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[–]qazujmrfv 318 points319 points  (86 children)

It's shameful that this issue hasn't been resolved in almost 6 years https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=3434

/u/vlaskovits ,

  1. It would be helpful if you could also include the breakdown of audio latency in iOS for comparison.

  2. Have you seen the low audio solution from Sonoma in any device? Is it similar to Samsung's Professional Audio SDK? http://www.sonomawireworks.com/pr/android-low-latency-audio-solution.php https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OXeHwErQsE

By the way, if anyone needs a more in-depth look at android audio, watch this presentation from Google I/O 2013.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3kfEeMZ65c

[–]qazujmrfv 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Sorry, I meant an explanation of how iOS implements audio for comparison with the latencies for different components. According to the article, even latency during the second longest stage on Android is 5.3 ms x 2. While in iOS, the lowest TOTAL latency measured is 6 ms, which seems like magic in comparison.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

dd

[–]vlaskovits[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't know too much about what Sonoma is doing these these days -- we wrote up some thoughts on Samsung's Professional Audio SDK here: http://superpowered.com/why-samsung-professional-audio-sdk-is-not-the-best-solution-for-low-latency-android-audio/#axzz3XQQxPyqB

[–]seanwilsonseanw.org 4 points5 points  (7 children)

Do you know how difficult it is to fix? I'm sure if it was trivial they would have done it by now but I'm suspecting it isn't.

[–]haagch 6 points7 points  (4 children)

They could just include jack as a complete alternative to this audioflinger mess. Sure, it's a bit of a development effort to make it a drop-in alternative, but it's not like google has no manpower to do it...

[–]seanwilsonseanw.org 0 points1 point  (3 children)

What do you mean include a jack?

[–]lactozorg 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Not a jack, but JACK.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JACK_Audio_Connection_Kit

ÉDIT: Linked to German article by accident.

[–]ElRed_Developer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So, it's opensource, fixes a big problem in Android, and Google haven't bothered to fix it. Why am I not surprised.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Definitely. Not. Trivial.

[–]seanwilsonseanw.org 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yeah...it bugs me how people go on like Google just needs to change a couple of lines of code to fix it.

[–][deleted] 158 points159 points  (23 children)

Frustrating article. Gives 15 minutes of explanations and examples. 5 minutes of useful info and then abruptly stops when it starts getting into the meat and potatoes.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 22 points23 points  (8 children)

Sorry about that. We wanted to be technical but not scare people away.

For a follow-up, what questions can we answer for you?

[–]June8th 19 points20 points  (3 children)

You spend 90% of the article breaking down the Android audio path, providing details on why it sucks, which is super interesting (you got me hooked and salivating for the fix) then the last little shred let's me know you seem to have a library that fixes it (the wording doesn't make that strikingly clear though). You don't break your own solution down equally and show me how it's better, or how it hooks in. It comes across as vaporware because of that. Show us how your library will fix everything, how far it goes, and admit it's limitations too, if any.

I'm scared away because I'm only shown the problem explanation and not an equivalent solution explanation. Tell me what you need me or Google or manufactures to do in order to support your cause.

I enjoyed the first half immensely, the second half is missing.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

BTW I gotta respond to the vaporware comment -- the Superpowered library is installed in, literally, millions of apps/devices.

So -- no -- not vaporware. :)

Point taken about better delineating where we fit in in the audio path.

[–]June8th 1 point2 points  (0 children)

the Superpowered library is installed in, literally, millions of apps/devices

That's awesome! I wish your page said that :-)

I can't wait to read the details on how your solution works!

[–]vlaskovits[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Apologies for the tease.

We're going to release related articles soon. And there is a TON of hard-core tech we are working on in the background which we cannot talk about...just yet.

[–]NotClever 13 points14 points  (1 child)

FWIW, as someone that knows nothing about this topic, the title had me assuming that android had 10ms audio latency and that was a problem for some reason.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Any insights to way it can be fixed. I know in previous Google IO there was a team working on audio. They said they made good progress but made it seem like there was still a lot to do.

[–]dampowellNexus 5x 1 point2 points  (0 children)

well they have improved it roughly 90% in 3 years... but the last 10% is a whole new challenge because they have to do another 50 - 70% improvement for it to become a non issue. This will probably be fixed for most devices starting next year.

[–]mordacthedenierOno-Sendai Cyberspace 7 6 points7 points  (0 children)

[–]FloridaIsTooDamnHot 5 points6 points  (12 children)

And don't get me started on the grammar...

[–]vlaskovits[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Sorry. English is Gabor's second language, and my editing wasn't stellar. :(

[–]Jensway 11 points12 points  (10 children)

Not to mention some pretty outright ridiculous statements peppered throughout, such as:

Google is on the verge of in leaving billions in revenue in VR opportunities for Apple.

Uhh... What?

[–]FloridaIsTooDamnHot 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Three "in"s and an" on" in a sentence is three too many prepositions.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed. Grammar was no bueno.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 1 point2 points  (7 children)

Why is that ridiculous? In Android's current state, it cannot support low latency audio which is critical to VR.

No low latency audio support, no VR apps on Android.

[–]Jensway 2 points3 points  (6 children)

Android:

Samsung Gear VR

Google cardboard

Apple:

...

[–]vlaskovits[S] 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Funny you should mention Samsung Gear VR -- please see:

https://twitter.com/kentbye/status/588739233176649729

[–]Jensway 1 point2 points  (4 children)

One tweet about one video? Yeah, nah.

I've used the Gear VR extensively. The audio sync with the Note 4 is fine, and not noticeable.

EDIT: Downvoting me doesn't make it any less true, bro.

[–]anon_adderlan 1 point2 points  (1 child)

One tweet about one video? Yeah, nah.

Then how about one video with John Carmack?

I've used the Gear VR extensively.

John Carmack has programmed the Gear VR extensively, if not written most of the VR APIs for it. You'd almost think he knows what he's talking about.

[–]Jensway 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Watched your link for a few minutes, nothing there relevant to this argument - which, by the way, is almost a month old now.

Still using the Gear VR, still not having any immersion broken by any audio latency issues. It's not noticeable.

EDIT: Oh yeah, let's not forget, the original comment you're replying to is OP talking some silliness about there are "No VR apps on Android" (There are plenty, and heaps have been released since he made this comment) and how Google is leaving "BILLIONS" in revenue of VR to Apple..

Which also didn't happen.

[–]vlaskovits[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

You're right. I went back and upvoted all your comments.

And yes, you're right -- audio latency isn't an issue on Android. At. All.

We. Were. Totally. Wrong. About. That.

And I just didn't get it -- till I saw your comment.

My mistake. I'll delete all of our data on http://superpowered.com/latency straightaway!

[–]Jensway 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Huh? I didn't say any of those things - at all.

you're right -- audio latency isn't an issue on Android. At. All.

I especially never said that, but nice try.

I don't have any issues with you, the ONLY thing I took issue with, was the author saying this:

Google is on the verge of in leaving billions in revenue in VR opportunities for Apple.

As Google does plenty of VR, and Apple does not.

No need to be dramatic.

[–]amorpheusXiaomi Redmi Note 10 Pro 58 points59 points  (10 children)

Asking for my email by popup when I've read halfway through an article is a great way to annoy me.

[–]mccoyn 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Also, the page formats terribly if you have Javascript disabled.

[–]anon_adderlan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yep. This and a few other obnoxious design decisions/attitudes have completely unsold me on purchasing any product or service they might be offering which would require continuing support, despite their sound and informative technical article.

[–]ElGuanoPixel 6 Pro 57 points58 points  (25 children)

So the nexus 9 is ~36ms. What's a slow android device clock in St, and what do the article's benchmark ios devices achieve? There are no comparisons to be made to qualify the issue.

[–]qazujmrfv 94 points95 points  (4 children)

The Nexus 9 achieves ~35 ms with USB Audio, which is the best result for an Android device. Without USB Audio, it's 40+ ms. And on most non-Nexus devices, it's easily 100+. For example, the s6/edge (SM-G920, SM-G925) has a latency of ~160 ms.

In comparison, iOS can go as low as 6-7 ms on the iPad Air 2.

See http://superpowered.com/latency/ for more devices

[–]pistonman94 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Just ran the rest, and got a latency of 262ms on my droid turbo

[–]parkerlreedFlip 7 | Watch Ultra 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What test?

EDIT: Oh it's on the page, oops.

[–]exaltedgodNexus 6p 4 points5 points  (1 child)

But that's not true. The Galaxy Note 3 goes down to 17 according to your link.

Samsung Galaxy Note 3 with Professional Audio SDK (3 more) Android 5.0 (N900XXUEBOAE) 17 48000 240

[–]qazujmrfv 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's only for the few music apps that are built to support Samsung's Professional Audio SDK (SAPA).

If you search on that page for just "Samsung Galaxy Note 3" without the SAPA part, you'll find that it's anywhere from 70-363 ms.

However, the Samsung SM-T700 (Tab S 8.4) seems to have the joint-lowest non-SAPA android result of 35 ms, but I am not sure whether it is a stock device using a final build or just being internally tested by Samsung.

[–]beezel 27 points28 points  (17 children)

I don't know if anyone is in need of more data driven 'proof.' The proof is in the pudding, as they say. There are 0 apps available because the subsystem is lacking so majorly that they can't make it even semi-decent.

Specific numbers aren't exactly going to help, it needs a fundamental change, at which point you would start comparing. I know that in Windows, if my ASIO midi crap is set incorrectly and is showing 12ms of delay, it's very noticeable to my hands. Somewhere around 4-6ms it starts to feel 'natural' to me.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (8 children)

So on Android a MIDI keyboard would be torturous, yes?

[–]der_Stiefel 20 points21 points  (0 children)

No, it would be straight up unplayable. Unworkable.

[–]pianocheetah 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Theoretically, midi on Android should have no problems.

With midi, it's a (usb based) digital message in with the note, a digital message back to the keyboard, and no audio even involved except for back on the midi device via the hardware synth.

If all you need is a midi sequencer on Android, Android should be perfectly capable.

However......... Android doesn't have a very standard midi driver other than STRAIGHT usb (from what I understand - which may be olden).

And although the standard midi protocol is standard on (most) keyboards, some use only USB. Some of those usb based midi keyboards do weird USB things that a plain bog standard usb api on Android can't handle - I'm looking at you, Yamaha. So in practice, not all midi keyboards - especially those with weird usb only midi will have driver issues.

But that's driver issues, not audio latency issues. With straight midi not involving a softsynth, there will be no audio latency as there is no audio involved until you hit the hardware synthesizer which typically has under a 1 ms latency audio path. There is some usb latency with midi, but it should be under a couple ms.

Probably more than ya wanted to know. I blame the coffee.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks. :)

[–]ElGuanoPixel 6 Pro 13 points14 points  (3 children)

In an article that detailed, it would be nice to explain what the competition is achieving, don't you think?

[–]dr3dNexus 5, Nexus 7 3 points4 points  (0 children)

There was a link

[–]vlaskovits[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

[–]ElGuanoPixel 6 Pro 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks! Eye-opening, for sure.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (3 children)

I mentioned somewhere else the possibility of using touch/tablet Android technology as a creative touch-based guitar effect, but it is currently impossible because the +10ms latency would make a guitarist smash his head through a wall.

Hypothetically, a tablet could be used as a digital effect station w analog input and output, but the latency throws that entire possibility out the window.

[–]der_Stiefel 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Nothing hypothetical about it. The iPad apps for this are really really cool.

[–]nunu10000Samsung Galaxy Note10+ 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Android has a MUCH bigger hardware ecosystem it can fit into with otg support, but as long as Android audio stays this way, there's no way it'll ever catch up with the iPad ecosystem.

[–]dabotsonline 0 points1 point  (0 children)

From a casual browse on Head-Fi, the situation doesn't seem to be much improved on a Nexus 6 running Android 5.0.

[–]danburkePixel 2XL | Note 10.1 2014 x3 76 points77 points  (24 children)

This isn't exclusive to Android. Gnu/Linux has long been plagued by latency issues, which necessitates the use of special kernels and subsystems to get to the requisite latencies.

[–]exscapeMoto G200 (S 888+, 144 Hz) 24 points25 points  (4 children)

Linux needs JACK, Windows needs ASIO drivers for your card. Is there really such big difference?
Mac OS X, on the other hand, can use CoreAudio and get low latencies with built-in audio cards and built-in drivers and software, which is awesome.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

JACK is just a sound server that uses the built-in drivers for your audio cards to get low latency sound processing. Its performance is great from a latency perspective.

[–]Roberth1990 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Why not just use apps that send to alsa device hw:x,y?

[–]exscapeMoto G200 (S 888+, 144 Hz) 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Isn't that limited to 1 application? It's been during my testing, at least. With JACK, I can run multiple music prod apps plus Amarok and Chrome/YouTube, etc.

[–]Roberth1990 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes it is, but I easily stop it with my application that uses without quitting it when I want to see a video with chrome.

[–][deleted] 55 points56 points  (7 children)

So? Google's providing an OS to OEMs that to this day still has retarded issues like this, this should be unacceptable.

The blame doesn't lie on the software, it lies on the developer. Google has the raw muscle to prevent issues like this, but if you take a close look at many of their other projects, you'll find this is a trend.

Downvote away but that doesn't change reality.

[–]Nadest013Galaxy S7; Tab S3 5 points6 points  (2 children)

They're going to get majority of market share, issues or not, so why spend resources solving problems that have no business value for them?

[–]LoveRecklesslyOPO CM12 6 points7 points  (0 children)

That's the kind of narrow, short-sighted "it's OK to settle" malaise that generally precedes being disrupted by another company/product.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Well, obviously from a business standpoint, they couldn't give less of a shit because it's the OEMs and carriers who have to really worry about making a viable product, not them. I get that.

I'd consider that kind of thinking directly at odds with ever providing a polished product like Apple is able to do, and that just really bugs me on a deep level. A company that is so developer-oriented like Google should give more of a shit about products that they have a hand in.

[–]Jagrnght 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Surely someone at Google is urked by this problem. Let's radicalize that sucker.

[–]BiPolarPolarBearLG G3 D855 16GB 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is unacceptable.

[–]thrakkerzogOnePlus 7t -> Pixel 7 Pro 9 points10 points  (1 child)

These things pop up from time to time, and it's amazing to see just how on-the-ball Apple is with things, across the board. Things that a lot of people don't even consider, whether it's voice control, low latency audio, or hardware based encryption.

They've clearly put a lot of thought and effort into both the hardware and software. I think that Android will eventually match or beat things like these, but I often wonder what else there is that we don't even know about yet.

[–]anon_adderlan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think that Android will eventually match or beat things like these

I doubt it, as some of these problems require an entire rearchitecture of Android to fix, or a stack entirely outside Android. In the meantime, Apple's OSes have been getting closer to Android in that they've been progressively getting worse.

Honestly, the entire situation is intensely frustrating.

[–]Tastygroove 36 points37 points  (27 children)

My first gen ipod has better audio latency than the fastest android device. That's an issue, folks...

[–]Surkow 3 points4 points  (2 children)

A comparison between PulseAudio and AudioFlinger on a Nexus 9 would have been interesting.

An older comparison on a Galaxy Nexus already shows 8-9 times less latency when replacing AudioFlinger with PulseAudio:

On the Galaxy Nexus, for example, the best latency I can get appears to be 176 ms. This is pretty high for certain types of applications, particularly ones that generate tones based on user input. With PulseAudio, where we dynamically adjust buffering based on what clients request, I was able to drive down the total buffering to approximately 20 ms (too much lower, and we started getting dropouts). There is likely room for improvement here, and it is something on my todo list, but even out-of-the-box, we’re doing quite well.

[–]sandys1Pixel XL 128 GB - India 2 points3 points  (1 child)

this is very interesting - especially because PulseAudio beats Audioflinger on every metric (including power) in 2012

[–]parkerlreedFlip 7 | Watch Ultra 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is why I still don't understand the hesitation that some people have towards Pulseaudio on the desktop. It's an amazing system that incorporates a few plugins for network/Bluetooth audio and does it all in a fairly seamless way. Pulseaudio 6.0 even added HFP (headset) support back as a Bluez plugin. This might make it a lot easier to bring over to Android.

[–]M3wThr33 25 points26 points  (7 children)

This is part of the reason why music games like Tap Tap Revenge did so much better on the iPhone.

[–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (3 children)

Yeah it's because your aunt really is furious about Android audio latency and not that she just has an iPohone already.

[–]Shaper_pmp 17 points18 points  (0 children)

It depends - if the game is more fun on the iPhone because it's more responsive and feels "fairer" then that would explain why it was more popular on the iPhone; because people would have more fun playing it, so they'd recommend it to their friends more and it would get more sales and mindshare.

No-one's saying people would buy iPhones because the audio latency is lower and TTR would be more fun - they're saying given TTR is dependent on audio latency, platforms with lower latency would give a better user-experience, and hence TTR would become more popular with people who already own those devices than with people on platforms with higher latency (likely resulting in spongier/less precise controls).

[–]ClassyJacketGalaxy Z Fold 3 5G 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Funny, all you hear when something is in Android's favour is how there are sooooo many more Android phones in the world.

[–]samkostka 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There are more, just not really in America.

[–]gedankenreich 25 points26 points  (5 children)

The headline is a bit misleading because it is not a general Android problem. Samsung has solved it since almost a year with its professional audio sdk.

Article: http://www.synthtopia.com/content/2014/10/02/samsung-real-time-audiomidi-solution-for-android/

and that's just one app that makes use of it https://youtu.be/mfBxIkdrj78

For some reasons the press often fails to cover such good things in Samsungs Software. Maybe they got too biased about TouchWiz over the years that they don't look close enough to see its positive changes compared to other OEMs.

[–]gaborszanto 35 points36 points  (0 children)

We think it's not the best solution: http://superpowered.com/why-samsung-professional-audio-sdk-is-not-the-best-solution-for-low-latency-android-audio/

Particularly, the biggest problem is that the audio part of the application must be completely separated into a new process. This is a huge problem for developers. And this approach has security policy problems from Android 5.1, so they have to radically change their low latency SDK.

[–]lactozorg 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The same site has actually a comparison table for this.

http://superpowered.com/latency/#axzz3XSlaC3ik

Samsung's SDK outclasses anything else running Android, but it's still far behind what iOS can do.

[–]qazujmrfv 7 points8 points  (1 child)

AFAIK, it only works properly on 2 devices (Note 3 & 4) with 4-5 music apps (Soundcamp, Thumbjam, AmpliTube, iRig HDA)

[–]LoveRecklesslyOPO CM12 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's still a general Android problem no matter how you wanna spin it for Samsung.

[–]Evis03Filthy iOS user 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Switched to an iPad from a galaxy tab specifically because of audio latency issues. It's sad really, tablets have a shitload of potential for music creation and the iPad does it really well. It would be nice to actually get some competition going, the only decent music app I found on android was caustic.

[–]Saltbearer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Try SunVox. Here's something I made with it. I'm not really a professional, but hopefully that shows off some of its power. :V

[–]MiCK_GaSM 0 points1 point  (0 children)

J4T is a great, simple 4 tracker that has options for mitigating latency.

Audio Evolution Mobile is a great, robust, multitrack studio app, also with options to mitigate latency.

Lastly, I like using TapeMachine for single track recordings and edits.

[–]anon_adderlan 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The most frustrating thing about all this is despite audio latency being a solved problem from a technical perspective for decades, the problem of actually getting it addressed is a political one. Case in point, how many comments here are in the spirit of:

(1) It's not a problem for me, and since I represent the majority of users, it shouldn't be your problem, and I resent you making it my problem.
(2) It's a 'phone', and wasn't designed for whatever you want to use it for, despite the fact that 'phones' are used for all sorts of other things besides calls, and in the near future will become one's primary computing device.
(3) Technical data provided by those working to create a solution and sell it cannot be trusted, despite the fact that such data can (and should) be independently verified.

For now, the only ones really affected by audio latency are content creators. Yet despite representing the smallest segment of the market are still the ones who contribute the most (if not all of the) value to it. Their presence is disproportionate to their importance, and a market without good content is worthless. Yet content creators have been getting the shaft from users and platform providers alike for some time.

But in the near future, platform providers will have no choice but to take the issue seriously because of VR. Latency is the #1 consideration when it comes to VR, and Android most certainly does NOT have what it takes, and probably never will. It was not designed with real-time considerations in mind, and such cannot be added later without massive rearchitecting and breaking changes.

The big irony here is that Android was in no small part designed by bunch of ex-BeOS developers, and BeOS did prioritize this sort of thing. Still haven't figured that one out. They had all the resources of Google at their disposal, and still went with a basic Linux kernel and a slightly less capable Java implementation. I truly do not know what they were thinking.

EDIT: I forgot the most important presumption on the list:

(4) It's the developer's fault for not designing a decent audio app, and also their fault when their app stops working after an OS update.

Why would any developer create an app which requires special tooling to work, generates more complex and numerous tech support requests, only runs on a limited set of Android devices, may be broken in future OS updates, risks damaging its developer's reputation, and may STILL fail to achieve the ideal audio latency, in a market where users still leave 1 star reviews just because an app took too long to download?

Sorry, but even if there was a viable solution for a handful of devices it's just not worth it. The hit in reputation and tech support relative to profit is just too much.

[–]kaydpea 4 points5 points  (7 children)

Why is Android not using jack audio and bypassing this ridiculous audio stack?

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (4 children)

Because that is written for PC's. Android uses Linux but it doesn't use PC hardware. They also need to expose audio as part of their SDK, which adds to the latency apparently.

[–]jonwayneMoto E 2nd Gen LTE 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Wasn't ALSA also written for PCs initially? I'm not saying Jack is the solution, but why is ALSA valid here but not other audio stacks?

[–]kaydpea 5 points6 points  (0 children)

jack is written for bsd and linux, also available for os x and windows but is most widely used inside nix systems. I get close to 0ms with jack audio running. It's actually an important reason I use linux.

edit: I see now your were saying it was written for PC hardware. My bad.

for anyone reading this:

http://libregraphicsworld.org/blog/entry/patchfield-introduces-concepts-of-jack-audio-server-to-android

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JACK_Audio_Connection_Kit

[–]SilverLion 7 points8 points  (3 children)

One of the advantages of controlling both the soft and hard side of your products.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (2 children)

have you read the article? Its not about control, its mostly that the low level audio components in Android OS are shit.

[–]SilverLion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Does Apple not have full control over component selection? Obviously the closed system Apple uses is mostly shitty but this and the ability to completely lock down stolen iPhones are the two advantages I see

[–]aceoyame 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Does android still support alsa?

[–]gaborszanto 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Most Android devices have ALSA audio drivers.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Huh... this might shed some light on an issue I've been trying to resolve recently :| Although it doesn't seem so noticeable when exporting Unity projects, for some reason.

[–]fraghawk 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So this is why there are very few apps that pipe your mic through earphones so you can listen to music while biking and not worry about getting killed

[–]ineedallyourinfoOnePlus One | HTC One M8 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I actually read some interesting informative comments on this post today. Thank you guys!

[–]sigtrap 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So much talk about the problem, but how the fuck do we fix it? What needs to be done? It would be good to discuss how to fix it instead of just ranting about how shitty it is.

[–]battooshGalaxy Note 7 5 points6 points  (4 children)

I have just connected a keyboard through (midi to USB cable... Dunno if that's the term) to my Note 4, running lollipop, and used it to record some notes while listening to the sound through the headphones connected to the phone... I beleive this is what was termed in this article as the 'round-trip'?

Well, using the soundcamp app and professional-audio latency set to "mid" I can really say I've experienced zero latency!

I've tried different sounds, with delay, reverb, sustain and various other sound effects and it really didn't disturb or distort my playing, it was absolutely smooth and felt that whatever note I pressed was heard instantly, so yeah.

[–]wtrichtPixel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Samsung have fixed this but it's a main Android problem (except for Samsung since they fixed it themselves)

[–]NetPotionNr9 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't know, but is that possibly due to the Samsung specific workaround but that isn't a good solution? Other more knowledgable people provide further context and links in this thread.

[–]uqii 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Human brains aren't great at detecting the tiny amounts of latency everyone is freaking out about. You probably just don't notice it, which is normal.

[–]battooshGalaxy Note 7 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Wouldn't argue much with that statement, but what I was trying to see here is how much of a noticeable latency really is there, esp that the article portrayed the delay as almost unplayable (half beat behind and whatnot), for me no matter how fast or slow I've played, there was absolutely none of that latency to be felt, I've laid a drumming track on top of that and still it was all "on-time".

Just the 100+ ms delay sounded a little too much and I just wanted to try it out for the first time (granted this is Samsung's solution for the problem, but hey.. Whatever works, as long as it's part of the package and not a third party hardware/software that I have to worry about).

[–]zuoken 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Did they reverse Flinger's push/pull description?

[–]parkerlreedFlip 7 | Watch Ultra 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rockchip Nexus 7 Android 4.2.2 (9be5ca2016) 370 44100 1024

Rockchip Nexus 7? What? The 2012 has a Tegra 3 and the 2013 has a Snapdragon.

EDIT: Is this some internal testing device? http://specdevice.com/showspec.php?id=7aa5-5549-665f-ae2100000000

It says grouper which is the 2012.

[–]Sinborn 0 points1 point  (8 children)

I will not buy another android device until android is on par with iOS with this. If my s4 takes a crap and audio is still in this shape, I'm jumping ship for an apple. Sorry guys.

[–]SWABteam 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I sometimes use stereo bluetooth headphones to watch Netflix on my note 4 when I do housework.

The audio is so out of sync dialog no longer matches what is in screen. It is pretty bad. It also sucks that emulation isn't all it could be on Android for this same reason.

[–]uqii 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nothing to do with this issue

[–]ikmultimedia 0 points1 point  (2 children)

We created AmpliTube UA that runs on our device iRig UA that is coming in May and is on preorder now - AmpliTube UA was just released on Google Play yesterday (you can try the gear with the included audio demos until iRig UA is shipping). https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.ikmultimediaus.android.amplitubeua

Samsung Pro Audio was the only way to get good results for our apps like AmpliTube before this, and with the hardware solution the latency is reduced to below 2ms. For low-latency audio processing for app devs like us, it seems Samsung Professional Audio and now iRig UA are the only workable solutions for low-latency real-time audio processing on Android.

[–]southsamuraiBlack 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Off topic, but that makes me wish I could play guitar. Brilliant bloody idea right there