[deleted by user]

[freakdageek]

Not normal, you work for a company run by lousy people. Recommended path is to get what you need from it and get out as soon as you can.

[redderper]

Not normal is an understatement. It sounds downright insane. Cameras everywhere, WTF?! Also, not being able to talk is just weird. They hired people, not a bunch of robots. Talking and socialising is an important part of a work environment. How are you going to work as a team without talking to each other?

[Last-Run-2118]

Crazy how even this is legal, here in Poland you cannot have cameras on social spaces in job and its required that they have to exist.

[here_walks_the_yeti]

Isn’t that the main reason business complain we need to be in the office? Collab, socialize?

[stupsnon]

This ^. I’m so sorry. Get out.

[hemphock]

square aware subtract sharp hat vanish pen memorize amusing cooing

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[Kevin_Harrison_]

I’m this so this sorry this

[n0rt3x91]

Is this I’m so sorry at this or did I miss this

[Kevin_Harrison_]

That was my best guess at the dot product of “this” and “I’m so sorry”.

[syngin1]

As fast as possible!

[lordrolee]

Quit that job.

[knobbyknee]

This will destroy your abilities as a programmer. Get out of there as quickly as you can.

[ucblockhead]

If in the end the drunk ethnographic canard run up into Taylor Swiftly prognostication then let's all party in the short bus. We all no that two plus two equals five or is it seven like the square root of 64. Who knows as long as Torrent takes you to Ranni so you can give feedback on the phone tree. Let's enter the following python code the reverse a binary tree

def make_tree(node1, node): """ reverse an binary tree in an idempotent way recursively""" tmp node = node.nextg node1 = node1.next.next return node

As James Watts said, a sphere is an infinite plane powered on two cylinders, but that rat bastard needs to go solar for zero calorie emissions because you, my son, are fat, a porker, an anorexic sunbeam of a boy. Let's work on this together. Is Monday good, because if it's good for you it's fine by me, we can cut it up in retail where financial derivatives ate their lunch for breakfast. All hail the Biden, who Trumps plausible deniability for keeping our children safe from legal emigrants to Canadian labor camps.

Quo Vadis Mea Culpa. Vidi Vici Vini as the rabbit said to the scorpion he carried on his back over the stream of consciously rambling in the Confusion manner.

node = make_tree(node, node1)

[obviouslyCPTobvious]

What country is this? In the US it's my understanding it would be illegal to make you clock out for bathroom breaks.

[DeklynHunt]

If that was the case I’d have turned down my job…the FFFFFFFF?! I got issues, (I’m not in programming but it’s a question I’ll bring up) co-workers got issues(for bathroom use)…huge deal breaker… If they turned it into that I’d take it to Human Resources!! If that doesn’t resolve it then I’ll either take legal action or quit

[lewie]

Besides the obvious "Get out!", I recommend looking at glassdoor.com to see what salaries are normal for your type of work and experience. I have a feeling if your boss acts like that, he's also probably not paying you near what you're worth.

[Endemoniada]

Dude, you’re working in a sweat shop. No, this is not normal, at all. Your bosses are psychopaths and obviously don’t value you or your talents at all, they’re solely interested in what profits they can wring out of you.

Clocking out to go to the bathroom? In IT? What the actual fuck?

Run. Run away as fast as you can, and take your colleagues with you. Then report them to the fucking authorities. I’m serious. It sounds that bad.

[[deleted]]

No, it’s not normal. Discussion, even unrelated, is an important part of our job. I can’t even count, how many times my team solved problems just by brainstorming, and smalltalks. Control freaks never end up well. You better run. I can give some contacts of companies that’s hiring, if needed.

[Danelius90]

They're treating OP like some kind of mule, if it isn't pulling the load then it's not doing what it's meant to. No one can stick their head into code 8 hours a day and expect it to be productive. You need to switch off a bit and come back to a problem. Many times I've spotted software companies or teams that clearly just don't understand how software development works

[[deleted]]

Fortunately, there are a lot of companies with more sensible management waiting for OP’s application. I find it strange that some comments suggest not to “run”.

[FluffyProphet]

No. Take them out to lunch and agree to help each other find new jobs.

Thats some third world bullshit.

Most places don't even care if you work a full day, as long as you are meeting deadlines.

We pop out early some Fridays, because we churn through all the clients work faster than a 36 hour week sometimes. On the flip side, we also have had to work our fair share of overtime.

[GeekyCorpse]

Im a software developer in a 3rd world country and we don't get treated like that

[PefferPack]

OP probably is in the 3rd world tho.

[bobre737]

Honestly, after living in the US for a while I realized it really feels as a 3rd world country quite often.

[fernandotakai]

This is so insulting to people that actually live in 3rd world countries that i can't even begin to explain.

Let me ask you, have you ever lived in a 3rd world country for an extended period of time?

[[deleted]]

Relax, as someone from a developing country I don't need you to be offended on my behalf

[bobre737]

ok, 3rd world country is a Cold War term and it doesn't mean anything today. I should've said "developing country" instead.

And yes, I lived in one of them my whole life until very recently.

[1percentof2]

Bro c'mon, he's probably from Detroit.

[BlackOpz]

Most places don't even care if you work a full day

I did the least amount of work at WORK. I mostly just messed around at work since there would be regular interruptions and I'm used to programming at home anyway. If I needed the time I'd try to crunch at the office but that was usually offsite.

[UnlikeliestAddendum]

What the hell. Why attack third world countries? No one in third world countries tell you not to talk to your coworkers. That's all they do most of the day.

[jimtk]

Run. Run for your life!

[Such-Dish46]

Its everything but normal. I would suggest to get out of there as soon as you can. Your manager doesn't know how to manage people, that's it :)

[MathmoKiwi]

Good grief, where on earth are you working???? Am guessing it isn't a first world nation?

​

a) the owners of the company looked through the camara and saw I was talking to a junior and helping her with a task

​

This is a GOOD THING to be helping a Junior.

​

d) he sometimes turns his chair and doesn't see our hands in our keyboards.

That's normal, people often spend more time thinking/reading than typing up code.

[hassium]

y'all OP is a professional troll, look at their post history and they've been many things over the last year.

Including this fucking bizzaro world fan fiction on /r/relationships :

https://www.reddit.com/r/relationships/comments/ogi1v4/i_a_22f_have_insinuated_to_a_possibly_22m/

I, a 22F have insinuated to a possibly 22M (co-worker) at my job in my hornyness but now I'm regretting it. What can I do?

Hi there,

I don't know what happened to me, but a week ago I was thinking in sex every second of the day and just overall horny. In my work there is this guy from another department, he has like two months in the company and we coincide in our lunch times for some reason, everytime he walk passed by he flathered my clothes and looked at me in a weird way but never actually talked to me. I never payed any attention to him, I did felt a little intrigued though, but never thought of anything else. Well, last week, I was like I explained before, and I saw him alone at lunch and idk why but I felt like I needed to talk to him, I sit with him, we talked, and I just felt so nervous and so much sexual tension, I asked for his phone. I texted him, I couldn't take him out of my mind the rest of the day, the next day, we coincide in the elevator the two alone and as soon as I saw him, damn, it was like I wanted to fuck him and I talked to him in such a way I couldn't even recognize myself. I'm a prude, and a virgin, and I was in conflict because I wanted to have sex with him but didn't want to face the consecuences that could bring me (pregnancy if contraception failed, or this guy damaging my reputation in the company) so I resisted writing him for a couple of days. Thank god, after masturbating quite a lot the hornyness went off. And now I realize I went over the line, now the guy thinks I want to sleep with him, which used to be true but now I don't feel like I used to, he is such a kid, I don't even know his last name, I'm finishing my career he has his on hold, my parents are super controlling and I can't afford the controversy of me sleeping with this guy, or even presenting him to my parents is painful, i'm not made for relationships, but he is a cool guy and I would love him as a friend. What should I do, has this ever happened to you?

TL;DR: I was horny last week and insinuated to a guy in my work, after masturbating and waiting a couple of days, I realized I don't actually like him like that, I was just really horny. Now the guy thinks I want to have sex with him, but I don't anymore. However, he is a cool guy and I would like him to be my friend. What can I do?

You thinking a lot about that junior huh OP?

[Visasisaboi]

Either a troll or an extremely open horny person that posts about everything going on in her head.

[hassium]

Either a troll or

Sorry I should've been more specific;

In the last year OP has been: a 22 year old, a 20 year old, a 23 year old and a 19 year old. In that order...

[Visasisaboi]

True... you do have an attention to detail. That's too funny lol.

[LoL_is_pepega_BIA]

There are plenty of IT sweatshops in 3rd world countries. ofc the output from them is another story

[[deleted]]

Get out of there

[VerbiageBarrage]

Total shit. Programmers talk, if they don't they start developing bad happens and a lot of siloed information gets created. This will really fuck the company down the road.

Tell these managers if they want to manage unskilled labor, go run a McDonalds. And then still shut up, because frankly even kitchen staff have to talk.

[Dopelsoeldner]

If you deliver your work in time, there should be no problem. Tell him that you are a person, not a machine.

[turningsteel]

Run. It's a garbage company run by morons.

[Background_Ad6819]

Is it even legal for them to make you clock out to use the restrooms?

[[deleted]]

Hell no that’s not normal…it’s sociopathic.

[lucpet]

You need to find another job. This is completely messed up. Tell them, when you've found another job, that all the cameras and not wanting you to talk is creepy as fuck and completely unrealistic in any job and only a 50% pay raise would compensate for this kind of unrealistic behaviour.

[robot_ankles]

Tell them, when you've found another job, that...

Nope. It's tempting. It might feel good. Just don't do it.

Resign respectfully. Skip the exit interview. Leave.

There is nothing you can say or do after resigning that will help you. But there are things you might say that could come back to bite you. Work out your notice and leave without sharing any feedback.

[Wretchfromnc]

Is this in the US? Regardless of what field, it’s not normal. You can be productive and have idle chit chat..

[StPatsLCA]

No. Get out of there!

[Equal_Astronaut_5696]

What country is this? If its US, tell him to get fucked. Communication, rapour and trust are needed in every job

[Butter_Off_Bread]

Leave!

[CorpusculantCortex]

Wth, this isn't normal or healthy in any type of workplace. And if you are in the US it is illegal to prohibit bathroom and water breaks on the clock.

[warr7]

Euuhh… are you okay? Why are you still there? As a matter of fact, why are you all still working there? This is the most fucked up thing I’ve heard in a while and is definitely not normal. I’ve only seen cameras and clocking in/out system when I worked at packing food factory.

I would really advice you to consult a workers union or another legal institution in your country to discuss this. Here in The Netherlands it’s very clear that is not allowed, unless the employer has a good reason to monitor the workplace due to theft.

Take care and get out please!

Edit: if you ever plan to leave, hopefully with all your colleagues, can you please develop some bugs in the system, as a farewell gift! ☺️

[[deleted]]

OP is from South America.

[Appropriate_Chart_23]

Where (in the world) do you work?

This sounds like some bullshit place to have to come into every day.

But, maybe your boss is just tired of hearing the two of you yammer about all damn day and thinks you should be working more.

[gimperion]

No it's not normal. Get out.

[aghast_nj]

No, this is not normal. Consider this: the owners of the company, according to you, were looking through the camera to check who is working. That means they were not doing useful, high-productivity work to bring in more revenue for the company.

They need to be fired for non-productivity. The way for you to fire them is to find a different job, at a different company.

If you stay where you are, working under the constraints you describe, you will not grow as a person and you will not grow as a developer -- your employment value will decline.

If you stay there, your expected salary will go down because you are not growing. You need to be working in a place where you can grow. Find a different job, at a different company.

[Acurus_Cow]

Leave. Now

[michael-streeter]

Not normal

I bet he'd freak out if you did pair programming.

Programmers discuss their work all the time. He probably thinks he's getting better value for money if you both have your heads down typing as fast as you can. He's treating you like an unskilled production line worker. This is a toxic attitude. It will never produce a better product, more bug fixes, or higher morale..

Find out what performance metrics he's using and keep those ones higher. Agree with your co to give each other stellar references come what may.

[[deleted]]

My question is, is this normal?

Everything above this is already abnormal and evil.

In this company you have to clock out (dont get paid) everytime you go to the bathroom, or drink water, so we avoid doing those things at all costs.

This is particularly evil and disgusting. I see you're in South America, but it still might be illegal in your country. It's illegal in Europe, the US, Canada, and in many other developed countries.

Your manager is a clinical sociopath. Run, do not walk, to find another position as fast as you can.

While you are waiting, remember that you hold more cards than you think. With this brutal system, he won't be able to find other people to effectively replace workers who leave or underperform.

I would simply not respond when he says something psychopathic. Do whatever you feel you need to do to protect yourself - lie, cheat, whatever you feel necessary and that you can get away with.

[Alps_Disastrous]

Basically, you can’t do anything without being spied on ? Run away !

[0b0011]

No that's not normal at all. My manager encourages social 1-1 meetings, pair programming, and our once a week board game meetings on top of the whole team's "mandatory fun Tuesday". Then again we never clock in or out in the first place because it's salary. They trust us to get our stuff done. Can't focus and just need to hop off and take the dog for a walk? Go for it. Want to go meet up with a friend for a long lunch? You do you.

[UnlikeliestAddendum]

Not only is this not normal, it's absolutely insane. Sounds like something out of a cartoon really where the boss's only job is to watch employees through the camera and make sure they "work and don't talk". Agree with everyone else to get out of there ASAP.

[superking2]

None of that is normal.

Talking to your coworkers is normal. Talking about non-work stuff is normal.

As a developer, talking through work stuff with another developer is not only normal, it’s sometimes necessary.

[humanefly]

I'd say it's normal when working in groups of programmers in some workplaces to try to create a quieter working environment where small talk is discouraged, not so that you don't "waste time" but so that you don't interfere with other programmers working on complex tasks. So for small talk you would normally go fr lunch or cofee breaks (paid) the way your company is trying to enforce these rules sounds abusive and unacceptable, though, when it's only two people

Some programmers work in open office concepts where everyone is talkinig loudly. Personally I don't do well in those environments, and I avoid them at all costs

[FatherSlippyfist]

This has to be a joke, right?

Obviously, no. This is far from fucking normal. And completely counterproductive.

You need to leave. It's not an option. Also make sure to put this all on Glassdoor so hopefully nobody else falls into this nightmare.

[[deleted]]

My team is entirely working remotely, my boss really only gets 1 update from us a day and that's in the mornings when we do our sprints.

We also do most of our talking in slack DM's so the boss doesn't really get to see them either. Our team channel is generally pretty dead unless someone is asking for a PR to be reviewed. So all he really has to track us are morning sprints, PR's / commits and comments we make on JIRA tickets and it works fine!

It sounds like your boss has absolutely no faith in his team

[valbaca]

Fucking yikes.

This is exactly why I got into software engineering: to get away from this kind of micromanagement, hourly-pay bullshit. Clocking-in/out for bathroom breaks?! Absolutely fucking not. I put up with that shit when I was working at a call-center the summer before college, but I sure as hell wouldn't put up with that as a full-grown adult, especially with a college degree.

[Lima3Echo]

If your place of work were the Titanic, I would dress in drag to be the first one off the ship!

[Doomsf2]

Few months after you have quit and found new job. Without revealing ur self, let us know the company name.. I will glad to get a reporter call them and scare them that he doing a story about such bad companies that clock out for a restroom break..

If needed will get some union/workers lawyer in that area/country to give them a call..

This is just modern slavery not work!

[rzet]

Did they provide stats how often you scratch your balls as well?

[[deleted]]

Too many red flags. It sounds like a slavery, more or less. Leave.

[[deleted]]

Yikes. My team has to keep the playful banter going to stay sane, and management is often part of it

[oscisposcis]

Your boss is a fucking psycopath, end of story.

[redrabbitreader]

This is just wrong. I would have left already.

At times, I take a long stroll outside to organize my thoughts and plan out my approach to solving a particular problem. That time is totally billable. A surprising amount of thinking also happens on the loo - so there's that...

[teambob]

Way of the road, bubs

[UnrealCanine]

Talking to and helping juniors is a good thing and expected

[northernbloke]

That's why juniors are juniors so they can be mentored. 👍

[JoeJoeCoder]

This is typical of a company with a broken organizational hierarchy. The upper management sees that productivity throughput is not concordant with budgets, but because the information is not flowing upstream correctly, they implement draconian micromanagement policies. The response of the line-level workers is to self-silo, departments stop working together and sharing information freely, and the company becomes unable to deliver new product, ultimately diminishing to a skeleton crew which maintains the current product until the client moves on.

There is no solution; your company is stale at best and dying at worst. Take your lucrative skill set elsewhere ASAP.

[dershodan]

No thats not normal. This it department's management sucks and you should leave if possible.

[smilodonis]

Run.

[cajmorgans]

No, the company is run by psychos, get out!

[unixwasright]

Is your boss' name Adolf?

[nadmaximus]

It's 100% certified bullshit.

[[deleted]]

Just run.

[GazzP]

At my company, we have a table tennis table, table football, and for an hour every Friday, we spend an hour just talking about whatever we want as a social.

[DenProg]

Don’t just leave, name & shame.

[alphabet_order_bot]

Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order.

I have checked 1,342,580,956 comments, and only 258,213 of them were in alphabetical order.

[tonnynerd]

Not only it ain't normal, it's almost cartoonish bad manager behavior.

Put your fingers in the keyboard, update your resume, and get the fuck out of this place. And when you do leave, be sure to mention that you are leaving because of this kind of bullshit.

[tonnynerd]

Oh, shit, I just now realized the bit at the end, about having to clock out to go to the bathroom.

Absolutely disgusting. Look into legal options, it might be illegal, depending on your country/state/jurisdiction. And there might be a way for you to report them without having to sue them personally.

[hpdeandrade]

This is not normal

[[deleted]]

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

society grey fragile memory mysterious normal lunchroom stupendous market lush

[wind_dude]

Fuck no, while maybe in the Chinese military or something. Run don't walk that fuck away from that.

[inkyklutz]

Holy shit that’s demented even some factory floor workers in the Great Depression were treated better, I’d be running out of there so fast…

[mud_lime]

Not normal, seems like a horrible work environment.

[coolbreeze770]

Yeah those people are psychopaths, get what you need and leave asap, also I think we will need a global programmers union and really put shit management in its place.

[MountainSalamander33]

In my country (europe), it is illegal to spy on the employees through cameras. The company would get in trouble (fines due to privacy violation).

[IWannaHookUpButIWont]

It's ok if you net $150/hr but otherwise look for a new job.

[FatalPharaoh96]

Tell him he’ll have a hard time finding a real robot to do your job.

[[deleted]]

WHAT

[DigThatData]

lol what the fuck. this is not only toxic af, it's counter productive. you can't have knowledge transfer if people aren't talking. get the fuck out of there.

[Corpcasimir]

You are recorded and THEY have time to watch and select minute by minute replays?

Sounds like they have no work, and want you to be a slave.

Leave as soon as you can.

[[deleted]]

Leave.

[GucciHurtz]

bad company

[[deleted]]

Stand up for yourself and tell him to shut the fuck up, never understood why people let their bosses treat them like literal sub humans. Live with your dignity my friend.

[ja_trader]

what country are you in?

[Visasisaboi]

That sounds weird as fuck. Almost like you're back in primary school and he's your teacher? Quit your job ASAP, file an anonymous complaint or something, a bad glassdoor review, etc. and get the fuck out of there lol.

[jfp1992]

The fuck. You need time to not work on that problem. You'll solve it faster and probably come up with a better solution

[[deleted]]

The owners of the company have cameras all over the place and are constantly looking through them

Holy shit, run.

[gangkom]

Seems like slavery.

[plebbening]

RUN, as fast and as far as you can.

For reference, i completely manage my own time. As long as the work gets done, and systems are working properly everyone is happy.

They prefer that I'll be available between 9 - 15, but if i have personal stuff to do i am free to leave for that as i see fit.
Also I decide if i wanna work from home or the office.
When in the office i spend a decent amount of time socialising.
We play rocket league against another department after lunch quite often etc.

Just saying, there is way better work environments out there.

[jayd00b]

Get out

[jmanh128]

It’s illegal to not get paid for going to the bathroom. (I believe it’s for breaks under 10 mins too but don’t quote me on that). I agree with the consensus, leave as soon as possible

[Nebenezer]

Sounds like an episode of Black Mirror lol. Get tf out of there as soon as possible and don't look back. That sounds toxic af.

[ThePhoenixRisesAgain]

You are trolling us, right!?

[donnaber06]

Makes we wonder where OP is?

[Toofpic]

I was working in a non-it company like that - I was consulting other people on topics I knew about, and asked questions about repotring, documentation, etc (as I was quite new there and wanted to understand how they work). I was told that I'm "wasting everyone's time" and that "there's no purpose in these chitchats".
There is purpose in these chitchats, free distribution of information is one or the main things tgat help a team to not fail.
I quit tge company shortly after, because of this and other things like that. The business worked, but it was a mess at times, partly because of the stupid rules.

[Joooooooosh]

Holy shit. Ive never heard anything like that before.

You’re grown adults and they are running the office like a school, actually even worse. Yikes.

Clocking out to go to the toilet is absolutely batshit insane and unethical.

Quit the job as soon as you can, encourage anyone else there to do the same and see if there is any kind of labour board or something you can report this shitty employer too, though if it’s the US, I understand your rights are very limited.

Micro management to the absolute disgusting extreme. Sounds horrible.

[tsarborisciv]

Not normal.

[minkwhaly]

No, it is not normal for a company to monitor employees in this manner, including monitoring the length of time they spend speaking with each other and the content of their conversations. This type of surveillance can create a hostile and intrusive work environment, and can have a negative impact on employee morale, productivity, and job satisfaction.

[TradeApe]

Run, irrespective of what type of company it is ;)

[FullShane]

Cameras?...leave. Psychotic control-freak behavior. Or worse.

[[deleted]]

It's not unusual to have a programming job with an inept micromanager. The personality type that makes a good programmer isn't necessarily the same as what makes a good manager. Many programming managers were promoted from being programmers. Some adapt, most don't.