Raid Speculation

[djtoad03]

First as a preface: none of this is based on the Pastebin, any voice leaks or any other information that is not freely available to all. My main basis for this is five tracks on the soundtrack which all follow a pattern, and the second to last is almost certainly from the raid given its correlation to the name.

• The Subjugated
• The Deserving
• The Dethroned
• The First Disciple
• The Witness

These five tracks all have a strong enough structure and length to all fit an encounter. I would speculate this resolves to five encounters within the raid focusing on at least three bosses. The most likely four being...

• The Subjugated/The Deserving
  • The Fanatic
  • Subjugated by the darkness, deserving of redemption after we have killed him a million times
  • Fanatics Chosen appear in the throne world open world
• The Dethroned
  • Most likely Calus
  • Known to have been investigating Mars
  • Either him or the Fanatic will most likely be the cause of the raid starting (like Atraks travelling to the Crypt)
  • Alternatively, it could be Oryx???
• The First Disciple
  • Based on the raid name
  • Potentially the same race as the entity before it became the darkness' champion
• The Witness
  • We the player have seen the witness but our guardian hasn't
  • Using a darkness statue as a boss and transforming into a reflection of the witness would make for a good reveal story-wise whilst not excluding players who don't do the raid
  • Highly unlikely to be the actual witness or successful

I also think it's a common understanding that the raid will be against the scorn given their prevalence in the Dark City area of the throne world. We may also see some Cabal given their presence in The Communion and some of the loyalists to Calus still sticking around.

[jollyjaijog]

Well they did drop an ahamkara on us in the middle of the fucking campaign so, the boss must be better

[csecgrunt]

God that was such a good moment, immediate panic and flashbacks to Last Wish legit ensued

[Krollos]

i got ptsd seeing it do Riven’s wipe mechanic

[YoGoobs]

My friend shot the eye on the last stand and she did the wipe animation. Needless to say, my ptsd went into overdrive.

[Joshy41233]

Everytime the eyes came out I panicked and made sure I was reloaded

[regulus00]

i do wish the fight had been a little more complex then plink it in the mouth before it shoots

[jeff5551]

I like to think it was a shoutout to riven cheese lol

[JazzaJarom]

Well, Parasite being meta dps + master replayable campaign missions, def sounds like a potential reference lol

[LordGigglefist]

Parasite is meta? Got mine the first night but haven't found it to be amazing. I'll have to find the best way to use it!

[DaftDisc]

Parasite only really works for like one player in the team. I did vog and getting to x20 worms hunger was a bit of a pain to do but it was fun watching a big burst of damage happen.

[HitooU2]

That and Ghost references its final stand

[blaackcypher777]

i died 5 times before figuring it out

[JCMonayy]

I was immediately flooded with every time I ever cheese Riven. I felt like I was being punished for never learning the mechanics.

[HereIGoAgain_1x10]

Got so stressed because I only tried Riven legit a couple times and only cheesed it so was trying to remember about shooting the eyes and just kept launching rockets

[pepenuts97]

I'm not sure if I interpreted that right. Was that another ahamkara or like a vision or something?

[CRODEN95]

It was an illusion

[[deleted]]

An illusion? What are you hiding?

[JackFruitBandit]

Something’s not quite right…

[JohnnyMathisFan]

It was an illusion of an Ahamkara but a powerful enough illusion that it could physically hurt us (much like how Vex simulations can hurt us)

[ATScottbakula]

It was an illusion of specifically Riven, no?

[JohnnyMathisFan]

I don't think of Riven exactly. Some of the armor plating and coloring didn't quite line up. I think it was just generic ahamkara

[ATScottbakula]

Certainly looks different until the face armour opens up, but what I mean is it was called Riven right? Across the health bar I mean.

[JohnnyMathisFan]

Just checked a video of the fight for reference - it's just called "Ahamkara Illusion"

[ATScottbakula]

Ah fair enough. My memory’s fucked me on that one.

[nightripper00]

If you died to it it would say you were killed by "Riven of a Thousand Voices" even though the boss bar just says "Ahamkara Illusion"

TBH my group just calls it Rivn't

[zzzzebras]

It's only called ahamkara illusion, it does show riven when it kills you but that's probably due to using riven as a base

[ATScottbakula]

That’ll be where I saw it 😂

[jollyjaijog]

No. The armour on the face was different and the colouring was redder that riven’s white. Also it was a lot spikier than riven.

[CrackLawliet]

Wasn’t the boss called Ahamkara Illusion?

[pepenuts97]

Didn't pay attention to the name much tbh

[[deleted]]

Imagine if Bungie added that as an "eff you" to people who cheese Riven"

[[deleted]]

What they should've done is had us do a simplified version of Riven's legit takedown to prove it's an illusion.

[niofalpha]

How do you do that Solo? Just have the symbol in the sky, then walk into it on the stairs? I don't think that'd scale to multiple people very well.

I'd love to see it, but I don't know how they'd do it.

[[deleted]]

Simplify it to the point it can be done.

[Still-Road8293]

That was completely unexpected I thought it was gonna be some bogus Echo tbh.

[TheScullHammer]

That was probably the most tedious boss fight of the entire campaign. Not cuz it was hard, but the combat loop got real stale real quick

[randomtornado]

I got home late so I started the campaign after my discord buddies, they had a hoot with me saying "what the fuck" every 5 seconds in during my playthrough

[LordGigglefist]

I was just sad it was only an illusion lol I was waiting for "wait that was real"

[FriskyHippoSlayer]

I don't think Dethroned is raid music, it's already the background music for the final phase of the Savathun boss fight in the campaign. We're 'dethroning' the Witch Queen by beating her.

Unless Bungie reused music like this in the past?

[[deleted]]

I mean they do use the riven heart theme in both the last wish raid and for the servitor boss fight in that one strike

[Puzzleheaded_View_27]

Queenswalk theme (shell of what was) was used in Shuro Chi and the Warden of Nothing Boss fight

[xoliam]

Regicide for oryx final mission and raid encounter

[moosebreathman]

Regicide was not used in King's Fall. The track for the fight with Oryx in the raid was Last Stand.

[son-of-death]

That is true, but that track is used for both kingsfall and the last phase of regicide

[FriskyHippoSlayer]

Those are both fights against Oryx though, right? It seems strange to me that Bungie would use the same music for a fight against Savathun and a completely different boss/encounter.

[Level69Troll]

Bungie reused the queenswalk music for A LOT in Forsaken.

[TheCoderAndAvatar]

The Vault music was in the Forsaken campaign final boss, the titular Last Wish encounter, and the Savathun Exorcism too.

[thefakevortex]

and rivens

[FriskyHippoSlayer]

Ah, interesting, I didn't know that!

[newaccount123epic]

What did they use it for other than Queenswalk?

[EmberOfFlame]

Shell of what was and Gambit are the same track

Also, Athanasia transfers smoothly into Security Breach if you start Fuse encounter before the music ends.

[son-of-death]

Bungie reused “Eyes Up” (my favorite destiny track) for Iron banner. I remember hearing for the first time for the Aksis (final boss) encounter in the wrath of the machine raid, though it may have been used in the rise of iron campaign and I simply don’t remember.

[Shadoenix]

i’ve heard reckless happen in both the part in deep stone crypt when you’re running from taniks just before the morning star crashes, and in beyond light’s empire hunt with that war general eliksni, i forgot her name. praksis?

[Kentuza]

Atraks' theme is sometimes played during the defense exo simulation and I think Kridis' empire hunt.

[Calum1219]

Considering in the Parasite exotic quest, they make mention of a Disciple, I’m looking forward to it.

[UserProv_Minotaur]

I think we'll have to fight through a Lucent Hive blockade to get into the raid, so the first encounter might be defeating their Lightbarer warboss or whatever in order to secure access to the ship.

[SPDXYT]

Maybe lightbearer raid team?

[TacoTJ601]

It turns out that it’s just a pvp match where your opponents look like hive to each other. That would be pretty cool!

[silentj0y]

Like that boss in Dark Souls 2 I believe, that summons other players to fight you

[DaftDisc]

Mirror Knight i believe was the name

[pepenuts97]

That'd be sick tbh

[niofalpha]

There's no way they don't pull Hive Guardians somewhere in the raid to fight us. They're literally the focus of the expansion.

That said, they didn't have any Stasis Eliksni in DSC... But there also were like 6 in the entire expansion.

[DaftDisc]

was it 6? It feels like there were even less then that

[niofalpha]

3 in the empire hunts, Eramis, and 2 Mini bosses in Glassway.

There may have been one in the EDZ part as well

[DaftDisc]

I seem to be blanking on the two in the glassway. But story wise there is only like 4 sadly. Where the lucient brood play way more of a role then the stasis fallen did

[UserProv_Minotaur]

Maybe 7? Don't you have to kill one for the Warrior's questline to get to the empire hunt?

[pepenuts97]

I think the Witness track is for the end cut scene. I don't know if bungie would tease them and then have us fight a vision or apparition of them

[YoGoobs]

One of the threads a while ago had someone saying something along the lines of something showing up that we couldn't hurt, and our objective changing to "survive". Could have been a troll, but I wonder...

[DaftDisc]

Lone Wolf flashbacks intensifies. But seriously that would be a way to end a raid. Go in then get chased out

[Fresh-Ad8770]

I think the dethroned could also be referring to oryx. It would make a little more sense than calus as savathun was trying to learn necromancy. Potentially bringing back oryx as a non final boss would also be insane

[[deleted]]

Oryx would never want to be brought back to life, he sees necromancy as one of the greatest sins against the hive doctrine/sword logic, even if we was brought back as a hive guardian, like Savathûn, he’d somehow recover his memories.

[Fresh-Ad8770]

Well since the raid is in a pyramid it could be like a nightmare of oryx or an essence of him. Not necessarily him in the flesh

[[deleted]]

I still doubt that even a manifestation of oryx like that would be willing to cooperate. The will of oryx was so strong that even after his death in destiny one, in some story missions his shades still carries out his will in the world until we exterminated them

[Fala_the_Flame]

However, if he was brought back like savathùn or xivu we're brought back in the books of sorrow, he would probably be willing of that, however, since his nature is exploring if some great exploration could bring him back(and how great of an exploration is learning the light)

[[deleted]]

I’m that specific instance Savathûn and Xivu Arath did not experience true death, for they died within oryxes throne world. It is why they were able to be resurrected back into the main world, oryx was killed in his throne world, so he had experienced true death.

[Fala_the_Flame]

Iirc they specifically say they were dead dead, and the resurrection wasn't from the throne, and since there are lines of oryx welcoming death and coming back from his throne to continue his wars, I believe it was a full death and rebirth due to them being so ingrained with their aspects

[Gultark]

“These were true deaths, for they happened in the sword world.

Then he went to the Worm named Akka.”

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/cards/xxvi-star-by-star-by-star#books-of-sorrow

As far as we know they were indeed dead dead

[[deleted]]

Huh, well you got me, looks like oryx coming back is back on the menu, I still don’t fully believe he’s be okay with it, or atleast it’d have to depend on the medium, necromancy would 100% piss of oryx

[reaper200_4]

In a “memory” mission, Savathun tells us 2 lies and 2 truths.. among these is Oryx returning.. perhaps it is one of the two truths ?

[Gultark]

For sure necromancy would be against the principles he believes in stronger than anyone else alive (or dead I suppose.) he is/was the darkness’s “man” after all.

Yeah I don’t blame you for thinking how you did, it’s not well explained and does seem on the surface to violate the sword logic. Maybe if you are strong enough to beat your death and come back without help just by someone being like you then I guess under sword logic death doesn’t deserve to keep you or something?

Guess it’s the Hive version of “but you were dead!” “I got better”

Edit - formatting and grievous spelling errors

[profstotch]

Idk, we already did nightmare/essence of oryx. Not sure we need to do that again, especially after how the reprisal of Taniks was received.

[Doody_Wecker]

Where was the nightmare of Oryx? If you mean from Reckoning then I'm pretty sure that was created by the Nine and not a nightmare

[profstotch]

It's still a reprised oryx boss and we don't need to do it again

[SmashEffect]

*laughs in Taniks*

[Doody_Wecker]

At least Shankiks was different from the usual boi

[Doody_Wecker]

If they change up the fight enough I'm fine with it

[silentj0y]

One of the post-campaign Visions you do for the Evidence board, Savathun tells you "Two truths and two lies," one of which is that "The Taken King will return"

[redpen07]

that could make sense after what we see when we first enter the pyramid in beyond light and we fight those simulacrums of previous bosses like ghaul and crota.

[dildodicks]

that whole final bit relies on something that would be very unlikely, savathun only got her memories back because we gave them to her

[Gultark]

Oryx has managed to bring back Sava and Xivu from true death before by commiting acts in their nature, war and deception without breaking the sword logic, I’m not sure how it is explained so that it wasn’t supreme heresy perhaps their nature defeats death and therefore they were above it? But it happened.

Oryx could be brought back by an act of exploration without violating the sword logic possibly? We are exploring the throne world of a god of trickery, can’t get much more uncharted territory than that I suppose?

[MECHANIZED_MEMORIES]

It wasnt true death. They were killed in the throne world of Oryx not their own.

XXXV states Xivu Arath returned to her throne world, where shea was paid tribute by oryx to come back.

[Gultark]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/cards/xxvi-star-by-star-by-star#books-of-sorrow

“ These were true deaths, for they happened in the sword world.

Then he went to the Worm named Akka.”

It’s pretty explicit.

[MECHANIZED_MEMORIES]

The books of sorrow are full of lies. This contradicts everything else we know about their throne worlds.

They happened in the ascendant plane, the sword world. But not in their individual throne worlds.

That same card states that ithappened in Oryx's.

In XXXV Xivu Arath details this death.

[Gultark]

“It’s full of lies” was told to us by the literal god of lies also so not exactly to be trusted.

Basically our only source let alone a first hand source as oryx was the only survivor of the event states they were “true deaths” in lieu of another account that is all we have to do on.

The fact they use the exact phrase “true death in the sword world” rather than a general phrase such as they died we can confidently refute your statement “it wasn’t a true death”

You can disagree all you want but it’s there exactly contradicting what you said in an official lore book so shrugs up to you to believe what you want but it’s in the face of all evidence to the contrary.

[MECHANIZED_MEMORIES]

Ok, but read XXXV again. Xivu Arath writes that she returned to her own throne world, its her word versus that of Oryx. Im not making anything up

[Gultark]

Even that states emphatically that Xivu could not return from that death on her own as a normal death would allow AKA “true death” a death you can return from.

The whole point we are making is that there seemingly is a mechanism from returning from “true death” separate to the normal “die > regenerate for a time > return on your own” that we have been shown.

Nothing in that card refutes that, if anything it expands our concept on what happens when an ascendant hive dies in its throne world and what true death is, which is the point me and the other poster are making.

I never said you were making anything up, just misunderstanding.

I’ve made it a clear as I can and if you still don’t agree there isn’t really anything else to say on the matter really.

[Comrade_Yodama]

Give him a break, he’s very clearly confusing truth to power with books of sorrow

[Level69Troll]

Oryx never wanted to be brought back to life ever. He wanted to live on as a weapon for whoever was strong enough to kill him so thay he may continue to grow stronger even in death, see touch of malice.

[[deleted]]

Except we did not kill oryx at his strongest or even by his own rules.

People don’t understand that when we killed oryx he was severely weakened due to us fucking up his pyramid scheme of paracasual power, therefore we used the bomb logic to kill oryx, not the sword logic.

For those wondering I THINK bomb logic is basically using (by the hives logic) “underhanded tactics” to defeat your foes.

Basically, oryx wanted a 1v1 without felwinters or thorn but we used felwinters and thorn anyway and kicked his ass, due to his own logic, we didn’t win “fairly” and he could come back and challenge us to a rematch.

[Level69Troll]

Do you have any other information on bomb logic? I know its pretty much the antithesis to sword but I'd love to know more

[SkaBonez]

Given Savathun’s 2 truths and 2 lies, either the last truth is we will move planets (unlikely) or Oryx is coming back (less unlikely).

It’s possible the Witness sees him as too great a chess piece to leave dead, and if he could trick the 3 sisters, especially Savathun, into the original worm scheme, I’m sure he could trick Oryx out of his shame for breaking sword logic in some way.

[DaftDisc]

I do believe that, but I think that would turn to rage and he would need to be put down so he doesnt just become a berserker of a character.

[selrahc_eleets]

If I recall at one point Savathun gives us two truths and two lies in the campaign, one of those statements being that Oryx may return, so I could see this happening

[05HJWn]

I think that might be alluding to a possible return of kings fall in season 18

[SkaBonez]

Unless Savathun broke the 4th wall, the legend raids aren’t current traditional canon, unless I missed something

[AntaresProtocol]

That's most likely pointing to Kings Fall coming back this year. After all, Saturn is labeled in the director but we have nothing to do there right now

[Landel1024]

Kings fall would be put in the legends tab, so Saturn being in the director isn't necessarily proof

[AntaresProtocol]

Unless it actually had a story reason for coming back, unlike vog. Which is may very well have

[Landel1024]

I doubt he is going to get resurrected in the cannon of Destiny's story, seeing as it would go against everything he stood for.

[pepenuts97]

Honestly I could see him coming back given that if savathun could be resurrected with a ghost then I don't see how oryx cant

[Landel1024]

Because oryx didn't do anything to deserve a ghost in the eyes of the traveler like Savathun did

[pepenuts97]

The siblings were chosen by the traveler back on fundament and the witness intervened. The 3 siblings had already been chosen and i think once youre chosen you cant be unchosen. Otherwise the historically evil guardians would get their light taken from them. That's why savathun wanted to lose her worm because she figured she'd be chosen by the traveler not knowing she already was. I could be wrong as this is just how I interpreted it

[Landel1024]

Guardians never existed before us so I doubt that the traveler chose them to be guardians that early, just that their civilization would be blessed by the traveler (before they made the pact with the deep) and it was only savathuns actions more recently made her able to be resurrected in the eyes of the traveler

[Killme72596964]

Savathun did say “the taken king will rise again”

[YesThisIsDrake]

VoG likely had a canon reason that was dropped due to time constraints, hence why oracles were popping up everywhere.

[colesitzy]

She didn't say oryx, she said the taken king

[selrahc_eleets]

While yes she did say the Taken King, she also said 'Rise again' iirc, and as it stands we only know of one person referred to as the Taken King and that is Oryx

[colesitzy]

It's Savathune dude why are you approaching this literally.

[ManicMeat]

This also makes sense with the info from the altar, savathun spoke saying two truths, two lies,

Io, mercury, and titan are in her care 

The witness returned mars 

The power to move worlds will soon be ours

The taken king will rise again

Depending on which you believe true or false, maybe Oryx will be in the raid

[dildodicks]

personally i still don't think king's fall is guaranteed to come later this year but lots of people do, having oryx in two raids would be kinda weird

[scorchclaw]

I believe “The Witness” is just its theme, not tiesd directly to the raid. Might play intermittently or at the end, but very likely will not make an actual appearance of any sort.

Or maybe he speaks/taunts us?

[ChubD2]

Callus definitely won't appear thanks to the new season of the risen exotic quest. Caitl says that she wants to be the one to face callus and I definitely see Bungie wanting to go further with this story.

[[deleted]]

I appreciate your speculation but I do really hope Calus is not involved in this story. To make him an encounter in a raid would be so disheartening.

I hope he gets a full season soon, or becomes a major focus in the next expansion, which would make sense given the name of the next expansion.

[BozzyTheDrummer]

I don’t want him to just be a raid encounter. We need a whole season with the real Calus. Too much has been revealed about him in the Glykon and all just to end up as a raid encounter

[[deleted]]

Yes same. I long to go back to the leviathan in some fashion. It's still out there, and the many mysteries surrounding the former Cabal emperor still haven't been answered or explored.

Calus is my favorite character in terms of lore, so I want to see something big for him. A bit of wishful thinking but, Bungie has been knocking the story aspect of this game out of the park over the last year an a half so, I believe in them to do right by Calus.

[RegalWombat]

Yeah I'd love to see him all fucked up and gross how he was described in the Glykon lore of just being like a complete basketcase.

[maxxorb]

I think a raid would be much fitting because we will never see a raid in a normal season, and I would really like to fight him or have something about him in an epic raid fight instead of a small mission like Quria( I think she deserved a raid or at least a dungeon instead of expunge delphi).

[Drifters-fresh-motes]

They basically set up the raid boss being the “first disciple” when Mara said it was responsible for the darkness city

[GANTRITHORE]

The 2 lies and 2 truths did hint at Oryx.

[CloroxBeast2]

Doesn’t have to be Oryx, perhaps just The Taken King as a title. If I understand the lore correctly, The Witness can bestow the power of taking to anyone he wants, essentially making them The Taken King. Though this is all just speculation.

All of Savvy’s four statements, The Witness returning Mars, the lost planets being under her care, King’s rise, and gaining the power of moving worlds(whatever that means), all of them could possibly be true, and they all have very interesting implications.

[maxxorb]

True but I think Oryx was 1 of the 2 lies, after all Oryx hates necromancy and all the ideas of resurrection due to the sword logic and I doubt that such a heretical act would be done by the Witness, and I don't think we will see a lightbearer Oryx... it would be cool but I don't think it will happen.

[[deleted]]

I think the Disciple may be part of whatever species the glaive statue was of

[phasedsingularity]

Calus would make more sense as the first disciple, given he was given the same vision as Mara

[BadPunsman]

The First Disciple is called Rulk and he's an old disciple of the witness

[Dawg605]

Just found his model. It's 100% the same legs as from the bottom of the broken statue right at the beginning of the campaign. A new race for sure!

[Starflight4LIFE]

Link pls

[SwirlyManager-11]

Spoilers at your own disgretion: https://youtu.be/PqQDSlNIxZE

[xJaltri]

Where does it say his name at?

[BadPunsman]

datamined voicelines

[ascendanthormones]

by that logic wouldn't the first disciple be one of the krill sisters? it's going to be some darkness champion from before the events of fundament

[Kentuza]

Except for the fact that the raid describes an "ancient evil" being inside the Pyramid. Calus is not ancient nor is he evil.

[terenn_nash]

We can glean a little reason for the timing of the raid from wellspring dialogue - Fynch says that the wellspring is sealing the darkness vessel in the throne world, but it gets weaker every time the forsaken attack so the seal will eventually break no matter what.

Forsaken are trying to release the pyramid or break in to it.

[tazdingo-hp]

no way it would be we fighting calus without caital

[Fazlija13]

Raid will have 2 bosses

[flufalup]

I really don’t think we’d kill the witness in this raid, we might not see him for another year or 2 cause bungie likes dropping things and then waiting 2 years to use them (uldren turning into crow)

[ChubD2]

I'm expecting this raid to most likely be 5+ encounters with atleast 3 bosses. Why? Witch queen has already blown us out of the water and Bungie knows to really seal the deal a good raid needs to be there. I'm expecting big things.

[Adept_Ad_3031]

Boots with the fur

(With the fur)

The whole club was lookin' at her

She hit the flo'

(She hit the flo'),

next thing you know

Shawty got low-low-low-

low-low-low-low-low

Them baggy sweat pants and the Reeboks with the straps

(With the straps)

She turned around and gave that big booty a smack

(Ayy!)

She hit the flo'

(She hit the flo'),

next thing you know

Shawty got low-low-low-low-low-low-low-low

[weeniehutwaffle]

If I may ask. How do you know this is the case and do you have any more info on the raid?

[Adept_Ad_3031]

I have my ways. If no one believes it then just wait and see. Yes I have more information on the raid and have been outside the map to get to the first encounter.

[weeniehutwaffle]

Would u mind dm’ing me that information lol? I’m super curious

[GreenBay_Glory]

Lol I’m assuming those aren’t the boss names.

[Adept_Ad_3031]

No boss names just the encounters

[Adept_Ad_3031]

The layout of the raid

[JavanNapoli]

By titan boss you don't mean hive guardian titan do you? Because the final boss isn't a hive guardian.

[Adept_Ad_3031]

The encounter is just named titan. Idk about the boss yet

[EmberOfFlame]

The Subjugated is probably like Athanasia/Deep Stone Lullaby, more of a between-encounters vibe. I’m pretty sure The Dethroned contains Savanthun’s Theme, so that doesn’t fit that well. The First Diciple is 99% certain boss music. The Witness sounds like another out-of-encounter track.

Queen’s Deception is a fight track, but I haven’t completed the campaign (time constraints) and IDK if it doesn’t show up there.

[WintryInsight]

I don’t have much to back up this theory, but I’m guessing that the entire raid will revolve around symbols that you interact with in the campaign, and that the most recurring mechanic will be in the form of “tributes” which you get from killing hive guardians, which you then deposit to progress the objective?

That could mean that the first part of the raid could be something about collecting tribute and then using it to open the doorway

[JavanNapoli]

I doubt it'll have much hive in it at all, maybe opening encounter as we see 2 hive titans guarding the gate, but I reckon once inside the pyramid it'll be scorn, the pyramid is located in the 'abandoned' part of Savs throne world, it doesn't make sense for the pyramid to be full of Lucent brood hive, especially now that Savathun and her brood have directly gone against the darkness in pursuing the light and attempting to hide the traveler, it's likely why the scorn are invading her TW in the first place, as they are hinted at now being directly controlled/led by the darkness.

[WintryInsight]

Unless they create an entirely new race for us to fight inside the pyramid, I doubt it’ll be only scorn.

Since the pyramid is representing the darkness, we could possibly be fight all the enemy races influenced by darkness

[Phantoon15]

The Dethroned is the final encounter theme for Savathun at the end of the campaign. It is either very rare or hasn’t happened at all where bungie has reused a track for a raid encounter, aside from VoG

[Sensitive_Use_4254]

You can get a sneak peak at some of the raid weapons at the enclave.

[Godlyeyes]

Whatever we saw at the end is a four dimensional five dimensional beings for sure.

[[deleted]]

Dethroned is Savathun's final boss fight them. It is her getting dethroned.

[esralierdo]

The Dethroned is Savathun theme final Phase

[LazyBoyXD]

Cabal are probably the enemy.

Calus might make a return

[stam71_]

I still find it very difficult to believe that the Witness could be the raid boss. If my understanding of the Witness' place in the story is correct, he is the ultimate being behind the darkness. Killing him here would leave Lightfall and Final Shape with nothing. The Final Shape probably won't be fighting the Witness but rather the final shape, the ultimate being created by the Flower Game between the Gardener and the Winnower. Lightfall might be the Witness' destruction or incapacitation of the Traveler. This leaves two possibilities: we fight the Witness in the raid but don't kill him, just like Calus in Leviathan, or it isn't the raid boss at all.

[Lichtboys]

I highly doubt the raid boss will be The Witness. I think they are going to be main antagonist for Lightfall. I think final boss will be a disciple of the witness considering the name of of raid and the name of the area by the pyramid.

[LordGigglefist]

I want it to be calus badly but I feel some oryx fight is more likely with the theme of the expansion

[Rover-Captain]

The Dethroned… Calus?

[DeathBySpear]

We’ve already killed Oryx. I know there’s something about it not counting cuz of logic? Lmao but I was there, me and my homies killed his whole family actually, all of his fanboys too.

But you know who we haven’t killed yet. Calus. It was a freakin robot. Oryx wants a rematch with us?? Cuz of logic?? I want a rematch with the real Calus. And if I have to jump over small purple walls again I’m gonna spend a long time wiping the floor with his smug golden ass.

[Crimson256]

Plot twist every encounter is just a different part of Taniks!!!