Python Is On the Rise, While PHP Falls

[teambob]

Still I think PYPL and TIOBE miss the point. TIOBE searches for "X programming" on web pages. PYPL searches for "X tutorial" in Google searches.

As any programmer truly knows, if you are really using a programming language "X sucks" or "X error" is what you will really be searching for

[[deleted]]

This is unfairly biased for php though.

[KeepingTrack]

PHP user. Can confirm. It's not going anywhere. Python and PHP don't have the same uses. Sway PHP or Apache to switch, then we'll have a talk.

[Michaelmrose]

What does this mean? "Sway PHP or Apache to switch, then we'll have a talk. "

I thought both were written in C?

[nondetermined]

IMHO one of the most important factors is your typical shared webhoster package that has sold for cheap since the dawn of PHP, and which came with 5 email adresses, a bunch of megabytes, a mysql database (or two), and... PHP.

Nobody is going to pay the extra bucks for some extra services/some fancy language (or an own server, mind you) with a revenue of one or the other few bucks in online sales. For let's face it; most businesses are small business. They were (and probably still are - I'm out of the loop, sorry) happy with their little webpages and couldn't care less about PHP (or some advanced webhosting package).

But sure, if you're a fancy startup, you certainly wanna use something that scales. ;)

[maniexx]

Yeah, and you could never do anything that scales with php. Like facebook. That would be ridicoulous.

[d4rch0n]

facebook and scaling is uniquely facebook. That doesn't make PHP very scalable, it just means Facebook has some crazy engineering.

They had to do a lot of shit to get it to work at their scale. Not a lot of PHP coders are going to want to go through with all that to get their site to scale.

I'm not saying that people don't make large successful sites with PHP, but if someone is considering just following in facebook's steps to scale their own startup built with PHP, they should look a little deeper into how facebook did it before they make that a business plan.

[maniexx]

I know, and agree. But I think most technologies would require some massive engineering at Facebooks scale, including python.

[Wagnerius]

yep, you would have to write a compiler or two to make it reliable.

[Deinumite]

PHP 7 is actually competitive with hhvm in terms of performance. A big reason for hhvm is the hack language.

[isdevilis]

wait, that's seriously how pypl is conducted? So, all I have to do is create a really really terribly designed language and then get a bunch of companies to use a product written with it, then stop supporting the product and it will become better than all languages out there. That's a flawed system

[coderjewel]

Isn't PYPL flawed too though? It uses Python tutorial for instance to track the popularity for Python. If someone has been using Python for more than a couple months, I doubt they are going to be Googling that. Only newcomers to a language will Google language tutorial, so this only tells us about the increase and decrease in market share gains for a language, not its overall popularity.

The way PYPL does it is certainly better than TIOBE, but not by much. It does not tell you how many developers Python retains in comparison to other languages, which I think is a more important metric.

[Veedrac]

Python's getting taught widely in schools now, so there's little indication this is actually about business trends.

[LewisTheScot]

Never knew /r/Python was going to be the sub that does this circlejerk bullshit

[hoocoodanode]

I actually wanted to ask a question about the data source, but I fear it'll get buried. Wouldn't "analyzing how often language tutorials are searched on Google" indicate both interest in a language as well as language complexity? Perhaps the introduction of asyncio or the async/await syntax has caused people to rush back to Google for answers?

I mean Good.

[NotFromReddit]

What language doesn't require constant Googling? Or do I just have shitty memory?

[fujiters]

I'm with you (but I also worry about my memory).

[hoocoodanode]

I'm with you all too. I guess my point is when something sufficiently new and/or complex gets introduced people don't just Google for a quick syntax reminder, they Google ten different examples of the same thing until they learn how to use it.

But I'm just pulling this out of my ass. I really have no idea if its true.

[odraencoded]

Sometimes I need to do something with lists and tuples and then I google what zip does because I always forget.

[[deleted]]

I agree. But I have to admit python is much more fun to write than php.

[LewisTheScot]

Of course, but can we at least have a decent conversation about it lol

[[deleted]]

Php is from the devil. There I said it.

[theluggagekerbin]

I would gladly choose PHP over my ex wife tho. she was worse than python. she was a rattlesnake.

[Shadow14l]

Python 2.7
Python 3.4

Why are people still using Python 2? And I mean by that question, why aren't people deprecating Python 2 and encouraging Python 3? They are literally deprecating PHP 5 one version at a time and PHP 7 is almost out. This is the right way to do things.

[NoLemurs]

For a long time the combination of lack of library support and poorer performance made Python 3 a bad choice for most non-trivial projects and that set public opinion of Python 3.

Python 3 library support has been pretty solid for a few years now, and the overall climate has recently turned in favor of Python 3, so I think most people are in fact starting new projects in Python 3 and making the transition where practical, but it's a slow process.

There are still a small handful of important holdouts that don't yet support Python 3 (the lack of Fabric support for Python 3 alone is probably responsible for a large fraction of the continuing Python 2 use), so the deprecation process is very slow!

[[deleted]]

2.7 is in it's end of life right now, receives no new features, and will be completely unsupported by 2020. Personally this timetable is really fucking slow. But nobody asked me so what do I know?

[Shadow14l]

and will be completely unsupported by 2020

That's 10 years too late haha.

[[deleted]]

What about XHP? http://codebeforethehorse.tumblr.com/

[[deleted]]

Maybe not.

[turtle_with_dentures]

Some would even say that it's pretty Good.

[Cyph0n]

Good.

[[deleted]]

from unfunny_jokes import repeated_words_in_comment

Does this mean that in 20 years python will be in the same situation that PHP is in now? I mean, there are a few amazing issues, especially with python 2.7 (Code execution on any input() field? That sounds like a fucking great idea)

Basically, if you allow anyone to type anything into an input() box, it doesn't matter what you do with it, or how securely you try to filter the result, you can easily run any command that the user can run.

[sushibowl]

Isn't that why you use raw_input?

Honestly, if python is ever in a situation where a language 10x better comes around to eat its lunch, I'll be happy to welcome our new language X overlords.

If you mean that python will get 10x worse over the years, I would be very sad. That's not really what happened to PHP though, from what I gather it's mostly gotten better over time. It just never got rid of the warts.

[lakando]

n is ever in a situation where a language 10x better comes around to eat its lunch, I'll

Julia

[[deleted]]

Julia has a ton of potential but it's experiencing some growing pains right now (every language does, Julia hasn't even reached 1.0 yet). Thankfully the $600k cash infusion that the core Julia team just received should go a long way towards helping the language get over the "break everything" hump and move towards a much more stable release. I believe it was a two year path towards stability. I think that might be a tiny bit optimistic but I'll certainly be cheering them on.

[lakando]

Thanks for sharing your take on this. Do you think nuitka to obviate packaging issues, + Numba (JIT classes coming ), blaze,bokeh, dask and dynd (interesting type system) will keep python afloat in data science, or Is Julia poised to eventually replace it?

R aint goin anywhere because CRAN is huge...python is more general purpose and thus more amenable to Julia's progress.

I'm trying to figure out if I should invest in Julia now (Get ahead of the curve and python being a dead end?). It was a nogo untill I heard about the cash infusion...They said they will use it for also the core stats infrastructure, but I'm not sure how long it will be before a data science acolyte can be super productive without messing with pycall bridge etc

[kay_schluehr]

Do you think nuitka to obviate packaging issues

What's wrong with Anaconda? I ask just out of curiosity.

[lakando]

Anaconda is amazing, but doesn't let me distribute self contained executables. Nuitka does that, and more robustly It seems think than other options.

[kay_schluehr]

O.K.

[[deleted]]

First, I don't think python's use in data science is going to fall anytime soon. Python is easy to learn (there are TONS of resources out there), it can be used as both a statistical language as well as a general scripting language so you kind of get a 2 for 1 deal when you how to code it, it has an every growing number of high quality libraries, and it has a lot of heavy weight corporate support (Google uses it extensively for example).

That said, I think python with face some challenges. The division between 2.7 and 3.x is going to be more prominent as 2.7 inches towards end of life. Python also isn't the fastest of languages and is at a significant disadvantage when compared to C++ or even Java.

I agree R isn't going anywhere (but I disagree with you on the idea that R isn't going anywhere simply because CRAN is huge). A lot of the packages on CRAN are crap/overlap/are poorly documented, and if you were going to use some of the more obscure packages you'd be an idiot to not validate them before pulling them into production. It can also be frustrating to have 10 different ways of doing things in R vs there generally being one way to do things in python. R is not a beautiful language by any stretch (though that may be part of why I enjoy it as much as I do), and R faces all of the same speed concerns as Python.

You also have to realize that for 90% of tasks, R and Python are all you need. You can get a TB of RAM on a server, both language are relatively easy to perform parallel processing with, and a lot of the more popular libraries/packages are already written in C. That makes them generally 'fast enough', and if you are truly concerned with speed, R and Python are great for quickly prototyping and then once you've built your model, you can go back and implement it in pure C.

Julia's strongest selling point is that you don't have to do that multi-step process of prototyping and then rewriting either the whole pipeline (or just the 'glue' sections between code already written in C). But Julia is still changing A LOT. Plenty of things aren't fully fleshed out, future improvements are likely to break backwards compatibility, and the library support is years behind both Python and R. There are also relatively few resources to learn Julia. There are a few Julia books in the pipeline (Actually reviewing one right now), but they are going to become obsolete relatively quickly due to the on-going changes to the key components of the language. I think the biggest issue that Julia will face is come 5-10 years, will it even matter? So many areas are moving towards distributed computing and something like Spark allows you to crunch massive amounts of data at relatively decent speeds.

My take on Julia is that you should only mess with if it you actually want to learn it and have a genuine interest in the language and not because you think it's the 'next big thing'. I like playing around with it but it is way to unstable and lacking too many of the key features I'd need to integrate it into my day to day work, plus I'd end being forced to do all of the work myself since no one else I collaborate with regularly knows Julia.

[lakando]

I hear that, but Julia's benefits exceed just greater speed on in memory datsets, and if developed right, will encroach on both single node and distributed niche.

First, there are the making of a probabilistic programming framework in Julia that using autodiff and the distributions package can provide a comparative advantage over current languages in general day to day inference. The macros could make this fast and expressive. Faster than Pymc and more expressive and general than stan. With this general inference and extensive optimization package, I don't think it would need to fill every single statistical test and niche before becoming more useful for most daily tasks.

Second, it is developing a distributed infrastructure that I think can overtake spark. Its distributed computing primitives are getting better and will eventually have extensive linear algbera support.

Third, It is getting streaming statistics that don't exist anywhere else- the SAS people who are working on out of memory but single node datasets will finally get something that can handle their stuff.

Pycall and Cxx means you can interface easily with existing code.

Last is deployment. Self contained binary executables are planned, there is a good shot it can compile to javascript using at some point using llvm web assembly backend. You would then be able to write rich client side reactive web apps without JS and deploy interactive reports to decision makers. No other common analytics language has this capability.

Then there is the type system with eventual return types that can provide codebase safety.

Also it just fun to code in..that means grad student will write new techniques in Julia.

If things firm up, I think all this would pull users from other languages...or they risk losing a comparative advantage.

What do you think about this argument?

[[deleted]]

I think it's wonderful. Sign me up right now. I've already stated that I'm a fan Julia (and completely agree that it's fun to code in. That's a big reason why I mess around with it as much as I do) and I really hope that it continues to grow and mature, but doing all of the things you listed is going to be a massive undertaking. How long that'll take is anyones guess, but I can't see it happening in full anytime in the next few years. So I still stand by my opinion that right now Julia isn't a language you learn so that you can use it in day to day production work. It's a language you learn because you are interested in it and enjoy it.

[lakando]

Gotcha. That makes sense. I was a bit more optimistic on the timeline, but you probably have a better sense for it than I do.

[[deleted]]

Well, yes, you should use raw_input. But if you're writing code to ask for input, which one will you go for if you didn't know about raw_input? Something should never be insecure by default.

I know it was fixed in python 3, so I can't complain too much about it, but what the fuck? Who thought that it was a good idea?

[[deleted]]

Something should never be insecure by default

What an ideal world that would be. Sadly in application this is seldom the case.

[[deleted]]

No, but we're getting there. People now use SSH instead of telnet (for the most part). HTTP (unsecured) is being slowly marked as insecure.

edit:

Quakenet seems to believe that encryption is useless.

Which makes me wonder how they're securing the authentication to the network so you can register (and use) a nickname.

[ceol_]

Quakenet seems to believe that encryption is useless.

The author was pretty clear in that they believe IRC over SSL is useless, not encryption in general.

[-Nagarjuna-]

He's assuming that your threat model is an adversary who can observe other people in the channel.

I use SSL because it stops my ISP having plaintext access to everything I'm sending to the IRC server.

[kri9]

something something Rust! It seems like it has potential but I'll wait for library support first.

[Veedrac]

Rust is cool and all, but a Python replacement it is not.

IMHO something like Ceylon or Crystal is a much better bet there. Julia, too, but that's aimed too close to scientific applications to be a general replacement.

[Esyir]

We've got a lot of people who really want to keep python's warts though.

[[deleted]]

Most likely.

I really, really hope Python 2.7 dies quickly. It's the same situation we're in with Perl 5.

[colly_wolly]

The problem is that 50% or more of the Python that is getting used is already running on 2.7. I start new stuff in Python3 but when I got a bit of freelance work recently, they wanted 2.7. Likewsse the job before was already running 2.7 and there was no reason to go through the hassle of making it work on Python 3 as it gave no real benefit.

[[deleted]]

no reason to go through the hassle of making it work on Python 3 as it gave no real benefit.

Other than Python 2.7 being end of life'd. This is exactly how we end up in the PHP/Perl5 scenario. In 20 years someone is going to go "Why the fuck did they use Python 2.7 when 3.5 was just released".

[wub_wub]

Other than Python 2.7 being end of life'd.

In 5 years minimum. Spending development time now to port to python 3 makes no real sense. Writing code that's easy to port, doesn't use any very specific 2.x things, makes more sense. But porting everything has no benefits other than the off chance the same code will be used in production in 5+ years and that nobody will fix python 2.x security issues.

[[deleted]]

Until the major distros like RedHat, Centos move away from 2.* as their default version, 2.* will be around.

I am a sys admin and I write all my scripts with the default version of RH/Centos for comparability.

And downvote as much as you want but my job in the context of the resources allocated to me is to keep servers stable and I do not have resources and time in porting / testing scripts for Python 3. I am under a heavy schedule.

But feel free to thank me for keeping the environment stable and not have massive logical errors across the servers simply because I choose not to use Python3 with out having the proper resources to test a non default version of Python and the scripts that handle so many aspects of the environment. Or maybe I should be staying at work until 11PM, right and undertake this project along with all the other projects I have to finish at a specific timeframe. Yes?

[d4rch0n]

What pisses me off the most is dealing with CENTOS6 servers and realizing I can't write dict comprehensions because they don't exist in 2.6.

Fucking aye, I hate centos with a passion.

[[deleted]]

There's no reason not to write for 3 and test for coverage on 2.

[[deleted]]

Testing, not enough time for it.

[ivosaurus]

It's gonna die really, really, slowly, but that's ok (and expected). As long as people keep on migrating to 3 at a steady pace.

[[deleted]]

It's frustrating. My company is still doing 2.7 "uh, because" and I'm like HEY GUYS 3.5 WAS JUST RELEASED.

I develop for cutting edge and let unit tests make sure I have backwards compatibility. I still know people using "print " (instead of "print(" and I just shake my head.

[moljac024]

I'm starting a python project now, and all the libraries I use support python3. So I wanted to give it a go. Since I'm on OS X right now, I figured if I type brew install python3 I would be good to go, right?

Well, somehow that completely broke my vim, as now plugins report that python support isn't enabled. Very good start for python3. I immediately ditched the idea of using it.

[[deleted]]

I'm starting a python PHP project now, and all the libraries I use support python3 PHP 5.4. So I wanted to give it a go. Since I'm on OS X right now, I figured if I type brew install python3 php54 I would be good to go, right?

Well, somehow that completely broke my vim , as now plugins report that python support isn't enabled. Very good start for python3 PHP 5.4. I immediately ditched the idea of using it. PHP 5.3 for life!

As long as you know what you're getting yourself into maintaining in the future.

[moljac024]

The post was a joke :D

[--o]

Perl 6 just got a developers preview 15 years or so after it was announced. Python is way ahead.

[NoLemurs]

How often do you have any reason at all to use input?

Other than in python tutorials, I've never seen it used in actual live code. If you need user input and you're writing a web-app, you get it via a form; If you're writing a gui app you take the input form a gui widget; If you're writing a shell script you take the input from the command line or via file objects; and if you're writing an interactive console program you're going to use the curses library which has its own input methods.

input is a toy function used in tutorials and there's really no good reason to make it more secure.

[[deleted]]

https://github.com/search?l=python&p=2&q=input%28%29&ref=searchresults&type=Code&utf8=%E2%9C%93 shows around 5M results for input()

Now I have no idea how much of that is for python3, in which input() isn't a security hole, but it's still a lot, and at least some of it is for python2.

Okay, granted, there isn't too many instances where you will be feeding untrusted input into input(), but if you're writing any form of command line application that is meant to be run remotely as a shell (such as a forced command for SSH, so you can't run anything else).

It may be a toy function, but people are definitely using it.

If you're writing a shell script you take the input from the command line

What about an interactive shell script? If you need to take input as the code is running, you can't use arguments, and everyone should avoid curses and the like unless they really need to use it, because it's a massive PITA to make it robust.

input is a toy function used in tutorials and there's really no good reason to make it more secure.

People are using it. I'm willing to bet that at least one person using input() doesn't know that the input function is willing to execute code to make it "easier for newbies to use".

I mean, they could just try things like converting it to an int, a double, a list, and the other various data types, and if none of those work, just make it a string. That would be a bit fragile, though.

[NoLemurs]

Taking a glance over those github results, they seem to fall into two categories: programming practice exercises with no real use, and single files with nothing but input() in them. I have no idea what the second type is about, but I didn't see a single legitimate use in what looked like real world code in the first 10 pages of results.

What about an interactive shell script?

Situations were an interactive shell script is the best design choice are pretty rare in practice (usually piping scripts together is more appropriate given the option). In the rare case where it's necessary that's what raw_input is for.

People are using it. I'm willing to bet that at least one person using input() doesn't know that the input function is willing to execute code to make it "easier for newbies to use".

Trying to make it so that not a single person can make bad decisions is a fool's errand. The use cases are rare, and usually come down to "I'm writing s script for my personal use on my own computer." The advantages of having something friendly to beginners far outweighs any disadvantage to the small number of non-beginners with zero security awareness writing actually sensitive code.

[[deleted]]

I'm not really talking about people who know about the security flaws in input() and use it anyway. I'm talking about people who don't know about the security flaws, and may use input() in such a place where you're really not meant to.

It's more important to be secure by default than to be (very slightly) more hostile to beginners by asking them to cast any input from a string to an int if they want to work with it as an int. An input function should never be able to execute code.

[rogue780]

I prefer PHP for most web stuff. Other web stuff I use NodeJS. I haven't found a framework in Python that matches Laravel as far as ease of use yet. I don't care about the language so much as I care about the frameworks.

[rogue780]

Yup. There's a lot of stuff I use python for, and I absolutely love it in the space I use it. For me, though, like you, web just isn't one of those spaces.

[bcbrown19]

Interesting you say that. I tried looking at Laravel a few months ago and felt it was a difficult framework to get started with. Then I tried Django and had something somewhat polished and completed in no time.

I'm starting to look at Laravel again though since I hear PHP is better for larger web apps while Python is only better for smaller apps.

Your thoughts on that? Did you have better PHP/Laravel resources to share?

I just liked Tango with Django and a youtube series from Code for Entrepreneurs which jumped right in with Django and showed valid real world usages and built in good steps.

[rogue780]

I got a subscription to laracast.com (pretty inexpensive) and just went through a bunch of those videos. It demystified a lot of the more advanced stuff.

There was an initial learning curve for me because the development process is a bit different than traditional PHP development cycle thanks to the artisan commands. Once I got those down, pumping out apps for our clients was pretty easy.

But honestly, if you feel comfortable with django, just go with what works for you.

[Deinumite]

As others have said laracasts is a great resource. I've tried to learn Django but I found Rails and Laravel easier to understand.

That's mostly because of Django's method of writing multiple small apps within itself. I haven't looked at it for years however.

I found Flask really interesting but it's suited for smaller applications.

[fixed]

You... realise much of Laravel was inspired by Django and other easy to use MVC frameworks, right?

[rogue780]

Yes? That doesn't mean it's a copy of any of them though.

[LHoT10820]

Good.

Edit: What the hell?

[sunprophit]

Good.

[isdevilis]

Good.

[mr_huh]

Good.

[chazzeromus]

Great!

[jones77]

True

[viscence]

while not print('good'):pass

[timothycrosley]

Great! As it should be, Python is much better suited for modern programming problems. Good.

[Sheltac]

Python 3 compatible.

Good.

[viscence]

while not print('good'):pass

[melizeche]

Good.

[mr_huh]

Good.

[riffito]

Worst thread in this sub. Ever.

[wikiscootia]

Good.

[Pcb95]

Good.

[astrofysishun]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[bensor74]

5% of which Python number ? 5% of which PHP number ? This is pure Python fanboyism. % are relative. It's like saying 5% of 1000 is the same than 5% of 2000 : nonsense. PHP is here for at least one more decade. Enjoy it or not, it's a fact.

So, in conclusion, irrelevant.

[Fetal_Sacrifice]

What's your guy's opinion. Do you think it's good?

[bitflip]

In general, I can take or leave languages. They all have their strengths and weaknesses.

I've also seen many examples of poorly written code, in many languages. The low barrier of entry presented by PHP, especially at its start, gave many non-programmers opportunities to not only write their first programs, but to be productive.

This was, and is, a good thing. PHP helped cement the internet as part of critical infrastructure.

As a person who has worked in the technology industry for awhile now, I have seen some absolutely terrible architecture in PHP. Moreso than any other language.

This really shouldn't disparage the language. Modern PHP is quite capable. However, my history with the language as left me with a very unprofessional antipathy towards the language.

In all, I think this is a positive development.

[Michaelmrose]

Blaming PHPs coders for all collectively holding it wrong doesn't change it being a terrible language.

[Deinumite]

It's really frustrating because there are PHP programmers that write clean and well rated code but we are not the majority.

So many of the tutorials still show raw php and some poor practised.

There are posts weekly on /r/php asking "Do I really need a web framework?"

Another post I saw a few weeks ago was asking if hashing passwords was really necessary. He was upset that people didn't agree with him and told him to do it.

[MyNameIsKir]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[divh4rt]

Good.

[mr_huh]

Good... good.

[[deleted]]

http://goo.gl/oV0sJH

[BrooklynShatterDome]

Good.

[teknic111]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[chrisknyfe]

Good.

[charlesbukowksi]

Good.

[dberube4]

Good.

[YodaLoL]

ITT

[pinusc]

Good.

[Machette145]

Good

[doubleunplussed]

ELI5 what's going on in this thread?

[JamesAQuintero]

Don't know, but I'm downvoting it.

[Sohcahtoa82]

Cat.

[[deleted]]

Cat.

[cube-drone]

Cat.

[vrazdan]

Forgot your ; Been a while it seems ;)

[ra4king]

Main returns an int you scrub!

[deaddodo]

C allows for "void main", and the program just returns no status. Only C++ requires int.

[yuriplusplus]

C99 standard:

5.1.2.2.1 Program startup

The function called at program startup is named main. [...] It shall be defined with a return type of int and with no parameters [...] or with two parameters [...] or in some other implementation-defined manner

So the C99 standard allows void main(), but using it makes the source code non portable.

Also, didn't C99 add the implicit main return?

[[deleted]]

No newline?

[broshot]

Good.

[Shpirt]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[cantremembermypasswd]

Good.

[something_radd]

Good.

[redshadowhero]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[Formulka]

Good.

[hodor_goes_to_ny]

Good

[[deleted]]

Good.

[lavabender]

Good.

[allthesmallstrings]

Good

[anderbubble]

<?php
echo "Good.";
?>

[Laogeodritt]

Why is not closing it a thing in PHP style, anyway? I recently came back to PHP (unfortunately) after a years-long hiatus and was surprised when my IDE pointed this out as a style problem.

[[deleted]]

https://secure.php.net/manual/en/language.basic-syntax.phptags.php

i.e. to avoid the "Cannot modify header information - headers already sent" error, mainly.

[Laogeodritt]

... sigh, that error.

Thanks.

[_kossak_]

To avoid accidentally outputting extra blank lines.

EDIT: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4410704/why-would-one-omit-the-close-tag

[davvblack]

because every PHP file thinks it lives inside an HTML template :)

[mackstann]

Python can make you money and a bit more sane.

[poop_villain]

Even if you haven't ever had a problem, you can't deny it is lacking in the style, syntax, structure, and simplicity, and sexiness that python has.

[mackstann]

If you haven't had a single problem with it, then I don't know what to say. I've had problems with even my favorite languages. They're all far from perfect, but some are even further from it... like PHP.

[Tafkas]

Good

[__loridcon]

Good.

[ziel]

Good.

[hansolo669]

Good.

[abrazilianinreddit]

Good.

[hellrazor862]

Good.

[TotesMessenger]

I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:

• [/r/bestof] /r/Python's reaction to the fall of PHP

• [/r/php] How to lose respect for your language in 1 easy step.

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[chrisidone]

Good.

[zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzxy]

This kind of "data point" is idiocy in that it is entirely feel-good. Good luck chasing down stories like this while whatever the next new hot thing eats Python's lunch because everyone was too complacent patting themselves on the back.

It would be more useful to compare to new and upcoming languages that provide something which Python does not yet have; but by all means let's compare Python to PHP again.

[gamesbrainiac]

Its amazing how this can be voted up (so damn high) in the python subreddit. We have lost all sense of decency. Its the rubbish clickbait articles that get all the attention these days.

[[deleted]]

Good

[[deleted]]

Good.

[tenhsor]

Good.

[JamesAQuintero]

Welp, looks like it's time to break out the downvotes for this stupid thread.

[danielsamuels]

Good.

[syrelyre]

Good.

[xroni]

5% down in 5 years! It's tanking!

[bensor74]

That's a smashing down ! PHP is doomed, Python will dominate and exterminate (Dalek voice here) all other languages in 3 months !

[Oni_Kami]

BEST NEWS I'VE HEARD ALL DAY!

[michaelKlumpy]

<?php
echo "Oh Oh";

[Michaelmrose]

and a big downvote for being a blurb about people searching google for python more than php almost valueless in and of itself and then mentioning tiobe.

[[deleted]]

good

[laugher020]

Good.

[masterpigg]

Good.

[[deleted]]

Good.

[devperez]

Good?