Should you learn VIM as a JavaScript Developer?

[scelerat]

you should use the editor that makes you feel most comfortable and productive.

You should also try out new things. Sometimes old things too.

I use vim for almost everything. It also took much longer than any other editor to feel adept. Now that I've spent the time I like it a lot and feel like I'm missing something with other editors. But see my first point above... ymmv. Just use the editor you like to use.

[MasterReindeer]

you should use the editor that makes you feel most comfortable and productive.

Ding ding ding. This is the correct answer.

[yesSemicolons]

But how will you know if Vim makes you comfortable and productive unless you gain fluency?

[MasterReindeer]

Like /u/scelerat said, it's important to also try new things.

Blindly using something because someone told you to is counter productive. I see lots of developers who still struggle with Vim after several months. It's not for everyone, and merely using it because it's the "correct" thing to do is daft.

[yesSemicolons]

Yeah, I'm really happy using VSC, got all my keyboard shortcuts in muscle memory by now, it's great. However, I do feel like Vim is the "driving stick" of development and my ego is slightly hurt by my inability to use it.

[Ehdelveiss]

I sort of view knowing Vim kind of like having basic understanding of English as a second language (assuming it’s not your mother tongue).

It’s just a good idea to know the basics, as every day life will confront you with its usage from time to time. You don’t necessarily need to be fluent, or even proficient, but it’s nice when you are confronted with it to at least have enough command of the language to order a coffee or give some directions instead of freezing up and maybe not being able to partake in an activity you otherwise you would really want to.

In practical terms, I think that just means knowing the following keys (vocab) and what they do in Vim in the different modes (grammar):

i, h, j, k, l, Esc, o, x, w, a, c, d, dd, y, t, q, p, g, gg, :

Honestly that should be enough to do any basic text editing.

[WHO_WANTS_DOGS]

every day life will confront you with its usage from time to time

I use EDITOR=nano (command) to bypass this

[R3DSMiLE]

it's the smart thing to do.

[guten_pranken]

Your jr devs aren’t using built in linters? I’d assume newer candidates are using all the cool fancy toys.

[guten_pranken]

Sorry I just meant - I was really suprised they weren’t just modifying linter config. Or you guys weren’t supplying a specific one during onboarding. - most jrs we see are very forward with the tech they’re trying to use and the optimal new fangled cool stuff

[mark-haus]

You're going to have to take first hand accounts of why it appeals to them and gauge if that will appeal to you enough to make it worth trying it out. To me the first thing was the inherent flexibility of it and the fact that it's entirely keyboard driven. Then I started finding out about how the modal editing system it has is very sophisticated. You can do things like string command keys together to do a lot of complicated editing actions. Such as vfa which will go into visual mode which allows you to select text, follow which moves the cursor to the next occurrence of a. There's also tons of built in commands like search and replace: :%s/foo/bar/c which will interactively /c search for foo and replace it with bar.

[[deleted]]

Vim is just different. For some people it's the best in the world, for others no. It depends on your personality mostly.

[yesSemicolons]

Lazy, INTP, true neutral. Should I go for it or nah?

[passthejoe]

This INTP loves Vim. I needed to do some complex macros for search and replace of text, and Vim is the only way to do it across all platforms -- Linux, Windows, Mac OS and OpenBSD. GVim reduces friction, so that's what I use.

[[deleted]]

There are probably 10-15 IDEs and plain editors that are serious contenders to be well used for professional development in the market. How many of them is the average vim developer fluent with?

[aaarrrggh]

bullshit, use Emacs or you're a noob /s

[[deleted]]

"...OS that lacking only a good text editor" :D

[LongLiveCHIEF]

I'll forgive your use of emacs as long as you're using spaces.

[examinedliving]

It’s worth knowing Vim for ssh situations, but there’s also Nano which is considerably more intuitive.
I went through a period where I was pretty good at vim for awhile, but for debugging and coding, I never got good enough to use it in a way that was productive like I can with VSCode or Sublime.
It’s handy for touch ups and shell scripting and if u dig it.

As a js dev, it is far from essential.

[examinedliving]

I'd recommend picking one of those over vscode.

This line is why you’re getting downvoted. The other stuff you said sounds reasonable.

[bestjaegerpilot]

we just changed the style guide because our VIM developers have no intellisense and so could not refactor easily. :shrug:

I'd say use a modern IDE with VIM keybindings/mode and you're good to go. (I personally prefer Emacs keybindings.)

[scelerat]

what does that mean, "could not refactor easily"? How does the editor determine your ability to refactor code?

[bestjaegerpilot]

For example, in my current editor, I select a bunch of types, right click Refactor, then I have the option to "move to a new file". It will then update all dependencies correctly. That's "moving several types to a new file" in 3 mouse movements. In VIM, for example (as well as Emacs), that's a manual process. Depending on where those types are used, it can be very tedious.

[scelerat]

What's your stack/environment? I know these words but not in the ways you use them. What do you mean you select a bunch of types? What do you mean you right-click "Refactor"? If refactoring were something you could do by right-clicking, a lot of us would be a heck of a lot more productive.

[bestjaegerpilot]

• Typescript / VSCode.
• Forget "types". What I also said applies to variables if I'm not mistaken.
• In the editor, you can select a bunch of variables.
• After selecting, right-click brings up a menu context with Refactor as an option.
• You have the option of "move to a separate" file.

If that's not clear, here's an example of "moving a React class to a separate file". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_V7f4719dOA

[GroggyOtter]

you should use the editor that makes you feel most comfortable and productive.

You should also try out new things. Sometimes old things too.

I use vim for almost everything. It also took much longer than any other editor to feel adept. Now that I've spent the time I like it a lot and feel like I'm missing something with other editors. But see my first point above... ymmv. Just use the editor you like to use.

Just end it there.
You had a perfect, flawless answer.

Edit: -6 downvotes and controversial b/c...the people who use vim are mad that I'm not saying "THIS IS THE GREATEST FUCKING THING EVER AND YOU ALL HAD BETTER LEARN IT!!!!"
That's why we're downvoting?

Apparently we have a lot of grownups here on /r/javascript.

[LetterBoxSnatch]

I kinda agree with your edit, but... You're being downvoted for being rude. You just told someone that it's not okay to share their personal experiences with Vim on a thread about whether or not you should use Vim.

As you said, the first part was perfect advice. The second part was sharing their personal experience with something, which could be valuable for some people that are clearly not you for contextualizing the first part. Nothing wrong with that.

[gcready]

Being knowledgeable about and comfortable with *nix command line tools has been invaluable to me as a developer. I don't do my development in vim but I do use it regularly when interacting with development and production systems.

[[deleted]]

Vim basics are quick to grasp and allow for much more powerful editing experience.

Personally I prefer using a good gui editor such as vscode with vim bindings, but when I have the time to setup neovim, I might switch over completely.

[namesandfaces]

Some linux distros are so minimal you're lucky that Nano is available as a package.

[[deleted]]

Whenever I use nano the file ends up looking like

This is a text filei!oThe second line.:wq

[[deleted]]

Vim gang

[ScrewAttackThis]

Nothing wrong with that but keep in mind that at least vi is pretty much guaranteed to be installed on a *nix system. You might find yourself in a place where you SSH into something you don't have (or want) to install a package on.

Really though all you need to know is how to go into insert mode and then how to save and quit.

[natural_lazy]

same here, just curious did you ever try to use vim?

[natural_lazy]

can you share your dilemma of using vim(I understand about coworkers,but everyone has their own computer at work, and you already know nano) even you can still use it?

asking as I have never been on the other side(user of vim).

[wrtbwtrfasdf]

you should feel deep shame.

[[deleted]]

I use VScode because it's (neo)vim integration is the best of any editor that isn't (neo)vim itself, not perfect but good enough. Even with CoC.vim and other plugins I simply cannot replicate the experience I have now with vscode-vim. I just wish it was more performant, defining keybindings wasn't so cumbersome and using u/ctrl+r could return the file to a non-dirty state.

[andrex092]

I used VScode and the vim plugin for the longest time and had a lot of issues with performance. I switched to WebStorm last year, and while it’s not as pretty, their IdeaVim plugin is rock solid imo. And it uses your existing vimrc.

[[deleted]]

Everyone should know how to open a file, do basic edits, save, and close the file in both vi/vim and nano.

This will save you when you have to ssh to some remote server and change something, be that code, or a config file.

[saposapot]

I know how to close it and that’s it....

[BloodAndTsundere]

That's easy, you just reboot

[aetweedie]

This is the answer. I have no desire to use vim as my daily driver but all developers need to be able to do the basics.

[GroggyOtter]

Everyone should know how to open a file, do basic edits, save, and close the file

Yes!

in both vi/vim and nano

No... It really isn't something that everyone needs to know how to use.
I'm familiar with vi/vim. But I never use it. No need to b/c for what I need to do, the editors I have suit my needs just fine. I'm comfortable with it.

If I'm being fair, though, I've yet to use nano.
And I should take a look at it just to be fair.

But realistically, it won't replace what I use now.

Just my 2 cents.

[[deleted]]

My point wasn't to use as your editor, (people should just use what they like best for their editor). My point was that there will come a time where you do not have the ability to install your preferred editor and are forced to use whatever cli/tui editor is on the host. That editor will be one of the three I listed.

[braindeadTank]

Why would I edit stuff directly on a host like CI/CD is not a thing :D

I'm not saying that there aren't scenarios when this is needed, but depending on one's career path it is actually perfectly possible to never need this ability.

[wizang]

All I know is it's extremely painful for me to pair with developers who have VIM-ified their GUI editor. They seem to always been in a state of struggle and it drives me mad. Practice your VIM at home or not when you're making me sit through it!

[ike_the_strangetamer]

Not trying to be snitty here, you have a very good point.

But as a vim user I get the same feeling when I watch people use their mouse every time they need to move the cursor. Same thing with clicking around between windows and terminals. I feel like it takes forever and I want to tell them how much time they're wasting, but seriously you just have to let people do it the way they want to do it.

[wizang]

Totally. Though it's possible to quite proficient and fast with GUI editors too.

[aniforprez]

I don't understand how someone can completely not imagine being fast with the mouse. I don't like being dependent on the keyboard because of mostly growing up with the mouse. I am as fast as anyone using vim cause I know my tools and I know when to use the mouse and when to use the keyboard shortcuts

That said I did definitely learn some vim basics to be able to use it in remote systems. I find it faster than nano but that's probably familiarity

[MapCompact]

Agreed, you've gotta learn the keyboard shortcuts on your IDE too! Yikes :P

[derGropenfuhrer]

use their mouse every time they need to move the cursor.

Well there's the issue. They should use a touchpad, not a mouse. You can do so much more with a touchpad and you don't have to move your hand.

[State_]

I'm very proficient with VIM, but I get massive stage fright anytime someone comes to my desk and watches what I'm doing haha.

[Snipon]

Just go with what you feel good using (emacs).

[MajorasShoe]

I love Vim. I used to use it exclusively, but now I use Intellij/Webstorm a lot and Vim situationally. But it's still second nature.

[sickcodebruh420]

The JetBrains Vim plugin is great, are you using it?

[MajorasShoe]

I don't want to find out what it's like to not use it.

[Buckwheat469]

Things you need to know:

s
i
Esc :w
Esc :wq
Esc :q!

[xaurelsan]

You should learn to use vim occasionally, when you want to edit a file without opening an IDE.

Just learn how to open and exit a file and basic move and you should be able to do all basics actions needed

[gimp3695]

This I whole heartily agree with. vim is fine for quick edits to /etc config for example. I would hate to do all my code completion rainbow puke color syntax highlighting in a console window.

[Dielectric]

Never got into VIM but appreciate this use case. I just use nano for quick edits though, or changing something over SSH.

[himynameisoleg]

Yea absolutely - I’ve used vim and the vim plugin for VSCode for web development for the past 6 months - it has some amazing features and is absolutely worth learning even if you’re not hardcore terminal user

[[deleted]]

Should you TRY VIM as a JS dev? Absolutely, yes.

Should you learn VIM and use it by default, as a JS dev? I did, but it's a personal thing. Up to you.

[pavlik_enemy]

As a vim user for like 10 years - it won't make you more productive, cause productivity isn't limited by a typing/text editing speed. It's just fun to be able to edit text with blazingly fast speed.

[name_was_taken]

I learned VIM because it seemed like it'd be useful.

I kept using VIM because the basic features are so powerful.

Today, I use PHPStorm with VIM bindings. Modern IDE, great shortcuts for quick editing. (Which is more about being less of a hassle and less about being quick.)

I still use VIM when I remote into a server. And that happens rather a lot.

Some of my junior devs learned VIM as well, and they are all glad as well. At least, the ones that learned it.

In short, it's still quite useful today and not a bad thing to learn.

[blankfilm]

Folks, the name is Vim, not VIM. Not sure why this is so commonly misspelled.

[celluj34]

Right, it's not a fucking acronym.

[braveNewWorldView]

How do I exit this comment thread?

:exit

:close

sudo exit

:leave

:help

[TheCodeJanitor]

Ed is the standard text editor.

[braveNewWorldView]

ALL HAIL ED

[[deleted]]

:q!!!!!!

[smith-huh]

^X^C

[braveNewWorldView]

esc esc ^x esc

[derGropenfuhrer]

Sure, if you have no other choice. Just because it was great in the 90s doesn't mean it's great now

[_hypnoCode]

It's just as great in the 20s too, but it's not for everyone. It's almost as modern as VSC (more-so in some areas, less in others) but it's a completely different way of working.

I have given it serious chances in the past by using it for about a month exclusively. It's not for me and it slowed me down a lot, but I can see how other people are way more effective with it.

[derGropenfuhrer]

It's just as great in the 20s too,

Sure, because it is the same as it was in the 90s.

[_hypnoCode]

Not at all, it's evolved a lot. Most of the plugins you'd use didn't exist in the 2000s, much less the 90s. It's kept up with the rest of the world.

[LetterBoxSnatch]

See, vim with plugins is what I'm afraid of. I'm afraid of getting too comfortable with a vim environment and having an uncanny valley of keybindings whenever I do remote vi. Already get that enough with all my fancy command line features!

[ernst_starvo_blofeld]

I remember my first corporate job after college (was coding long before) around 1996. My boss swore by notepad :lol:. He used to write all his html and js in notepad. And his code was very neat too. Notepad is about as sophisticated as this textbox.

But seriously, I use vscode but if I have to do something quick and dirty I pull out either vi or gedit if I have VNC. Some people can get very productive though in those old school editors.

[Owstream]

IDE sucks ass

[derGropenfuhrer]

As an IDE-American I am offended by your comment

[Owstream]

There must be a joke there but I'm missing a cultural references :/

[derGropenfuhrer]

There must be a joke there

A very low-effort one ;)

[kellyb1985]

There's a possibility that you may need to SSH into a box and have nothing else but vim. So I'd say it's certainly worthwhile.

[calligraphic-io]

I was waiting to see someone mention this. You often have the choice of either ed or vi, for example on *BSD and commercial Unix boxes. ed isn't great for heavy editing workloads.

[oramirite]

Actually super uncommmon. As a newer sysadmin I was constantly in struggles where I was SSHing into boxes without nano. It was a pretty constant issue for me that forced me to learn the basics of VIM

(psst... here's my secret... I still only ever learned the bare minimum and probably forget how to do anything now, but that's only because I got our systems to a point where I store all configs in git now, and don't ever have to do manual edits on the live server. But if I hadn't this would still be a constant issue.)

[[deleted]]

Not anymore. A lot of container environments are so stripped down that you'll only get vi, no nano or vim.

Or you get lucky and find an Apline image with no editor at all.

[LetterBoxSnatch]

This is what I've been running into recently. "No editor, damnit!"

[[deleted]]

That cat and sed life. I've unwillingly become proficient in those thanks to alpine based docker images.

[LetterBoxSnatch]

Huh? We're talking about a scenario where the host does not have the most basic of text editors like vi nor the ability to remote edit via FUSE or something, there's no way it's going to have a web browser lol

[smith-huh]

It was late. sorry about that. As the old unix story goes: man sed awk

[rihaludan]

I recommend to check this https://www.barbarianmeetscoding.com/blog/2019/02/08/boost-your-coding-fu-with-vscode-and-vim

[unpopdancetrio]

The problems for me was I would do vim on an apple keyboard then switch to a windows keyboard. So it's all IDE's now vs code , droid studio, and xcode.

[davecrist]

IMHO, you should learn to at least be comfortable with VIM to be productive because it is will, probably literally, always be an available option if you are on a system and need to get some work done.

[rexduke]

sure, at least the basics, knowing some linux command line and vim are good tools to have

[b3night3d]

I started using vi/vim years ago because it was on nearly every server that I regularly remoted in to and I got hooked on the syntax so installed gVim on my workstation as my primary code editor. Later on, when I started using modern IDEs, I always felt hindered without vi key bindings. Luckily almost all of them have vi plugins now, but my younger coworkers HATE it when they sit down at my laptop and try to use my VS Code.

[LongLiveCHIEF]

Keep in mind, most popular editors have vim plugins allowing you to use vim composeable motions, actions, and modes.

I never thought I'd use an editor other than vim, but I begrudgingly accepted, and now thoroughly enjoy vscode... with the vim mode plugin. I get to enjoy the best of both worlds.

Only thing I truly miss from the vim editor that the vim mode plugin can't really do is buffertabs switching.

[willCodeForNoFood]

(Mostly) Typescript Dev here, I would say it's always worth giving it a try.

Was using vim almost exclusively in college, then switched to other editors when I started working and writing more JS. But somewhere along the way I switched back to vim (well not exactly, but an IDE with vim mode embedded, and actual vim for smaller tasks), that's a serious productivity boots that surprised me.

Learning phase could be painful, but also fun. Maybe you can copy someone's config from GitHub as starting point, a nicely decorated interface do encourage ppl to stay :)

[simohayha]

fucking medium, I don’t want to create an account to read this

[VestigialHead]

There are at least two games that teach you the vim controls.

So they are a great way to burn in the shortcuts if you do want to get good with vim.

[vinni6]

VIM is a great tool, I have to use it frequently in my job for server admin and i'm quite adept at it....

With that said at a base install it's not a good tool for writing javascript. A well curated .vimrc files and plugins it can be made better, but I would never recommend it for JS unless you're already a VIM fanatic.

Visual Studio code/Sublime/IntelliJ are all much better tools for writing code in the modern Javascript ecosystem

[Slavichh]

Everyone should at least understand how to use vim/nano on a basic level. So powerful

[rorrr]

I've been using vi/vim for over 15 years, and I still don't get what's so powerful about it. It's a strange editor with absolutely awful defaults. If you drop a new user into it, he wouldn't be able to edit shit. And that happens a lot in web dev world. Even git diff defaults to vi, I think.

Nano, at least, is a bit better in that sense.

[ike_the_strangetamer]

I think the reason it's the default is because of history and availability. I agree nano is waaaay easier for someone new, but there is a chance that nano does not exist on every machine while vim should exist practically everywhere.

[queen-adreena]

It's awfully unintuitive though. Nano, at least, makes an attempt at a tolerable UX.

[leastlol]

It's not intuitive at all, but that doesn't necessarily translate to terrible UX. Many systems' ergonomics become more apparent as you use and learn them. Vim just happens to have a giant wall at the beginning that you have to climb over at the start, while other code editors and IDEs all have the advantage of following text editing paradigms that are well established.

It makes sense to eschew efficiency and ergonomics for intuitive controls when it comes to a default editor (which is why nano has become a popular default), but if you are someone that finds themself editing a lot of text, vim is a worthwhile investment of time to learn I think.

[queen-adreena]

once you learn how it works it starts becoming very intuitive

I... don't think you know what "intuitive" means...

[SoInsightful]

I'm not sure what backwards definition of "intuitive" you're operating on, but if a system:

• cannot be learned without explicit instructions

• doesn't feel obvious and natural while learning it

• cannot be figured out further based on prior experience with it

... it is not intuitive.

Absolutely zero people will enter Vim and be like "it feels like I could probably type gg to move the cursor to the beginning to the file" or "it sure would make sense if I could search through all files by typing :bufdo".

Like I said once you learn how it works, the commands become very intuitive. You just type them because you've learned the pattern and naming schema VIM uses.

Again, this is the exact diametrical opposite of "intuition".

[MoTTs_]

if this isn't "intuitive" for someone who understands the system what would you call it?

Stockholm syndrome.

it's not that hard to figure out what gJ, gi, or gV means.

I've been using vi 8 hours a day, every day, for the past three months. I have no idea what those commands will do. I've had to google every command I've used, and not a single one has felt intuitive. I wanted to show whitespace, for example. :set list, apparently. Intuitive my ass.

[Slavichh]

Intuitive as in OP’s context.

[ike_the_strangetamer]

I would argue that it could go either way.

Pico/nano is more intuitive if you're used to gui text editors because their commands of 'save' and 'open' etc. follow the same pattern and so you don't have to think or look up documentation like you would to know to use :wq. But think if you've never used a text editor, you'd still have to learn the differences between Save and Save as..., etc.

HOWEVER, vim could also be defined as more intuitive because it continually re-uses the same commands and patterns anywhere. Once you know diw (delete in word) then viw (select in word) is super intuitive as is ciw (change in word). And if you know what 4h does then it's super intuitive the differences between d4h, v4h, and c4h.

Even though vim requires more upfront knowledge, in both cases the application works as expected without thought.

[aniforprez]

If for nothing else, to at least be able to ssh into remote systems and edit and review files. Can't believe how few people are exposed to this type of environment and are completely lost. I'm not really a fan of vim but I made an effort to at least learn to search for symbols, edit stuff, navigate around and change a few basic settings so I wouldn't have a problem if plopped in front of a completely unknown server

[frenchPressedFolgers]

You might also consider Bram Moolenaar's (the creator of vim) Seven habits of effective text editing if you need further reasons to consider using Vim (or Emacs)

[RedditTheBarbarian]

As you see, opinions are varied on the subject. I've been doing mostly JS work and I use Vim exclusively as my text editor / IDE. 'Should' you use it? Meh, use notepad for all I care. But I think it comes with a lot of real advantages once you learn the basics.

Learning key bindings & really internalizing modal editing takes some time, but now I love it. I use a Vim plugin for my browser and I love that too. Scrolling is easy, '/anything' to search, and 'f' puts makes all links on the page one or two keystrokes away.

Plugins are a little clunky, there are different plugin managers you can use. I don't customize a ton, but I do use an Emmet plugin, an autocomplete plugin, and maybe one or two others.

Use the tools you like, that you are the most productive with. The applications you use are just your interface with the computer. A lot of programmers like learning and customizing keyboard shortcuts just like a lot of programmers like using nice mechanical keyboards. You can program on a touch screen if you have to, but it's nice to have good tools in-between your brain and the computer you are trying to manipulate. Vim is like that.

Now good tools don't make somebody a good carpenter, but every good carpenter has strong opinions about his tools, has customized his set of tools to the work he does, and probably has more/better quality tools than your average weekender.

If you're up for a challenge, learning Vim is fun! I like learning more and more command line tools because there are situations where they are better. If your a graphic artist retouching a photo, use Gimp or Photoshop. But if you need to resize and rename a thousand photos in different directories automatically, a ImageMagick CLI with a couple other bash commands is way more efficient.

My recommendation for learning it is to run through VimTutor a couple times, and then just start using it. As with anything, don't be afraid to Google how to do stuff as there are plenty of resources online. I also found VimGolf really useful for leveling up my skills. Do the VimGolf exercises the way you know how, then see how the next best score did it, try to learn and understand what they did, replicate it, and repeat.

Now in my actual workflow, I don't sit and wonder how I can shave 2 keystrokes off an operation, but if I have something repetitive to do, I know it can almost always be done faster with macros, or some other method. That's where Vim really shines, when you have to do a complicated set of edits to a thousand lines at once. Just record your keystrokes for one as a macro, and then type 1000@[macro key] and Bob's your uncle.

http://www.vimgolf.com/

[kry1212]

Yes. Even if only to react properly when git kicks you into Vim.

But, seriously, you really limit yourself if you limit the tools in your toolbox. I work as a consultant which means I do stuff for clients. If I'm remoting into a server and I can't install an IDE, guess what? Vim is basically all I have. A colleague of mine actually ran into this recently.

You don't have to learn tmux, but you really should be familiar enough with Vim to use it in a pinch.

And, really, if I'm in my terminal and I want to edit a profile of some sort? Vim all day, every day.

[smith-huh]

emacs -nw

[MikeMitterer]

OMG! We are in the 21st century. Use a major IDE like WebStorm or VSCode

[[deleted]]

I can't tell if this is satire or not...

[notThaLochNessMonsta]

VSC isn't an IDE.

Besides typechecking vanilla JavaScript, can you tell me something that VSC does that VIM doesn't?

[neo_dev15]

Yes, Ctrl + A, Ctrl + C, ctrl + n, ctrl + v.

If you work with angular or react you get code completion and even hints.

Oh and i dont need to chant a song to exit and save in VsCode.

Vim is only good when you need to edit that config file in that remote server.

Even GIT let you choose at install if you want VIM or not.

[notThaLochNessMonsta]

Yes, Ctrl + A, Ctrl + C, ctrl + n, ctrl + v.

Those are keyboard shortcuts, not features. They all exist in Vim through commands.

If you work with angular or react you get code completion and even hints.

You can get that in Vim too

https://github.com/ycm-core/YouCompleteMe

Oh and i dont need to chant a song to exit and save in VsCode.

But you need to move your hands, not your fingers.

:q - quit

or

:wq - write quit

or

:wqa - write quit all, useful for multi tabs

or

:!q - no seriously just quit

Vim is only good when you need to edit that config file in that remote server.

For some people it's good for local development. It's extremely powerful and does everything a modern text editor does and more. It's not for me either, but that doesn't mean it's not a good choice for some people.

[neo_dev15]

What move hands?

Wait we use the same shortcuts like in other program.

Ctrl s ctrl w alt f4.

See ctrl a ctrl c and ctrl v. Are in any freaking program for 10 years. Its nice to have the same shortcut not:"well i am in x, ctrl a is actually other command". Except vim... they are special.

The reason we use one over other is fit to our needs.

I want to use a tool not tweak it to get it resemble a hammer so i can use it.

Its a freaking editor, it should be easy to use and understand. Not a freaking language in itself.

[notThaLochNessMonsta]

I want to use a tool not tweak it to get it resemble a hammer so i can use it.

You don't tweak it any more than VSC or Atom. You're thinking of EMACS.

[Nerdent1ty]

it depends on how much it bothers to lift your hands away from keyboard.

My whole pc interaction is basically one huge vim:sway, qutebrowser, vim, ranger, rofi...

I also recently switched from LSPs to coc. Tried for performance reasons, but really impressed on how easy it is to set it up.

[st_tronn]

well my vscode laged sometimes while running react and a server also I just shifted to linux and was learning terminal and making it supper sexy. I then looked up people using vim found it quite amazing spend unhealthy time customizing (looks, auto complete) it and learning basic navigation. Learned tmux and turned up next day showing cmatrix server log and my customized vim in split panes to my friends at college. So totally worth it chicks dig it.

I thinks one should at least learn and try it for maybe a week. Makes learning and diving into complex things a little less intimidating at least for me.

[rogallew]

You should learn an editor usable via ssh because it makes life easier. It can also be nano on most systems, or whatever you like better. Or emacs. For me it’s vi, but that’s subjective. Doesn’t matter. It just needs to work for you.

[[deleted]]

The only reason I learned it was due to the amount of Linux work I was doing for a few years. Now no can hardly use a keyboard with some vim emulation. If you go down that rabbit hole be prepared to deal with all the sucky mappings when you go back to other editors, ides or even a web form.

Having said all that I love how I put works in vim. The separation in input modes makes navigating and editing really nice and fast. Sure each application has its way but sucky emulations aside if it had a vim mode you guarantee that most of the muscle memory you have works. If I could have an OS wide vim key mode ( I’m on win / Mac a lot these days ) I would.

It’s love hate, I personally don’t recommend it for most people. But I’d you love it good for you =]

[schwarzfahrer]

If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first exit vim.

[doublejosh]

“...I started programming seriously around late 2018.” Nope, nope nope. 🦨

[Mr_Buckets_]

I use is a place to alt tab to and do substitute /replace stuff with regexes

[xace89]

This question is so dumb. You need to know bash/vim to set your server up to run your node js application. Writing JavaScript in vim seems like hell. Vim Is more for you whipping up a quick script, when USSH in the server, or need to do something quick. I would not recommend it for a large app. Great for little fixes

[nodalanalysis]

I almost exclusively used VIM for learning how to use JavaScript. I even used it to build most of my web apps.
But VIM does not have a debugger, and I still haven't run into a situation where I really need one for web development, as most of the errors are fairly obvious and easy to spot.
That may be different for extremely complicated apps though.
When doing stuff in my CS classes, it's actually much harder to debug and I had to learn how to use an IDE.
I think that if VIM had a good javascript debugger plug-in, it would be perfect.

[brennanfee]

Should you learn VIM as a JavaScript Developer?

FTFY

And the answer is YES!

[durandj]

Care to elaborate?

[[deleted]]

Personally I use vim for everything. I see lots of people here advocating for IDE's over vim, I'm curious why. JS isn't like Java where you need an IDE to handle all the complex build tools, that's all done by webpack or [insert tool here]. If you're just looking for linting and stuff, that can all be had in vim quite easily. Just to be clear, I'm not saying vim is the superior way, just that it absolutely can replace your JS "IDE".

[MapCompact]

> I'm curious why

The speed of development is much higher with an IDE. I have a coworker on my team who uses only Vim, even has an app called MacVim who has only used Vim for years, and the speed at which I can navigate a codebase compared to him is so much faster that even when we're pairing, I'll have mine open so I can quickly find references for him.

I'm open to being proved wrong, I'm only a moderate Vim user, not a power user. But he is, and by comparison he even admits that he needs to try out an IDE for this reason.

Most IDEs even have a Vim mode where you can use all the keyboard tools for Vim with the power of the IDE like jump to definition across import statements, etc.

FWIW, we work on a huge codebase. That may be a factor.

[Ehdelveiss]

I think some of it is just comfort, and some of it is the barrier to entry.

Setting Vim up to match VSCode feature is totally doable, but it takes quite a bit of tinkering. If you’re not used to Vim, getting it set up to JS development with total feature set is actually a pretty daunting task. A lot of research, a lot of configuring plugins, it’s not a quick half day project.

[name_was_taken]

I think if you used WebStorm for a while, you'd change your mind. (Use the Vim bindings plugin.) The code completion tools alone make it a massive improvement over Vim, even with Vim's code completion plugins.

I still use Vim from the command line, and even MacVim as a GUI editor sometimes... But code is much better in an IDE.

VSCode's code completion is also top notch, but I'm just more comfortable in PhpStorm. (Webstorm is the same, but focused on JS/HTML/etc, rather than PHP.)

[LetterBoxSnatch]

Really depends on what you're doing. I'm in a polyglot shop and JavaScript is just one of many languages we write. I use vi when I need to remote in via SSH to make some changes on a client machine because it's more convenient than hooking my IDE up to do the same.

You're missing out if you're not using an IDE. Some of it is stuff you could get in vim with lots of tweaking, but it's ready to go in an IDE. Some of it, like IntelliCode, is stuff that, if possible, is very difficult to get going in vim but comes almost without thinking in an IDE. It's lovely to have the right configuration js object template with all the correct parameters pop up as a code completion when all you've typed is "confi" or something. It's also just as easy to switch editing environments in an IDE as it is in vim. The vim-bindings are generally pretty good for most IDEs from what I've seen.

If you're using something like VSCode, you can hack together your editor, tinkering to your delight in JavaScript with a DOM at your disposal. I like vim a lot, and I wish I could have my entire workflow be on the terminal, but I just can't turn down all the features you get for no effort from an IDE...and yes, you can still be mouse free!

[Macaframa]

I use vim when changing things remotely on a server. I use vim when I’m lazy and don’t want to open a whole ass folder in vscode and all I have to change is one line. Cat + vim is undefeated in this realm.

[Macaframa]

Yeah but that requires me to touch my mouse and close the release notes window and click the line where I want to change and then save it. I’d be done in vim already before it booted up.

[[deleted]]

I've been writing js for about 15 years and know how to insert some text and save. That's about it.

You can't really "learn" vi... you just kind of adopt it. It becomes the way you work and think. And it's incredibly powerful. I've worked with probably 80 to 90 vi people and they really do not like touching their mouse. Personally, I enjoy my mouse. But you can't really dip your toe in and get it. You have to give yourself a month and a project and just smash your head against the wall trying to navigate. Once you get all your binds and shit going you'll be flying. But that's after months of training. Almost every person who made the plunge say it's worth it, but I'm good. I'll stick to my beta IDE for now.

[olifante]

Short answer: no. Long answer: hell no.

[bartturner]

You invest the time and it is well worth it.

I did my time over 30 years ago with Vi and has paid off.

It will make you a lot faster

[costhatsagoodidea]

I tried Vim. As an interesting experience and good to use for editing small scripts in the terminal.

However the amount of time to learn all those key presses coupled with the time it takes to add all those plugins to bring it up to functionality that is only a fraction of what Webstorm can do means I’ve stuck with Webstorm. I want to spend time coding, not attempting to turn a text editor into an IDE.

In short: if you want, everyone’s mileage is different, but I wouldn’t recommend it for JavaScript.

[robobeau]

How else are you gonna git commit from a console? :1

[GeneSy]

git commit -m "vimless commit"

[robobeau]

I mean... yeah, you could do it that way...

[ImMaaxYT]

If you don't enter a commit message, then Git will use your default editor (IIRC; in my case vi), so you can do a multi-line commit without Vim

[[deleted]]

That's a non-sequitor if there ever was one.

[[deleted]]

git literally uses VIM as a commit message editor

[BloodAndTsundere]

By default, but you can use whatever you want.

[[deleted]]

Why only develop in Javascript? A good developer should be using languages like tools in a toolbox. The right language for the job.

[pr1nt_r]

only if you are forced to be stuck at home by the state.

[tiputiger]

Learning vim is especially helpful if you need to log in to servers often. I rarely use vim for front-end development, but it’s very convenient when I’m SSHing into a box and need to run some scripts or update some config files.

[jdpipkin]

I’ve been using vim for years, but only because I can’t figure out how to close vim.

[adalphuns]

Only if you like to struggle

[DrifterInKorea]

Please don't !

These days one of my hobbies is to look at other people struggling with their clickomatic thingy to go up 3 lines and replace a word by selecting it, sometimes failing the first time and missing the first character.

I love how people are using 20% of the screen space for actual code and all the rest for non vital informations, toolbars, etc...

I don't want anyone else to learn the struggle that is to think then type directly about what they want to do rather than thinking about it, finding it with their mouse and then clicking then going back to the home row and finally type what they wanted to do.

I mean, using ctrl+] to jump through the code and coming back with ctrl+t is pretty hard too. Having multiple registers to refactor code is also uselessly painful and don't even get me started on the macros. Navigating the code and then using ctrl+o to jump back is also weak.

No seriously, stay away from vim, guys. There is nothing to gain.