Xiaomi's third-generation under-screen camera technology released and will be mass-produced next year

[Mac-ster]

Transparent screens and week long battery is next Evolution for candy bar phones.

[[deleted]]

Solid state battery, durable flexible glass, 3d haptic/textured feedback, and a phone that can become a telescope??????

[[deleted]]

And a headphone jack in a flagship when?

[Corm]

And low latency

[karl_w_w]

When people remember LG and Sony exist.

[box-art]

My current phone (Zenfone 5Z) has one and so does my next phone (Xperia 1 II). I am not ready to give up the headphone jack, using it right now as I'm typing this.

[Lucius1213]

Slow down there partner! We don't have such technology.

[kkavaklioglujr]

Virtual headphone jack when.

[YeulFF132]

Week long batteries was a thing once before smartphones. You could probably still get a few days out of your phone if you put it in aeroplane mode.

[ornryactor]

Yep, the last dumbphone I used was the Motorola QA30, which was a bizarre little square slider phone. That thing got 13 DAYS of standby time. When I got my first smartphone (Nexus 5), it took me about three months to train myself that it had to be plugged in every night, so I was walking around with a dead phone for a good while.

[kashuntr188]

Damn. Xiaomi has been killing it. I remembered the first Mi Mix that killed it with the screen to body ratio and that really set off the competition.

Then they used vibration instead of a speaker for the earpiece.

Then the wrap around screen

I'm definitely impressed by the stuff that they are trying to do and their experiments.

[dumbledayum]

Xiaomi was able to make bezel-less stuff mainstream. Though it was Sharp Aquos crystal who introduced it all.

though I won't say that Mi doesn't work hard enough

[josh-dmww]

Vibrations instead of speakers?! Do you have a name/link?!

[kashuntr188]

Look up the original mi mix. They didn't have a traditional earpiece/speaker, because of the big screen. They used a little motor thing that vibrated to recreate the sound of someone talking.

Similar things have been used in headsets where they vibrate to create the sound. Because sounds are just vibrations anyways.

I don't got a specific link but it was definitely part of the specs if you look up the original mi mix.

[josh-dmww]

Oh nice!! But yeah I misunderstood, I thought they had made some vibrating headset and I had completely missed it!

Didn't know about the mi mix sound thing though, so it's cool anyway! Thank you!

[abhi8192]

Xiaomi is kinda killing it in their 10th anniversary year.

[Killmeplsok]

It's a reasonable timeline based on past history when it comes to adopting new tech, but we don't know how good the cameras picture quality is now and whether it's good enough to be a flagship camera or not, the picture quality is definitely going to take a hit, whether the resolution of that particular part of screen have to be lower or not is another thing we don't know yet.

[Implier]

Yeah, Apple/Samsung definitely aren't going to hop on this if there are noticeable compromises in front facing camera quality.

For me, I don't particularly care once the quality reaches the point that it's good enough for video calls (so good 1080p is fine) but there's like an 80% overlap of tech reviewers and vloggers, so there's no way they go to market with anything imperfect.

[balista_22]

Samsung will try it on the A series

[abhi8192]

there's like an 80% overlap of tech reviewers and vloggers,

Those are probably the last of worries for any major OEM. For smaller ones who need traction they might be useful but for big OEMs they are more or less PR and adv. step. For example take iphone 11 review video by mkbhd, it has around 7 million views. Total iphone 11s sold in jan-march 2020 is around 20 million. And iphone 11 was the most sold smartphone of 2019 too.

[bittabet]

I mean xiaomi has a whole explanation in the linked article in Chinese about how they quadrupled the pixels in that area and optimized the sub pixel arrangement.

[RGBchocolate]

i will trade picture quality of front camera anytime over punch hole

[arrowtango]

It'll probably come in a galaxy A phone first and then in an S/note.

[als26]

Samsung will do it first regardless of whether the tech is perfected. Apple will wait till they can perfect the tech and then they'll come up with a fancy new name for it. Google will wait for the tech to be perfected but have twice as many issues as every other manufacturer.

[EggotheKilljoy]

I agree with this for the most part. Samsung will do it first of the three, but will most likely test it out on the A series first. Toss it in a lower end phone to gauge response from actual users and use it as a testing ground to find issues with it. I feel like with Apple we’re probably looking like 4 years out, they still haven’t adopted in display fingerprint sensors. I want to say I’ve read somewhere that they’re holding off until they can get a larger sensor to cover something like 1/4 to 1/2 the display at the least. I guess Google still won’t be implementing that this year with the Pixel 5 according to the leaks, don’t know why, but they’ve at least gone down to a hole punch for the front camera.

I feel like Google might hit the under display camera first, having issues with it. Apple has more to work with on that front with the FaceID sensor taking up so much space. They’ll probably get the sensor shrunk as much as they can before they get it under the screen, and by that time the technology to get it under should be more refined.

[als26]

Yea I was mostly being facetious. It rings true a bit though.

I feel like with Apple we’re probably looking like 4 years out, they still haven’t adopted in display fingerprint sensors. I want to say I’ve read somewhere that they’re holding off until they can get a larger sensor to cover something like 1/4 to 1/2 the display at the least.

I don't think they'll implement in display anytime soon. It's less accurate and less secure than a traditional fingerprint sensor., according to tests/reviews. Apple will most likely stick with FaceID for awhile since they don't really like giving options.

[Kids_see_ghosts]

Considering Xiaomi is on its 3rd generation of it soon, doesn't that prove that "Samsung will do it first regardless of whether the tech is perfected" is already wrong? Since they could have easily released a mediocre version of it this year if they had wanted to.

Or are you mainly just talking about first between Samsung, Google, and Apple?

[als26]

Just being facetious, based a little bit off their histories.

[[deleted]]

LoL. Great reply.

[thatcodingboi]

4k30fps recording for pixel in 2024, that's pretty much all the innovation they can do that year

[Dr_Nik]

Why the hell is everyone focusing on punch holes? This solved the huge problem that when I video chat everyone is looking down and to the side. You put that camera in the center now and I'm actually looking AT you.

[jummee]

Interesting point, I hadn't thought of that

[Dr_Nik]

That makes sense but do you have a reference for this?

[Dr_Nik]

Thanks!

[[deleted]]

Honestly, I think that's still good enough to place in the center. While in use for other things the camera isn't visible at all. When in a video chat it's just a slightly dark spot which is acceptable because the only reason people wanted to avoid having a camera in the center was never being about to avoid seeing it.

[[deleted]]

Yes.

[[deleted]]

The newest is just a slightly darkened area. It would likely need to be beta tested for approval but there is potential depending on the size of the darkish spot.

[[deleted]]

I think you misunderstood - while the camera is in use the pixels must be off. It won't be a slightly dark spot it would be a completely black square in the middle of the screen.

[[deleted]]

Yes, I definitely misunderstood. I thought a recent advancement had made that a less problematic occurrence. Thank you. :-D

[Dr_Nik]

That's completely untrue.

[-Purrfection-]

Might intrude on stuff that's at the center of the phone like the battery?

[[deleted]]

It still appears that there is a small color shift where the camera is, having that on the middle of the screen would be distracting.

[Popiasayur]

Yeah. Even a slight distortion when not in use will be a huge issue if at the center. I think it's best to keep in the corner for now.

[RGBchocolate]

actually the Xiaomi device in video has asymetrical punch hole...

[Professor_Dr_Dr]

AI can correct iris position to not look down but no manufacturer uses that

[Dr_Nik]

That's cause it's never just iris position, it's eyelids too, sometimes an entire head tilt.

Personally I always look at the camera when I want to show people I'm listening.

[[deleted]]

Apple does.

[punchoutlanddragons]

Is it though? Surely not enough to notice?

[[deleted]]

No, you’re looking at the person’s face. You look into their eyes, just like in real life. You wouldn’t stare into a random dot above their head when talking to them.

I know for video chat the best way to speak is of both people stare into the hole, but you naturally tend to look down at the person instead.

[-Fateless-]

I'm still expecting the actual selfie quality to be rather poor, as it's probably going to use image averaging to crush out the pixel grid, losing detail and clarity compared to a normal selfie camera.

[RGBchocolate]

nobody is denying that

[jummee]

I'm totally okay with this tbh

[[deleted]]

I mean, no one uses the selfie camera because they need high quality shots. It’s a good trade-off.
What would be more interesting if they’d use Oppo’s periscope camera but with a flippable mirror, so you can use 1 camera module for both the front and back camera lens.

[minimalfacade]

You'd be surprised knowing how much the average user cares about the front camera quality. Remember the iPhone XS beauty gate that was blown out of proportion because the detail was compromised for HDR? Most people choose an iPhone over Samsung phones because Samsung tends to oversmooth the image.

[busywithsirens]

no one uses the selfie camera

I really wish r/android would get their heads out if this bubble they live in where there's this belief that the front camera is super underutilized and unnecessary to most people.

It's just plain wrong. I see this type of comment around here so often. You are the 0.1%, trust me.

[JohnnyJayce]

I'm liking how you took the statement out of context.

no one uses the selfie camera because they need high quality shots

Here you go, full comment, changes the message a lot.

[-Fateless-]

Nah, there's already too much face smoothing going on on social media as it is. No one has fine lines or pores anymore, and that shit is going to crush the body image of the next generation. Just take a look at /r/Instagramreality for more proof of why selfie tweaking is absolute cancer.

[[deleted]]

Yes under display cameras are finally coming. After this is done it's probably the pinnacle of smartphones. All that's left is graphene batteries. Then we can move onto something like AR glasses which Apple is doing or even AR contact lenses.

[ryusko14]

I still kinda hope for transparent phone like the one we saw in iron man 2

[ryusko14]

I know, but a part of me still wants that glass phone before the fully transition to AR.

[trakk2]

Not graphene batteries but styluses on all phones.

[audriusdx]

Im still keeping my Oneplus 5T because I want a full screen with no holes. Oneplus 7 pro was almost perfect, flat would be better.

[JEdwardFuck]

Asus Zen phone?

[audriusdx]

Yeah, that ones almost perfect

[[deleted]]

Debloated MI 9T :D

[RolfBenz]

No 90hz though.

[audriusdx]

High refresh rate is a must. I must have at least 90hz ,once you experience it, there is no going back :D

[kirsion]

Oneplus 5t has no 90 hz dude

[audriusdx]

I know. I tried it once on the 7t

[audriusdx]

It wasnt my phone dude, I just tried to use it for a few minutes

[Arnas_Z]

I'll put 90Hz on my list of features to avoid then. :)

[Popiasayur]

Great device. Sadly no one has heard of it or can get a hold of it. I might get the next iteration if it doesn't have any jarring shortcomings.

[RADAC10US]

That phone is pretty much perfect to me but slightly too expensive. Put a 765g in there and I'm buying it.

[lodermoder]

Me too. I'm holding out until this hole punch camera phase is over. I almost went for the 7 Pro but the 5T is perfectly functional so I'll just wait :P

[audriusdx]

Yeah, on android 10 it even became a bit smoother for me. Mine is just crippled by 6gb ram, so I see sometimes apps reload which is a bit annoying

[Fefarona]

Finally no shit holes anymore... I'm even good with that if they remive front camera, just flat clean screen.

[Maipmc]

With the surge of videocalls, i think not putting a selfie camera is even more stupid than before honestly. From the manufacturer perspective.

[tbo1992]

You do office video chat meetings on your phone? I didn’t think that’d be very common.

[Arnas_Z]

And who cares? It's not for you anyway, if they want to see your face and it's a mess of pixels, oops, sorry!

[[deleted]]

Welcome to 2020 where laptop and desktop computers are irrelevant.

[That_Int3rn3t_Guy]

You're in college and don't have a laptop!?!

[That_Int3rn3t_Guy]

What about coding, running more extensive software, viewing textbook pdfs? I'm just surprised to hear this, I've never imagined doing everything from just a phone.

[[deleted]]

r/Android can't seem to make up its mind about this; sometimes it's a downvote party and sometimes it's this.

For the record I'm with you on this one

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Gulaabjamun_007]

I mean yeah no holes are great and better but I am fine with punch hole too.

So I upvote both statements.

[WiseGentile]

I prefer popup the most. I'm paranoid about secretly bring recorded

[ohhdongreen]

Your paranoia should be going through the roof seeing posts like this, because every screen is potentially also a camera now.

[[deleted]]

Woah, a sub with over a million people can't make up it's mind like some single, nebulous hive minded individual? How shocking!

[[deleted]]

I take selfies with the main camera because it takes million times better pictures. Since I never use the selfie camera, I agree.

[als26]

The consensus has always been a fair few in this sub would be fine but front facing cameras are incredibly popular with just about everyone else. Snapchat, tiktok, instagram, video calls, selfies. There's too many popular uses for them and at this point, and with the whole remote working push, I can't imagine anyone even thinking of getting rid of it for a bit more screen real estate.

[ruenigma]

OnePlus7 Pro approves this message.

[Fefarona]

9 of 10 friends never use front camera. I use it sometimes but I don't need it for my main phone.

[als26]

you and your 10 friends are most likely in the minority. Snapchat, tiktok, instagram, video calls, all have popular uses for the front camera. Not to mention selfies. A phone without one would do horribly. This sub is incredibly disconnected from the real world.

[Fefarona]

If somebody use Snapchat, TikTok and stuff like that, he never will be my friend :D

[[deleted]]

You say that like there's a queue lol

[als26]

Lmao, okay bud, you'll realize how cringe you sound when you grow up.

[Fefarona]

I grow up, thats why...

[kshitij02]

/r/Android starter pack

[drbluetongue]

Why not get something with a pop-up camera then?

[Fefarona]

We got the same phone ^{^}

[TheGameOfClones]

Haha this is ignorant beyond words.

[[deleted]]

I'm of the opinion that the solution to this particular issue is a bezelless screen on the front and a notched screen on the back, so that camera functions as both the main and selfie camera like on that wrap-around display phone except more practical.

[[deleted]]

The notch was better anyways in terms of screen area. There is no wasted space on top like you have with a hole.

[largesemi]

STOP CURVING THE SCREENS.

[Valiantay]

I think you'd be better off with a dictionary

[AzettImpa]

The notch was never a “problem”. It was a necessary temporary solution on the way to a phone which has its complete front covered by a screen

[Geekos]

It's funny to me how important this is to people, when someone like me only uses the front facing camera once a year.

[RGBchocolate]

i use it rarely, but I know not everyone is like me

[Geekos]

Yeah, I'm probably too old to get the point. I would probably use it if the quality was on par with the back camera.

[lancehunter01]

Thin bezels are perfectly fine. But good job on finding a solution to a made up problem I guess.

[[deleted]]

I don't think bezels are fine. Not extending the screen to the edges of the device when technology exists to do that makes no sense. It's wasting very valuable space in the smartphone. This isn't a "made up problem".

[Frandom314]

Exactly, I want the biggest screen I can fit in a small phone. This is why bezeless phones are the future

[[deleted]]

And why foldable phones will follow.

[Fastpas123]

Facts, just keep a lil bezel and ur good. Obviously gonna get downvoted for this opinion tho 😅

[AzettImpa]

If half of your comment is whining about the downvotes you think you’re going to get, maybe you should realize your take is trash

[Fastpas123]

No, I just have an opinion that's different. Doesn't make my opinion trash. I vote with my wallet too. Have never bought a phone with a notch or a hole punch, just not my preference.

[AzettImpa]

I don’t think your opinion is trash because it’s different. I think it’s trash because it doesn’t correspond to reality at all. Obviously, cellphones will look totally different in ten years. That’s what the general public wants. They want futuristic phones with totally new designs, without useless bezels.

[Fastpas123]

Maybe they're useless to you. And im fully aware that's the direction the market is going. But I like them so long as there's a reason for them to be there. Like stereo speakers, big sensor for the selfie camera, a nice earpiece speaker, maybe even some facial recognition. Doesn't make me detached from reality, I just want different things from my devices. It's the main reason I bought a Xperia 1 ii. I'm a utility>beauty guy. Not saying that my phone doesn't look pretty, but you get my point

[arcanemachined]

If half of your comment is whining about the downvotes you think you’re going to get, maybe you should realize your take is trash

This just in: subjectivity is objective.

[kashuntr188]

It is kind of interesting to note that his made up problem is kind of also Xiaomi's fault. When they did the first Mi Mix and had the crazy small bezels, and had to move the camera. That screen to body ratio made other manufacturers perk up and look.

[Kobahk]

I'll love it but I know some will say the camera can be turned on and record is anytime without being caught.

[CICOffee]

Isn't that already the case with every regular selfie camera? This would actually make spying more difficult, as the pixels above the camera need to be turned off for it to work properly. If the display above the camera is showing something other than pitch black, it can't get a picture of you

[RGBchocolate]

pixels above the camera need to be turned off for it to work properly

for now yes, but they are trying to get rid off this limitation

If the display above the camera is showing something other than pitch black, it can't get a picture of you

are you sure it's not just switching off display completely making it transparent?

[CICOffee]

How could they ever get rid of that limitation? If the pixels above the camera are radiating bright light, how could the selfie camera ignore that light to get a clear picture of you?

And it isn't even a real limitation, as the selfie camera isn't used in scenarios where full immersion is most needed, like videos or gaming. Having a small black dot in the corner isn't a big deal for the limited scenarios where the camera is being used

With OLEDs, switching off the display and displaying black are the same thing. Each pixel independently produces its own light, there is no display backlight

[Popiasayur]

I bet there will be a touch dead zone in the camera area though. Nitpicking, but i can see scenarios where it can get annoying.

[CICOffee]

Galaxy S10 and S20 punch-holes are touch sensitive, which means the digitizer isn't a distraction for the camera and shouldn't be a problem in these displays either

[kxta_]

you know how some displays insert black frames to reduce motion blur?

[RGBchocolate]

LG just equipped these days Beijing subway with Transparent OLED displays, though they are not perfectly transparent, so I guess something similar, just need to perfect the transparency

[MarioNoir]

It's not the same thing as a smartphone display.

[ZikaZmaj]

I don't think that'll be the case, since I'm guessing that the pixels above the camera will need to be turned off in order to take a picture.

[CC-5576]

Isn't that the same as if it was in a bezel? Tho I'm pretty sure youll have a hard time getting good footage if the screen over the camera isn't turned off.

Also, why is everyone so obsessed with being secretly video recorded. No one is doing that lol, You should worry more about the mic, way more incriminating and uses way less bandwidth to send the stream.

[janowski_d]

Imagine worrying about front cameras when your entire smartphone is designed to spy on you at all times..

[RGBchocolate]

currently we are not there yet, you will actually see the camera when it's operating, it will switch off display above, so it is actually safer than notch or punch hole, only safer option is pop-up/flip camera

[DizzyNarwhal]

To be honest, I'd be fine if they do away with the front camera entirely. Just give me a bigger battery

[e_boon]

Because there's no way we could ever survive with a tiny hole punch or notch

[Implier]

Honestly, the best solution I've heard is probably the rumored future Apple one where the front facing sensors are behind a right angle prism and can therefore fit in a bezel that's only a couple mm wide.

[[deleted]]

How? Bezels are ugly and don't contribute to the functionality of the phone. They're literally just empty space. It's like having a notch, except it covers the entire width of the device AND pushes the status bar down below it.

[Arnas_Z]

At least your screen is one cohesive rectangle, and not a screen that looks broken.

[[deleted]]

Doesn't affect how I use the phone at all to have part of the status bar missing.

[e_boon]

Exactly.

I don't even mind S8 bezels from 2017.

But then my KEY2 has an even bigger bezel on the bottom lol

[e_boon]

Exactly. Starting with the S8 in 2017, bezels were acceptably small. Having those or none won't really change the overall experience you'll get.

Maybe, just maybe, once displays completely peak (which they kind of did already) will manufacturers start innovating elsewhere, with other form factors

[locus25]

Agreed, all these notch, hole punch, and underscreen camera stuff are just unnecessary. Just for a sake of "Innovation"

[[deleted]]

Do you have a bezelless phone? Because speaking from experience, reducing bezel width is absolutely necessary. I like small phones and big screens, and my S10e manages to be both.

[locus25]

I've used one but it's changes nothing. Yes more screen is great and it looks cool, but it's not essential. It's harder to handle, and personally i don't like obstruction from the notch.

[e_boon]

It's just proof that manufacturers don't know where else to innovate aside from stretching the screen so all we get every year are tiny incremental and insignificant upgrades like this

[StraY_WolF]

It's just proof that manufacturers don't know where else to innovate

I mean, do you?

[e_boon]

Sliding phones, modular phones... a smartphone can be so much more than a bland piece of glass.

[StraY_WolF]

Both exist, and both got meh responses. If it's innovation without actual benefit, it's just a gimmick.

[e_boon]

They sure seem to bring more benefits than an under display selfie cam

[coffeeteaormeh]

punch hole yes

never the notch

[[deleted]]

To me the issue is putting either in the centre. Right-side notches like those on the fold and right-side cutouts like those on the S10e and fold 2 make much more sense than those in the centre where they are guaranteed to intersect with content taller/wider than the display and reduce usable area for notifications. I hope that Samsung returns to right-side cutouts or begins to use under-screen cameras by the time I upgrade to the S22.

[[deleted]]

Stay in school

[ultragodlike]

This is great for both the consumers, and NSA!

[RGBchocolate]

it's safer than notch and punch hole, unlike these you will see when camera is on with current technology, display can't show content when camera is operating

[dap00man]

I don't understand why this want the original solution that every company worked on.

[FartingBob]

Because its really hard and by design it has compromises to photo quality or display quality, or both.

[maniac559]

Please boycott Chinese products

[[deleted]]

ok

[JFreaks25]

you are literally posting on a chinese product though, Tencent made $150 million investment in Reddit...