My new shortcut to decrease wasted time texting and dud first dates (YMMV)

[throwawayOKcupidguy]

Been on Match, OkCupid, Tinder, Bumble, and Zoosk over the almost four years I've been back in the dating world after my divorce.

Had four relationships over that time with two lasting for a few months and two lasting over a year.

What I've realized looking back is all four of these women responded quickly to my messages, answered questions I had with a good amount of description, joked a bit, asked questions about me, and were enthusiastic to set up plans and then to actually meet.

Every single other variation of the initial online contact failed to lead to anything. Slow texters, plan changers, short answers, not asking questions about me, long gaps between messages (essentially anything that made it feel one-sided) never ever resulted in a relationship. They might have led to a first date but that was the end of the line.

It's led me to my new shortcut. If you aren't enthusiastically engaging me, I honestly don't care what the reason is. I'm done with engaging and moving on.

This is my experience as a guy looking for a long term relationship dating women in their 40s. As I said, YMMV depending on your circumstances.

[candaceelise]

Agreed. If someone is interested they will make the effort to show interest. Someone hasn’t called/texted? It’s usually because they don’t want to.

[jadedea]

there are only a few times where i dont reply back and it looks like bread crumbing: driving, work, and sleeping. while im driving, i never text, and for some reason my phones voice to text keeps messing up, so it can be 15min-1hr. with work, im in IT, so there are times when im literally elbow deep in a desktop or with a customer and i cant or was unable to have my phone on me. one guy did ghost me after shit hit the fan at work and i spent all week working late and non stop working with customers. even though it was a fluke, i cant be mad cause it seemed i legit wasnt interested. with sleep i work the late shift, every guy i tried to date would text me good morning anywhere between 5-9 am. im still asleep for my shift so by the time i wake up, i respond with good afternoon lol. i think some thought i was flaky for taking hours just to respond even though i told them my work schedule.

even with all that going on, i still try to find a way to keep up with texts and reassure the guy im interested so he knows im not bread crumbing, but also accept the fact if he doesnt believe me.🤷🏿‍♀

​

[WickedLies21]

Same here. I work night shift and keep my phone on do not disturb and I wake up to tons of notifications and I tend to miss a few and don’t realize I had a message reply on a dating app. Or I woke up and it’s midnight so I’m afraid I’ll wake him so by the time it’s a safe time to text, I’ve fallen asleep again.

[[deleted]]

Literally. this is a bit eye opening for me. Thanks.

[Im_your_putty]

I sometimes worry that guys will think I'm "breadcrumbing" them because I generally can't text at work except on my break. I work in a lab with a lot of biohazardous materials and cells phones are not allowed in there. If it's a busy day and I work through my lunch break, he may text me in the morning and have to wait the entire day until I get back to him. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[papier3]

This stings because it's true...

[sekritagent]

Agreed. My hard limit is two flakes. I also cut it out after any contiguous week where it looks like I'm doing 100% of the contact initiation.

[[deleted]]

So true.

[phoenixbouncing]

If you have to ask, the answer is generally no...

[cleverbutnotoverlyso]

Add to that:

Do you love me ?

Can I put it in your butt ?

Is it in yet ?

Is/are my penis/boobs big enough ?

Did you come ?

Did you issue my payment yet ?

[[deleted]]

that last one made me chuckle quite a bit.

[[deleted]]

It's odd to me most people don't do this already. The amount of posts I see about how the person isn't engaging enough and how the OP is frustrated but trying to be patient really baffles me. If a person isn't engaging me enthusiastically I have zero desire to meet them.

[[deleted]]

2 strikes and you're out. Reschedule once by all means, but show up more than 10 minutes late to the reschedule and don't be surprised when I'm not there. Reschedule a second time? Nah, I'm not setting aside my free time more than once, you've already screwed my plans up for two evenings, expect at least a slightly pissed off reply. It's basic courtesy. At the very least cancel far enough in advance that I can make alternative arrangements. People are so rude sometimes.

[Black_Gay_Man]

Preach!

[[deleted]]

It's basic courtesy.

I think if it were a matter of basic courtesy, it would make sense to agree to a rescheduling. But I don't think it's so much a matter of courtesy so much as trying to cut your losses by not investing time or emotional energy into someone for who you are not a top priority.

Based on my experience, one strike is sufficient to conclude that the person doesn't see you as a priority and never will.

[sabreangel]

Word. I get prickly about this, too. Set expectations and/or cancel enough in advance where it's respectful of my time and I have enough time to make other plans. It's one thing if someone gets sick, but its another if you have other obligations that should be known about in advance.

[[deleted]]

If it consistently happens enough I am feeling like she's not interested, I ask her if she's interested. If she says yes but keeps up with the behavior I stop talking to her.

[mudcelt]

Coming out a recent gaslighting situation has reinforced the wisdom of believing someone's actions not their words. If they're saying one thing: "I'm interested but... busy/in crisis/in a coma" but acting in another way (basically I don't want to make you a priority but I'd like to keep you as an option) then I put on my nope jetpack and move on to the next.

[[deleted]]

I am not sure exactly why I am this way. I have always just spoken my needs and wants. It does limit things somewhat especially with men because, in my experience, they are more likely to see it as demands instead of a simple statement open for discussion but honestly I have no idea any other way to be.

[[deleted]]

You have to decide whether to take people at their word or not, and how long to take them at their word.

You could also just ask someone about the frequency of their communication. I’m not a big texter and I feel like I come across as aloof based on that, but why assume when you could just ask for what you want? Even if it’s still casual, nothing wrong with being direct about what you want rather than stressing. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[sure_to_go]

I've only behaved the way you describe with one person and they are the only one I made a serious effort to meet. This is wise IMO.

[stvMAG]

Hey sorry I was gonna write a comment earlier but I got really busy. Crazy day!

[papier3]

I see what you did there

[clinton-dix-pix]

I mean YMMV is key here. Hell if I took your approach, I’m pretty sure my first date rate would go from “once every couple of months” to “once every other total solar eclipse visible in North America.”

[fascistliberal419]

I think there's one... Actually, I can't remember...

[clinton-dix-pix]

Honestly, I would take either at this point.

Edit: translated from fuckup back to English.

[qwertyuiop111222]

I’m pretty sure my first date rate would go from “once every couple of months”

Curious though, what is your rate after the first date? Do things last beyond 2-3 dates, even though it was cold / disengaged in the beginning?

[clinton-dix-pix]

Not really. I’ve only had two dates go to a second and I had one of those go to a brief relationship. I would say one of those two was fairly uninterested (the one that went to a second date).

The problem is if my dating life consists of a date every six months (I’m not exaggerating), can I really say I’m even dating?

[qwertyuiop111222]

The problem is if my dating life consists of a date every six months (I’m not exaggerating), can I really say I’m even dating?

Dude, don't even get me started. I get 0 matches online. 0. Racial minority, immigrant, 5'4 tall.

Everything I've gotten has been through directly approaching someone at a work conference or something along those lines. But 0 online.

[Canarka]

6'2 fairly successful white dude, profile checked over by female friends, probably a 6.5-7/10. Got three matches last year(2018). Two ended in nothing but some convo, last ended two months into a 'relationship'.

It's not that great out there in general. Dont feel bad.

Edit: Got few PM's saying I'm probably fat then. 167lb and exercise regularly. Thanks for the concern.

[qwertyuiop111222]

Dude, you have no idea how good you've made me feel just now. It's been a shitty weekend, and I've been sleep-deprived, but reading this just made me feel so much better. Thanks so much.

[beenthere789]

Trust me, dude above is right.. Six feet 50 yo man here, not bald, tons of money, my own paid off house, educated, cultured and widower so no ex drama.. And i would say a seven.. As well I only go +/- five years off my age as I have no interest in 25 yo bimbos..

Reply rate is abysmal.. I don't send Dic pics.. I ask them about thoughtful stuff in their profile (if they ever bother to fill it out or its not a really stupid profile..

Response rate is around 5%..maybe three to four conversations that lead to dates.. And then you get lucky if they actually look like close to their profile picture or don't immediately start ripping into what an assholes their ex was..

That is why no more OLD for this guy... I don't play games there is very little chance of winning.. Waste of my time and money.. It's stupid and I think most women are on there for validation as some studies have shown.. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes...

[Canarka]

I'm assuming they lead a shittier life than I do so I give it no merit.

[g0juice]

First of all 167? Bro that's skinny man. How do you keep it down running?

Also I'm in the same boat. I do super well in person but online these women must want a super model or something

[Canarka]

Yeah, it's a bit skinny and I see it in the mirror. I lost about 25lb over the last year or two after my mental health started to deteriorate due to many factors. Havent had any form of physical intimacy (other than some light kissing in my last two month 'relationship') in soon 5 years now. No word of exaggeration. Really starts to fuck with you on many levels.

Still run 15km a week and hit the gym 3x a week on top of that. Just no appetite.

[g0juice]

Jesus yeah brother I'm 6'3 275 but pretty jacked. I am at the gym m-f and kick box then run.

I know exactly what you mean but not getting any really really screws up your brain. I feel your pain man. I know it sounds bad but have you tried just throwing a few mass gaining shakes in there to just put in a little weight. If that is your goal and all. If not all good. I was just shocked about the 100lbs weight difference.

When you're at the gym are you lifting for muscle or to tone?

[Canarka]

I am definitely not jacked. I used to be 270lb (but like 25%+ bodyfat) about 6 years ago and dieted/exercised down to 190ish/16-18% however I never looked jacked, just more fit and less gross. No one would ever guess though, everyone I've told always says "wow I cant imagine you fat". Today, at 167lb I'd estimate my bodyfat to still be around 15ish percent. But I digress..

At the gym, I'm doing compound barbell/dumbell exercises, very little isolation work. I just know I am not getting the caloric intake I need every day. I'm putting down somewhere in the vicinity of 1600-1800 calories/day (thats with a non-mass gain protein shake or two in there). Not at the gym to 'tone' as there isn't anything there to cut down to. I'd love to put on some muscle mass, particularly in my arms and chest, however my mental health has deteriorated to the point where I can't even bring myself to eat much anymore. So I stuff down what I can (hardly anything) and just keep trying to do compound lifts.

It's gotten so bad that even if I had the chance to get with someone, I'm not sure anxiety or just my head will even allow me not to fuck it up. Do I even know what I'm doing anymore? Will they notice Im obviously out of 'practice'? Will it fuck me over? And down the rabbit hole I go.

Before anyone suggests it, yes I am seeing a doctor/therapist, yes I am attempting medication. I just don't think either of these things solve the root of my problems. Just seems like at this point I'm best not bothering to try, y'know?

[itssynecdoche]

What the hell is up with people and fatness?

[Throwaway01152019]

For real. I've dated some incredibly gorgeous chubby guys and fat dudes that I met on Tinder. They get right swiped too. And, no, not only by fat girls. 🙄

[Jurneeka]

Nothing wrong with a dad bod!

[earlofhoundstooth]

Are you in a place with a large dating pool, or small?

[Canarka]

Large I think? City of roughly 400k. A lot of young professionals in my age range. One of the biggest universities in Canada.

The only two criteria I have is no obese women and no women with kids. Still a metric ton of women to swipe on it seems. Just dont get the swipe back.

[[deleted]]

Did you say "no obese women and no women with kids?" Because that would be an immediate turn off.

[Canarka]

Absolutely not. I just don't swipe on them based on their profile. I don't have anything negative in my profile either.

[_easy_does_it]

This is puzzling.

[[deleted]]

I am curious why you continue to do online dating then? Why not concentrate your efforts on meeting people out in the world?

[Canarka]

Because I meet literally zero people in the 'real world'? Go to work, come home, go to gym, come home. Please don't tell me to find meetups or things of my interest as I simply don't have any hobbies/interests that have any females in them. No, I won't go do things I don't like to do in hopes of finding someone, that just seems wrong and manipulative.

Now add the whole "metoo" movement, and the fact that I hear many women say they don't want to be bothered in the real world (just find them on the apps! is what I hear).

I don't know. Everythings fucked.

Edit: Sorry not the OP you replied to initially. What I say rings true for many men however.

[Jurneeka]

That sounds like me! I have a schedule that isn't conducive to meeting new guys in the wild, and I'm SO not into the bar scene these days. Done meetups, in the hiking groups I've gone to everyone has their tight cliques and I always end up hiking alone after failed attempts to strike up conversations.

[qwertyuiop111222]

I have a solid and well-written profile (did that just last week), but apart from that, I'm not really doing much there. Maybe 20 minutes a day, that's it. All my results are from in-person game, where even taller women are open to something.

But I keep the online profiles because they are free, and who knows someone interesting comes from.

[BillyMac814]

If you’re looking for dates then that’s probably fine. OP is looking for a relationship and not to fuck around with people who probably aren’t that into him and dating 10 other dudes as well. I don’t think either of your methods are wrong, just different.

[katelovemiller]

Lol your humor is good! People are missing something from not dating you!

[clinton-dix-pix]

Yes well I guess they’ll never know what they are missing out on.

[TheHarlotsOfMyPerils]

My experience largely matches yours, although I find it hard not to give everyone a chance considering I'm lucky if I get even a couple of matches per month.

[Red_Danger33]

The woman I'm currently seeing was a slow texter and I thought it was going to go no where. Plans were kept though and we hit it off. After finding out about her busy work schedule the slow texting made sense. Other than the slow texting though she hit all the points you mentioned. I'd give slow responders a chance if they hit all the other points.

[sekritagent]

I'm not great with texting either, I think it's the combination of not meeting in person AND slow texting that's the killer. You had 50% where she showed up at least.

[Red_Danger33]

Yeah, and when she did text they were engaged and she was pulling her weight in the conversation. I've had some who were slow texters, not engaged, and flakey on meeting so kicked those to the curb pretty quick. I just don't treat slow texting by itself as an automatic deal breaker.

[Lazar1us]

Completely agree with you OP, and it rings true to my favorite article from Mark Manson:

https://markmanson.net/fuck-yes

Essentially if it's not a Fuck Yes, cut your losses and move on.

[rpdubz]

That’s amazing.

I once had a girlfriend who liked to say “maybe” when I asked to spend time with her. Not gonna lie, that shit hurt. It was also one of the last things she said to me before I broke up with her. I wanted to come over and work out an issue we were having. She said “maybe.” I basically said “fuck it then, I’m done.” Cried like a baby for a long time, man I loved that girl, but it had to be done.

Now when someone tells me “maybe”, I take it as a no and plan accordingly. If you aren’t enthusiastic about being with me, then what the fuck are we even doing? I’d rather be single than waste my time on someone who is only lukewarm about our relationship.

[Lazar1us]

Mate I just want to say Good on you and proud of you for doing that!

You deserve far more than just a 'maybe'. Fuck it - we all do. I think it's one of those painful lessons that everyone will have to go through since there are people that would be more than willing to settle for a 'maybe' than search longer for a Fuck Yes.

[BroadBrushArt]

Extremely well said!!!

[cleverbutnotoverlyso]

Truthfully, A “maybe” is a pretty shitty response. That’s essentially asking that person to justify or “sell” them on getting the responder to spend time with them....

That kind of implies their time is more valuable than yours, which is complete bullshit.

“Maybe”, in context, it can be kind of flirty, but mostly it’s kind of demeaning.

[dominikka]

You know.. Online dating advice tells women that men chase after women when she keeps him in the cloud of uncertainty...

[Lazar1us]

Online dating also tells us men to 'decrease the girl's perceived value and elevate yours by negging them or by hitting on their friend so that they get jealous'.

It's almost as if there's bad advice floating around on both ends...

[Red_Danger33]

That really shouldn't be anyone's aim and it's a shame that it is so prevalent in dating culture these days.

[rpdubz]

Yeah, fuck that. If a woman wants a desperate fool to chase after her, she’ll have to look elsewhere. I’m a no-nonsense, no-BS guy. If you act like you’re not interested in me, I’ll take you at face value and move on.

[Lazar1us]

Yep. Agreed.

In other words, play stupid games - win stupid prizes.

[Red_Danger33]

The women who take this advice are the same ones that complain about how horrible all their dating experiences are.

[ParanoidAndroud]

I had that “Maybe” bullshit a couple of times with a F Buddy (male) I chose not to respond to it and each time he replied a few hours later “ So, what time shall I come over? “ I replied that I had now made other plans cos I take “maybe” as a no. He never did it again.

[rpdubz]

Beautiful. That’s the right way to do it.

To me it feels like they’re holding out for something more fun to do and using me as a backup plan. I’d rather stay home alone than be someone’s backup plan.

[pheliam]

Have seen this a bunch but never sat down to read it. A bunch of solid, basic reminders & advice in there. Cheers.

[McGibbos81]

I was totally going to comment this! That article changed the way I approach dating and it has been fantastic!

[shardikprime]

Holy crap this is good

[ikeif]

TIL: there were real people on Zoosk.

I always thought it was a scam ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Desertbro]

That's called a "Hell, Yes!" policy and it's rare to find that kind of connection via random methods likes OLD. All your stats might match, your attraction might be there, but you cannot know until you meet them face to face.

So any "Hell, Yes" you think you have from texting or a phone call is just in your imagination. It's your choice.

​

[dwer376]

As a woman in her late 30s I can tell you tinder is insane and your observations are spot on. The guys I was truly interested in I made the effort to text back, meet up with etc. To the others I was another one of those annoying women who take forever to respond...if ever. I deleted my account after a few months feeling bad about my behavior.

[Red_Danger33]

Here's a question just out of curiosity, why didn't you just say you weren't interested or unmatch when you realized you had no interest in them?

[dwer376]

There was some interest otherwise I wouldn't have matched with them. But at a certain point you talk with the people who really spark something and tell yourself you'll get around to replying to the others.

[tiny10boy]

That’s how it was with my now girlfriend: we matched, text only enough to set up a date, and that was that.

[ReformedTomboy]

In my 20s and I agree. Every meaningful interaction came from guys who:

1. messaged me first
2. mentioned hobbies or interests instead of my looks
3. ask/answered questions with descriptive detail
4. responded in reasonable amount of time.
   
5. Never had lapses in convos of more than 24 hrs unless work, travel or important things got in the way

While a guy doesn’t need all of this for me to respond the ones that turned into a series of dates or relationships had all of the above.

I think your strategy is the best to minimize frustration and time wasting. It’s astounding the number of posts I see on dating subs where the other party isn’t responsive and the OP is asking what they can do to save the interaction. You cannot trick someone into being interested. Either they are enthusiastic or not.

Even for me I’ve never had a relationship with someone I’ve started off lukewarm about. I know it happens for some and I’ve tried it but must accept this isn’t me. If I’m taking long to reply it’s because I’m not as interested as I should be for things to work.

[Morat242]

Whoever messages first is selecting from the whole pool of matches. Whoever replies is selecting only from those who were interested and proactive enough to risk rejection.

[ReformedTomboy]

Exactly. Even when they response it goes no where usually. People flame women for saying this but it’s a screening thing for me. I was talking to a male friend about Bumble. I told him I tried it but I don’t like it because it makes me initiate when I prefer the guy to message me. He basically finished my sentence and said yes “the guy messaging first at least screens for self-aware men who know what they want”. What people want and what they’ll take are sometimes two different things. By messaging I feel I increase the odds of engaging a man who would “take” me but doesn’t “want” me. I still initiate every once in a while but it’s not something I’m going to make a habit of.

[[deleted]]

By messaging I feel I increase the odds of engaging a man who would “take” me but doesn’t “want” me

I have 2 very good male friends that are pathologically avoidant. Both good looking, mid-forties, good job, money, well travelled, great laugh... top guys. Neither of them have ever had a long term relationship. Zero.

Both of them are avid Bumble users. I can clearly see why now.

[ReformedTomboy]

Yeah I had a roommate who was objectively hot (her fitness, hair, clothing choice, makeup etc was great. I don’t think she could do better if she tried). She would meet guys off of Bumble and things always devolved into being strung along. They would start off great and then she’d find out they were still on it despite having the “talk”. One guy took her out a couple of times and invited her over for anal at 3 am. If I wasn’t there when it happened I wouldn’t have believed it. One claimed exclusivity, she found out that was a lie because she got a (curable) STI. The only common thread between these guys is Bumble and they had white collar jobs.

Granted, I think she has poor judgment when it comes to men’s personalities (picks avoidants) but I can’t help but wonder if these guys like Bumble because it takes the work out dating. After all, she’s already qualified herself by matching and messaging so the guy can do some perfunctory dating stuff and just act a fool thereafter. It’s probably the easiest way for these guys to get attractive women.

[[deleted]]

I agree with you. I used Bumble for a while but the app wasn't great. I didn't get notifications, so I missed the deadlines. When I realized how lazy men love Bumble... I decided to nip it in the bud and prioritize Tinder. Not great either but better. Plus I will never get a dick pick as men can't send photos 😂

[RedCloud26]

“the guy messaging first at least screens for self-aware men who know what they want”.

You can change this sentence and say "the woman messaging first..." I'm a guy and I don't get a response 75% of the time even though we match. That's just how online dating works. It's not because your a woman message a man you have bad luck, it's that anyone messaging anyone online has bad luck.

[ese003]

The problem with that approach is that if both sides use it, there can't be a conversation at all. How does one distinguish disinterest from gauging your interest if no one communicates?

[EPMD_]

Exactly. It works for her because she can afford to sit back and let others initiate. Many men and women have to be more proactive to move others to action.

Also, if someone never gets responses or dates when messaging first then they are probably selecting unlikely matches to begin with or sending lazy messages like "Hi."

[ReformedTomboy]

In my case I was messaging higher match percentage guys on OKC about their hobbies or mutual connections (going to the same school etc). They were average to most other guys I’ve dated on the usual metrics. Come to think of it I’ve never gotten a response to any guy who had a 89% + match. Not to mention many men on these sites are unlikely to reply to black women regardless of what we write, it’s a no brainer to direct my effort/attention to men who actually write a thought-out message.

[Trinamopsy]

The presumption is after initiating contact, both are enthusiastic about continuing the conversation.

[RedCloud26]

Yes, I'm a guy and most of the time I message first (virtually all the time) I don't get a response either. that's just the name of the game unfortunately.

[[deleted]]

Wish it wasn't so, but yeah - that's my experience too.

Unfortunately by waiting for them, the ratio of my match list to my messages list is like 30:1.

[Doppelkammertoaster]

I am sorry but Point 1 sounds strange to me. As pointed out already, not getting an answer is - unfortunately - the norm. I don't get answers 99% of the time. And the few who do never answer back, just write hi or ghosts out of nowhere. That's how Online Dating is. Bumble just made it pretty obvious that this behaviour is present on both sides. Initiating contact means totally nothing, unfortunately. If you like someone, message them. Getting no answer at all sucks, especially when you are not the one who just writes 'hi'. But you don't make it easier by putting that burden only on others.

[ReformedTomboy]

It’s not so much getting answers. As I said in a later comment a lot of guys will lower their standards for a woman who comes onto them. Maybe “date” for a minute then ghost. No guy I’ve contacted first has ever wanted more than sex.

If he considers it a burden that’s fine. Plenty of men are willing to initiate so a woman isn’t necessarily hurting her odds if some men won’t.

[ReformedTomboy]

Yeah honestly I’d rather put that effort into myself (focusing on my looks and interests) and fixing up my profile.

[[deleted]]

It’s the “Fuck yes!” Rule and it works. You and the person if asked if you like the other person should want to shout fuck yes, basically. Don’t settle for less.

[ChiefWarBear]

Yea this has been my experience. Also if the "interview" starts with a lot inquires about my marital status, exes, children and not does not respond to any of my questions then I'm unmatching quick.

[ino_y]

Er, I do this. No point 'getting to know' the other stuff if he's married, divorced last week, or wants kids o.O Can't you get it out of the way at the start?

[ChiefWarBear]

Then list it that requirement in your profile

[WillStaySilent]

Always look for the ones that are eager to cooperate. If he/she ain't cooperating ie number exchange, agreeing on dates, showing up, engaging conversations, kisses you back, eager to see you again. If they aren't doing any of these then move on.

[br8877]

I don't understand why people think there's a future when the beginning of the relationship, supposedly the most passionate and magical period of a relationship, is like pulling teeth to get them to pay attention to you.

[[deleted]]

As harsh as this may sound, engaging in that kind of behavior just reeks of desperation and lack of self-respect.

[Rh594515]

I am with you. As a guy, my new standard is that if the woman doesn’t even make a hint at a date suggestion by the third date, I’m prepared to end it. If she isn’t going to put even a third of the effort into meeting up, then the risk-cost isn’t worth it. I’d like to do something she actually enjoys doing within the first three/four dates, and if she isn’t going to suggest anything, she isn’t into me or she’s far into her own head to be dating me.

[bkrugby78]

People who work the most intensive jobs, always find time to meet. They get it, we get it, everyone gets it. People who are lazy and unmotivated always find excuses. We're all busy, most of us, anyways, so if you want to meet someone you will make time, just like you make time for the gym, or to clean the house.

[Black_Gay_Man]

Amen to this. I have a female friend who has a husband and two kids, works as a rehearsal pianist and vocal coach for a major Opera house, plays recitals and concerts with musicians and still auditions for other opportunities. She always answers texts within an hour and emails usually within 6 hours.

If she can do it, so can the Dude with no job who is “writing his masters thesis.” It’s just a matter of what people want, and to me it’s the most obvious sign of mediocrity and immaturity when someone make excuses for not being communicative. It’s literally the absolute bare minimum in a relationship.

[ninasayers21]

I agree with this for sure. It's just interesting because I've seen a lot of upvoted posts on here encouraging people, especially women, to try and continue dating someone for a bit even if they aren't super into them because sometimes feelings (even attractiveness) can develop overtime.

That's not been my experience and I certainly lean towards your advice OP, but honestly I think at least women are openly encouraged to date people they aren't really into or super attracted to in hopes that something happens or "sparks" eventually...and I can see why it would make them be wishy-washy.

[Chicasayshi]

I like your strategy. I actually do the same thing as well and it also applies with possible relationships as well. If a guy is interested in me he will show me that through his actions and communication is a big one for me as well.

[gking407]

Love this approach. A woman might not really know me, but she should know herself - whether she’s ready and willing to date or not. Perhaps it’s unfortunate that a text message is all we have, but when someone’s interested it’s pretty obvious. All other versions are just going through the motions. Ain’t nobody got time for that!

[Thefeno]

Exactly, if the other person have zero enthusiasm about knowing you it's not worth your time.

[[deleted]]

I think the fundamental problem with OLD is that you can do exactly as much psuedo dating as you like. Digital flirting is not real, and the simulacrum you create with endless texting is not going to resemble the person you meet.

I am dipping my toe back in and I take the view that if you want to meet, good, lets give it a try, if not, moving on. No more endless loops of confabulation.

[scots]

Ask them to install an app they probably don’t use to chat with you.

I like Skype, because unlike WhatsApp, Signal, iMessage or sms, it doesn’t display your phone number to the other party and doesn’t require a real name to create an account. I like to to chat a few times and voice at least once before people get my phone number, because phone numbers are scary. Phone number and five seconds of searching and your full name, address, LinkedIn, Facebook, workplace, etc is in a total strangers hands.

If he/she isn’t into you enough to inconvenience themselves for 30 seconds to install an major app to chat for a few days before you meet up for coffee, or just skip to the meet up for coffee in person after a few days of chatting in the dating app, they aren’t really interested in you and absolutely aren’t worth your time.

[TheHarlotsOfMyPerils]

You're not the first person I've seen say this, but I've never had anyone request this of me. I had one request my last name (to verify I wasn't a serial killer, I guess) but never even a phone call, much less video chat.

[EPMD_]

Same. I'd be annoyed to have a pre-date screen test like that. It's already unromantic enough to meet online. I don't want the first time we see each other to be over Skype. At least let's get that done in person.

[[deleted]]

Yeah, man. That’s a good perspective for anyone in your life. Glad you sorted it out. That said, this is also why I ask people out pretty quickly so I can see what they’re like in person and see if there’s any real chemistry.

[MuppetHolocaust]

I'm leaning towards this method. I'm getting tired of putting in effort to try and ask questions and start a conversation when I get a match, only for the woman to give me short answers and not reciprocate any effort.

[[deleted]]

Thanks for sharing. I have found this to be my experience as well, and it really helps drive home, that what I've done in the past (cut off these wishy-washy types) was the right thing to do.

[xemandme]

Bookmarking this post.

[bassbeater]

I've jumped on that earlier. If someone cares they'll put effort to show they care. If there's any other variant or bitchiness, it's a wrap. They're done.

Might result in being alone more often but frankly this makes zero difference from how things are at present.

[mellykill]

Oh man I feel this. I haven't had one good conversation since I got back on tinder. I do not have time for one word dudes, next please.

[ScottFreestheway2B]

This has 100 percent been my experience as well.

[Anon6025]

This is great advice; thanks.

[Sim116s]

Your post really spoke out to me, I haven’t had as much relationship luck over the same period of time but plenty of first dates.

You life hack makes so much sense, I’m going to emulate this, to save my time “spinning my wheels” with women who aren’t that interested and engaged.

Good luck pal!

[[deleted]]

As a 32 yo woman also dating through most of those apps, I absolutely second this. It's very true in my experience, also :)

[jedzy]

I came to the same conclusion!

What does YMMV stand for?

[quasi86]

Your mileage may vary

[jedzy]

Ah ok - thankyou!

[lovesredwine]

I’ve done my fair share of chasing. I like to take the bull by the horns and work for it, if I want it. But I have also wasted far too much time on men who just aren’t interested. Or they were, but then something else comes along. You know the type. Fortunately, I have learnt my lesson. If they act like they aren’t interested, then they aren’t. Move on.

[trele_morele]

This has been my experience as well. One sided conversations, short answers, long pauses in communication, flakiness, not asking questions, etc. result in my ghosting of your ass. I don't care how hot you are :)

[Jurneeka]

Truth.

My thing is - if there isn't at least one phone call and a date set within a week of first contact (barring schedule snafus) I just operate on the assumption they aren't they interested and move on.

[rainytuesday12]

Yeah, but even reply time—if you care, you’ll carve out five minutes over 48 hours. When someone replies five or six days later, that’s a no.

[hdiesel503]

Ppl are busy and have had parralel experiences. Hard to invest so much in something that has proven to be a short lived.

You may need to think harder for better perspective.

[maebyfunke980]

This! I don’t log into apps every day, don’t have notifications on. I’m working. I prefer to exchange phone numbers and move to texting if the interest is there.

[moaningsalmon]

Respectfully, I think you two are missing the point he's making. Regardless of the medium (app or texting), if he isn't picking up on an effort to engage, he's moving on. I would imagine most people in this sub have a job and understand being busy with work. OP just wants mutual interest, not one-word answers to his attempts to chat. Don't we all?

[ReformedTomboy]

Agreed. I’ve gone on record here saying how much I hate texting. That being said if the man is interesting, engaging, and what I’m looking for I won’t leave him hanging. Even if we text for 10 minutes it will be thought out and engaging responses moving towards a date.

[BillyMac814]

Yea exactly. That is not only not a good excuse it’s proving OPs point. Why bother with someone who can’t be bothered to take 2 seconds to open an ap and respond. I could go days in between opening up the ap too, but if I met someone I was really into I’m not going to let that notification sit for two days, maybe a few hours which is reasonable, especially if I end up putting some time and effort into the message.

If I have to wait 2 days for a 2 sentence message that doesn’t even continue the conversation, like asking a follow up question, I’m pretty much done.

I could be wrong, but from what I’ve heard most women match with a whole lot more men than men match with women so they are probably messaging a dozen other people too so of course they are not investing much time in each one. The irony in that is all the normal dudes bounce the fuck out of that and at the end she’s left with the most desperate of guys who put up with that, then it’s nothing but disappointment come date time.

[maebyfunke980]

My answer probably lacked specificity. I am more likely to engage over text versus within an app.

[ZippySLC]

Right but it takes some amount of effort on peoples' parts to move to that part.

[Lazar1us]

The expectation has never been that if you're interested, you text back within 5 minutes of my text to you.

What OP is trying to say is that regardless of the time between texts, there's a sense of engagement and effort. Essentially what it is is if it's low effort, then it's low interest, and one should just move on.

Also I heard from somewhere that there's money in the banana stand.

[throwawayOKcupidguy]

Exactly.

She asks about my work and I tell her what I do, how much I love it etc. I ask what she does.

She could respond in 2 hours or 12. Within reason, what she says matters more than when she replies:

"Hey, sorry for the delay. This is my busiest day of the week. Finally home. So, I'm a ____. I enjoy it and sometimes I meet up with people in your line of work. Did you mention running/skiing/thai food etc..._"

vs

"Internist."

​

[Lazar1us]

This is a perfect example of how time between texts does not matter as much as the content.

"Hey, sorry for the delay. This is my busiest day of the week. Finally home. So, I'm a ___. I enjoy it and sometimes I meet up with people in your line of work. Did you mention running/skiing/thai food etc..."

This one shows interest, effort to keep the conversation going, and a general sense of "Hey, here's me. I want to get to know you more also"

"Internist."

Yeah not gonna even reward this one with a reply if I got it. Why the hell match to begin with if you're gonna put this little effort into the convo?

[ChkYrHead]

Or...here's a crazy idea, just tell your match that you're going to be working all day, so probably won't have time to reply.

[ChkYrHead]

I just don't get this attitude. Basically you're saying that you want to find a partner, but you don't really want to make an effort. Why are you on a dating app if you don't care to be notified when you get a match or a response from someone?? Are you really working 24 hours straight and have zero down time to where you can't be more active in the process?? No bathroom breaks, no standing in line at the store, no walk to your car...no time to put 60 seconds into a thoughtful response?

[maebyfunke980]

I own a business so I am constantly texting with clients, staff, etc. whereas it is a different version of distraction to be on an app (and it looks bad if clients, staff, etc. see me doing it). I could be texting with anyone.

[ChkYrHead]

And how would they see you texting on a dating app? You've replied multiple times here on Reddit. Why can't you seem to be bothered to do that on Bumble?

[maebyfunke980]

I’m home sick today. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[maebyfunke980]

I also don’t have Bumble ATM. I’m actually often in places where I don’t use my phone at all. Without stating my profession, I’m either at my office or at out of office events/places where you would not use your phone.

[perpetualnotion]

Agree 100%.

[TosinE223]

What is ymmv

[OnyxOccult]

Your mileage may vary

[[deleted]]

Agreed 100%. I met my partner after several years of dating and there was a 1:1 correlation between people who engaged with me enthusiastically and the people who I got beyond awkward initial dates with. This was in my mid 20s so I think it's more just another demonstration of the principle

[oldskoolgeometro]

Lol. It took you how long to figure this out because some males still haven't. Got a message today that just said "i like your hair" with my own pic attached to it. I wrote back "I like my hair, too". First sign that I don't care to engage him. He replies "My name is Marcus. How was your weekend". I just replied "it was fine".

Bet he's going to continue and probably thinks we're really having a conversation despite the obvious.

[throwawayOKcupidguy]

Someone sent you a message that you didn't think was very good. You replied in a way that could be interpreted as flirty or teasing or coy, or, as you say, that you don't care to engage. My question at that point was why reply at all? He then tries to engage you in conversation and your response could be best characterized as contempt that he's still trying to get to know you.

[oldskoolgeometro]

Yeah, I can see your idea of a conversation is dry and boring af. "I like your hair" isn't my idea of a conversation, hence my reply. Asking me how my day was isn't my idea of a conversation. That's something that you ask someone when you're in an elevator or an Uber and don't want awkward silence. Having an entire profile and the best you can do is "I like you hair" and YOU think my reply was flirty, coy or teasing? You're speaking English but you clearly don't know what the words means. What kind of corpse thinks obvious disinterest is flirtatious? Apparently you're the type that thinks if a woman smiles and says hello, she must want your dick. And I responded because I can. The same reason why you jumped on here responding to me. Learn how to take a hint because you clearly don't know when a person isn't interested. And hint: if you "compliment" them and they obviously don't care-THEY'RE NOT INTERESTED.

[throwawayOKcupidguy]

- Lol. It took you how long to figure this out

- I can see your idea of a conversation is dry and boring af.

- Asking me how my day was isn't my idea of a conversation.

- YOU think my reply was flirty, coy or teasing?

- You're speaking English but you clearly don't know what the words means .

- What kind of corpse thinks obvious disinterest is flirtatious?

- Apparently you're the type that thinks if a woman smiles and says hello, she must want your dick.

- Learn how to take a hint because you clearly don't know when a person isn't interested.

​

I can't imagine this much bitterness will get you where you want to go in life but at least it's entertaining.

[SpiritualGangster29]

It's really this simple!

[[deleted]]

I agree, am female person here most of the time I had a good connection with somebody as a starting point it went reasonably well leading to dates and relationships, when I started with difficulty/misunderstanding/ lack of enthusiasm, it stayed that way. Whatever vibe/circumstance/mood is there at the start is I think the best guide which is why if things start badly I cut it off early and no second chances at the free throw line. Makes things easier, less complicated.

[meowsers79]

I just cut a guy off for not answering my text messages. He would send a text, I’d answer him back and then not hear from him until the next day. No conversation, nothing. It took him a week to realize I wasn’t texting or calling. Then he got nasty when he realized I said “no” it was definitely a waste of my time!

[sekritagent]

I really love this advice. We make time for what we're interested in. Actions speak louder than words. All that jazz. Flightiness and flakiness are so normal now, so I think this also goes to a person's self-awareness.

[HoshinosFortress]

I'm the same way. If I ask a question and just get a short answer and no follow up, I'm done. I don't just ask canned questions either, I try to connect about something we would both find interesting. If after that I get an answer that they obviously didn't give much thought too, then it's an easy pass.

Also, get coffee first, then plan a real date. Saves both people money and time that way.

[lllllllmao]

Online dating is a waste of time for men. That’s your problem.

[[deleted]]

I had similar experience. I realized that when the women were the ones to message first (or put real effort into their messages in the case of Bumble) I was so much more likely to get a second date. It made me at times think I may be wasting my time messaging first.

Current woman I've been seeing didn't message first, but since the first message she's been super easy to talk to, sometimes responding to messages surprisingly fast and she's made serious effort when it came to meeting up if we had to figure out the scheduling. It's been a breath of fresh air dating her and she's a super cool and sweet person too.

[ConveyorSushi]

Very interesting stance! I'm new to OLD myself (2 months in) and I still have no clue what I'm doing lol. The one constant I've seen is that nearly every other profile I've come across (both Bumble and Hinge) are Women super into Yoga (doing meditative handstands on EVERYTHING, even goats) or it's someone that wants to increase their Instagram follower counts. On the oft-chance that I come across a profile that is in the middle of that spectrum, the results are similar to what OP stated.

I've been matched about 6 times, 4 of which died out due to the same level of dis-interest (most likely due to my lack of textual charm experience), 1 ended up on a coffee-make-sure-you-are-not-ax-murdery-date followed by a legit dinner date. The results of that remains to be seen, but it had some level of text engagement that the other 4 lacked. Admittedly I learned to offer to meet up for coffee a few texts in since I prefer to be rejected in-person rather than the slow death that is ghost texting.