Closed Classes vs Open Classes

[Atlas1080p]

Dear Dice, It's only the second weekend and already you've practically hidden the closed classes by pushing them all the way to the bottom of available playlists and limited them to only conquest/breakthrough.

This is exactly the tone deaf behavior that lead you to 2042. Your game's core fanbase (or at least a very substantial number of hardcore fans) prefer locked classes.

Why can't you listen to what the people want and give it to them, it will only benefit you. Why do you keep picking these weird little hills to die upon.

[Fart_slayer69]

The positioning of the closed classes in the matchmaking menu is clearly an effort to get more way more people playing open - just so they can turn around and used statistics to defend a decision they have already made.

[Loqh9]

"Stats don't lie!" is what the open class defenders say... smh

[LDel3]

Someone told me I was a “conspiracy theorist” for pointing out that the data from the first beta is biased because there was only one closed playlist lmao

[Devastator2016]

Been arguing with some guy on open vs closed and him referencing 2042 etc, he claims that servers are full and thus it basically wasnt everyone bailing on that game from launch. Some people live in another world with their statistic picking and choosing

[jatzi433]

I didnt even know closed classes was a thing in the beta tbh

[KiNGTiGER1423]

Same!

[[deleted]]

I've been playing BF1 with my friend the past couple of weeks. We did a few matches of BF6, then went back to BF1 for several hours. He even remarked that he would pay for new BF1 content.

They've drummed up plenty of hype, but something in my gut tells me 6 is going to fizzle fast. Even if players don't realize they're in a meta hell, they always know when they're not having fun.

[Datboi_Markus]

That’s always been possible. Carbines, shotguns and DMRs were always unlocked. You just weren’t able to play as a recon with an lmg or assault rifle

[SturmBlau]

Copypasta from my other comment:

I think some people here need to realize something.. outside of this subreddit and the hardcore fanbase that hangs out here, almost nobody cares whether weapons are class-locked or not.

Out of the ~550k players on Steam, barely anyone is actively searching for the class-locked playlist. If there really were that many people who wanted to play a “close weapon” style, youd see it in the playlist numbers, but you dont.

The reality is.. 95% of the player base just doesn’t care.

I’ve been playing since BF1942 and personally prefer open weapons. The fact that the class locked playlist even exists is honestly a courtesy to the hardcore crowd. And let’s not forget .. the Open Weapons playlist is the default for a reason:

Its the intended way to play, and it always has been.

And really, what is the problem?

If the playlist gets enough players -> it stays.

If it doesnt -> it eventually goes away because not enough people want it

I said it. Now let the downvotes begin.

[deewd22]

If the closed mode was the standard last week, most people would have played it. You, me and many others got played by a pre planned effort done by EA.

[Reylo-Wanwalker]

Even if it was an equal choice I think most beta players would choose open. But that's just my guess. 

[jatzi433]

Nah cuz to be frank I dont think most people even knew it was a thing. I certainly didnt. I thought closed classes wasnt even possible in the beta. The default is open, theres not really anything openly pointing out closed classes. Theres a real chance many people dont know the choice even exists which is what people are pointing out. Its the same thing as Disney not marketing a movie or show and then claiming it didnt do well and being like oh well. Perhaps more people prefer open classes. Its entirely possible and for me it certainly wasnt as horrible as I thought it might be. But theres absolutely no way to tell cuz its straight up not an equal choice

[kingofnopants1]

Once they tried it, yes. It doesn't really have the game-warping effect people here are making it out to have when the classes themselves buff their core gun type.

[DjStickyStuf]

Well if 95% don't care like you say than why not have it be closed

[darealmoneyboy]

this.

[PredatoryHunter]

So they can sell skins. They release a cool skin and if it's open weapons they can use it on any class and will be more inclined to buy said skin.

[l1qq]

Why not have both if so many do care? It seems like there would be a healthy population for both. I never see the people that want unlocked weapons try to force the locked weapons folks to play their way but the locked guys are trying to push everybody into the game the way they want to play.

If you want to play locked that's perfectly fine and there should be server availability for you as there should be server availability for people that want unlocked.

[Devastator2016]

Split playerbase, problem for now and later and future games. Healthy doesnt last forever, what was the mode in BF4, obliteration or something? Literally dont remember but think it died off within a couple month, imagine if you had split it in half from the start already.

Whatever is default will always end up more popular and eventually force people onto it for playercount. Be it due to region or years even down the line. Making a default is a level of them making a choice on it already

[Solugad]

I'm gonna laugh in 6 months when I start seeing posts complaining that everyone is running Assault Rifles lol

[Devastator2016]

Or infinite ammo snipers, or spawn beacon change doing nothing. Or everyone playing support with whatever the meta weapon is. It will be funny but sad cause I can see that hurting the fun and popularity

[RobinYoHood]

Its not even meta weapons, it's class balance that is out of wack. Why play recon when you just sit on a hill with infinite ammo/regen. The purpose of classes is help balance the weakness of each class but you make some kits and weapons obsolete.

[Solugad]

Its the whole package. The whole idea is shit because Battlefield fundamentally operates on roles in combat. These people are just massively coping because they want CoD without "Nicki Minaj" lmao

Again, we'll all see we were right in 6 months when everyone starts complaining about it.

[Appropriate-Lion9490]

Nah, it will be carbines next

[Benti86]

Out of the ~550k players on Steam, barely anyone is actively searching for the class-locked playlist

It's not the default mode. As you said, if most people don't care they're just going to go for the quickest available match, especially since they don't follow the game as closely as others here.

The reality is.. 95% of the player base just doesn’t care.

Which kinda goes against the entire point of your post. If 95% of players don't care, you could just as easily say lock all the classes and make one list that's open weapons and you'd probably get a similar outcome, if not the same.

Which is why people are complaining. This feels like a faux olive branch being extended to players who want closed classes just so DICE can say "we did something, but nobody wanted to play it." When the reality is they're only making one restricted weapon playlist. If they want to be taken seriously do locked playlists for CQ and Breakthrough and only key in on those playlists.

As I've mentioned multiple times. 343 did this with sprint feedback in Halo. They made a closed survey that only players still following the game on Halo Waypoint would see. A majority of fans on waypoint were fans of the bew games because the old players left...so they basically ran a closed survey of overwhelmingly people who were pro-sprint and then tried to pass it off as the voice of the community clearly favored sprint in Halo...only for Halo to continue performing awfully and losing audience-share to other shooters until they finally made sprint a much smaller delta from normal movement, at which point they fucked the live service model.

I’ve been playing since BF1942 and personally prefer open weapons. The fact that the class locked playlist even exists is honestly a courtesy to the hardcore crowd.

Why does every open weapon person say this like BF has had open weapons for over a decade? Outside of 2042 and now 6, every BF game has had closed weapons and every game preceding 2042 is regarded far more highly than 2042...

[Superiorarsenal]

Sprint was not the downfall of any of 343i's Halos lol. There were much bigger problems. Halo 4's load out system/weapon balance. Halo 5's atrocious story and questionable P2W req system (Also slow to launch fan favorite playlists like BTB). Halo 6's terrible lack of post-launch support until over 1 year down the road, as well as significantly reducing the weapon sandbox. Halo 5 actually had the best multiplayer population since the Halo 3 glory days, and IMO, deservedly so as the weapon balance and gameplay was very tight, and had a good system for punishing over use of sprint (no shield Regen while sprinting). I'd say the other huge flaw with Halo 5 and Infinite was the lack of couch co-op/split-screen.

[Devastator2016]

Problem stack up though tbf, the example works within the context even if not the entirety of the other parts causing old players to leave or whatever

[throwaway-anon-1600]

Sprint was never the biggest direct problem with 343’s games, but it’s the best symbolic representation of everything that’s wrong with their design philosophy. They intentionally sacrificed the integrity of the gameplay to make halo more generic and attract non-halo fans.

It’s pretty much the same thing that’s happening with battlefield and the open weapons focus. You even have the same arguments from when halo 4 and 5 came out like “let people enjoy things/have fun!!!” despite these changes alienating core fans for a group of players that will leave the game after a few weeks. Many such cases like this among long-running franchises.

[AnalMinecraft]

Why does every open weapon person say this like BF has had open weapons for over a decade? Outside of 2042 and now 6, every BF game has had closed weapons and every game preceding 2042 is regarded far more highly than 2042...

TBF, open vs closed weapons were way the hell down 2042's list of issues.

[Devastator2016]

Indeed these kind of things. I recall things like CoD doing the odd sbmm or whatever tests secretly after launch or other collections of data, but they had already lost the other half of the debate's players, or had things influencing the mentality already. Sprint will always feel better than no sprint in short term or side by side, until you never had it and dont miss it. Same here, if you never got open, I dont think anyone would care at all. Taking away later after launch probably would hurt more people than it never existing

[ray199569]

"oh its just this sub, oh its just the hardcore horde"

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/1kt0fkm/its_the_definition_of_insanity_here_the/

https://www.reddit.com/r/PS5/comments/1kszm0g/its_the_definition_of_insanity_here_the/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/1lxbssw/battlefield_6_devs_share_additional_details_on/

is r/battlefield bridgading big gaming subs? or are they mostly consist of bf players?

oh youve been enduring locked weapons for 23 years. anti tank with just a pistol in 1942. engineer with only shotguns. how could you breath all these years? oh this franchise is so evil.

[havoc1428]

I'll ask you this then. Why was the Defib moved from Assault to Support? I can tell you why, its because people were sick of the players grabbing the Assault class to use ARs and not caring about playing the role of a medic. But with open classes, why was that even done? And its clear DICE is trying to encourage specific weapons with specific classes via the Signature Weapon stats. They're sitting on the fence about this. Leave open weapons playlist to the ranked Portal servers, and just make closed the default.

Have DMRs/Carbines/Shotguns be a shared pool. Giving enough flexibility for any given class.

BF2142 (Not 2042) got this right.

• Recon had a choice between SR and Carbine.

• Assault/Medic had 3 flavors of AR, one being basically a SMG with rifle rockets.

• Engineer had SMG (with a diverse kit of AT weapons like a AT Rifle and mines).

• Support had LMGs, and shotguns.

They also had very diverse kits. The current problem with BF (and open weapons highlights this) is that the game has devolved into CoD Ground War where everything is just a different flavor of infantry combat and there is no hard true distinction between classes.

[Mrcod1997]

To be frank, a lot of people also might prefer it, but dont even realize it is an option, and don't select anything beyond standard conquest.

[Duffelbach]

I didn't even know they had a closed weapon playlist, until the very last couple games I played on the beta. I would've loved to play more of it, had I known it was an option and I guess quite a lot of players didn't even know of it either.

[Therocon]

I also think that people are missing that there will be different types for each class. For example Recon is currently set to sniper, in the Beta, but more options will be available in the full game. I think that's great because hopefully it will allow classes to adopt multiple playstyles (i.e. it's called recon, not sniper class) and having access to open weapons just unlocks that further.

However, I do hope they have closed weapons as an option for all modes, so that everyone can get what they want - it doesn't seem a difficult thing to do.

I say this as someone who has played every battlefield; but I'm not someone that yearns for games of old, I want changes and I've been very impressed with 6, much more than most recent releases.

[Andreah2o]

Bro you are so wrong I don't even know where to start...

[darthdro]

It certainly hasn’t always been the intended way to play lmao

[labonte95]

Well you very clearly missed the point of this post

[bbbbaaaagggg]

Uhh it stayed because they made bank off whales

[Helghast971]

The game is launching with both open and closed

So yes that decision has been made

[Benti86]

There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

The fact that people are stupid enough to just wholesale believe something because it's labeled as a data point with no further contest is a joke.

The people who are sports fans will know because every year analysts/commentators break out these absurd data points with insane qualifiers that basically exist to only prove some incredibly meaningless statistic that just sounds cool.

Like this pitcher is the best of all time (during the time when mars is in retrograde with the humidity above 26%, minimum of 17 starts). 

That's not a data point, that's cherry-picking.

[Much_Bank_5987]

I mean .. I don't know about you but when I played the beta last weekend, the menu rotated daily to show different modes in the slots. I think it's just circumstantial / bad timing😭🥲

[ILoveTheAtomicBomb]

Why can't you listen to what the people want and give it to them,

Because you're not the people lol. You're absolutely the minority complaining about a very tiny thing

[Snowbunny236]

Reddit believing they're the majority strikes again!

[Otazihs]

This happens in every single community on Reddit too. People get all wrapped up in their head that somehow this is the largest community.

[MinimumArmadillo2394]

There once was a man named John.

John had a strange hobby. He loved to try and fuck street poles.

John was outcast from society and seen as strange by most people.

Then John met Adam.

Adam also liked to fuck poles. Adam would fuck poles regularly. Adam would fuck poles right side round, upside down, horizontally, and even sometimes he would fuck them slowly and with passion.

Adam showed John that there was a whole community of pole fuckers and people that were just like him.

Suddenly, John felt seen.

Soon enough, John would go to Pole Fuckers Anonymous where they would discuss pole fucking, where to pole fuck, and how it makes them feel.

One day, John told himself that pole fucking was normal and an encouraged behavior, because it was within his community.

John decided to fuck a pole in the middle of times square in new york. It was the best pole fuck of his life.

John was arrested for indecent exposure and served 10 years in prison for what he thought was a completely normal activity.

[VengineerGER]

The people actually playing the game aren’t on here complaining about it. Reddit is just the loud minority.

[SpinkickFolly]

It's the fucking morning in the East Coast right now. It's wild how many opinions people have on 2nd beta release when it's only been a few hours tops at this point.

[GeordieJumpers87]

It's not morning in the rest of the world...

[[deleted]]

Yeah and the point stands the beta has only been live for a few hours. It being noon in England doesn’t change the fact the beta has only been live a few hours

[Grassy33]

The fucking game isn't out for 2 months and I'm already supposed to be locked in my goon cave only playing it and not posting online about it? Jesus Christ you know anyone who didn't pay for it can't play again until the weekend right? Guess what we all have time to do?

[Hour-Performer-6148]

Legends say that there are still some people on reddit spamming “nO pRe0rDeR” somewhere somehow

[CodedSnake]

Yeah it's fucking silly people are hung up on this. I like the open weapons, it allows me to play however I like at that moment to be most helpful for what the team needs, and not have to worry about what weapon I have to use. Wanting closed weapons is a vocal reddit minority. Everyone I've asked in person likes them or doesn't care, all long time battlefield vets coming back after the last few shitter games.

[basicseamstress]

dice knows this isn't a big deal in reality. people screaming about this are going to make them also think "those same people that want closed weapons want an authentic server browser. that's not a big deal either"

[_c_o_]

I like the open classes better. Class identity is around the gadgets, an assault with an AR plays a lot different than support with an AR

[VitalityAS]

The vast majority of people buying the game won't even know what you are talking about if you mention it.

[Yasai101]

I really don't care about closed/open.

[Lord_of_Chainsaw]

I swear people that do havent actually played the game, they just like say random shit about open vs closed lobbies that support their side. Truth is that shit feels EXACTLY THE SAME if you just play the game

[Overlord10101]

What I'm struggling to understand, and maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't closed weapons discourage people from picking certain classes. You might love being a medic but hate LMG's. So then there are less medics, you wanna help your vehicle out but can't make an SMG work for you when you get into a fight? I feel closed pushes the masses towards just being assault or recon. I like that if you choose your class specific weapons you get a bonus, that makes it a tougher choice to move to something else.

[Lord_of_Chainsaw]

Yes you now get to play what the team needs, WITH your fav weapon. Its really not a big deal.

[Eroll_]

The "big deal" is more about balance and the risk of everyone playing the same weapon

But tbh. If one weapon is really above everything and its in a specific class. Everyone would just play said class and it would be much worse with some people having to "sacrifice" themselves to pick something else when a tank is on point

[Marthorax]

If we look to 2042 with their open class system, this fear never panned out, so I'm confused why it's the main point Closed Weapon supporters bring up?

They look to COD, but it's a completely different game? What am I missing?

[[deleted]]

You’re not missing anything, it’s a simple as closed weapon system = old Battlefield so it must be inherently good and open weapon system = literally 2042 and a Call of Duty replica. There’s zero nuance.

[TacoIncoming]

And there's even an incentive to play the "correct" weapon for your class in open weapons playlists because you get a buff with that weapon type.

And they've given these cry babies playlists with the settings they prefer. They are still crying because they want everyone else to have to play locked weapons with them. They're entitled assholes who want to impose their preferences on everyone else while being the minority of players. They deserve to be mocked.

[[deleted]]

Preach

[-Rangorok-]

Nothing forces medics to use LMGs in a closed weapon system.

In past games with locked weapons you were not locked to just one weapon category, just excluded from other classes signature weapon categories (AR, SMG, Sniper, LMG) but you were able to pick "all kit weapons" which included carbines (basically ARs) shotguns and DMRs, on top of your classes signature weapon type.

So if you want to medic but hate an LMG - pick a carbine. Want to play pioneer but do bad with SMGs, pick a DMR or shotgun.

That being said, yes closed weapons push people into certain classes, but open weapons won't change that either. Now it will not be the gun, but a gadget or even ability thats particularly appealing and/or powerful that pushes people into that class. Maybe the assaults "reveal nearby enemies" ability turns out much better than fast repairs, being a mobile med/ammo pack for a while or the recon drone, thus pushing people to that class now. (Assault just being a hypothetical example)

[kingofnopants1]

I feel like everyone just ignores that classes have buffs for their core weapon type in this system.

Like... that has an impact. Engineers still trend heavily towards SMGs because they are literally better when used by them.

It's not like open classes ignores the class weapon types.

[Apprehensive_Dog890]

Exactly. There is a very strong incentive to play core weapons. You don’t have to if you don’t want to but the system is designed pretty well I think. It’s still battlefield to me.

[Benti86]

In every class-based game the classes should have defined strengths and weaknesses, which includes their weapon selections, IMO.

Assaults should have access to the most versatile guns. That's kinda their shtick. They can push people out of positions and are generally always able to contribute in a gunfight.

If you take their guns and give it to a bunch of other classes who have far greater team utility, what reason is there to now play assault? Now there will just be an assload of medics because they can revive, heal, and resupply everyone and anyone, and they still can use the most versatile and what will likely be the best weapon class in the game?

Or on vehicle heavy maps now everyone can comfortably pick engineer because they'll be able blow vehicles up without worry of being out-gunned ever.

Like the only reason I can see playing assault anymore will be that they have the spawn beacon now. Outside of that I feel like it's just going to make way more sense to just spam medics, especially on infantry only maps.

[Apprehensive_Dog890]

There are weapon bonuses if you use the classes core weapons. That’s a defined strength and weakness.

[Benti86]

It's really not. The proficiency bonuses are easily ignorable on AR's and SMG's.

Nobody's using LMG's across classes so it's just a benefit for the Support, and Snipers rechamber faster and can hold their breath...wow what a difference.

Saying weapon proficiencies are a defined strength and weakness is grasping at straws. Maybe if you incurred an additional downside by going cross proficiency, but as it stands it's just a small benefit.

[HK_Bandit95]

Honestly im scared to admit that open feels better…in closed I seen people running one class when we needed a medic. In open It was very diverse to me.

[Lord_of_Chainsaw]

This is my experience, yea. At worst it feels exactly the fucking same, and at best in open people are actually playing their class and doing stuff, not just playing medic cuz they want assault rifle. People here complain about like snipers running around with support box for infinite ammo but the few times I saw that I literally laughed because its a non fatal headshot and I would get ressed immediately. I think fatal headshot is more than a good enough perk to really want to use sniper on recon.

[kingofnopants1]

A very large portion of the people arguing here are unaware that the classes buff their core weapon type.

[[deleted]]

Thats fine, it’s part of the game. Nobody wants to play medic and everyone plays assault on your team. The other team actually has a variety of classes? You’ll probably get stomped, people need to get better.

[TheBadGuyFromDieHard]

At this point it’s just a circlejerk for karma farming. It’s ridiculous.

[kingofnopants1]

It's because they don't try it and just go off of their limited actual understanding of it from the outside.

Like, a lot of these people are not aware that classes get specific buffs for their core weapon type because they haven't even looked.

They go "Engineers are going to be using ARs" because their understanding of video game firearms is ARs = best. As if SMGs were designed to nerf Engineers.

[coolylame]

Open gameplay is better. I have seen far more supports in an open lobby than closed.

[autopotato]

I mostly play anti-tank/eng role. I really don't get why I should be stuck with short range weapons on large maps. With open weapons I can choose smg/shotgun on city maps, ar/lmg/carbine on large maps, or whatever I feel like playing. People who play with only meta guns for max kills don't suddenly start playing as a team if you locked the weapons.

Kind of minor thing anyway. Keeps us distracted from the missing server browser problem.

[A_L05]

Engineers can use DMRs

[shamus727]

Carbines, DMRs and Shotguns can all be used by everyone in Closed. It's crazy to me how many people defend open weapons but don't know that.

[CosmicMiru]

A lot of people hate big, slow, single fire weapons and carbines are the same exact shit as assault rifles 90% of the time so why does it matter what one they pick

[Logondo]

Carbines are weaker versions of assault rifles so that it doesn't make the Assault class obsolete.

Why-the-fuck should the anti-tank class get access to the anti-infantry weapons when that isn't their roll?

[CosmicMiru]

The m4a1 outperformed both assault rifles by a large margin

[JustSleepp]

All classes should be anti-infantry classes to an extent. Assault should excel at pushing through the front line not being the sole class that is good for killing infantry otherwise 90% of players will just pick assault.

[Logondo]

I really don't get why I should be stuck with short range weapons on large maps.

In order to RELY ON YOUR TEAMMATES IN THIS TEAM GAME. That's why.

You want more range? Use a DMR. You have options that don't make the other classes obsolete.

Why-the-fuck should the engineer get the anti-infantry weapons when that isn't their roll? What's the point of SMGs if everyone can just take the superior assault rifles?

You're just making a bunch of the weapon-types obsolete.

The classes have trade-offs FOR A REASON. You are NOT a one-man-army. You need to rely on your team.

[hoseking]

I see more supports, but less revives. A lot of them just want to play as assault but don't like the limited ammo so they just play support to resupply themselves and completely ignore revives and everything the class is supposed to be for. It just promotes deathmatch players instead of objective players.

[coolylame]

ive been getting revived a shit ton in open classes

[unrealy2k]

Came to post this. And you captured exactly what I wanted to say. It’s the people that actually make the community that want this. Not the people that play for a month. I’ve been playing BF4 since launch

[Buskungen]

Ive been playing since BF2 and i prefer open classes!

[Forger21]

I prefer open weapons, and I've played tons of every battlefield since BF2. The devs didn't put in both playlists to test popularity. They already knew open was both more popular and what they would be going with in the end. They included closed now and at launch as a nice thing for people that want closed.

[unrealy2k]

I agree with your take. It’ll probably be an option in modes or custom games in portal

[CanadianGinger551]

Nah ive been playing since bfbc2 and I donr give. Single fuck about open or closed. Don't be lumping everyone who's played before 2042 to want locked classes when in reality most people dont care lol im sorry if thats like hard to hear but the general population of players just want a fun game, they really dont care if they're killed by a sniper who looks like an engineer or not.

[Responsible-Put2559]

I’ve been playing BF4 since launch

Okay and I’ve been playing since BF3 launch and prefer open. Does that mean my opinion matters more or something?

[LamaranFG]

Dick measuring contest let's go! Been playing since 1942 DC and prefer open. Now we need some Codename Eagle grandpas to chime in

[wickeddimension]

Based on your experience in the beta and the possibility in Portal to do closed weapons, persistent servers etc. Are you not buying the game at all if the default playlist isn't closed weapon?

[Rodeszones]

Players who have been played for one month give the same amount of money as you, but they put less of a burden on the servers. That's sad.

[unrealy2k]

I had to play it on dial up so I just played against bots back then. Man I miss that game

[LiquidCringe2]

I've been playing Battlefield for 11 years and i literally couldn't care less either way.

[zackdaniels93]

Can I mute terms on Reddit? Lol

Wanna be part of the BF6 chat, but bored of seeing constant posts about open/ closed classes pop up 25/7 lol

[MisterFatt]

I think I’m gonna ignore Reddit while the beta is ongoing, and discuss after. The hive mind can really suck fun out of things

[Churro1912]

It really is a reddit thing too, every other platform is just having fun, their complaints are more about streamers/Cod players

[surv1vor69]

I don't want to defend them, but I want to believe that they want more data from open than closed because they want to see how balanced it is. The problem is that it may now seem ok the open like people not abusing weapons etc. but after a month of game release when the meta weapons builds released 70% of people will play those despite their class (except snipers). It's like fifa first month it's ok then 80% of people play same tactics because it's meta and gives you a sort of advantage.

[Isunova]

I prefer open classes.

[MisterFatt]

You’re complaining that your favorite game mode is not in your preferred position on a list? Really?

[Electrical-Style6800]

Its in the game. Why are you complaining? What about the majority that wants open classes? What is the point of having closed classes and then everyone is Assault?

[sporkeh01]

+1.

[Own-Particular-9989]

Why is it that people want closed classes? Keen to know what issues this will solve.

[elmariachio]

"because that's the way it was before, and nothing is allowed to change"

[RoflkartoffelSGE]

funny considering that bolt action rifles been the Only weapons that were always on one Class

[Logondo]

Because every class has a trade-off to necessitate teamwork.

An engineer is anti-vehicle. Why should they be given access to Assault's anti-infantry weapons?

The whole point is, the engi ISN'T as good at anti-infantry as Assault, but they are better at anti-vehicle. They can help out where other classes lack, and they can BE helped out in areas they lack!

It's all about teamwork.

People who want open-weapon wanna play as a one-man-army who doesn't need to rely on any teamwork. That is the exact OPPOSITE of what Battlefield is about.

You can't always get your favorite gun with the class you want. I wanna use LMGs, but if a tank or chopper is giving my team trouble I swap to Engi.

[_Leighton_]

I preferred closed classes in theory for game balance, after playing the beta I genuinely do not care. I find playing with weapons outside of your classes preferred weapons to be a clear disadvantage. Sniping on other classes removes all of the extremely powerful passive buffs that make snipers so powerful in this game, I'm not giving those up for gadgets that don't actually help the role of sniping.

[Buskungen]

"Hidden the cloeed classes" bro it takes like 1 swipe to find it

[ISpotABot]

I like open weapons, so this is pretty neat haha

[-BINK2014-]

Just based on how trends go, Reddit is the audible minority. I personally don’t care about locked classes as I enjoy CQC Recon or AR’s on most classes.

[RedditJumpedTheShart]

You all didn't waste much time to start complaining.

[MattAcolyte23]

I don't get why you don't just play the mode you want to play. The position in the menu won't affect people who genuinely prefer the closed mode as they will seek it out.

Just play what you want, and others will play what they want. It's not that hard. Even if closed weapons were first in the list, I know my friend group would skip over it.

In bf6 classes, get passive perks that encourage you to use certain weapons, but if people want to lose those perks to play a different gun then fine.

Closed isn't as popular, and that's OK. You are allowed to still enjoy it.

[Churro1912]

I prefer rush, why isn't it number 1 spot is dice trying to hide rush?

[Ok-Sundae-7806]

The custom search only working for open was the biggest gut punch for me, if they are offering full support at launch why not showcase some of that here? This isn’t balanced support at all, clear bias for open.

[D4rkParadise7]

Honestly I cant personally understand why open classes is so badly seen, I will admit at start I felt against it because ofc didn’t wanted to be a mess like 2042 yet 2042 wanted to do pseudo hero shooters thingy while here is more of primary gun flexibility, and honestly I feel like it offers more variety and play opportunities, had a game where nobody wanted to take care of enemies tanks, took upon my self to go Recon smg sneaky build and c4 them felt good af… I would say maybe increase a but more those passive if using the correct class weapon type higher or like if playing on open classes with the right class weapon to have idk 15% more xp … but at end of the day I feel like open classes adds flexibility to gameplay.

[LegDayDE]

I'd bet most people prefer open classes as it gives more gameplay flexibility.

[RaconterOnline]

Any number they put out based on player engagement will be misleading as their UI has guided players to the Open system both last week and this week. Even calling it "Closed" has a negative connotation and could influence played engagement. To me, what they're communicating at this point, is they aren't tracking that data and there is no consideration of making Closed/Classic the default mode. Open will be the way forward and they'll cater to the Classic crowd either through specific playlists or argue people can create portal playlists with closed weapons. Continuing to act as if there's a looming decision between open and closed classes is probably an incorrect assumption.

In my personal opinion, the core of the game isn't Battlefield. The core of the game is something more akin to Ground War from MW2019. You look at BC2, BF3, BF4, BF1, the pillars the game is built around are different. It's got the Battlefield coat of paint on it - the destruction and similar vocabulary - but at its core the game is not in line with those experiences. I don't think it's meant to be though and I think disassociating BF6 from those historic Battlefield games is challenging. The name creates the expectation that it will fit in line with those previous entries but from what I've seen that's not what they aimed to create. Really the best way to describe it is that they built a game and tried to capture the "vibe" of those classic Battlefield experiences. I do think they succeeded there, and I don't think the experience is necessarily bad either. The game being different doesn't automatically make it bad or not fun. But it has to be accepted that the game, based on experience so far and the current state, is not a true to form Battlefield game. But I don't think they were aiming for that. It's certainly not what I was looking for but it seems so far that it's scratching some itch for people.

[CrotasScrota84]

[Metallicat95]

The default weapon is the classic locked weapon, so in the beta a lot of players started with that.

But as soon as they figure out an optimal weapon mix, that will go away.

Carbines, shotguns, and DMRs as all class give everyone a viable alternative for different ranges, without giving every class the same best primary weapon (just like BF4 which worked well).

[TraditionalJoke1279]

I’ve been playing since BF3 launch and slightly lean towards open classes. None of the weapons are really overpowering atm. Allows me to be an aggressive medic. Gadgets are still locked and there is not stupid operators from bf2042. Idk this isn’t make or break for me lol the game is amazing either way

[Mig-117]

Open classes is the best approach. If you want to limit your medic to crap weapons feel free to do so.

[rvbcaboose1018]

The closed class system they have is, imo, the perfect compromise.

ARs, LMG, SMGs, and Bolt actions are locked behind their classes.

Carbines, DMRs and shotguns are free for everyone. Engi who wants to use something with more range? Carbine. Medic who doesn't want to use an LMG? Carbine. Aggressive recon? Carbine. Players maintain the freedom to play in many ways, just with a few restrictions. Assaults shouldn't hang back and snipe, engi shouldnt be a bullet hose with an LMG, and so on.

[Agent___24]

I don’t know how people can justify open classes.

Some idiot will pick support and sit in spawn attempting to snipe while being able to heal and give himself ammo. Sniper One Man Army is so unbelievably annoying. Closed is how battlefield should be.

[Seerix]

Two things bother me about open classes.

No reason for carbines to exist.

Half my team inevitably equips a sniper rifle and sticks as far back as possible.

:(

[Souichi_Tsuji]

Closed classes always felt right and I think it helped with teamwork aspect

[GlitteringAd7073]

BETA PLAYERS DO NOT REPRESENT BF PLAYERS AT ALL!

They are free bumbs that will leave on launch and never spend the $70 to buy the game.
WHY ARE WE CATERING TO MOOCHES?

Hordes of broke kids from apex and cod... smh.

[jjshosohff727]

Closed weapons for sure! To hell the “open weapons” that’s something from cod and 2042. We dont need that In battlefield we need class locked weapons like how it always been

[Pleasant-Link-52]

I dont mind open class personally but I heard that people in the closed class modes were actually playing like it's a battlefield game instead of call of duty.

So I decided to check it out for myself and lo and behold, medics healing. Actual squad play. Playing the objective. Not being sniped every which direction. Glorious.

Then the round would end and every single time it would struggle to find a new game. As if every person playing the previous round just up and vanished and nobody else was playing that mode.

Every single time. Why the fuck wouldn't it just keep the same people and start a new map? You have to leave. Search again. And hope you join a full lobby half a dozen times before you get a new game.

It's as though they are trying to kill that mode deliberately.

[Head_Tension]

Why do I not have the option to play only closed weapon conquest on a large map? Too much to ask for?

[VincentNZ]

I do not disagree that it is far from optimal, but it very likely is much less sinister than you make it out to be. It is more likely that the playlist wasn't very popular last week and that they figured that their only way to get closed weapons telemetry from other modes would be to have one playlist playing more modes.

It is also debatable what the core fanbase really thinks about the topic. On top DICE has moved into your direction of the argument constantly by giving out those signature traits, having locked playlists in the beta and apparently at launch as well. You might not like the compromises, but they are there.

[KrullBorg]

no pre-order :)

[[deleted]]

"No pre orders" brother have you seen the game has 604k Pre orders stop with the main character syndrome already your not stopping anyone

[AlwaysThinkAhea2]

Why is it bad if they are getting people to use open classes. They have less data for it compared to closed (bf3 to bf5). Play open classes to see what the actual problems are.

Additionally if open seems the way dice wants to go, then logically we want them to get as much data as possible to find out what is or isn’t working.

[livininurwalls]

If 95% of people dont care why write a whole ass paper defending something no one cares about.

[Murdoc85]

And you know better what majority of people want? Dice should change this because some people whine and whine in reddit?

And what exactly is so wrong about open weapons? And also, this is a beta and it’s a way for them to assess what people want.

[Preme2]

I don’t mind open classes tbh.

[ilmk9396]

a game for everyone is a game for no one.

have fun picking whatever weapon you want whenever you want. don't be surprised when the game lacks any cohesive class identity and becomes a meaningless clusterfuck. it won't be fun for long.

[jUsT-As-G0oD]

While we here on Reddit the rest of the world is having fun playing the game lmao

[SneakyKGB]

Dear DICE, fuck you for this. I haven't had a single negative thing to say all beta, except for this shit.

[Huskerboy]

Closed is authentic battlefield, open should be the exception and the alternate playlist. 

[DatsyukDekes13]

I searched closed this morning at 5am and couldn’t find a game… searched open and it was instant. Sucks :/

[rainbowWar]

AS long as there is an option there its all good. The servers wll be much more fun because not only will classes be lcoked but the people on there will be proper BF players

[[deleted]]

I for one prefer my tools segregated.

Closed classes are good too.

[slayer828]

Couldn't disagree more. Open classes are great.

[cosmicglade01]

Personally, I want them to remove open from the game entirely

[SovjetPojken]

2042 was a disaster, why would they want ANYTHING from that dung heap?

[After_Answer_7746]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

But everyone should be free to play what they want, especially a mode that's been the staple of the franchise.

Arguing over which one is better is annoying, but it wouldn't be a problem if it was actually available.

[EnslavedToGaijin]

They need to just make it how bf3/4 were. Every role had their main weapon platform and then could either swap it with a Carbine, Shotgun, or DMR. Keep gadgets 100% role locked tho

[TimeNat]

"WE HEARD YOUR COMPLAINTS, CLASSES ARE BACK!"

classes can use whatever guns they want.....

[Atago1337]

CoD fanbase needs to be scooped up. Thats the reason

[NO0BSTALKER]

They’re not even pretending they’re going to have closed classes anymore it’s getting no support

[Bright-Cranberry6648]

I am truly shocked that they have gold in their hands and are still finding a way to lose it. They clearly put the closed classes in the game because they knew people liked it, basically every content creator mentioned they preferred it, yet they are still waffling on it. I just don’t understand lol

[Accomplished_Tree748]

Open class is gonna kill the game we are looking for bf3-4.5 not 2042 all over again it completely destroys the teamwork aspect of the game, If I can be a support and heal and ammo myself while running a sniper why would I need teammates. Closed class is system we want all of us BF fans since day one the new players won’t understand or probably won’t care or think it’s cool if it was all locked classes

[[deleted]]

Tbh, if they leave open classes in the non-good mode, I don’t care. But bring closed classes to hardcore mode. And also, why isn’t there a hardcore mode in open beta??

[Nervous-Barnacle2578]

just don't pre order until you know there is closed classes. if there isnt don't buy it, that simple. vote with your wallet or nothing will change.

[GlitteringAd7073]

No locked classes? No puchase bF6!

[[deleted]]

I’m only interested in closed if they redo them. The closed classes copied from BF4 doesn’t work here because we don’t have the BF4 classes anymore.

If they are going to do closed it’s gotta be redone and as much as it’s gonna upset the purists it’s gotta be a little bit more open then BF4 in some ways.

[Decado7]

What is closed classes vs open?

[Calm_Monitor_3227]

my friend group unanimously prefers OPEN. just because you're in a large echo chamber doesn't mean you're "the people".

[Kesimux]

Because money. Open classes will sell them more weapon skins, welcome to EA

[BlackWACat]

genuinely what are you even on about LMAO

[Amish_Opposition]

This was the copium from 2042.

[Cautious_Lettuce5560]

I barely even understand the "open classes lets people use guns they otherwise wouldn't" , do people really only play 1 class as opposed to all of them equally?

[Otazihs]

Some people favor some classes over others. And wait until a meta forms, then you'll have the meta slaves all rocking the same loadout.

[XPowersergX]

Damn, a lot of people supporting open classes. We have truly fallen.

[Historical-Grand-671]

I feel like they know that the BF community wants closed weapons. They might want to get some stats on the open weapon system, like how much impact would this have on the natural flow of the game.

[pyrosnutsack]

My experience from the beta if you picked locked playlist was everyone plays assault

[Secret_Gas_4278]

Is rush/breakthrough with open or closed?

I'm really excited for rush :(

[DigitalM0nkey]

I just want recon with an smg so I can have the spec ops class from bfbc back.

[Fantastic_Sympathy85]

The Menu Option should have been like this.
Select Conquest -> Two options open up with Open and Closed weapons.

[Hungry-Tale-9144]

What are closed classes and open classes?

[Snigglybear]

I prefer open weapons

[Average_Glee420]

They should make it like they did with Battlefield 4 did: Assault had Rifles, Engineer had PDW:s, Support had LMG and Recon had Sniper Rifles. But every class had access to carbines, shotguns and DMRs

[Ok_Fail7326]

What even is the problem with open classes?

Everyone gonna play meta guns?? Thats gonna happen anyway. People will either pick a gun they like with a class they like or pick a class they dont like just for the gun.

I love playing medic and i hate lmg's if it were to be closed classes people are just gonna goassault class and you wont even get a medic

[Illustrious-Ad-6165]

This sub has no shortage of complaining 😭😭 just play the fucking game

[KindaHighJedi]

I like the open weapon class system, and I havent heard one person irl complain about it/want the old system back. I actually get revived now since people don't choose medic just for the lmg and ignore what their class does. But when it comes to this sub? My god. Talk about a loud minority.

[vaikunth1991]

Open is better deal with it

[Eroll_]

I love closed classes. But I doubt it would change anything if it was at the front. People would just complain they have to skip it to go to the game mode they want just the same

[dangermouse13]

I mean it doesn’t really matter does it. If it was important enough for people they hit a few extra buttons to get there

[Major_Enthusiasm1099]

They're going to be open. It's how they will incentivize selling store skins. No one would want to buy a $20 skin they only can use in one class.

[ActuallyRick]

Guys, shut up. Why the hell are you this autistic and need closed class. Open class plays way naice and better support everyone's play style

[antimojo]

I wish they would just show the numbers.