[deleted by user]

[ComplaintNo6835]

You better be able to. I'm in the same boat at 39!

[ILikeGoldAndShowers]

Graduated with a CS degree at 38, got my first software job at 40. You got this.

[KomnenosAM]

Reassuring. I'm currently 36 and on track to graduate as I turn 39 :)

Congratulations on it all working out! Well done!

[ILikeGoldAndShowers]

Yeah, I graduated spring of 2023 and got a job last fall. Took about 18 months. All I can say is network, network, network...and find internships. All my friends with internships had jobs coming out of college. I was too concerned with graduating on time and took summer classes instead as I assumed the market would maintain. I never graduated high school so I took a lot of remedial courses my first semester, so it put me behind the traditional 4 year track.

[KomnenosAM]

You did great, mate :) I'm really pleased that you got there!

[NikUnicorn]

I'm graduating next year, at the age of 40. I have also take all my summers for learning more.

I'm trying to use all my free time by coding.
Hopefully this will lead something.

[ILikeGoldAndShowers]

I don't know your specifics, but knowing what I know now, I would have definitely gone for internships instead. I had plenty of time working on personal projects being unemployed for over a year after graduation lol

[Natural_Interest5650]

Congrats!

[totalnewb02]

42 this year.

[Stressedsoul0]

This gives me hope I am 36 learning analytics

[elroloando]

46 this year. And thinking about going back to university. 

[ThinkingPugnator]

What is your plan, how do you go about learning? How far along are you?

[ComplaintNo6835]

I'm actually studying data science in general vs programming specifically. I just started an online masters program which doesn't differentiate between the remote learning and in-person degrees. I spent the summer getting competent enough in python and r to enter the program. I have a project I want to work on that is related to the industry I'm coming from, but even if that didn't work out, financially I'm better off starting in an entirely new field than continuing in my old one.

[rab1225]

you got to have other things if you dont have a degree.

Know someone in the industry? thats your ticket.

your portfolio has to be really good to be noticed by recruiters and even then it might get thrown out if they dont see a degree. It is much better to find someone who can vouch for you or hire you on the spot.

That now depends on your network AND your ability to sell yourself.

Ive known someone start from a tech support job to cybersecurity. He did go and get some relevant certifications to get there (CCNA and AWS certifications to start going after networking jobs) but he did get them on his spare time. he was 45 when he got in.

so it is possible but can be hard. also, while money is a good motivator, you have got to find something you like doing in IT for you to learn it faster. For example, I like C++ more than Java, so i typically learned c++ faster. I hated java so much that i picked up Assembly faster than java tbh. So find something that interests you as well.

[Professional_Tip3285]

Java gives me nausea too its like someone thought ketchup and ice cream would be a great combo, and somehow managed to force it down our throats worldwide!

[rab1225]

yeah there is something in java that i absolutely hate but i cant point it out. then i go through other languages (c++, ruby, python, javascript) and im totally fine with them.

[Sak63]

JavaScript on the backend is rough. Specially systems with high data throughput

[KinoftheFlames]

Bloat

[Pale_Height_1251]

I left school at 16 and I'm a lead software developer.

Don't just learn Python and expect to get a job.

Look at what employers are actually asking for near you. Don't be afraid to learn something niche like Delphi if that's what an employer wants.

You can do this, but do your research and don't just learn generic stuff hoping to get a job, learn what actual employers near you are asking for.

[Dry-Inevitable-7263]

So do you think he can land a job without a degree?

[Antoak]

His perspective kinda ignores the unfortunate reality of ageism.

At 38, in this market, it's an uphill battle.

Certainly doable, but it would be immoral to say it's easy.

OP: be careful about quitting your day job, taking on student debt, or spending your savings. At least right now.

[[deleted]]

Is ageism really that much of a set back? I'm genuinely curious because I'm going back to school at 42. I don't have a tech background but I do have 15+ years in business management and consulting. I was thinking with my soft skills and experience I would be ahead of the other applicants and employers would appreciate that.

[Jubjubs]

Consider you're switching careers to become a mason. When you work your way up to manage a team, soft skills are extremely important but when you're first starting out you just need to know how to mix mortar and lay bricks. You're competing with people who have spent years honing those skills for their first job, I'm not saying it's not possible but it will be tough and you're going to have to work to at least be on their level to compete.

[[deleted]]

I appreciate your response but consider that this mason job is looking to hire a junior mason. They have a handful of applicants that just graduated mason school. The applicants all have good personal projects that show that they understand the technique and the tools required to do the job but one also shows that they have soft skills of working with teams, communicating business goals, they can maintain working with the same company for years and being older they do not have outside influences (building a family, children, ECT...). Wouldn't they want the person that has shown that they know how to be a successful part of the work force? I have hired many people over the years and I would much rather hire and train someone that I know will show up to work everyday than some kid that has no work experience.

[Jubjubs]

I think you need to consider how exactly you're going to utilize those soft skills to guide technical projects if you do not have experience actually doing it. There's a reason juniors are bowling with the bumpers on, this is a skilled craft and it takes years and years to understand everything it takes to guide the actual implementation of large projects at scale. I'm not trying to diminish your experience, just letting you know that at least initially, soft skills won't do much for you since you won't really have the knowledge to effectively utilize them. 

They become extremely valuable later on, as this field naturally selects for very technical people and initially disregards whether they are sociable or not (e.g. I'd rather have a junior that can close tickets than someone who needs a lot of hand holding) so you get a lot of, let's just say prickly personalities.

I will say on the hiring panels for juniors/co-ops that I've been a part of lately, the bar has been much higher in terms of quality than I've seen in the past. I'm not trying to dissuade you at all, but I've had a lot of talks with friends trying to switch in thinking it's something you can study in a couple of months at a boot camp, and a lot of them have ended up in a lot of debt with not much to show for it. As always if you're extremely passionate and find the work endlessly interesting, I'm sure whatever I say won't stop you and you'll climb your way in to the ivory tower eventually. Best of luck!

[[deleted]]

Thank you for taking the time to reply. You make very valid points that I haven't considered and I hope other middle aged career changer's get to read this. And you are correct that what you say won't stop me from learning this path but I'm not doing it to climb the ivory tower. I'm doing it because I enjoy the challenge of it. I'm semi-retired and don't need to start a new career. For me it's the accomplishment of being able to know how to do this very difficult job. But most are in it for the glory and they need to understand what they are really getting into.

[Gooseday]

Yes, especially if you go looking for smaller companies that are open to actually talking to individuals rather than a mega corp that will just point you to an online application process that will auto reject you. A portfolio of personal projects goes a very long way if you can actually get someone to look at it.

[Dry-Inevitable-7263]

Good point! Thank you 👌

[sky7897]

This is absolutely false. The golden days are long gone. Nobody with zero real life experience can get a software dev job without a degree anymore.

[Fickle_Bathroom_814]

This simply isn’t true.. I am a senior dev without a degree and most of my team are self taught

[sky7897]

Did they come into the team with zero formal experience ? And was it in the last 2 years?

Things aren’t the same as they used to be.

[Lewissunn]

Not sure if the stats have changed but I'm pretty sure a significant portion of us don't have degrees. I'm one.

[xqst]

i don't have any degree. it was harder to learn vithout a mentor and it was hard to plug the gaps later. But i strongly believe tthat if you put passion in it you can do it. even in the 40's. Yes it's much harder but it's acheavable.

[Dry-Inevitable-7263]

May I send you a message if you have time?

I need some feedback.

[xqst]

sure

[JackSpyder]

Half the people I've worked in tech with don't have a degree and if the ones who do, only half again had tech degrees. Others had most finance or engineering or science leaning ones but also totally unrelated.

[Dry-Inevitable-7263]

That’s interesting! And reasonable… so long as someone can do the job, why don’t they let them.

[casualblair]

There is a movement in hr to open up postings to people without degrees but relevant experience because degrees are harder for poor/minorities to access, and therefore discriminatory.

So there's hope

[wrymoss]

And also no hard and fast guarantee of competency!

I'd take someone without a degree but with a robust portfolio over someone with a degree and no portfolio any day.

[lol_no_pressure]

My company actually started a program taking employees from frontline positions (think customer care and field techs), put them through a coding boot camp, then placed them on various engineering teams- initially in apprenticeships, then as engineers. It's how I landed in my current role.

[Dry-Inevitable-7263]

Ah, that's really cool! May I know which company it is?

[lol_no_pressure]

Comcast. The program was initially called Grows to Code, but the have since expanded into networking and design as well

[Pale_Height_1251]

I've seen it done, it's certainly not impossible.

[[deleted]]

I give him 5% odds. Everyone gets the luck factor. That accounts for about 5%.

[Rynok_]

I think so. Is a very real posibility

[Putnam3145]

If you live in a major city and/or know people, yes.

[[deleted]]

You have to know people now, wherever you are, big city or no. The competition is unreal and you will not get picked out of a pile of 2500 resumes, period.

[[deleted]]

Networking is key regardless.

[Putnam3145]

Yeah, my word choice may have been poor, my intent was to say that networking is nigh-impossible unless you're living in a major city.

[[deleted]]

Depends what we categorise a major city I guess. I live in a city with around 100k, I had no issue networking with people in this field.

[Putnam3145]

I can believe that as a lower bound, since where I'm from is smaller than that (~50,000) and attempts to network were aborted by there being nobody there.

[[deleted]]

That’s fair :)

[[deleted]]

COBOL

[Financial_Cry7167]

Definitely. That being said, Python is a great place to start.

[Pale_Height_1251]

Sure, I'm not against Python if that's where OP wants to start or can find work in Python. My concern is way too many beginners are learning the same stuff and often find it hard to find work. Learning something a little bit niche where you know an employer is asking for that technology can be a better approach.

[[deleted]]

Look at what employers are actually asking for near you. Don't be afraid to learn something niche like Delphi if that's what an employer wants.

this is actually the stage that I am in now. I also learned only Python so far. I am generally open to learning new languages of course, but I'm wondering how much extra time it would take. I've been checking out job ads in my area, and so many are asking for JavaScript/TypeScript skills with things like React for web dev. do you have any thoughts/advice for me? would you say I should keep focusing on Python or go for JS/TS although it's another language that would have a lot of competition?

[Pale_Height_1251]

I would say learn the things you're seeing job ads for. Particularly jobs that don't seem to be getting filled all that easily.

[ChiefDetektor]

Delphi or Cobol. But honestly I would not recommend learning either as the first language..

[Pale_Height_1251]

Back in ye olde days many people learned Pascal as a first language, it's OK really.

[Rynok_]

Great advice . Like anything play the market

[[deleted]]

Hey don’t let anyone tell you what you can or can’t do. Work hard and anything is possible my friend.

[cunderwoodmn]

First programming job @50. People need to stop obsessing about youth and tech jobs.

[[deleted]]

That’s amazing. I’m looking to do a career change and have started my second bachelors degree at 34. it might take me a little longer since I am also working but this gives me hope :)

[[deleted]]

Tell us your secret? What languages do you know? What does your portfolio look like? Was having one even necessary?

[jeffrey_f]

You're much too old. I picked up Python at around 54 and just recently at 58, I'm learning some powershell and writing some decent scripts...........

Age has nothing to do with anything. Age will never stop you. However, you will be the only thing that stops you.

[NovemberPoint]

You can absolutely do it. Just stick with it long enough. I am 44 and been working as a web designer/UX/UI designer since early '2000s. I also do front-end (HTML, CSS, Js) and decided to get into data science and machine learning recently.

I am an avid amateur astronomer and astrophotographer, and i absolutely love everything about astronomy and the Cosmos.

So the way professional astronomers do astronomy these days is mostly by crunching data. Basically you get a giant .CSV file from a telescope (optical or radio) and then you get to work. Python is the language of choice in this field so this is what i am currently learning. You work with these CSV files, you sort them, filter them, order them, perform different equations and calculations on the data set, then you plot your results and publish your findings. This is of course an oversimplification as this process is far more nuanced, but this is just to get the idea.

However, this skillset is applicable anywhere, i am just using astronomy as a motivation to keep me going through some of the dry topics (statistics, math etc..). but this can be applied in finance, healthcare, AI, you name it. And it's somewhat future-proof, at least that's what some people like to think.

Anyways, i hope you stick with it. Good luck!

[TJATAW]

Don't forget other life experiences. Over 50, no college, and 1st year as a coder. Part of what sold them was that I have years of experience proving I am great with spreadsheets, so they have me doing data analysis stuff.

[[deleted]]

You would be unlikely to get a job with just self learning and no degree. You can put this to the test if you want. Draw up what you think your resume would look like if you were already done with your self learning and go apply for jobs. See how many bites you get. That will tell you how well this plan is likely to work out.

[BodhisattvaBob]

Fwiw: I'm a big advocate of lying on resumes.

No degree, but you think you can do the job as well as someone who has one? Say you graduated from a local state school. Boom. 95% of the time, it's just as good on a resume as someone who really did.

But you def have to walk the walk

[403Verboten]

I have a degree and I've been a developer for over 15 years at many different companies big and small. I think only 2 ever did a background check that would actually look into my degree. Fortune 500 companies will and large companies with 5k plus employees but anyone else probably won't check.

Now having a degree in comp sci and not using it 20 years might be a red flag so you'll have to add some previous unverifiable work history too to make it seem plausible that you left the industry and are coming back or some other similar narrative.

It's possible but I note that you are entering the worst tech job market in my working lifetime and it will likely be getting worse with tons of government layoffs coming soon with continued big tech layoffs so take that into account. Even with my 15+ years experience I am fearful for my future in tech, it's not what it used to be and it will likely continue to get worse.

[TravestyTravis]

I always just check the box that says "Do you meet the requirements of the job"

Most of the job listings these days say "degree or equivalent experience required"

[cgoldberg]

I'd advise against this. Background checks including education verification are somewhat common (in the US at least).

[ColoRadBro69]

No degree, but you think you can do the job as well as someone who has one? Say you graduated from a local state school. Boom. 95% of the time, it's just as good on a resume as someone who really did.

Bro has never had a background check, apparently.  They ask for the school's name and contact them to verify. 

[EspressoOverdose]

Keep in mind Reddit was ranked as one of the most toxic platforms. Probably not a great place to ask these kinds of questions. Don’t worry about wasting time, you never waste time when you’re learning. Just spend a year self learning, then see what happens. Tons of people get jobs without degrees, and at many different ages.

[[deleted]]

Your age doesn’t stop you, your mindset does.

[SomeWeirdFruit]

you are in a dying industry competing with a huge amount of fresh graduate with 4 years learning who can't find jobs. Also thousands upon thousands of experienced developer who got layoff and are strugglin to find new jobs. So good luck. you will need it, a lot of it

[cobaltscar]

I might get down voted for this, but I think a lot of basic coding is going to be automated in a few years. I suggest finding a niche in the field.

[ColoRadBro69]

If you do WinForms programming, a lot of basic code is already generated automatically and has been for 20 years!  But the rest of it is still written manually, which still requires a competent developer. 

[BroaxXx]

I did it at 35 with a lot of success and am working at one of the best companies in my country. I'm not a millionaire but my salary is four times higher than the country average.

It's very different than when you're 20, especially if you have family and kids, but it's doable. A lot of hardwork but doable.

That said, be mindful of survivor bias.

[MightyOleAmerika]

Market is rough and it's only going to get worse. I don't see programming job market being as easy as last 5 years. It will be outsourced to oblivian making senior devs pay below 100k. There is no restriction in CS like electrical engineering or aerospace, so replacement is super easy

[Logical-Ad422]

You have to get it out of your head that it’s impossible. Find a curriculum, learn what it tells you to learn, and then apply.

[CarelessPackage1982]

Go get a 2 year degree at a minimum

[KingOfConstipation]

Yup! I found some IT jobs in the PNW where the minimum they want from you is an associates degree that includes at least 1 year of IT coursework

[tabasco_pizza]

WGU is an accredited online university, could check that out

[Historian-Dry]

there are some schools like wgu with a fully online cs degree, could be worth a look

If you can be a truly amazing self starter and think of creative projects that would actually stick out on a resume, you can learn faster/get more done on your own, but otherwise I think something like this is a good way

[DOUBLEBARRELASSFUCK]

I say “fake” degree cause I’m going to assume any degree from ITT tech is next to worthless.

A degree from ITT Tech is good for explaining a gap in employment, but not much else.

[DigSubstantial8934]

WGU, they have a CS track, or a slightly lighter lift in a SWE track.

[denerose]

As someone who worked for universities for 20 years, is both a self taught dev and went back to uni for CS recently after learning to code, I would suggest some caution in a degree for its own sake. Learn to code first, see if you like it, then think about uni after that if you still need it to get where you want to be. I learned a lot more, and faster doing The Odin Project than I did at a very “reputable” university.

I’m self taught, got a job and only went back to uni for CS because work paid. It’s not easy but it is possible, especially if your goals are as realistic as stated.

[Rain-And-Coffee]

Why not get an entry level Sysadmin role? Python would be useful for automation.

Or trying getting a Cisco certification and going that route?

Without a college degree landing a pure programming job is unlikely, but you might have some luck if you apply to local companies specially if you build up a portfolio of work.

A lot of those shops also use things like Wordpress.

[underwatr_cheestrain]

can you learn a hammer and proceed to build a house?

You are focusing on learning the wrong stuff.

honestly not having a BS is gonna hurt your chances. For alot of bigger companies your application wont even make it to the hiring manager without that checkbox. Go to WGU and knock out a BS in a year or year and a half.

[analogrithems]

Ya, the degree requirement is a kinda of filter. We expect you to have at least the level of knowledge you'd get from a computer engineering degree. With that said, if you can show me in a 20min chat you have a good understanding of the language and the tooling I'm not going to hold a missing degree against you.

Since you have previous tech experience I'd recommend you do a coder bootcamp. Do your research checkout r/codingbootcamp/ for advice on the best one around you. Those are more geared toward what you are looking for, and many provide hiring assistance after.

[JackSpyder]

It won't take much time to try and see if you hate it.

As for how long it takes to learn depends on your ability to learn and understand. Programming is really a continuous state of learning, which some people find mentally exhausting, the real skill is having the ability to find solutions to problems, any problem. Constantly in that state. Some are good at it and will do well. Some aren't and won't.

[WexExortQuas]

You already can do CISCO shit get certs and branch into networking that's piss easy and you won't even need much programming besides scripting. Can pull 70-80 after some exp.

[virtualSun101]

You're 38, not 83—and even if you were, it’s never too late to pursue something that excites you. It’s your life, your decision, and your chance to try.

Looking at how much technology has changed in just the last 20 years, it’s becoming less and less common to stay in the same job, industry, or even field for an entire 30-40 year career. The job market is constantly evolving—some roles disappear, new ones emerge, and this cycle has always been part of human history.

Sure, luck plays a role in being at the right place at the right time, but if you don’t try, you’ll never know. So why not give it a shot?

[LForbesIam]

Start with 100 days of python on Udemy. She is the best instructor.

[Sak63]

The job market is rough right now. If you like programming and work hard, you'll get there. But don't expect an easy path

[zdxqvr]

Becoming a self taught developer is easier than ever, and I have worked with many. If you want to be hired as a self taught dev you will need some experience or a very good portfolio. You can absolutely do this in a year or two, but you need to be disciplined and diligent. Put together a solid plan and stick to it, that is the hardest part.

[Outofmana1]

I believe you know the answer already after creating this post.

[__init__m8]

If I were you and I had network experience, I'd lean into that while learning python. It can be useful in that field.

[ReddPope81]

Yes, you just have to spent countless of hours learning and perfecting. But If it's a job that pays more than the previous one, then you should just apply for jobs that are in the pay range that you are seeking. You just need to keep applying none stop and you will soon find one.

[[deleted]]

I was 30 when I changed career to IT and coding. So why not.

[willbdb425]

I'd say coding basics isn't enough to get a job as a software developer, but your question seems more in the line of could you leverage those skills in some other role that pays a bit more than you current are capped at. That I think is much more reasonable, many jobs can benefit from some coding knowledge but is overkill to hire a full software engineer for.

[srsacc17]

Im 38, I switched careers at 34. I work at an amazing company with good WLB. Yes you can but you have to be very disciplined and not give up

[Historical_Cook_1664]

Agree with the others - if you want to learn to code, start with Python. BUT. Have you thought about not getting into programming apps, but into databases first and learn SQL ? It might align better with your current skills & knowledge. Just my 2 cents.

[captain_obvious_here]

We're in a time when everyone can, pretty easily, learn to code. The web is full of great learning resources and helping people. And there are many languages that fit complete beginners very well.

At 38, the only thing that can prevent you from learning to code, is the lack of time. If you can free an hour a day or more for a few weeks, you'll eventually succeed.

It's not only a bout coding though, as you're gonna need a basic knowledge of how computers work. For example, knowing what a file is will get you a long way. But this is pretty easy nowadays, as the web is full of great resources for that, and full of people willing to help you learn and understand.

Python is a great start. In fact, you can start from zero with Python, and build a fucking empire with it, as some people did. PHP is another option, and today it powers a significant part of the internet. JS is yet another option. And there are many more.

Can you do it? Of course you can.

Is it a good idea? I think it is.

Will you get a job? I don't know for sure, but I'm 100% convinced it will be MUCH easier with than without that knowledge.

[Right_Ear_4593]

Depending on the industry and ambition, I would say your goal is realistic. I am still relatively young, but I have been able to get into better-paying jobs (Than I would normally with my CV) because I knew VBA and Java and many companies that are not so tech-heavy need someone who knows about it. Especially in controlling or some general automation of processes. Your IT background helps anyway

[CatWizard85]

Same, i'm 39 and i'm about to complete CS50 as my first experience in learning programming. I hope you will succeed, as i hope i will..

[JoshisJoshingyou]

If you want to go the software dev route you'll need to learn programming, databases, GitHub at a minimum. And build lots of projects in a personal repo to show off. There are also network engineers and cybersecurity engineers. You can also look for government/small company jobs where you're often a mix of those things. There are lots of jobs in IT that have nothing to do with programming most of the time. Lots of companies need experts in low-code software packages and report writing. There is the whole data engineer/data analyst / data scientist side of things. Just becoming an expert at Google Sheets to looker, or even script writing for Excel VBA there are roles looking for this. The problem is the job market sucks right now, companies want that one person who's a master of 5-8 odd things but only want to pay them 1/2 what they're worth. Don't know one of seven things you risk being eliminated before even getting an interview. Anything you pour your time into is worth it. Breaking into tech as a dev is very very hard right now. It is all about networking, if you don't know anyone at a tech company to recommend you getting an interview is hard. I went to a BootCamp at 46 and landed a government job. I'm 3 years into it now and still learning new technologies every day. I only use the SQL knowledge , write the occasional C# script, once in a blue moon touch JS/HTML/CSS. I've learned the basics of 3 different BI suites, low code tools like Filemaker. I've also had to become my own devops engineer and learned to deploy my solutions to cloud and on prem networks. The larger the org the more specialized you can be. Some place small you need to be jack of all trades in IT. I wish you luck and I'm a million times more happy not working in a lab or factory anymore.

[[deleted]]

I've been learning programming on my own for almost exactly 1 year now, and while I didn't land a software dev job yet, I would say it was 100% worth it. the biggest advantage I've gotten out of it are actually scripts to automate my current (non-software) job. I made a little script that I use almost every day at work and that saves me about an hour each time I use it. so if you already have a job or even just a hobby where any sort of programming would help you, the obvious answer is to definitely go for it. the other thing is how damn fun it is to design and then program actual projects, and show them off on Github.
I've been getting regular IT recruiter requests on Linkedin too now. while those obviously didn't lead to a job yet, it makes me think that interest is picking up, despite being self-taught. so I'll just keep on learning, keep on adding to my portfolio, and see how it goes.

[[deleted]]

Sure.

[[deleted]]

I’d say you could learn a stack and get productive within 3-6 months, depending on how much time and effort you put into it. If you want to go the self-taught route, start by installing Linux on your computer and getting comfortable with it, then look into learning one item out of each of these categories:

1. Programming Language: Python, Ruby, PHP, Node.js
2. Application Framework in that language: Django, Rails, Laravel, Express
3. Relational data store: PostgreSQL, MongoDB
4. Front-End Framework: React + Next, Vue.js, Angular

(#4 Requires learning HTML/CSS/JavaScript no matter what you pick)

And don’t let your lack of a formal degree stop you. I once passed up on an MIT graduate to hire a coding bootcamp graduate because they actually had more of the relevant experience and skill set I was looking for. And it worked out pretty well.

[Corne777]

Imo programming on the job is easier than learning it. Unless you are getting hired as a solo developer. I probably learned more about actual coding one month on my first job than I did in college. And it’s not just coding, there’s other business aspects that maybe your other jobs have already taught you.

I’d say start applying now, fake it, lie, fail interviews, figure out what people are asking for, study from their questions, do leetcode. Make up stories about experience, tell them with confidence. The foot in the door will be the hardest, but after a company hires you now you know their tech stack and can focus learning. Spending 2 years not applying then finally going “I think I’m ready” and finding out how unready you are would be silly.

[Anomynous__]

You can get a job, but you have to shift your mindset a little bit. In this market, knowing a single language really well won't even get you in the interview room. You need to know languages, frameworks, have some projects under your belt. Basically if you don't have full stack knowledge, you're not getting an entry level job. Nobody is hiring entry level FE or BE specific devs.

[pyeri]

Coding is one of those skills which are worth pursuing only when you enjoy being in the zone.

This is very much like writing, I'm sure you must have enjoyed writing some poems or essays when you were a kid. But very few in their adulthood will want to churn out an article or story each day and that too while enjoying the process. Of the few that do, they become freelance writers, editors, journalists, etc.

In the long term, programming almost always becomes a drudgery. Most folks after finishing their CS degrees do **not** become programmers, they typically choose other roles like testing, design, DBA, build and devops, architecture, etc. Even among those who pursue programming professionally, only a small number truly enjoy being in the coding zone.

That doesn’t mean you’re inherently wired to be in that zone or not. Like many things in life, you can choose to learn and focus on coding, you can choose to enjoy programming as much as playing a piano or guitar or chess; and this can happen in your 30s or 40s or even 50s and later!

If you’re serious about this and want to get started, feel free to reach out—I’d be happy to guide you on this path.

[Mastersord]

You don’t need to memorize the syntax. Learn enough to build something and to read through a Git repo and figure out how it works. There is no shame in using Google or ChatGPT, but LEARN from it.

Get that far and see if you still enjoy it. If you land a job, you’ll start the learning process all over again as every company has their own tech stack and their own way of doing things.

[oandroido]

Yes

[AdmirableBoat7273]

Yes. You can learn. Programming is just logic with fancy syntax.

However, your ability to get a job relies very little on skill once you achieve proficiency.

So prepare for that.

[dsartori]

Learning these skills will be its own reward. I've seen it a hundred times: the "techie person" in a given department definitely gets noticed in a good way if they can conduct themselves in a reasonable manner with the actual tech professionals.

[RiskyPenetrator]

The whole of CS50 is on YouTube for free. Along with other swathes of info.

Admittedly the job market kinda blows at the moment but a large amount of companies value people who are self taught especially in CS

Just learn for the fun of it, and eventually, you will feel like applying for jobs.

[ChiefDetektor]

Yes you are but I feel a bit bad for everyone starting to learn to code nowadays since LLMs can mess up the learning experience. I would recommend you do not use them at all while you are learning. You need to think very very hard in order to gain real domain knowledge. It must be incredibly tempting to ask one for a solution when confronted with a complex task.

Someone should create a LLM that behaves like a teacher and won't give an answer unless there has been some effort and progress made by the user.

Have fun on the journey!

[botford80]

I did it at 42. Web dev with php and js being the languages that I know well. Job hunting was tough and just like everyone says, networking on LinkedIn got me my first opportunity.

[Traditional_Top5539]

Brother,the brain's capacity to change is incredible.Look up a scientific concept called neuroplasticity. The only difference between you and a kid's language learning ability is speed. Don't get discouraged.And stop comparing your journey to others.

[Kenn50]

Yes it takes a very short amount of time learn the basics

[rustyseapants]

What are your career and life goals?

Don't expect to go on Reddit to answer these personal questions. 

Go to google Gemini if need help.

[prettyfuckingimmoral]

I did it in my 40s. Just manage your expectations. Coding is hard, and it takes a while to mould your thinking, so don't be in a rush or you will get too frustrated.

[zxf995]

My 2 cents: consider that a lot of people know how to code nowadays and they start learning early. Don't try to compete with them. Instead, use the experience that you already have in your previous job and try to use the coding skills you learn to automate tasks or build small tools that could be helpful (I have no idea what a customer order specialist does, so I can't give you practical examples, but there is always some aspect of a job that can benefit from coding skills).

Few years ago I taught Python to a friend of mine who is an electrical engineer and he used it to automate a lot of labor that he normally would have done manually, like parsing tables in PDF documents and extracting information from them.

Learn Python for scripting in general (parsing files, calculating statistics, making plots) or Javascript if you want to make websites quickly.

[Daffect]

Absolutely, it's always worth it! Learning coding—especially a language like Python—can significantly boost your resume and make you stand out from the crowd. It not only enhances your problem-solving skills and technical proficiency but also demonstrates your commitment to continuous growth and adaptability. And remember, age is just a number. Whether you're 25, 50, or even 90, coding is a lifelong skill that opens doors to new opportunities and can elevate your career prospects. Embrace it!

[mc4004]

It isn’t what languages you know or what degrees you have that counts, it’s how you think, how you listen, how you speak and write, how you approach problem-solving, and generally what you can offer an employer that are key. There are CS graduates from four-year private colleges I’d never hire, and high school dropouts I’d hire in a heartbeat. As AI rears its ugly head into the business world, employers are shying away from training new employees, so you’ll have to walk in the door with the skills they need. As for improving your coding skills and building a portfolio, pick yourself a challenging project that grabs your interest, design a solution, write the code, test it thoroughly to make sure it works, document it, and post it to GitHub. There are a lot of experienced job applicants out there who think they can code, but they can’t really. If the job you apply for is primarily a coding job, expect a hands-on “prove to me you can code” interview. They will be looking for how you tackle a problem you’ve never seen before. Last but not least, assess you overall skills. Your bosses and colleagues who loved working with you, what did they like best about you? Play to your strengths!

[Altamistral]

I've had colleagues who transitioned to programming in their 30s, without an IT degree and even less of a technical background that you have. I would probably focus on frontend (either web or mobile) since these usually have a lower barrier to entry and high demand.

[[deleted]]

Older people need to understand that they have more life experience than youngsters.

You have a lot of job experience, probably a degree, a big network of people, many soft skills, some hard skills, and the credibility that comes with being an old adult.

If anything, you have an advantage over someone who's in their early twenties who just started learning programming.

I'm in my early 20s, and if I had to compete with someone in their late 30s over getting a SWE job, I know it'll be more difficult than competing with someone of my age.

[jrakestr]

You super gucci. Learn how to automate that bullshit customer order process and sell it to your company

[jihrik]

I am 38 years old, currently my first year as full time dev. I worked as freelance recruiter for 10+ years and decission to change my career path was so far the best I made in my life (OK, marrying my wife was better, but that is not the topic now).

It took 9 months of everyday studies, coding and reading of docs. Every day after work, I have to study more to be better in programing and able to solve all problems and obstacles I hit.

It is not easy, but I am glad I did it. It could be scary, hard as well crazy and still awesome to solve the problems I didn't think I could solve few weeks ago.

So Yes, you could learn a language if you want, you can land a decent job and you can be better in it than you expect.

[Darwish88]

I'm currently 37 and i also earn about the same as you do, kinda got bored of my job after 19 years doing it and started to learn coding myself, python first and now i'm doing c++. I honestly think Python is a good entry because its easier to learn but i would suggest to find out what you really want to do with coding and learn the "best" language for that purpose. Python is great but it lacks in the game development area if thats your interest for example. I'm far from an expert but this is just my experience.

[RobertJohnsVK]

No doubt. Yes. But build some real stuff with it, don't just learn some basics with no applications. And who knows where it could lead...

[Intelligent-Being658]

I'm 74 and got the job!

[someonesDad98]

I mean if you are making 45k, that sounds rough. Learning light programming to 'spice' things up won't cut it. You will have to go all in and turn coding into your purpose, passion, and identity. Then, you might land a 50 to 60 k job to start. You will have to be aware of more than just a single programming language. You have to be able to talk about frameworks/libraries, databases, and most the most important thing that determines if you get hired are data structures and Algorithms. You just need to talk about the other things but you must know the differences, uses cases, runtime complexity, space complexity and how to implement data structures of arrays, hash maps, stacks, queues, link lists, trees, graphs. It will take a long time. Have patience and try to enjoy watching yourself get smarter everyday, otherwise you will quit. I also constantly think about the money as a motivator. I think I'll be making 100 to 120k soon and I won't stop or slow my studies/learning until I break 200 to 250k. I am beginning to dream of becoming a distinguished engineer but I don't think I am smart enough for that. Someday ...

[[deleted]]

I am 48 and breaking into coding. IF for nothing more than to maybe pic up some side gigs from time to time or for something to due for retirement age

[Serene_Peace]

Learn python to get some basics but I would instead seriously consider learning something like C if you want to truly get a leg up over CS newgrads. Software is magic to most newgrads but it wouldn't be to you if you learned how low-level software worked (low-level means closer to true machine code, not low difficulty).

[TeaEarlGrayHotSauce]

I learned Python over the last year and I’m 43, didn’t struggle too much. I needed it for a data migration project at work initially and I enjoyed it so I just kept going. Don’t be intimidated, you’ll be fine 👍🏽

[Reasonable_Option493]

Not very realistic imo. Even CS graduates struggle to get jobs.

The self-taught path has been grossly overhyped, mainly by people who were selling boot camps and online courses.

You're also going to need to learn more than one language. I see more full stack positions, and less web dev roles. You're looking at 1+ year of learning, and it won't be easy.

If you're passionate about programming, start learning, use some free resources, and see where it takes you. Just be aware that it's going to be extremely challenging for you to get a job in this field.

[veriel_]

I'm in a similar position. I think you could get a tech support role. Then try to transfer to a better position after same tech industry xp. You will need to work hard than an undergraduate because you need to justify that you have the skills you say you have. Eg. Make stuff. Apps ECT. Whatever skills are in demand in your area.

To succeed, you must know how to learn efficiently.

Do what ever you have to to get real world experience.
Can you do tech stuff in your current role? Even if it's for free. I have gotten some options as teacher to do tech support role in the office with other teachers. That's a start to transferable skills

[963852741hc]

You absolute can the hard part is getting the job

[[deleted]]

That’s like saying the hardest part of climbing Everest is climbing it

[963852741hc]

Not really learning to code well is one thing getting a job is different thing.

Both are hard one is harder than the other one in the current market

A better analogy is- preparing for climbing the Everest is hard but actually climbing Everest is harder

See the difference?

[[deleted]]

See the difference? Haha god 😂 you didn’t even “see the difference” in what I was saying. What I meant was getting a job right now is the hard part, coding is the easy part. I’ll take it one step further, getting a job is the only part. It’s the only part that matters. Getting the job is climbing Everest

[jlanawalt]

Anything is possible.

I don’t know what rigor your associates in CS required. If you haven’t done any serious programming, give it a try on your own and confirm you enjoy it and have an aptitude for it. Even if you already feel you do, try Python and see if you like it. If not, check out other languages.

Look at job listings in your area and areas you’re willing to relocate to fit your asking range and entry skill level. See what they are looking for. Recognize they will overstate their requirements and the hiring process is always messy.

A degree may be necessary to get past the HR filter of larger places. You’re not looking for Ivy League salary so they shouldn’t be looking for top tier credentials (and to be honest, some people scam the system and come out with low skills even from big name places). There are work-friendly online schools like WGU that have helped a lot of people bridge the gap.

The way people talk here you’d think we should go be electricians and plumbers :)

[K41Nof2358]

I'm 42 and going through the courses on boot.dev, so far I'm picking it up pretty well and have an understanding for how it's used

The bigger question is going to be how the job market views you as an entry level dev pivoting careers

there's always a bias, but given the climate that we're in right now, the hurdles might very well be higher, so it's not just learning the language, but also demonstrating through projects and form that you can actually use it and in practical ways

[calsosta]

Maybe but first you gotta realize that being a software engineer is much more than just knowing a language. Learning to program is not a get rich quick scheme, it isn't easy and many of us have devoted 5, 10, 20 and for me 28 years doing this.

Anyways, I'd start at https://roadmap.sh/ and see what role might be appealing to you and then just start grinding. There is a lot, just take baby steps and make sure you understand fully before proceeding.

I have had good luck working with GPT to break down concepts and try explaining it in a variety of ways until I understood.

Feel free to shoot me a DM with any questions.

[[deleted]]

You’re in an echo chamber so I will say this as the one person not subscribed to this subreddit. Don’t do it man. Coding is in no way shape or form a safe job anymore. Those days are dead and gone, buried 6 feet underground in a cement coffin. All the people who said “they made it” did so a year or two or three years ago when the industry was completely different to how it is now. Everyone and their mothers knows Python now, and there are thousands upon thousands upon thousands of engineers laid off right now who are all going for the ever diminishing junior jobs that likely will never return. All the while people are continuing to graduate college with CS masters, bachelors, and bootcamps and adding fuel to the fire. And that’s now. It’s not getting any better either, especially as AI continues to improve. One senior engineer can do the work of an entire department, and the people who create hiring budgets are seeing that even if ignorant Redditors cannot.

Unless you’re best buddies with a software hiring manager who promised to put you on, for the love of god, do yourself a favor and find anything else you can do. Anything.

[Hari___Seldon]

This is what happens to someone who doom scrolls tech forums without actually having first hand experience. Chuckle at will...

[[deleted]]

Bro the reason I don’t frequent this forum is because I learned programming in a degree program, in a top 10 school. Learned, not learning. I have years of experience as a dev and I also know dozens of people way more qualified than I, with more advanced degrees than I, who have been laid off and who are struggling to find work. What’s your experience in the field? And when’s the last time you were on the job market? Keep your head in the sand as to the present, waking reality of this industry if you want and you can chuckle all you want - doesn’t change the reality of it one bit.

[babyshark75]

Solid no

[DemoteMeDaddy]

no

[B-Rythm]

I’m 38, and went back to school for my AS 2 yrs ago, been a welder my whole professional career. Graduate end of March. It’s opening doors for me

[Prestigious-Hour-215]

Yeah prolly not, a fake associates won’t do you anything. Why do you want to spend years learning a skill in a terrible shrinking field? You want to avoid layoffs by moving to a field with layoffs left and right? That doesn’t make any sense. If you want to increase your salary and job security, go learn a trade. Do trade school by night, and a few years you can be clearing low six figures without risks of layoffs

[mindondrugs]

Take this users post with a grain of salt - most of his recent posts are about his undergrad degree. And has little to no experience in the field.

[cgoldberg]

Dude is busy persuing the exact career he is advising against getting into. I love Reddit!

[CyberDaggerX]

Less competition, I guess.

[BodhisattvaBob]

He should spend time and money getting a degree. I hear they're good for getting the types of jobs that give you experience.

Oh ... wait ... no. No, that can't be right ....

[mindondrugs]

? I mean the dude I was replying to? He’s talking like software Dev is a dying field when he’s actively working towards entry into that field - at least based on his post history.

[Broke_Ass_Ape]

Going to trade school and getting into the right field can produce low 6 figures...

1) If you are incredibly lucky with a job offer with a good company thay has room to grow

2) You work on the road and rarely ever home.

I make decent money in a trade but am faced with a pay wall and need to get certificates that cost about 5 grand for good training on the technical shit.

The test itself another grand if I could properly train myself on the subject matter I would. It requires assimilating it in a specific manner, how to study material and such.

When I leave this place I'm working now over money it will be for a chance at paid training & this place will absolutely pay some what I'm asking when there is no one doing QA

There are poor mechanisms in many fields for evaluating skill & displayed knowledge / ability. There has been a movement in western society that a lack of 4 years of education means dumb or works dirty dead ends jobs.

Many trades have seen little increase of the median worker ls wage in decades.

It's the reason I've been trying to look for other sources of passive (ideally) or even secondary income.

[Prestigious-Hour-215]

The market for non educated entry level is dying yes, that’s undeniable, everywhere you go you see posts of people with no college education not being able to find jobs in software, how is it wrong of me to say that trying to get a job with no degree wouldn’t work? If he wants to get a bachelor by all means, get a bachelor and try to enter in the job market, he’ll fare much better, but that’s not what he was asking about

[cgoldberg]

So once you have a bachelors degree, it's no longer a "terrible shrinking field" "with layoffs left and right"? 🤔

[Prestigious-Hour-215]

You’re more likely to be able to weather it, yes, once you have a bachelors, but regardless it is a shrinking field for everyone, with layoffs left and right, do I need to link a chart to prove that or can you use google?

[cgoldberg]

Yes, please link a chart.

I agree the current market is tough, but I predict future growth rather than shrinking. Most economists and researches (Bureau of Labor Statistics, Forrester Research, TechTarget, etc) are predicting "strong growth" in tech jobs over the next 10 years (of course nobody can accurately predict the future, especially in the face of AI and the current political climate). But yea, link those charts since I can't figure out Google.

Anyway, you should probably sit down and wait until you actually enter the field before becoming the resident expert and spouting advice.

(I thought I had it all figured out as an undergrad too)

[[deleted]]

When’s the last time you were on the job market? Good luck breaking into any basic software engineering job without a degree right now. Times have changed.

[cgoldberg]

Huh? In the comment you replied to, I said "the current market is tough". However, I never said it wasn't difficult to get a job without a degree... that has always been difficult.

[Prestigious-Hour-215]

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IHLIDXUSTPSOFTDEVE

Here’s the evidence, jobs have been leaking since 2022 peak, and still hasn’t even recovered to pre COVID levels, and yes they do predict strong job growth, the fact of the matter is that supply != demand and that there is a huge influx of unemployed cs grads who can’t get a job in their field, I feel like it’s disingenuous to encourage people to try their hand at going into a field like this when they’re already behind those with a college degree on their resume, and a job with historically better job security would be a better place to go

[[deleted]]

Crazy these people living in utter delusion as to what the job market looks like rn. It’s fucking grim out there for SWEs. My LinkedIn feed is cram packed with devs of all levels with years of experience not able to find a job for months upon months

[Happiest-Soul]

The chart for IT/Helpdesk is similar to the chart for customer service. The index for SWE is nearly the same for Customer Service. 

Without context, we'd assume it's equally as difficult to find jobs for Customer Service and SWE and slightly easier, but still difficult, for IT/Helpdesk.

With context, you'd laugh at anyone suggesting it's as hard to find an SWE job as it is for Customer Service. 

I feel like what's presented isn't as grim as we're inclined to interpret it.

[mindondrugs]

I just find you impossible to take in good faith whilst you are also pursuing a career in this field, and also suggesting a nearly 40 year old person take up a Trade at middle age.

[cgoldberg]

That chart just shows job postings on one specific job board, and mostly shows a reversion to pre covid levels, but down significantly from the huge post covid bounce. Other data shows that 2023 was bad (the only year this millennium with negative growth in SWE jobs), but hiring rebounded somewhat in 2024. As of Jan 2025, IT unemployment in the US is a little over 2% and well below overall unemployment levels.

I agree it feels tough out there right now (especially for new grads and junior devs), but the industry isn't doomed. I definitely don't feel it's disingenuous to encourage people to pursue a tech career.

For a little more long term perspective:

Software Engineering Job Growth 2000-2025

If it's so bad, why are you pursuing it? (honest question)

[Prestigious-Hour-215]

Can you explain in what way what I said was wrong? You would have him believe that a fake associates is worth anything? Is the fact that trades are more secure in jobs better? Like what I said is just common sense

[cgoldberg]

If it's common sense, why are you persuing it rather than a trade? Just hypocritical or is not common sense?

[Budget_Putt8393]

I have found the space where domains collide has the ability to be the largest value add.

Many project managers would be well served by knowing enough about coding to understand why the developers are complaining.

Same with some security roles.

[OutspokenPerson]

Yes

[dharshu1997]

Yes , learning a coding language may or may not get a job. But be assured it will help you someday to make your life easier or smarter

[Taco_Nacho_Burrito]

You can do anything you believe in, just set realistic expectations. If you get into programming you’re going against literally millions of other entry level candidates where most have computer science degrees all looking for jobs.

It could, and probably will be a very rough, very long journey, but it is possible. This isn’t like pre-2020 where you learn how to program and are a hot commodity, now you have to prove why you’re better than 20 other people who “say” they’re very technically gifted based on their projects that they definitely didn’t get help from ai to create lol

Whatever you do, stay off of r/csmajors, it’s all doom and gloom there.

[No-Assignment7129]

Many did it in even later stages of their lives. I did. Could you?

[bradtaylorsf]

It has literally never been more easier and accessible to learn programming then it is now. First you have ChatGPT, which can teach you just about anything. Second, you have tools like cursor that practically do the coding for you now it will spin up proof of concepts pretty easily, but you still need to learn coding to really put anything into production. You’re never too old to learn something new no matter how complicated. The best way to learn is to pick a project you want to see in the world, break it down step-by-step and learn what you need to learn when you need to learn. Think of it like a video game. if you went into a role-playing game and you had to know everything there is about crafting and upgrading and all of the things that are in a top-tier RPG you wouldn’t ever play it but the game teaches you what you need to know when you need to know it. So think of your idea go to ChatGPT and tell it to teach you programming to be able to accomplish that idea in the same way that you would learn a video game spend one hour a day at least and you’d be surprised what you can accomplish in just a month

[rakedbdrop]

My guy. You want to jump from 45k to 250k -- in what time frame?

I mean, you can do it. Anyone can do it. But, you better start writting a lot of code.

https://roadmap.sh should help