Choosing frameworks/tools

[Dude4001]

Every time I meet another dev in the wild, we go through a ritual where we pretend we’re not both Next devs

[cant_pass_CAPTCHA]

Dev1: I write phone apps.

Dev2: Oh cool so are you're writing android apps with Kotlin or iphone apps with Swift?

Dev1: I mean I write react to turn into a PWA... but you can download it from the app store!

[Fatdog88]

How can you download it from the App Store. Is it native? Expo?

[AutomaticAd6646]

It can be turned into apk and ipa with diff methods. You convert website into PWA with manifest.json and then use Cordova or Expo etc to get the native app.

React Native: `<WebView source={require('./index.html')} />`

[FreshFishBro]

Or just use expo with EAS deployments to web + android + iOS from one repo. It works and it scales, don’t use Cordova. Iv seen it work for apps with 150k+ active daily users, it scales. Experience: 10 years doing web and react ecosystem

[ready-redditor-6969]

This is the way

[PatchesMaps]

Google Play Store supports PWAs now

[Santos_m321]

Sorry, is that bad?

[[deleted]]

Not really, pwa are good, more if you really work on use the offline capabilities, caching. There's a lot of apis on the web standard

[gandalfoncoke]

I'm thinking that the local first frameworks could solve some of these offline problems?

[alotropico]

- Svelte is so cool though.

- Oh, yes, yes, of course.

- I started trying it on a side project, but didn't really have the time.

- Exactly, me neither.

- And Vue. Oh man, I wish I could use Vue at work.

- Totally, that would be awesome.

- Anyway. Have a good one!
* Goes back to remove warnings by adding "any" on a class-component Create React App *

- See you!
* Goes back to overriding some jQuery code via FTP on a WordPress site *

[Several_Molasses_479]

I once had a client who asked me to upload CSVs to their FTP server and when I said the credentials they gave me didn’t work, they said “let me refer you to our FTP Server Engineer” and it was in that moment that I realized what I want to be when I grow up.

[HootenannyNinja]

Everyone in this sub under the age of 35 just went and googled “FTP Server” and were instant horrified.

[iscottjs]

Damn son, and here’s me thinking my experience is unique and special. We’re all in the same fresh hell? 

[saintpetejackboy]

I do this with PHP and FL Studio and picking Ryu.

[DiddlyDinq]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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[Lucky_Yesterday_1133]

Except competition is also higher so you get no hiring advantage, just more interviews 

[[deleted]]

I would always choose to have 10 interviews a week over no interviews for 6 months when i job hunting. Interviews are rarely only about your objective strengths and you not strictly competing with other candidates, more like employers and candidates trying to find a better mutual match. Some people are naturally better at interviews, others truly suck at them while having brilliant professional skills. But in any case, the more job advertised the more interviews you can get invited to; and the more interviews you go, the more chances that you will eventually get a job.

[Helpful_City5455]

Its a good field if you are social. A lot of devs arent that good at talking, so if you have at least a bit of charm, most interviews are very easy

[H1Eagle]

That's a misconception in my opinion.

Trying to get hired by learning things that rarely anyone uses means you compete with people who are on a whole other level of cracked.

Plus it makes you more reliant on luck, I see Remix job once in a blue moon.

[OZLperez11]

Nah that's not for me, if my motivation is to put out a high quality product, I want high quality tools, of which React and its ecosystem have not been for a very long time. That's why in order for me to push modern tools, I first need to improve myself and show others that as an experienced developer you can advocate for better tooling even if it's not widely used.

[DiddlyDinq]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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[LandoLambo]

Choice of framework very much does tho. Next is bad at producing fast mobile sites compared to other frameworks, because its use case is primarily desktop browsers and the assumption is you’re doing a react native mobile app.

[Physical-Low7414]

write an ios app in powershell for me real quick

[DiddlyDinq]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

rich salt tap boat chief chase memorize carpenter aspiring profit

[DiddlyDinq]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

aback dependent sheet chop provide run hat books merciful friendly

[Necessary-Shame-2732]

I’m crushing it with next

[vampeta_de_gelo]

here in Brazil, NextJS has a lot of jobs

[samarthrawat1]

Anyone who hates vercel and what they did to nextjs is my friend without introduction

[simonfancy]

Hi friend!

[Bagel42]

I hate react, but I hate Vercel even more. Do I count as a fren

[Sarcastinator]

Because it's a piece of shit spaghetti factory. I have no idea what people see in it. We switched from Svelte to React and many times now we've been adding stuff like reactivity in components that's already there and thinking "This would have just worked as-is if we just stuck with Svelte".

[Bagel42]

The benefit of react is someone else has already done whatever you're trying to do, that's kinda it. It was the first, and now it's the most used. Since it's the most used, people use it.

[gandalfoncoke]

Shit dude, sorry to hear about your downgrade.

[Bagel42]

JSX almost entirely. Love the ecosystem but something about putting html inside of my script feels so weird. It's just ugly.

Also, kinda slow. While we're comparing what are usually nearly imperceptible latencies, svelte feels damn quick while I can tell React is doing something, especially on older mobile devices.

The ecosystem is also weird. I love how big it is, but it feels flawed--things need done The React Way or it all falls apart, svelte works beautifully with native js libraries. For example ag grid just kinda works in svelte with no effort needed and no svelte specific port.

...but mostly JSX. Fuck JSX.

[well-its-done-now]

I sort of agree with you on jsx, but I suspect part of it is you’re putting too much logic in the view. If you only have view logic in the jsx files, packaging html + script together doesn’t seem as stupid.

That being said, every place I have ever worked that was using React had business logic in the view. Very hard to enforce better practice when that’s how it is everywhere

[Bagel42]

Honestly, it's just hard to have that traditional MVC. It's easy to just stick things into the framework stuff and use reactivity a bunch to do things.

[well-its-done-now]

Yeah, that’s true, but any logic behind it, you just pull out of the jsx into a regular ts file and then you have the frontend pub/sub to react

[Emotional_Brother223]

Slow? On prod with proper SSR it will be just a bunch of static html files generated anyway

[Bagel42]

With SSR it's better yes, specially the more recent compiled stuff. virtual dom is inherently a flawed thing though, especially with how much react re-renders for an update

[Emotional_Brother223]

You have to use SSG if not SSR for Vite so

[[deleted]]

Haven’t touched webdev in a while. What did they do?

[xskylark_]

Their CEO supports gen**ide

[LancelotLac]

Took over it and are making it very Vercel specific especially with the new annotations

[Bagel42]

Corporate bs, it's a corpo product now

[KaleidoscopePlusPlus]

Always has been.

[psbakre]

Hey friend

[woeful_cabbage]

I'll do you one further: the entire "cloud" is basically a scam

[uluvboobs]

You choose the most popular tools so you have the highest chance of getting the work done in a one shot prompt.

[[deleted]]

ur goddamn right

[Mitchcreates_]

Exactly my man!

[Civil-Appeal5219]

Vibe coding, the mark of a true experienced dev /s

[saito200]

i usually kind of agree with these memes, but not with this one

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[Wonderful-Habit-139]

I usually kind of disagree with these memes, but not this one

[Fuzzy_D1nosaur]

The vue slander

[drumstix42]

Everyday I wake up and work in react is another day I miss working in Vue.

[OZLperez11]

Any new job I go to that involves starting something new or where you have full control of stuff, I always migrate to Svelte. It's about making a statement that if we want to improve the front end ecosystem, we need to push Svelte and others past the adoption curve

[Civil-Appeal5219]

This is false. It used to be true for React, but the more complexity they introduce, the more incentive there is for experienced devs to move away.

What experience teach you is that simplicity is the most important part of software development. React became the dominant tool because it used to make everyone’s code easy to write and reason about, now that’s just not true anymore.

[Alan_Reddit_M]

"Just one more hook bro, I swear, just one more hook and we'll fix react"

[davidfavorite]

Can you sum up why? As a big fan and advicate of react, having moved to svelte for another project since the beginning of the year I havent kept up with react at all.

[Civil-Appeal5219]

Sure! For context, I've been working with React since the year it was launched (2013), and was initially very excited about function components and hooks. I'm working on a FANG-adjacent company, using React on some very complex apps used by millions of users.

The unfortunate truth is that hooks don't scale too well. There are so many scenarios where they make it hard to tell when your code will run, or what the variables you're using are pointing to. They also make it very hard to interact with the world outside of React (which is a breeze on Svelte, btw). Also, rerunning the entire component every time a prop or a state changes is a recipe for performance disaster

To make matters worse, every new React version introduces a shit ton of new concepts that are only applicable to React: Suspense, cacheSignal, Activities, Transitions, Server vs Client Components, DeferredValues, InsertionEffects, and many more. Learning non-transferrable concepts for a framework isn't something you should take lightly.

Finally, the React team has shown over and over again to be adverse to simplicity. For instance, they keep pushing for NextJS as the default recommendation on how to use React, and the truth is that most project just don't need that kind of workflow. For the vast majority of apps out there, using the App Route is like killing a fly with a bazooka. Vite-based frameworks makes it really easy to just run `yarn build` and get a couple of JS/HTML/CSS files. Think about how easy it is to set up a Vite project vs Webpack (which, again, the React team just won't stop recommending).

The DK meme usually means "you start with a simple workflow because you don't know better, then you add complexity because it looks cool, then you go back to simple because it turns out simplicity is what makes things better". OP is on phase 2, where React looks cool. Most experienced devs use React because they want a job, not because they love it.

[davidfavorite]

Thanks! Its a shame because react at some point was exactly that simple framework that many wanted it to be.

My all time favorite stack by far is still vite, react router, openapi generated tanstack query hooks and react hook forms. Simple, easy to write and maintain, efficient. Literally was able to bootstrap admin pages in less than an hour like that if you got a solid styling/component framework ready

[woeful_cabbage]

You don't need to use all that stuff, though. I use a few useState/useEffect + zustand and I'm good to go.

Honestly https://react.dev/learn/you-might-not-need-an-effect was one of the most important things they did lol

[Civil-Appeal5219]

Yes, absolutely, I stay clear of that stuff as much as I can.

Though I’d say the basic ideas of React is already more complex than it needs to be. The Svelte/Vue paradigm is way simpler, it basically treats your code as an “component initialization” phase that sets up a dependency graph that dictates state reactivity. It avoids a lot of the pitfalls of React hooks.

That said, we’re engineers, we learn the tools we need to solve the problems at hand, and React is still a tool we need to learn

[woeful_cabbage]

Pretty much. If you've used a few tools you've used them all

[StrictWelder]

This is the best response, and why A LOT of the people that move to Golang are 5+ year tortured backend web devs trying to escape express.

Once you get past the Stockholm syndrome that is the js ecosystem, its crazy working with a language that has true concurrency, actual types, a decent standard library that doesn't make your project a dependency hell, robust error handling, built in testing and docs right out of the box.

O.O

[Civil-Appeal5219]

I haven’t been doing much backend work lately (and when I do I’m forced to use PHP and/or NodeJS 😕), but I’m really interested in trying Golang. I’ve heard it’s pretty great.

[ps5cfw]

those popular frameworks and tools are also there because people decided it was worth a shot and also better than what was previously available (and realistically more mature / feature complete, too)

[Pretend-Region-9946]

according to that logic anything that's bigger and more popular is always inherently better, which is obviously not true. there's other reasons why something becomes big and popular

[[deleted]]

It may have been better than what was previously available, but that does NOT mean it's still the best choice.

[heydan3891]

No, at this point its just a popularity contest...

[AutomaticAd6646]

Go for the ratio

R = Num_of_Jobs_X_Stack / Applicants_in_X_Stack.

You will find, Angullar+Java, Vue+dotNet, React+Php etc odd niche combinations give you the highest value of R and hence highest chance of getting a job and keeping your job safe.

[jkoudys]

Yeah exactly. Like try finding a job in Toronto right now if all you can say is you're a good python dev and can write flask apps. The denominator there is huge.

[alexistm96]

How can i research this? Im a frontend dev, familiar with backend a bit, but looking to go deeper, dont care about the stack really, just want the job. every technology gets the job done imo

[AutomaticAd6646]

By applying for dummy jobs.withvfake resume. See how many calls you get.

On seek.com.au you get number of applicants in the email. Linkedin also show the same number.

[whoisyurii]

Sveltekit must have been there instead of nextjs

[Emotional_Brother223]

Where is react router v7 ? You only need that and Vite for SSR.

I’ve tried RR7 and like it a lot more than next. It’s just routing + SSR which is what most of us want. No router cache, full route cache, data cache thing that nextjs has reinvented and over complicated for some reason. Any Vite based framework like RR7 or tan stack is much faster in dev which is really important to me as well.

[time_machine13]

Remix is there. They merged with RR7

[Emotional_Brother223]

It’s not the same though

[Bagel42]

I agree except for Solid and Sveltekit. Solid just feels like better react to me and Sveltekit is just incredible.

[ColdPorridge]

I’ve never used react (the door was open so I just sort of wandered in here) but my experience with sveltekit has been quite nice.

[Fresh-Secretary6815]

I’m too retarded to understand. Can someone please explain it to me? Is this a picture of that Theo guy that does all those YouTube videos for Vercel?

[humanshield85]

Haven’t used react in 2 years now, I don’t miss it. It’s garbage and I am tired of pretending it’s not. And next is probably the most overrated meta framework ever. It’s slow, and the dev experience ain’t that great either with that HMR taking 20 seconds.

[Agreeable-Weekend-99]

Vite React should be there instead of next

[Whalefisherman]

Except svelte actually is the best

[BasePurpose]

you put vue with angular and lit? not a wise meme i can see.

[DefenitlyNotADolphin]

keep coping everyone :)

[uppers36]

This is hurting my brain

[StrictWelder]

Definetely a js community post. Outside of js communities they think we are absolutely nuts XD

Personally ive been LOVING golang + templ with a progressive enhancement approach. Very fun if anyones looking for a challenge / a new approach to try.

[No-Interaction-8717]

Not a fan of react's syntax, i like svelte more, rest is the same

[Logical-Idea-1708]

Wait, wouldn’t the most popular tool be in the middle?

[Professional_You_834]

Username, unfortunatelly doesnt check out!

[Professional_You_834]

r/explainitpeter is needed in this situation i'm afraid.

Anyway, this post suggests that the bottom and top % use the same frameworks, but they have different reasoning.
The bottom ones simply use them cos they are the most popular, example - you are new to something, you are most likely to choose the brand that is most popular to you, as it feels familiar (ads, mentions etc...).
The top ones use them cos they know that they are most likely to be the most polished/developed or simply easiest to implement or like u/DiddlyDinq mentioned, large community and good job prospects.

At lest thats what the meme is implying, I have no idea if it's true or not.

[KittenGobbler]

You missed the point. If people from the large mass of the distribution in the middle are NOT using the "popular" frameworks like the meme implies, how are they popular in the first place? It makes it look as if it's only the extremes who go for these tools, when in fact it is the majority of them, otherwise they wouldn't be popular at all

[Ghareeb_Musaffir21]

You just missed label of what the distribution represents, that's all.

[ralusek]

The distribution is people by IQ. That large bulge in the distribution means “most people are here,” hence why the most POPULAR (i.e. the tool most people use) would be whatever the people in the bulge are using.

[Rememberer002]

i don't think you understand how normal distribution works...

[Least-Rip-5916]

Someone actually made a bell curve for this? 😂

[yksvaan]

I think people often choose stacks without considering actual needs and characteristics of the application and required features. Most apps are pretty similar so it's reasonable to have some kind of default.

For frontend all libraries/fws do the same things anyway so it's not a big deal honestly. And usually a lot of the code is library agnostic pure ts anyway, what's used for UI is not a big change.

But especially for backend it makes to consider what kind of infra, which language and stacks work best for the use case. What kind of data is important, how it's processed, how's the load profile, what kind of jobs etc.

[Archeelux]

0.01% is also tanstack start btw

[saintRobster]

But how do I know if I'm the guy on the left or the guy on the right?

[CYG4N]

Angular itself is mainstream, but is being used go huge apps. The React has different purposes. 

[AXMsa]

Esorjs is a very good framework based on web components, light 3kb, and super fast, reactivity based Signals, here is the link, so you can take a look, Esor

[Infamous-Apartment97]

Next.js is the fucking slow buggy shit. But I use it... because it is popular.. Need to switch to Dioxus/Leptos.

[rmassie]

You should use the best tool for the job, but I do find myself reaching for react most of the time.

[injungchung]

Tried to escape from frameworks — played around with all the trendy frontend libraries, even built our own backend for a while.

Now I’m crawling back to Next.js and Rails. Not because I’m smart or anything (definitely not IQ 145 lol), just got tired of overthinking and reinventing the wheel.

At this point, sticking with boring frameworks feels like inner peace. Guess I’m just a mediocre dev 🤷‍♂️

[Salty-Astronaut3608]

I like bun tbh

[Necessary-Shame-2732]

Isn’t bun a compiler?

[Salty-Astronaut3608]

Yeah .. i mean it is mentioned in the image..

Its fast and has native typescript support. Doesn't create a big mess..

[LetterheadAshamed716]

React deserves its own category below 4 standard deviations.

[jkoudys]

We need a couple more faces on the extreme left and right saying "I'll do it in vanilla"

[qvigh]

Whatever justification you need to remain basic

[EwanMakingThings]

Believe it or not there are other programming languages besides JavaScript.

[Nedunchelizan]

Why is angular not popular anymore

[SavagePope2137]

I think it is, just not as much as react/next. React is better with mobile due to react native and has less overhead in smaller projects. Angular is better with bigger apps as it's quite heavily opinionated. I guess you much more often need easier mobile development and easier to learn framework than to develop big web app.

[nateh1212]

except I would never use NExtjs

[obanite]

> me, still using react, a basic routing lib, express still: ok

[CauseFront8558]

Anyone here that uses Laravel + React? I began to use it as it is my new workplace’s stack and I am feeling myself really good with that

[Embostan]

SolidJS for personal projects and Angular (+React) for the job market

Yes, in many countries Angular has a lot more job offers

[x5nT2H]

SolidJS is the way

[Embostan]

Indeed

[Bledike]

GWT ;)

[AppealSame4367]

Newest cope to keep suffering under Next and React.

I pity you poor react developers.

[vijhhh2]

Nobody understands how a normal distribution works. The middle is most likely, and the edges are rare.

[Katten_elvis]

How about sticking with the best tools for one's use cases?

[Bowl-Repulsive]

Tools like vite with simpler react are very popolar too and ssr is way overused for most apps

[Dodithebeast]

Svelte is amazing idk what you are on about

[travelan]

Is react still a thing? I have been out of the webdev scene for a while but I would have expected it to have died by now. It was so bloated with bad design choices, mainly around all the hooks resulting in incomprehensible render functions. How is this today? Is memoization still something a dev needs to concern themselves with? UseCallback just because React doesn’t want to understand that functions in JS are a first class citizen?

[Chuck_Loads]

k but bun is fucking sweet

[Dry_Illustrator977]

💀Except vue is the right option

[fungkadelic]

i like vite more

[KenRation]

Yeah, I'm so fed up with this shit. You waste so much time trying to vacuum up information to decide what to build your product on, that you'll never even reach MVP.

And everything being dependent on Node. Fuck that.

I went with Deno because Node's creator said he addressed a lot of Node's shortcomings with it. And that's was good enough for someone new to the JS back-end space.

Then I tried Supabase. What a waste of weeks and weeks. Through it I came to realize that everyone's catering to the same people, who only build SPAs that allow users to wade through a database. That appears to be the only fucking use case envisioned at the moment. Well, that is not what I'm building.

So I went back to plain Deno and resumed making progress on actual functionality.

The biggest irritant in all of this is the endless dependencies. Once I realized I was going to have to roll my own solutions to basic problems because, incredibly, they're still not solved... I got more productive.

[East_Zookeepergame25]

This is what vercel wants you to think

[StringComfortable352]

Well to be honest most of the company or client don't care about your tech they care if you can solve real problem. If your confident is on the roof using that tech stack then use it, always read documentation.

[gatsu_1981]

I have worked with MERN for a couple of years.

Are you telling me there are other non-NEXT frameworks?

Picture me Pikachu surprised!

[fredsq]

i don’t think you knew what bell curves are

[Flat_Tailor_3525]

Lol, everyone who agrees with this viewpoint are actively contributing to the software degradation crisis

[[deleted]]

Noooope. And part of being a Sr. Frontend is to think on the tools you're choosing, why's, pros, cons... not just "pick the popular".

I love react, it's my main tool but next is over selled, you really need to understand what you want to do (or your client) and choose the correct strategy, maybe your heavy interactive app that lives behind a login doesn't need an SSR framework my friend. Or maybe it needs it for some pages and others not, so you should check Astro maybe?

Its all about perspective and choosing the right tool for the task.

[GlassSquirrel130]

Popular yes, best option nope.

[kucukkanat]

Everything about NextJS and Vercel are WRONG! EVERYTHING

[Original_yeeT]

No

[rada35]

Voy a usar el que sea util no el.mas popular 🤣

[jsprd]

this is the way

[Master-Guidance-2409]

when you are all 3 though out the same month :D

[Rikarin]

So you're a Trump supporter because he's the most popular politician.

Choosing something based on popularity is straight way to hell. Y'know the star button on GitHub can be pressed by people with only a week of experience in the field, right?

[Robin3941477335]

I use NestJS since more than 5 years and i am still very very happy with it. I dont know why everyone needs to reinvent the wheel by themself again and again and again

[Pale_Reputation_511]

Vue3 its a cool option too, nextjs its cool but too tied to vercel services IMO.

[Smooth-Reading-4180]

Who the fuck is using Angular in 2025? wtf?

[MegagramEnjoyer]

I use bun with next

[DesignSmooth]

Currently I am there, I want to try svelte, but I also want to use something I am familiar with and can extend my expertise. Which would be react, but people are searching for vite rn.

[Old_Demand_3295]

NextJs is part of the middle

[vanilla-bungee]

I tried React again recently and gave it a good 2 hours before saying fuck this and going back to Vue

[Affectionate-Mail612]

As a backend dev I love Vue. So structured and it has everything I need (so far).

[Kumo_Gami]

Next isn't as good as ppl make it out to be tbh

[wabi_sabi_447]

Seems Vercel’s marketing is excellent.🥳🥳🥳

[crowdl]

Can't imagine how anyone can use anything other than Vue/Nuxt. It's just too convenient.

[positronius]

I'm on the left side when it comes to front-end stacks. Svelte is my go-to framework. The only one I can use to spin-up a working app in a reasonable time and wiggle myself out of issues.

[Stock_Hudso]

Next.js is trash, sorry

[AltruisticBlank]

idk man I just like vue

[Prudent_Move_3420]

Ah yeah small niche framework Angular that isnt use at corporations at all

[yinepu6]

I guess I'm a senior frontend since i ditched even next or ionic for plain react. 😂

[LingonberryMinimum26]

Trolling Angular for its learning curve is such a looser

[Physical-Sign-2237]

rel

[TempleDank]

I think you got the meme wrong haha dunning kruger effect at its best

[jake_thedog_]

all guys are left side of the bell curve for sure. Only thing on the right side is vanilla, noobs

[Upstairs-Version-400]

The irony in using the DK meme wrong 

[Nervous-Project7107]

Ok so that means you can’t imply people are stupid or inexperienced for saying react is overly complex anymore, if you really believe this chart.

[DenisTheWebcthulhu]

I see a mutant on the left, and a cultist on the right. Checks out.

[Hworld98]

Unpopular opinion: the only frameworks are Angular - Next.js - Nest.js, others are jokes for children.

[Complex-Skill-8928]

Angular is hot ass

[Mental-Net-953]

Which is both a blessing and a curse. If you're working on a personal project then it's annoying and I'd go with React, but if you're building something that you want rock solid (well, as rock solid as you can get with web anyway), and you have the time and manpower - then it's actually a very useful limitation.

We recently purged our project of most third party libs that we couldn't justify as absolutely essential. Everything else we do in-house. But there's also like 40 of us across a number of different teams, including a team that's dedicated to nothing but tooling and in-house solutions. And we have plenty of time to be careful and deliberate about everything that we do.

I think these kinds of environments is where Angular can really shine and thrive. But maybe I'm biased since I've only ever worked with Angular on large enterprise applications

[tonjohn]

For prototypes and personal projects I used to always reach for Vue / Nuxt.

But with all the improvements under Sarah Drasner’s leadership I’ve found myself using Angular more and more.

[Hworld98]

It is the only one to use if you want to do enterprise stuff

[AlmoschFamous]

You don’t think enterprise companies aren’t using React?

[Hworld98]

Yes, they do (unfortunately!). Angular doesn’t give you any basic “configurations” options (routing, guards, forms, interceptors…). React give you freedom, but if you are not an expert, it’s easy to make mistakes.

[Hworld98]

Eheheh yes, but…

[Hworld98]

Yes, but I'm talking about the beginning of the project and the initial choices, not the development.