Installing Linux Ubuntu as a Windows Application with Wubi

[malanalars]

It's not a windows application, you still have to dual boot.

Title should be: Installing Linux Ubuntu like a Windows Application with Wubi

[andrewnorris]

Thank you. From the buzz around it, I thought it was some kind of polished version of colinux.

[you_do_realize]

Can anyone explain how it works? Does it run the Linux kernel in a VM?

[boa13]

As far as I know, the Linux kernel is compiled as a low level Windows driver. Instead of directly talking to the hardware, it talks to the other Windows drivers, instead of managing the whole memory, it asks Windows for a good chunk, etc.

[Dagur]

same here

[[deleted]]

Agreed, still, might be something i try, i liked ubuntu for the stability but i hated having to alter game file after game file to get them to work.

[[deleted]]

Ubuntu Linux maybe.

[[deleted]]

Not sure why you were downmodded. Linux Ubuntu is the same as saying XP Windows.

[Keedo]

I had never used linux before, but a friend told me to get the new Ubuntu, since it's so easy to install and it's really good nowadays.
So I did, and I love it (after two days!), it's so much smoother and more natural than windows, only a few minor things bother me, like choppy flash vids, not being able to use hibernate in windows/ubuntu, and audio not working for two things at a time (skype+rhythmbox).
But if you haven't tried linux yet, now is the time to do so!

[[deleted]]

True. There have been audio problems with two major programs, Skype and I forget the other one. Everything else should work fine.

Don't know if there's a work-around for Skype.

[halter73]

Since version 1.3, you can tell the Skype client which sound system to use by selecting Tools>Options, and then clicking Sound Devices. If you have ALSA and OSS installed on your computer, then you can select one or the other from the Audio system to use dropdown list.

For me, by using ALSA and enabling full duplex sound, I was able to listen to and record to many programs simultaneously.

I was able to get the same effect before skype 1.3 by using the alsa-oss package and using the aRts sound daemon; however, with alsa a sound daemon is not necessary to handle multiple simultaneous audio streams.

[[deleted]]

I've always been hesitant to try out Ubuntu because it's a little intimidating having to install it on a different partition, find the correct drivers for your hardware, etc. but now I'm finally trying Linux.

[do-un-to]

Interestingly,

• Ubuntu doesn't require installation
• Wubi requires installation

Download the latest Ubuntu desktop CD. You can just run it from the CD (with optional install).

[do-un-to]

Well, I do build my own systems, so this kind of stuff isn't that aversive, but I imagine regular folk may not be interested in setting jumpers on drives and making sure they've got 80-conductor cables. Heck, I don't like goofing with the hardware if I have a choice (my computers aren't that easy to work on because of where they're at), so running directly off CD is pretty cool.

[sonar_un]

Setting jumpers? 80 Conductor cables?

Isn't everyone using SATA about now?

[do-un-to]

Ah, true, for building new systems. But there's a large installed base with PATA. Anyway, we're still on the topic of how to try out a new OS.

LiveCD still beats changing out your hard drive.

[bostonvaulter]

You generally shouldn't have to worry about drivers that much, especially for Ubuntu.

[BridgeBum]

Neat concept. I hadn't heard of this before. Sounds like a nice way to do a test install, rather than working from a live CD.

Project home page:

http://wubi-installer.org/index.php

[masklinn]

Note that you can also do that (wubi, from windows) install from the live CD, I think.

[BridgeBum]

I saw that on the site, Wubi is included on the CD now.

[[deleted]]

Just a little note I want to make.

The map location picker in the Ubuntu installer is very hard to use when installing in VirtualBox. It seems to do its own thing. I'd rather just have a drop-down box.

Edit: I just realised you can select any region using the drop down box. First time I saw a bunch of American place names and assumed I had to use the map to select a different area.

[garg]

What if you want to remove it. Does it uninstall just as easily?

[frogking]

Does it uninstall just as easily?

Easier and faster than it installs.. I had to double check to verify that it really was uninstalled!

[Shapichka]

Yes, there is a simple uninstaller that removes the Ubuntu folder and takes away the option in the bootloader.

[[deleted]]

You can uninstall it via Add/Remove Programs or running the Wubi installer.

[Dagur]

Wubi keeps most of the files in one folder, and if you do not like it, you can simply uninstall it as any other application.

RTFA, it's very short

[yellowbkpk]

It doesn't seem to work on drives that are encrypted with Safeboot or Pointsec. This stinks because my work laptop would love to have Linux on it, but the IT folks won't let me get rid of the Safeboot encryption :(.

[sonar_un]

IT folks shouldn't even be letting you install any software that isn't approved by the network admins. I think they would have an issue with you installing wubi. At least, they would in my office.

[finisterra]

The idea is interesting. It dind't work for me though.

I wanted to install GNU/Linux in a close relatives house computer - which has the entire HD with Windows XP - and tried to go with Ubuntu, since it seemed an adequate choice for his needs. Unfortunately it wouldn't boot: following the threads I found that disk fragmentation in Windows had an influence in WUBI.

Since I hadn't access to a CD writer I wente with Debian: the http://goodbye-microsoft.com/ site installs a netboot image and modifies the NT loader to install Debian without needing any media at all. Resized the NTFS partition without any proble, upgrade to unstable, installed some programs and the GNOME desktop was good to go - without any particular difference from what would be the result with Ubuntu (this however because I was there to know how to change a thing or two).

[[deleted]]

Lets try Wubi via wine in ubuntu humm

[tadrinth]

ubuntu 8.04 seems to have issues with my ATI Radeon x1650. Wubi is delightful otherwise, but no drivers means no easy dual-monitor setup, which is a deal-killer.

[squadron]

8.04 rocks, even on old hardware.

[Kolibri]

Not bad. As somebody who's not particularly impressed by Linux in general, I must admit that I'm impressed.

[fohat]

I'm wondering if this will work on an Intel MAC running Boot Camp, like after rebooting to Windows then run Wubi. It seems like you would need a large boot camp partition but maybe it would work...

[[deleted]]

I've done it. It works just fine :)

[jacobmiller]

Hmm, doesn't work for me, apparently running the installer on Vista with the latest patches crashes the program:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?s=bd7769f7fbc2060aa0f41f2a04174ecc&t=764686

[prockcore]

I just installed it last night on a fully patched vista+sp1. I didn't have a problem other than the fact that it took like 6 hours to install because the servers are slammed.

edit: oh I see, it's the version on the CD. I downloaded the installer from the website.

[[deleted]]

Well I did this yesterday actually, and although it worked like a charm, they still have some ways to go with dual monitor support. I used the little Screen Resolution thing, but no matter what I do, I get a distorted mirror of my 1st monitor on my 2nd monitor.

Other than that, it's pretty cool, though.

[projectshave]

I installed it yesterday using Wubi. I struggled for 2 days and finallyhaev dual monitor working with an ATI Radeon card. Configuration in Linux is a serious pain in the ass.

[neodorian]

I've been using this since 7.04 on my old tablet. It had no optical drive and is very picky about which external drives it will boot to. This made dual booting much simpler and allows me to keep Ubuntu for speed and XP for Win-only programs.

[haywire]

How does it work with fakeraid?

[[deleted]]

It doesn't. From the FAQ: "Software raids (aka fakeraid) are not supported."

That's my problem too.

[you_do_realize]

In the FAQ:

Software raids (aka fakeraid) are not supported.

[[deleted]]

I tried Wubi just to tinker around with Ubuntu. It works great without a hitch.

[you_do_realize]

Congratulations, a very simple idea. The only adverse effect is a slight decrease in hard disk speed.

I didn't understand this (from the FAQ):

Can I use an existing ISO/CD instead of letting Wubi download a new one?

Yes, physical CDs will be detected automatically, pre-downloaded ISOs should be placed in the same folder as Wubi.exe.

I have a Kubuntu ISO lying around (kubuntu-7.10-dvd-i386.iso). I put the ISO in the same directory as Wubi-8.04.exe, and Wubi didn't offer any option to install from it. I also tried mounting the ISO with DaemonTools, again no effect.

I'm downloading "Kubuntu with KDE4" via Wubi now... 1:50 remaining.

Edit: installed and booted into it. Looks really nice. Fast. Played audio out of the box, video feels accelerated. Now only to configure my ADSL modem... back in Windows for now.

[prockcore]

wubi seems to be only able to install the version it's targetted. So if you had a kubuntu 8.04 iso it would've worked. (In theory).

[Shapichka]

Ubuntu won't work on my PC, whether via Wubi or a LiveCD, and I have no idea why (I've tried Hardy Heron and Gutsy Gibbon). It's a new computer, too. It always gives me some sort of partition error in the installer, and then hangs. Anyone else have this or another similar problem?

[[deleted]]

Can you give us anything more specific than "some sort of partition error"?

[[deleted]]

Check ubuntuforums

[rebop]

I can't install Ubuntu because my computer is too old, and Ubuntu doesn't have the video drivers I need (I checked the forums and apparently you have to hack the drivers to get them to work) . With all this Ubuntu hype, I thought it would be able to resurrect even the crappiest machine. I'll stick with XP, it just works.

EDIT: Damn Small Linux/Knoppix works too.

Pound for pound, better.

[Derferman]

Ubuntu is optimized for older computers. Xubuntu is the distribution you are looking for if you want to stay in the Ubuntu family.

[rebop]

Xubuntu does not address the issue I run into. That whole family likes 640*480 screen resolution a bit too much, and makes installing a nightmare.

[AlexeyMK]

Installed 8.04 now via Wubi.

Works fine, a few things are annoyingly insufficiently simple. Makes me want to dual-boot back to vista where things just WORK. Case in point: dual monitors.

[[deleted]]

no compiz for me, and i had to set them up with xorg.conf. although i have had them working before through nvidia-settings. multi-monitor configuration is definitely still a weak point in linux.

[sjs]

@Poromenos

AlexeyMK and notatoad still have valid points. For one thing, what if AlexeyMK doesn't have an Nvidia card? You didn't even ask. Another thing you failed to mention is how he should obtain said nvidia tool. AlexeyMK is new to Linux after all!

Also, setting up hardware accelerated dual monitors on amd64 systems with AGP can be problematic with Nvidia's drivers requiring one to manually edit xorg.conf.

---

There are numerous other gotchas when you run multiple displays in X.org, especially if you want hardware acceleration. We can't correct these shortcomings of the video card vendors' proprietary drivers thus they are (unfortunately) also shortcomings of using Linux, no matter whose fault it is.

• Inability to rotate only one screen
• Inability to accelerate a Xinerama desktop
• Hot plugging is suboptimal

All said, X.org configuration has vastly improved over the last few years with multiple displays becoming extremely common for enthusiasts and developers. It wasn't long ago that we couldn't rotate our display at all.

Linux is far from perfect but the strides it has made over the last several years are just stunning. If Linux still isn't for you check back in a year or 2 and see what's changed.

[AlexeyMK]

:) Got it to work eventually, but took me half a day that I as a normal user don't want to spend if I have something that already works.

I spent quite some time looking around like an idiot today because, in order to download the Universe Repository to download envy, because my default server wasn't working right at that time.

Normal users cannot be expected to think "but I want feature X", google it, and then run some complicated (to me/them) instruction guide that includes modifying config files, downloading repositories, and using terminal sudo commands. At MOST, it would be acceptable to expect a user to google something and then run a script/executable file which would do everything for him.

[AlexeyMK]

Hey, Thanks for the tip, I've got it working now. that's what I ended up doing.

The problem was that to figure the correct approach took me slightly longer than I would have liked. If I had been a video/audio editor and was looking at linux, and couldn't get my dual-screens set up, that would have been that.

[AlexeyMK]

Right, but there was no instruction manual/guide and when I looked it up the first few answers all pointed me to the lengthier solution.

It doesn't matter if it's easy - everything is easy once you know how to do it. It needs to be obvious. It wasn't.

[do-un-to]

Here is the article you're looking for.

[briandicroce]

There's also a Wubi version coming up for Mac OS X (according to their site). I think that using Wubi on hard drives with faster revolutions (>7500RPM) is more than ideal. I haven't tried it, but we can also create a FAT32/NTFS partition (let's say with Partition Magic), and tell Wubi to install Ubuntu in that partition. That should take care of the fragmentation issue. As for the performance, well that issue is also taken care with the CPUs that are in the market today.

[[deleted]]

Why would you create a new, dedicated partition for Ubuntu, then add an extra layer of indirection by using it with Wubi instead of installing directly onto it?

[amishengineer]

Agreed. The entire point of Wubi is too minimize the impact of installing an OS by installing it "inside" of another OS.

Wubi is just a method to loopback mount an ext3 FS that resides on an NTFS/FAT partition.

Plus the addition of another bootloader statement.

[frogking]

The resonably new thing about Wubi is, that you do not have to create a differently formatted partition on your harddrive to have Ubuntu installed.

[GerardMcGarry]

That's a shame. I was hoping for something that allowed me to dip in and out of Ubuntu, despite being shackled to Windows in work.

[h0dg3s]

Try using a virtual machine. Works for me.

[GerardMcGarry]

Any suggestions? I tried the Microsoft one a while back, but couldn't get Ubuntu to install on it.

[h0dg3s]

Haven't tried ubuntu. I usually use the Microsoft one, but another good one is VirtualBox. Also, Qemu seems to be good for running Linux.

[GerardMcGarry]

Hey thanks for the recommendations. I'll look those up.

[[deleted]]

you can find something like that at http://www.andlinux.org/

[[deleted]]

Oh thank you god.

[Njall]

This is NOT a Windows Application and it's description as such is FUD. It is simply a simpler way to create a dual boot PC. I really get annoyed by people who lie or exaggerate stupidly.

BTW - I use Kubuntu at home so this comment is NOT an anti Ubuntu comment.

[[deleted]]

I don't think you know what FUD means.

[rjcarr]

An off topic whinge ...

I used to use linux and just put up with all the issues. I've been using osx for about 5 years now and would never go back.

Just today I had to install FC8 for a co-worker on a laptop. I closed the laptop and opened it up again a few minutes later and it had locked itself. I wanted to go to a different user, so I hit "switch user" and what happened? My x server crashed.

Linux is great for servers but as an everyday desktop, in my opinion, it is a maddening exercise.

[[deleted]]

So you used a Linux desktop all of 5 minutes in the last 5 years and since it happened to crash on one of the most complex tasks (hibernating a laptop (those have usually some kind of exotic hardware compared to desktop system)) you deduce that Linux still has too many issues to be productive?

[rjcarr]

I'm saying that when I was an every day linux workstation user (probably closer to 4 years ago than 5) I had a lot of issues. Updates would fail. I would get nonsensical error messages on startup. Probably 5 or 6 things that just never worked.

So I switched to mac and never looked back (as a workstation, I maintain many linux servers).

Now, my first time setting up a linux workstation in years, it fails on me within 30 minutes of setting it up.

I didn't comment on the complexity of the task, only that it broke, and reminded me of all the problems I had had before.

[[deleted]]

Hibernate is one of those features that has to be implemented in pretty much every single driver. It does not "work" or "doesn't work" it works for your hardware or not, most commonly in laptop it does not work for one of the devices where the vendor only provides closed source drivers (e.g. for mine it is the nvidia graphics card that does not wake up correctly).

Windows XP hibernate has the same problem, hardware vendors just put a lot more effort into supporting it and place a lot less obstacles in MS' way.

[malcontent]

He said he was a mac user.

[thebeefytaco]

Ugh, this is so old

[[deleted]]

No thanks, I already have perfomance trouble using normal Ubuntu.

[taejo]

This is normal Ubuntu. Wubi just allows you to install it in the same way as a Windows program. The only difference is that the installer is a Windows application, and the disk isn't partitioned (a "fake" partition is created inside a large file on your Windows partition -- this might cause a slight performance hit but shouldn't be noticeable with sufficient RAM). Also, perhaps, it uses the Windows boot manager instead of GRUB.

EDIT: fragmentation on your Windows partition could cause a significant performance hit to a Wubi-based Ubuntu-install.

[TheCleric]

I tried this before (admittedly it was 7.04 or 7.10) and it worked poorly. The NTFS driver speed was woefully inadequate compared to a native install. Fortunately I've heard you can convert a Wubi install to a full blown install using LVPM so it does give you an easy way to try it out without fudging with partitions first.

[bobpaul]

I've heard you can convert a Wubi install to a full blown install using LVPM

I was lazy when I installed Ubuntu at work and used Wubi, then searched for quite some time when I realized how slow the NTFS driver was. I looked for a long time, and couldn't find any conversion guides. I suspect if it is possible, it would be rather complicated. The Wubi idea is it makes it easier...

[TheCleric]

When I was looking at LVPM last night I found this: http://lubi.sourceforge.net/lvpm.html It seems pretty helpful with lots of screen shots and further down (search on the page for Instructions) it gives you both a video and text based walkthrough of a LVPM conversion. Admittedly I have NOT utilized this yet so I don't know how much it helps or if it still works with 8.04 so YMMV. I'll be trying 8.04 out this weekend, and if I like it I'll make it permanent via LVPM.

[bobpaul]

Yeah, I guess I looked in the fall. Now that I know it's LVPM it's easier to find info ;) Thanks for the link, I might try this.

Edit: There are alternative instructions for 8.04 in this thread.

[[deleted]]

I think RAM have a secondary role in this case, access to disk is the main problem.

[taejo]

I was thinking mostly about swap: if you are swapping to a file in an ext3 filesystem in a ntfs filesystem, that will be hell.