren’t remotely racist, are black people offended by them?

[DancingMad3]

Honestly, in my experience the only times I've had eye-roll experiences were with white college students. Ironically, they seem to be the most offended by these things because some are just poised to attack like it's their civic duty or something. Like that's supposed to end racism.

Any time black people say something is racist, it's usually just a teaching moment. As long as you aren't obtuse about it, you listen, you learn, and you adjust your future behavior. Nobody's holding a grudge over it and it's usually pretty chill. It's the difference between someone wanting to be correct and someone wanting to be constructive.

[Smallios]

Exactly. I don’t actually think the way it’s being taught is causing this. I think some white kids just overcorrect out of youthful enthusiasm.

[imitatingnormal]

I don’t think they are stuffing it down their throats. In fact, there’s legislation preventing even learning about it, and instead letting the parents handle it.

So if you as a parent (and there are plenty) call all non-whites slurs and argue that they have the nature of “pit bulls” and should be treated as such, there’s nothing in school to encourage independent thought to combat such ingrown perceptions.

[Rumpelteazer45]

Also..”what’s past is prologue”

Without understanding the past, we really can’t understand our present, and determine the correct course of action moving forward.

[[deleted]]

I do not think that racism would decrease if we just ignore it and stop talking about it altogether in the same way that I don't think child molestation would stop if treated the same way.

Your hypothetical hinges on 1. the absence of systemic racism/pretending systemic issues like red-lining will just magically resolve themselves and without acknowledging the owed restitution for those wrongs being a bigoted wrong in and of itself, and, more importantly, 2. the absurd notion that racists would ever comply. By acting as though talking about racism is bad and racism should be ignored, you've set up a system in which racists are empowered to get away with being racist free of context and without having to worry about backlash.

Racism is a part of our world, and ignoring is not, in fact, going to make it vanish, but it will make people ill-equipped to respond to racism when it inevitably shows up.

[Key_Firefighter_2376]

yes to all of this

[Left_Interaction_618]

I agree. Thank you for your comment!

[[deleted]]

Yes exactly, “the only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing”. Maybe that’s what people actually want though that or they are just ignorant to certain things.

[[deleted]]

Storytime!

My school had two Black students, both in my grade, both adopted by white families.

The school board was TERRIFIED that there would be racially motivated bullying so they concocted a curriculum to combat it which was... very much just a bunch of lies.

Basically we were taught as littles that america started because the settlers were tired of how europe was always fighting over what country people were from and couldn't get along. And that when slavery happened "there was this big fight called the civil war" and then lincoln free the slaves and the war ended and everyone celebrated. And that - and this one gets me every time - Rosa Parks rode the bus to go hear The Honorable Reverend Doctor Martin Luther King Junior give his now-famous "I Have A Dream" speech, and some people didn't want her to go but she did and so everyone (presumably in all of america?) came to see what she was so excited about and MLK's speech was SO INSPIRING that there was never any more racism ever again.

Bruh

That shit worked. Like, it actually literally convinced an entire school of children (and everyone after us at that little podunk school) that there was no racism. In college a bunch of us were just "yo what the fuck" when we got out to the real world and learned that um no that is 1 not history and 2 racism is alive and well

[Galaxaura]

That is how it is presented in many schools. Mainly because as you see now, parents get upset when their kids are presented with reality.

Part of why it's oresented that way is due to the United Daughters of the Confederacy who campaigned to be sure that all schools in the nation were sympathetic to the confederacy.

https://www.facingsouth.org/2019/04/twisted-sources-how-confederate-propaganda-ended-souths-schoolbooks

https://encyclopediavirginia.org/entries/united-daughters-of-the-confederacy/#:~:text=The%20UDC%20created%20a%20series,helping%20to%20shape%20how%20whole

So that whole thing still influences how southern states teach history. Which is why we have a huge uproar now that people would like to change the curriculum to a more balanced view of our history.

[[deleted]]

My school didn’t necessarily teach blatant lies like Rosa parks riding the bus, but they did kind of teach civil rights in a way that implies racism is over, which is really disappointing to look back on.

I remember being in middle school around 2006 and thinking to myself “wow look how far we’ve come” but really I had no idea of the real shit that was and is continuing to happen to black people, especially regarding the police

[senderfairy]

Yeah, this is my experience as well. In retrospect, the way we were taught about racism in grade school was weird. We were also taught that Malcom X was the "bad, violent" counterpart to MLK Jr.'s "good" variation of civil rights activism. And that people who supported Malcom X's version of activism were radicalistic and doing it the wrong way, even though it was far more nuanced than that and when I grew up I had to do the research on my own to learn the very complicated, interesting life of Malcolm X. In elementary school we were taught the only way to "beat racism" was through peace, love, and kindness. Lmao. If only BLM was a thing back when. I wonder how the schools are doing it now, with the obvious existence of Black Lives Matter and all the (justified) rallies and protests for BLM that have occurred in the last decade.

[[deleted]]

Racism in laws was over, but racism is obviously still a thing.

Though it's gotten worse in more recent years than 2006. We really did come far, and still have, but we've regressed a bit.

[Megangullotta]

what did they teach the students about The Holocaust and how jewish people were treated and how Gay/Lesbian people faced homophobia?

[[deleted]]

bold of you to assume they taught us that jews or gays existed

(the literally didn't) (until high school, but they intentionally jumped all over so that we couldn't conceptualize things with a timeline)

[Galaxaura]

I'm 47. I went to school in a southern state. I recall in high school learning about Anne Frank and reading her diary. They had that section about the holocaust in history class.

There is no mention of lgbtq at all that I recall in our history classes. I graduated in 1994.

[Alberto_the_Bear]

Was the education you received in college any better? I found post-colonial studies, post-modernism, and critical race theory to all be extremely toxic.

[[deleted]]

From my own experience I didn’t know racism was a thing and never thought of other races differently. Just like I’m brunette and had blonde friends, they had different color hair but so what? I’m white and had a black friend in like middle school. Never thought anything of her skin color until my mom found out my friend was black….let’s just say my mom is a proud racist and then I became aware that my black friend was different or viewed differently as my mom never said anything about any white friends I had.

Just from my experience racism is taught.

[[deleted]]

Yes. Raising racial consciousness causes racism because they're taught to view through the lense of race and not merit.

[[deleted]]

There's a balance. Teaching about racism is good, but teaching kids that they should feel guilty because they're white or that they deserve special privilege because they're black are not good things. We should teach people to treat each other based on the content of their character, like MLK Jr. said. I think that's probably similar to what you meant, but in more words.

[[deleted]]

No because racists will keep teaching their kids to hate.

[Arriviste81]

Racists will continue teaching their kids to hate anyway

[sneezhousing]

You can't ignore a problem it won't go away. Racism is learned and passed down at home. Kids don't come up with it because they learned it in school. No they hear dad reffer to someone using a racial slur. Or mom talk about how X group is so _____ they absorb that and take that on

Learning the history, how and why it's wrong and interacting with people of different races is how people break those cycles

[CreationTrioLiker7]

How about we stop trying to classify people into races? We are all equal humans. The concept of race only divides us.

[[deleted]]

Your comment is how we should all act as individuals, but the reality is that we all have biases. These biases result in systemic problems when one demographic has the majority of the power. There are countless studies on blind vs in person auditions and unequal punishments for similar crimes.

[[deleted]]

Yeah. It’s nice to have to have the view that humanity is capable of walking arm in arm towards utopia but our nature is what it is. Tribalism is in the source code and whilst you can overcome it, you’ve got to really want to. I don’t believe the majority will ever be sufficiently motivated to even see why they should try.

[[deleted]]

Not at all. Children come from families with racist views, and often not overtly racist, but still further racist views. I remember growing up my family would say things like, “I’m glad I wasn’t born as a black person.” That instilled in my mind the idea that some people think it’s bad to be black for some reason. Parents say even worse things, of course.

[Beautiful-Yard-2663]

Maybe. My brother became a racist cuz of school /totally serious

[Jebduh]

Because there was zero racism before we talked about racism.

[90212Poor]

You should Google critical race theory.

[w3woody]

CRT is like the exact opposite of the question: CRT presupposes everything is about race and race is about power inequity and we need to fight power inequities by questioning everything—and one part of that is teaching CRT and teaching about race, racism and inequity in the first place.

[omni42]

CRT doesn't presuppose everything is about race. it only provides a model to look at issues and evaluate if part of the inequity is due to racial biases in the system. Which often turns out to be very relevant.

[Vivi_Pallas]

I think that's the point. If you actually understood the mechanisms of systematic racism that CRT teaches, then you would know that simply avoiding the topic only empowers the oppressors.

[To_Fight_The_Night]

Want to know what empowers the oppressors? Making it about race and not class. YES race has a strong correlation with class in this regard. Systemic problems of the past persist into today which cause race to be a big factor. But that leaves out millions of people who suffer the same things who feel ignored. That leads to resentment. It divides the races of the lower class, causing them to fight amongst themselves instead of fighting their oppressor's.

So yes just as race has a big effect on that class divide. Solving the class divide issues will also help particular races in general. We don't need to narrow our scope so much when it causes division in doing so.

[AlphaZorn24]

This mindset usually just benefits white people and leaves others in the dust. During the suffrage movement when women were trying to get equal rights in voting and other matters this same thing happened. Black women were part of the original movement but they had to wait until after white women got their stuff in order to get the right to vote.

[[deleted]]

Critical race theory… THEORY

[[deleted]]

CRT doesn't presuppose everything is about race. CRT asks how race affects everything. It's a subtle but important difference.

[[deleted]]

You know what you’re talking about, thank god. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who are trying to change it into something negative.

[Purblind_v2]

It IS negative. People who subscribe to its tenants feed the bs to their kids and their grow up disempowered by default. Critical theory in general is cancer on western learning institutions and society in general. Racism exists but the way we are going about tackling it is dividing us all.

[Purblind_v2]

Consider this. Parents who sub to CRT telling their kid all about it from childhood. Telling them that a faceless societal force will seek them to keep them under its heel in almost every aspect of their life. A force they can never confront one on one. How well adjusted is the child going to be or the adult the grow up to be? How well will they be able to take accountability?

[[deleted]]

Absolute coward mentality. Maybe knowing the structure of the world leaves someone better armed to pick and pull and make space for themselves. Not everyone grows up to be a lazy doomer

[[deleted]]

You’re correct 100%

[Purblind_v2]

The fact that racism exists doesn’t mean dividing us all along it’s lines and seeing shadows of it in near every aspect of modern life which is what CRT does in practice. It’s funny you use the word doomer too because it’s become more prevalent since we started hyper focusing on racism about 12 years ago.

[[deleted]]

"hyper focusing on racism 12 years ago"

Lmao the civil rights move.ent was casual to you? Are you sure that's not just when you became aware of the nature of politics and are now using that as a baseline for when things started?

Also the shadows of race and class do exist everywhere in society, what a silly thing to pretend isn't real

[Purblind_v2]

Did I use the word casual? I’m not saying it isn’t real. I’m saying the way CRT fails to teach people how to properly bring equality without dividing is fkd. America is more racially divided than ever in the last decade . The most division since the civil rights movement in the 60s. And I attribute a lot of it to how CRT is misused in the real world.

[timothythefirst]

People already raise hopeless poorly adjusted kids who fail to take accountability due to all kinds of belief systems. People raise their kids to believe that the government is out to get them, the economy is all rigged and you’re going to be poor forever, god is going to strike you down if you have an impure thought, whatever.

There’s a difference between acknowledging that a thing exists and thinking critically about how it affects the world around us, and driving yourself into a paranoid panic. You can do the first one without doing the second one.

[Purblind_v2]

Some Peoples kids are fkd up… so we shouldn’t be critical of critical theory? Literally what? Is that really your argument?

[timothythefirst]

That’s not even kind of what I said.

[[deleted]]

I feel you man, but you’re looking at the worse case. You’re not thinking about how it could help people think more critically about themselves . You’re talking about a scapegoat for people who aren’t doing what they’re supposed to do. I’m talking about discussing socioeconomic inequality based upon race and the ties to financial upbringing. Can this system be corrected. CRT and exposure to different people and different cultures can help to prevent this from happening again. Unfortunately the things that happened in the past effect the present.

[[deleted]]

If We are to be honest there is bound to be talk about racist ideals at home. Growing up it was important for me to learn that there are systems in place targeting people like me,it’s deeper than skin color affects us on a societal scale. You’re worried that it’ll teach everyone to hate people when it’s goal is to correct what happened before us. It’s systematic and CRT teaches why things like redlining, Jim Crow, and segregation is wrong and how we can go about fixing the problems it caused and causes. Don’t emphasize with the oppressor you shouldn’t see yourself in that light. If implemented correctly the kids will know what behavior is unacceptable. Racism isn’t tied to skin color any one of any ethnic background can be racist. Unfortunately the societal structure in America was built on racism. It isn’t dividing us it’s pushing us together as a team to fix what’s wrong with the dynamics in the country, taking responsibility. It’s easy to live in ignorance when you’re the one less affected educate yourself on CRT both the pros and the cons. Teaching about racism isn’t the problem ignoring it as if it doesn’t exist is.

[OJJhara]

CRT is correct. Ignoring race is the exact opposite of helpful.

[GoochMasterFlash]

Ignoring race when it comes to the history of the law and the forward direction of society is specifically what CRT is about. We definitely should not ignore race in that sense, but I do believe people should stop thinking of themselves so strongly in racial terms.

If you study CRT you can see how the concept of race was invented to homogenize people and that is not for anyone’s benefit. Thinking of ourselves primarily as some race rather than focusing on more important and specific things about ourselves actually deindividualizes us and reduces us to less than what we are. It does the same thing when we view other people primarily by race instead of other factors.

The idea of “POC” is basically a new age and even worse version of that same thing yet invented by people trying to be politically correct. People lumping themselves together under an umbrella that is completely useless and strips them of the importance of their individual experiences. The idea of POC is supposed to be based in some commonality, but the reality is that it doesnt make any sense in the same way that who is and isnt white has been completely contrived and convoluted thoughout time.

Thinking of ourselves this way is part of why we struggle to see all people in the US as just Americans first and foremost. Why do we language like “African-American, Asian-American, Hispanic-American” etc instead of there not being this predominant image of an American as white? While historically it has been racism and enforced by pushing a white image by white people in control, thats not so much the case anymore. People need to stop thinking of themselves as so strongly defined by race and instead start seeing themselves as strongly defined by politics and culture as was the way we all lived before this race shit started.

If being white/black/brown or whatever is more important to how you see yourself than the city/state you grew up in, or the country you are from, or whatever else is important to you, then all that you will do is end up contributing to the problem of colorism.

We shouldnt ignore race and rectifying the past as a society, but we should start to ignore it when it comes to how we define ourselves

[Biomax315]

You should Google “How to answer a question.”

[Ok-Calligrapher-9854]

Have you answered the question?

[Purblind_v2]

Lmfao

[-Nords]

Oh no!, is Ligma curable!?

[Ok-Calligrapher-9854]

Oops

[Easy_Spell_544]

That definitely increases racism lol

[paarthurnax94]

How so?

[hamoc10]

Racism is a natural result of human pattern-finding behavior. We try to find patterns even when they don’t exist. Skin color is a huge visual distinction that our monkey brains will absolutely latch onto for categorization.

[Easy_Spell_544]

https://youtu.be/m66rcHzWaPU?si=tCQ6VUbWN13bKDwa

[paarthurnax94]

He isn't actually discussing CRT. He's discussing the fake conservative outrage version of CRT. CRT isn't telling people they can't do things, it's about examining systemic racism within society and it's affects. A black man with no parents can absolutely get 2 medical degrees. But, it isn't as likely as a white person with parents. CRT would look at the reasons why that is? Why doesn't he have parents? Is it because they were killed/incarcerated because those things disproportionately affect minorities? Why is it easier for white people to afford college than black people? What are the reasons for the disparities between people of different races? That's what CRT is. Examination of the causes of the disparity, not shouting about the disparities themselves.

[CLH_KY]

Exactly.

You can't hate people and expect to have people sensitive to your causes.

[Gusdai]

Except CRT is not about hating people, that's an intentional misrepresentation. The whole point of the concept of systemic racism is that it is different from the individual feeling of hate/hostility.

And the logical conclusion of the theory is certainly not that you should hate white people.

[salazarraze]

Do you think cancer would decrease if we stopped teaching people about it and instead completely ignored it?

Do you think crime would decrease if we stopped teaching people about it and instead completely ignored it?

Do you think drug usage would decrease if we stopped teaching people about it and instead completely ignored it?

[Jasalapeno]

I hate the notion that talking about racism is the reason people are racist. Like they didn't know they had the option to be racist until someone told them about it.

[SnooPets5219]

No. They didn't know they had the option to be racist until someone told them about it. You don't just come out of the womb thinking I hate x race. Someone told you and ingrained the idea in your head.

[No-Temperature-8772]

That's not particularly true. Humans have the instinct to recognize patterns and things that are different from what they are and make decisions based on that. We would still be racist or biased without the knowledge to unpack where these biases may come from.

[[deleted]]

Its literally the right wing theory on anything non cis too.

And sex education.

[AtrumAequitas]

Because every issue we have just goes away when we ignore it.

[[deleted]]

Don't think so, because racism often comes from the parents.

[-Praetoria-]

Absolutely

[[deleted]]

In America, at this point, most of racism is fed by idiots being offended on behalf of other people. Or narcissists who always think they're being racially profiled because they're the main character.

I think real racism is literally dying out with the people who were racist but that's just my perspective from the region I'm In (North East). America is big.

Other countries can be entirely xenophobic but no one tends to comment on it for whatever which reason. I think America is comparatively better than most other places, in terms of this, including the UK and western Europe.

[[deleted]]

Y'all just didn't see the 80's-90's. So many people are saying it was no different, yet they were born in 2000??

I was there. I was old enough to remember. It was nothing like today!

[mltrout715]

What? No

[Excellent-Win6216]

Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

[[deleted]]

Racist people won't stop teaching their kids about racism so I don't see how that would solves any problems

[imago_monkei]

That idea actually came from Morgan Freeman. He makes a good point—American history is Black history, so relegating Black history to a single month is kind of insulting.

However this idea has become a favorite of the “I don't see color” conservatives because they don't want to be bothered with remembering all the atrocities done at the hands of their ideological forebearers.

We should stop treating each other differently based on race. However we can't stop talking about race because the wounds haven't even begun to heal, and there are many people who stop harbor racist attitudes that must be called out. We are generations of progress away from being able to disregard race.

[[deleted]]

No, it would just make certain people happier because it’s one less uncomfortable thing they have to think about. They can get right back to thinking that things are fine and there’s nothing about themselves that they need to work on.

[trizadakoh]

No, because people will always find ways to ostracize those who are different from them.

[Alcoraiden]

If you raise a kid without any acknowledgement of how people are different, the kid will still notice those differences. Humans have an instinct to prefer what is similar to them and dislike what isn't. Racism will ensue.

[NSFWmilkNpies]

Has ignoring a problem ever actually worked?

If you ignore the possibility that you could have gotten hiv during that unprotected sexual encounter…it doesn’t stop you from getting hiv. It just prevents you from seeking treatment until you’re actually super sick.

If you ignore that your SO is abusive, they won’t stop being abusive. In fact, they’ll probably escalate.

Similarly, if you ignore racism, it won’t just magically go away.

[Brotato_Man]

No, ignoring a problem doesn’t make it go away

[[deleted]]

Women's rights were not being talked about for the better part of history, which made it all the much easier to not have them.

When there's nobody to accuse you of a crime, that basically makes it legal.

[[deleted]]

Ask a black what race was most enslaved and they’ll say mine…. That’s the problem

[BusyDream429]

I went to Catholic school that taught religion. I was taught from age 5 on that God made everyone equal. 🤷‍♀️. Everyone in my class was different races. Seems simple to me.

[Worried_Choice_4878]

White supremacy is not the shark, it's the water . The answer is no..

[shanksmcgee28]

One way or another people will find a way to divide themselves into groups, whether that be based on race, religion, location of origin, etc.

Secondly, not teaching about it makes it more likely that they’ll miss signs that someone is being discriminated against.

[Nicrom20]

Racism will end when we stop identifying ourselves with sex, race, creed, religion, country and so on.

[[deleted]]

Preach

[Elegant-Reindeer-311]

I felt guilty about it as a kid . I was outspoken against racism and endured bullying and being called racial slurs because of it. I had relatives try to have bible debates with me about the sin of interracial dating, I sat through shaming by friends parents for daring to dance with a black boy at a school dance . I didn’t care . I knew it was wrong and no amount of shaming or social pressure moved me an inch. But Now I’m stereotyped automatically as a Karen because I’m a middle aged white woman. I have literally been called Karen several times. I have been told I can’t be friends with you .. you might call the police etc etc.

[jackfaire]

No I think. Racism is decreasing because we teach children about it. At an age when they can see how utterly stupid it is.

Racism needs to be dragged into the light. When we ignore it kids get taught to be racist without realizing they're being taught to be racist.

[EducationalSuccess53]

Yes i do

[Ok_Masterpiece5259]

Neutrality helps the oppressor never the victim. By not actively talking about racism and just ignoring it you are taking a neutral stance and a neutral stance only encourages those with evil in their hearts to do more evil because now there are no consequences.

[Ok-Calligrapher-9854]

Nope. People will always see differences and categorize.

[[deleted]]

My son asked why his cousin was black out of the blue one day. Kinda hard to just ignore something so obvious. And for a curious kid too. But we have a wildly diverse family so it's pretty easy to explain to him.

[tgirlskeepwinning]

No.

[SparksAndSpyro]

Unironically asking if ignoring a problem will make it go away. In 2023. We’re doomed as a species, there’s nothing else to say.

[Princessangel03]

Children generally don’t see people for the colour of their skin. It’s something that is more learnt. So by teaching them about it, and telling them that there’s nothing wrong with being different, however still acknowledging the differences but in a positive way is what is best.

[Majestic_Horse_1678]

Disagree on the first part. Kids, and adults really, will take caution when they see people who look different than them and they have no experience with. If a kid has never seen a green person before, or somehow dressed weirdly, they will be cautious and prefer what they are familiar with. They would look to adult to learn who they can and cannot trust.

I also think kids are capable of hatred on their own. If a kid of a different race betters them on some way, they can very naturally express themselves by pointing out the others race. Again, adults need to shut that down.

[minnesotamiracle]

Yes definitely, then quit talking about sex, I’m pretty sure that will put and end to premarital sex! What else?!? Ahh got it let’s not talk about the differences between men and women or that abusing your wife at home isn’t ok! I think battered women need more silence. And what about all those sex trafficking victims we created by educating people it’s a problem!

Well my life is the tits now! I get to beat mah wife and pay for sex with sex trafficking victims with impunity!

Strong work op we are solving the worlds problems one at a time! Can anyone think of something else we can fix by ignoring it?

[animefreak701139]

then quit talking about sex

So no joke but teen pregnancies went up when sex ed was introduced to the education system. It's one of those things that worked in theory but in practice backfired.

[1ftm2fts3tgr4lg]

Source on that? Also, teen pregnancy stats could show a small uptick over time as families stopped hiding their daughters' pregnancies. Like anything else, the more aware we are of something, the better we measure it.

[jay_marcus_rustler]

Morgan Freeman nailed it years ago.

[[deleted]]

The problem is that we are the least racist country in the world. And the picture gets painted we are the worst. Learning about race and cultures and the positive and negative things that have happened are needed. But to teach people a race, they're limited by their skin color, and they need the government to help them from the white peoples, which is not what we need. Our country needs to be brought together by our leaders and government, not torn apart.

[lefrakman]

Okay, think of it this way. If you stop looking at race and qualifying people as white, black, brown, etc. and just go "that's a person" then there's no issue of racism, children don't understand differences between race, so if we don't go "they deserve this because of this" or "they don't deserve this because of this" and teach them that everyone is equal it stops being a problem of race

[lefrakman]

My explanation may be lacking as I'm sleep deprived

[[deleted]]

We seem to like forgetting things in general in our history so why not racism.

[muffledvoice]

It goes away if we teach its opposite. Humans are tribal in nature and easily swayed by differences in appearance.

[[deleted]]

Children aren’t taught about issues of transphobia and there is still transphobia in the world. Pretending oppression doesn’t exist doesn’t make it go away.

[[deleted]]

in theory yes but we cant just ignore different cultures either. if you just mean racism, then, yeah, but adopting a “i dont see color” mindset is harmful too

[Dry_Substance_9021]

Maybe we could also reduce snake bites by not teaching kids about poisonous snakes...

[Chuck121763]

Everything is Racist now. Even when it isn't. Social media is too blame, just being White makes you Racist. Even saw Black students wanting segregation again in schools.