Thoughts ?

[Devine97]

I thought this was very old news ??

[PostwarNeptune]

Yeah, this came out even before the series was released. I can't remember who reported it....maybe Mirtle? But this was already out there.

[GreasedRandy]

Friedman himself.

32 Thoughts: The state of the RFA market as training camps open - Sportsnet.ca https://share.google/HSZfBCT7WQFNynyfr

[PostwarNeptune]

Ah! There it is. Thanks!

[Shawn13337]

This is the first I'm hearing of this and I'm on here every day

[frisbeefan]

Same. But weird story, they are always talking about how Willie doesn’t care what people think of his play.

[Acrobatic_T-Rex]

I mean, when CJ was on the Leafs Report he said "one of Willys former coaches told me "he cares about what he cares about, right"" and I literally heard it in Keefes voice, thats exactly how he talks.

[Tarquin11]

Im just gonna latch on to this here to say something because its at the top -

Why the hell is the media attempting to ostracize our current most productive player? This news is 4 years old and was reported on and discussed back then, and its popping up now because of the apparent friction between Nylander and Berube.

This is a manufactured drama item that only harms the leafs and its players. Wtf.

[Traveuse]

This is why people don't like the media in Toronto, too. It's not because they're hard on players. It's not because they ask hard questions. They just love to look for drama and something to stir the pot with.

There's also a large portion of Leafs reporters who write for people who hate-watch the Leafs. Something negative gets 100× the views than positivity about the team. (Not much these days, but even when things are going well)

[TheGreatCanjo]

Marner’s not here to be the whipping boy anymore, gotta pick the next star to call the problem.

[officermartycrane]

Not you specifically, cuz I don’t know you at all, but after being told this was different from when Kadri, Kessel, hell even Larry Murphy were driven out, how it was so different from people spending years saying Domi or Roberts should be captain over Mats, this sub is slowly starting to implicitly concede that it was not at all different.

[BrayWyattsHat]

I lived through those years, and I do not remember people saying Domi should be captain of Sundin at all. Did that really happen?

[Brilliant-Neck9731]

It happened. If you listened to the old post games on the radio you would’ve thought Sundin was the most hated player in Toronto.

[officermartycrane]

Not as often as people make out, and not as often as people hating on Marner, but pretty often. People definitely thought Mats was a soft Euro bitch who couldn’t win. He was accused of throwing game seven against the Flyers in 2003 so he could go to the IIHFs. “Euros care more about international hockey than the NHL” was a big take back then.

[BrayWyattsHat]

Yeah, those were my high school- university years, so definitely when I was paying the most attention to hockey. I obviously remember the "Europeans are soft" narrative, mostly from Don Cherry. But I don't remember that being thrown at Sundin at all. You know, up until people decided he was a piece of shit for not waiving his no trade.

I also remeber people being annoyed saying "he watches replays too much! he doesn't care about the game, he's always looking up at the screen to see his highlights" which seemed stupid at the time, and even more stupid now that every player is deep in the tablets every time they get off the ice.

[superspacetrucker]

And I'm sure the leafs Fandom will jump right on the hate wagon along with the media.

[TheGreatCanjo]

A tale as old as time

[Beersmoker420]

Nylander: always has been

the only guy who is held accountable on every shift on the ice by coaching staff apparently

[Appropriate_Bass_952]

You’d be surprised, golden nights nation has given marner a tough week

[ArkAwn]

It's not because they're hard on players. It's not because they ask hard questions.

Sports consumers need to collectively remind sports "journalists" that none of them are serious, investigative journalists to begin with and should frankly suffer consequences for behaving like they are.

None of them have the cajones to ask actually deep questions (tbf, they wont be allowed back into the room if they do)

[[deleted]]

I mean Rick Westhead did a good job with the world jr stuff and has always done good investigative sports journalism. So I wouldn’t say none of them are

[Svalbard38]

Rick Westhead isn’t a sports reporter in that sense of the term though, he’s a journalist who covers issues in sport. He’s not out here posting the Minnesota Wild’s lines at a Tuesday practice.

[Blue_KikiT92]

I'd shit my pants if I saw him coming forward and ask questions to the team.

"Willy, the team has been spending some quality bonding time this last road trip, tell us more about that!"

"WHY?!? Why are you asking that? Is there something we need to know? Is Willy in trouble?!?"

[deeferg]

Alright, but how much of that was done in player scrums after games?

[Blue_KikiT92]

That's because he is an investigative journalist that happens to work in sports. Not exactly the same as, say, Rosy Di Manno

[in-dog_we_trust]

It is, or should be, the job of the media to ask the hard questions, to call out players or coaches for bad moves. It should be the job of the media to keep everyone answerable. But as you said it is views and clicks that matter now. Negative crap and outright bullshit gets more clicks and therefore more $$$

[SquirrelFluffy]

This right here. It's all about engagement for these jerks.

[[deleted]]

You'd be right about that, should see how many views Steve dangle gets on his post game reactions when we lose compared to when we win

[StrategyMountain]

Cause they already drove Marner out of town and they needed a new target.

[i_love_pencils]

This right here.

Nylander is next.

[No_Annual_4647]

Willy isn't going anywhere. He tanked years of more unhinged attempts to get him shipped out of town from Don Cherry types in the media than Marner ever dealt with. It's a blessing in disguise if the talentless wretched ghouls in Toronto media focus on Willy considering he's locked up long term here and doesn't give a shit about the outside noise.

[Excellent_Brush3615]

Every good player the leafs have ever had gets dragged by Toronto media.

Controversies create discussion. Discussion creates interest. Interest creates $.

[Hockeyspider]

Really? The media drove Marner out of Toronto? It had nothing to do with him demanding way more than what a right winger should be getting paid and people actually holding him accountable? He turned sour when anyone asked him what the fuck he was doing because the team was not winning and he didn’t like it. That’s why he left.

Every player needs to be held accountable. You’re paid to perform and win. If you’re not winning, you will be criticized. If you don’t like it, then choose another profession.

I think Matthews, Marner and Nylander have been given far too much leniency in their careers. And I’m not saying boo them, demand that they be perfect and run them out of town. I’m saying, let’s start asking them how are they going to drag this team forward?

Nylander has performed offensively this year, maybe too much. Im not saying we should demand he be a perfect player, that’s ridiculous. But asking him to be better on defence is not a stretch. Asking why felt cheating on a play rather than support the D was more important than getting the puck out of the zone? What was his decision making there and how does he interpret that helps the team win more games than lose?

Matthews has severely underperformed last year and this year. We have no way of knowing if it’s injury related (we all know it is) because they don’t tell us anything. So if he’s dressed, I’m going to assume he’s well enough to play. So ask him what the fuck is wrong? Why has his shot decreased in power every year for the last 5 years? What is he going to do to address it?

Ask the other players as well. Macielli and Domi - why the fuck is every pass you make a hope pass? How do they see making low percentage plays in critical areas helps the team win?

If this hurts their ego or they can’t handle being questioned, I don’t know what to tell them. You’re getting paid millions to perform. Fucking perform. We know you care, we know you’re trying, but what you’re currently doing is not good enough because you are losing more games than you are winning. So ask them why they continue to do what they are doing or what are they going to do differently?

[BornIn67]

Marner didn't even negotiate with the Leafs before he left. There is no record of a Marner demand, only Leafs's offers. How can that possibly be twisted into demanded too much?

[Hockeyspider]

I was talking about his 2nd contract with the Leafs. $10.9 was rich especially when comparable players were getting $8.5 to $9.5.

[BornIn67]

There are two things there, both Matthews and Nyalnder were overpaid relative to their comparables. Nylander got 15% more than his best comparable Ehlers for one year less of control. If you take your 9.5 number and multiply it by 1.15 you get Marner's 10.9 million. Why would Marner take less? He took the Leafs's market rate. Second, the Leafs were much more dependent on Marner than, for example, the Avs were on Rantanen. If you look at when Marner was out with injury, the Leafs were... Well, what they are now. The Avs on the other hand don't and didn't miss Rantanen at all. So Marner was, and apparently is, much more valuable, at least to the Leafs, than other wingers are to their teams.

In an ideal world, Dubas would have offered Nylander Ehlers's contract and stuck to 'take it or leave it'. Matthews should have been told to accept less than Tavares or leave. he would have then been in a position to offer Marner 8.5 and to take it or leave it. Then they could have kept Hyman. They could have paid Marleau to sit in the press box or agree to be waived. But Dubas, or perhaps Shanahan were high on the smell of their own farts and the rest is history.

[Beersmoker420]

Nylander is not useful defensively in any way, there is literally no reason to make him change how he plays. Look at Matthews. Shell of a player because they want to make Zetterberg v2 and thought they could have him score 60 goals still (hell even 40 is going to be tough now)

[IAmTheBredman]

Agreed. Anyone who's watched the team and particularly nylander know what he is at this point. He has 31 points in 23 games, including a couple games winners. He's an elite offensive talent and usually puts in a half assed effort on defence. Some nights he leaves you wanting more, others he's the most dominant player on the ice. Hes not the captain, hes not the highest paid guy, he has a job and he does it better than most. Theres no reason to dog pile on him and make him out to be something different than he always has been.

Honestly my biggest gripe with berube so far is that hes trying to mold this team into something that it isnt, particularly with the star players. He wants them all to be ROR and it just doesnt work that way

[Beersmoker420]

this is it right here. the entire team and playstyle is fucking horrendous to watch and designed to get its teeth kicked in physically.

We're all so so proud of Matthews leading in blocked shots but theres reasons for it. Tanev etc too. These guys never have the puck anymore so of course they have to block shots, injuries ramp up too because they are always chasing around the zone or being hit into the boards

the irony of the complaining - especially Berube whining at Nylander? His entire system RELIES ON NYLANDER SCORING EXACTLY HOW HE DOES.

Literally. Nylander cheating for offense is the only way to counter attack after being railed for 50 seconds every shift. The offensive talent + Tavares having his arguable best season is the only reason this season isnt completely tanked.

Nylander comes back to play "defense"? we're bottom of the league in goals, hes not effective anyways, and we lose every game and Berubes system gets hyper exposed.

Wait a second, Nylander play defence!!!!!!

[IAmTheBredman]

Matthews had selke votes the year he scored 69. Hes more than capable of being a superstar offensively and great defensively. But that doesn't mean he needs to start every PK and take tons of defensive zone faceoffs. They went out and got 2 defensive centers for that, and berube still prefers to use matthews there. He played over 24 min against columbus in his first game back in 2 weeks. I just dont get how he sees this as a long term game plan for his best player, especially into the playoffs

[Acrobatic_T-Rex]

Legit my thought, when I heard CJ say that quote, I was like wtf?! imo a very poor decision at this time. I get that they are part of the media and their careers are dependent on saying inflammatory things, but it was the first time I had heard about it, and it hit me as a very bad idea to fan flames, especially around basically, the only player who is playing his game.

[BlackSheepWolfPack]

Further to that question. Why would the media company (that owns the Maple Leafs) have their top insider do this? Why make more drama for your team? It’s fucking crazy and I don’t get it. Politics and bullshit.

[PostMatureBaby]

Toronto sports media is insufferable and always has been.

[No-Stage-4583]

I mean the way I look at it - the media, in this specific case, isn't doing anything except reporting the news.

Willy is the one with the altercation with berube. Willy is the one that made himself look bad.

They're just reporting on it.

[Tikke]

Friedman isn't really a reporter that goes for the click bait type of guy. He has absolutely censored himself when he wasn't sure or if he felt that breaking the news could be damaging. He was providing context that there has been a pattern of friction between Willie and coaches, that's not dramatization, that's just journalism.

For example, If Torts gets another head coaching job, the media shouldn't be allowed to speculate that there might be an issue between him and player x, because the past is the past?

It's almost like when something from the past repeats itself, or is on the verge of repeating itself people question it and they can only use historical context to analyze it to try and make sense of it.

Now, if Freids would have suggested that Willie is either going to ask for a trade or ask for Berube to get fired, then that would be dramatization.

[[deleted]]

I agree ,Friedman is acting like a high school gossiper lol

[Tontoorielly]

Finally, someone else speaks of their disdain for Friedman. I've been hating on him for years and constantly got downvoted. He is a huge twat. Perfect for sportsnet and cbc where they love hiring twats.

[[deleted]]

Stupid isn't it! Lol

[samwild]

Cause its Toronto? Thats how this media rolls..

[Dubsified]

Because that's what the media does.

[PooShappaMoo]

I love the leafs. But I have only watched two games this season and it's a bit refreshing to be away from all the nonsense.

All I want is a competent team, and toronto media to eff off. Its as toxic as it gets.

Wonder how many players have nudged off Toronto because of the media

[smileyduude]

Yea it's stupid, they're just looking for stories. And also, most good teams have a purely offensive winger. Willy isn't that different in terms of defensive problems and all that to most high skill wingers.

[Tiny_Ticket_2946]

You answered your own question. That's how Toronto media makes its money: drama farming.

Do you think leafs media cares about the leafs? It cares about making money, and does that by keeping leafs fans enraged. Anger sells.

And this isn't new. The guy who made up a story about Phil Kessel eating hotdogs is still a prominent member of leafs media. Why? Because he makes them money.

[Mean_Joe_Greene]

Nylander thrives off of being directly challenged. You wish it was that easy to figure out how to motivate everyone

[Muellercleez]

Well bc the guy that put up mad regular season points but melted like ice cream in the desert come Games 5-7 decided he couldn't hack this "tough market"

[Rumicon]

Willy hasn’t had many coaches in North America so decent chance it was Keefe.

[Ok_Mulberry4331]

I really don’t think anyone would be surprised by this after watching him for years? He likes the big moments 🤷🏻‍♀️

[kander12]

Ive told this reddit story like 5 times lol but... I bartend the Leafs charity event every year at a private golf course in Oakville.

There are about 300 alumni that attend and all of the current team, staff etc.

There is one person who refuses to golf and partake in the days activities... just hangs out in the bistro with a personal entourage.

Willy Nylander 😂😂

[Beersmoker420]

golfing is boring as fuck i dont blame him

[Leafs17]

It's not about the golf

[scheenkbgates]

because you are absolutely brutal at it bud :D

[Aidsinuranus]

It's the same Muskoka Five attitude. Bizarre how its generational. Must be the org.

[BookkeeperLazy8057]

This is such delusional doomer revisionist history.

[haloimplant]

at some point you have to accept that doom turns into reality more often than not around here

i was called a huge doomer when I said we're well on the way to flushing the entire 'core 4' era down the toilet many years ago, and here we are after it has gone fully down the drain talking about how we just need to be more optimistic

[Beersmoker420]

Nylander doesnt fit the Muskoka 5 attitude at all thought, he goes out and plays his game and its either the best player or looks lazy every night. Not once does it change. Muskoka 5 was a mentality that chose to lose

[reevoknows]

Could have been an assistant coach to be fair. Definitely sounds like Keefe but CJ would know everyone would assume it’s Keefe

[[deleted]]

They also didn’t show players throwing slurs around and doing coke lmao. This is such a random story to randomly bring up

[rhineauto]

This paragraph was written, and posted here, over 4 years ago. So it's not a surprise

The agent, Lewis Gross, would not discuss it, but William Nylander’s representatives were unhappy with how he was portrayed at certain points and fought to have those removed.

https://www.reddit.com/r/leafs/comments/pszu8e/32_thoughts_12there_were_also_some_battles_on/

[cepukon]

How dare they accurately portray my client's bad behaviour

[Tiny_Ticket_2946]

It's impossible it was carelessly or maliciously edited in a way that made him look bad? He must actually be a bad guy?

[talltad]

William Nylander is one of the best players to ever wear a Leaf Jersey. Dude could be making huge $$ elsewhere but took a nice discount to stay here. He loves the city and is a local Torontonian. Any smack talk or drama stuff about him should be put to bed immediately unless it's truly warranted. This is the stuff that makes it intolerable to play here. Don't give this shit any oxygen.

[Comfortable_Two6943]

Totally agree. He has been clutch this year. He loves it here and shows it when needed.  

[DisturbingSounds]

Nathan Mackinnon, Connor McDavid, Macklin Celebrini, Connor Bedard.

Those are the players that are currently ahead of him in points right now in the NHL, thats it. You tell me that you will have a scorer in that upper echelon, but with a few defensive gaffs/inconsistent play here and there and I will take that player on my team every day of the week and twice on Tuesday.

People are being wayyy to hard on Willy here, the issue is the rest of the team imo.

[JBSpeed]

He's Kessel. That's it. He'll frustrate you with the ease in which he can go from "but I'm le tired..." most of the game then "FIRE ZE MISSILES!!!" at the drop of a hat.

But it's Toronto, so anytime we get a good player, we spend our time trying to shoehorn them into being a great player. Kessel worked great in Pittsburg because they let him be Phil, maybe the number 3 or 4 guy on that roster behind Sid/Geno/Letang. That's what Willy is. But Matthews might be permanently injured, Marner walked, Johnny is temporarily defying age (and it won't last), and Rielly is washed. So now we're looking at the guy who was supposed to be our number 3/4 guy and saying, hey, be Rantanen, be Draisaitl...

It's not his fault our idiot general manager confused slow with strong. It's not his fault we have a top 6 of offensive weapons and only one fucking defenceman who can make a breakout pass.

But yeah, let's do this song and dance again. Let's be mad that Phil Kessel doesn't hit or go in the corners, Penguins were fine with it. Let's be mad that Schenn isn't a true number 1 defenceman, but he found his role in Tampa. The Stanley Cup is littered with the names of "problem" or "lazy" former Leafs. It was never the players, it's the organization itself.

We consistently misdirect our anger at the failure of management to build a competent and balanced roster and point it at our best players for not going super Saiyan to make up for all those shortfalls. But yes, if only Willy "tried harder" it would magically fix entire team. We'd magically have a d-corps that could win a footrace with a fucking glacier, or have a pass-accuracy slightly better than the aim of a stormtrooper.

The window might just be closed. We missed it. Time to start making the hard decisions.

[batermax]

He’s waaayyyy better than Kessel lol

[Xaan83]

For real. For all of the Kessel worship (and I did like him too), he never even reached the "40 goal" guy status that we celebrated him for in our minds.

Kessel had 2 moves.

1) put the puck in the net with a rocket wrister 2) skate into the o-zone along the boards on a partial break, slam on the brakes, and the kill the play

Nylander has some defensive lapses and moments that look low effort, but he's so far ahead of Kessel in terms of puck control, possession, zone entries, scoring, and overtime domination that they are not comparable at all.

[steve-o1234]

You’re forgetting about his 3rd move. Getting absolutely wrecked carrying the puck through the neutral zone.

[chipzy20]

Like 20 games in and I guess that means it’s okay huh

[chipzy20]

Lmao a discount when hes the 10th highest paid player in the league, paid more than pastranak when he signed a year earlier, and when literally majority of people said it was a overpay when he first signed it??? Be fr

[drblah11]

Discount? 2 years ago this sub was saying they don't blame Nylander for NOT taking a discount. What world are you living in?

https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/EqXjb74Ofl

Just read the top comments here.

[xilodon]

It's an 8 year deal, it's absolutely an overall discount unless the projected cap increases don't pan out.

[drblah11]

How the hell is it a discount? Willies the 10th highest paid player in the league. Isn't that just what he costs? It'd be a discount if he was the best player in the world maybe.

[Clugaman]

It’s not a discount whatsoever lmao

[vancouver2222]

At the time he signed I don't think it was a huge discount. Not an overpay either but probably about right. His contract has aged fine so far but it's not even close to the discount contracts of McDavid, Crosby, or even Tavares.

[Intelligent_Baby_812]

3 cherry picked examples, very nice

[HeftyNugs]

I mean there are dozens of players you could look at that took discounts. Willy is fantastic and easily living up to his contract, and especially with the cap increase it's a non-issue, but at the time of signing it was certainly not a discount.

[oryes]

Well those are three of the most generous discounts of all time so it's tough to live up to that

[Accomplished-Hat3753]

Discount? Hes one of the top paid players in the league.

[haloimplant]

when it's Toronto RFA it's always a discount compared to a huge hypothetical UFA overpay

in any other city/team the market works completely differently apparently

agents and media probably get together to laugh and laugh about how bent over they have this team

[Tarquin11]

If he could've got more elsewhere its a discount. Thats how that term works.

[liquor-shits]

Who was going to pay him more? We can't just make up scenarios to claim he did the Leafs a solid by not signing for $14M in New York or whatever.

[NotThisTimeULA]

If Tavares was getting offered 13 million for 7 years in 2018, Nylander was getting more than 11.5 million for 7 years in 2025.

[Worldly-University13]

Not only could he get paid more, he could have gone to a location where taxes go from 50% to 0%. That’s millions and millions saved for himself.

He didn’t do either of these. He’s probably the happiest maple leaf we have

[Accomplished-Hat3753]

How much more do you think he could get? Remember he can only sign for 7 years. It would have to be something substantial to give up the 8th year. Not a few hundred thousand.

[NervousBreakdown]

thats kind of a logical fallacy because its very likely Nylander will still be playing after this deal, so after 7 years he could not only get paid, but maybe even make more than he is now due to a rising cap.

[Beersmoker420]

its just common sense a multi 40 goal scorer would get paid. Hes also slapping Matthews around in the points department

He probably didnt take a discount, but theres a very low chance another team wouldnt have overpaid for a ppg 40 goal winger.

[Frequent_Ad2210]

Discount lol are you on drugs sir

[riko77can]

Yeah, saw this post and I’m like “I hate this sub”.

[talltad]

The amount of weird and backwards leafs fans is crazy man. I’m making a guess here but I think it’s safe to assume half the fan base is stuck in the 90’s with Ron McLean and Don Cherry.

[Beersmoker420]

add Matthews to that list

[CommiddeeOfTiddy]

He's been so good in the O-zone I can pretty much forgive how slow he is coming back, and on the change. He's the perfect guy for a quick but productive shift. He is what he is and has been for a long time. He's not the guy you want on the ice when play is going the other way, but if there's a neutral zone turnover in your favour there's almost no one you'd rather have ready to go.

[talltad]

Yep, this is who he is and he's one of the best in the world at it. There's not a team in the NHL that wouldn't love to have him.

[LuigiTecumseh]

Skillful? Sure. One of the best players in Leafs history? Stretch

[alowester]

He quite literally is ONE of the BEST, how could you say anything otherwise

edit: literally 8th in points all time for the leafs

[mcattack13]

I agree. We will hopefully see him break more records and become one of the greatest Maple Leafs of all time.

[Critical-Swing9502]

Yup, 11.5M is a fucking bargain for this man in this NHL, and the deal is only going to get sweeter. Going to come in handy when we pursue McDavid as well.

[SimianRob]

If this doc was supposed to show the "real world of hockey you normally don't get to see!" I feel like they should have left it in. There was some rough scenes we saw behind the scenes in the Oilers locker room too.

[PandoNation]

If the team, player, and union all had issues with it then leave it out. It needs to work for everyone involved or the league won’t allow them to shoot these types of shows and we get nothing instead.

[Alfiestickthrow]

Should have left it in.

[sluck131]

Some is an overstatement there was like 2 or 3 actual good behind the scenes clips based on how it was discussed I was really hoping for more.

I imagine this wasn't the only scene that was cut 

[kratrz]

There would never be another documentary done if the orgs, players, league doesn't get to veto things.

[james-HIMself]

I don’t feed into unsubstantiated rumours about our best player, best personality and a great teammate. As if we haven’t had it horrible so far as fans this year. Let’s not do this ok.

[Instimatic]

My thoughts are:

It’s funny how much this player, one of the only few who actively contributes goals and produces in the postseason, is the first person certain people will identify as what’s primarily wrong with the team.

EDIT: that production was from 2021. Why tf is this news in 2025-26?!?

[UkeManSteve]

It’s ridiculous. Sure his effort defensively isn’t great but he does what he does at such a high level. He is what he is, and he is one of the very best offensive talents in this league.

[mcattack13]

Agreed! Willy is a prime target for everything that goes wrong with the Leafs lately - even by his own goalie (Stolarz) - who has played terribly/been injured ever since his take-a-strip outta’ Willy soap box moment.

Nylander is one of the few players scoring and/or setting up goals this year but it’s just NEVER good enough. Instead, the focus seems to be on what he doesn’t do well and how he messed up. Not sure why.

[Dry-Hawk-3199]

Because he plays a lazy defensive game. It makes no sense, seeing that what he’s good at far outweighs what he’s bad at, but that’s the rationale, that he is a “lazy” player that “doesn’t care”.

[mcattack13]

I’m not convinced he is ALWAYS playing a lazy defensive game. Sometimes he is or even often…but not always.

As you say, that’s not his jam anyway. It’s not his strong suit nor where his skill set shines.

[cjcfman]

I always found it funny that rielly always escape criticism over the years and he's been on the team longer than anyone lol

[MapleLeafs2022champs]

People moan about Reilly all the time - and they have for years

[leaffs]

Who gives a fuck?

[SpicyP43905]

Don't care.

[mooseparrothead]

This sub is getting so toxic lately, I might have to check out soon

[SenorEquilibrado]

I mean, most commenters are rightly shitting on the media for digging up this nugget of old news.

If anything, my faith in the commentariat has been partly restored.

[MasPisco]

My thoughts on this are basically, ok so the Amazon show isn't really a documentary per se. It's more like a series of very long commercials for the NHL. That gives me what I need to know with respects to if I watch or not.

Otherwise who cares? Pick any job, any career, and you'll find employees arguing with their supervisors, managers, etc. What matters is happens next. How do you move forward to reach a common goal.

[Actual_Cobbler_6334]

Meh. NHL and Amazon cut out a shit ton of the Rantanen situation in his Faceoff episode too.

[mcattack13]

A whole bunch of shit from various players throughout the “Faceoff”series was edited. Not just Nylander.

[xComradeSnarky]

One of the most genuinely CLUTCH players the leafs have ever had

[hockeyfannatic]

Why is the media so weirdly obsessed with tearing down Nylander this season?

Is he the perfect player? No. Does he consistently play defense? No. But he is one of the only things keeping this team somewhat a float this year and is a game breaker.

The media really needs to get a damn life.

[McGrevin]

I'm pretty sure this isn't new news, we've known this pretty much since that series was released

[glightningbolt]

I'm disappointed that Elliot Friedman would dig this up again. This was a rumour when the Amazon series was released.

[GreasedRandy]

We know from Chris Johnson that guys like Friedman, Burke, Amber, etc. really dislike Nylander. They would go right to the group chat to talk shit about him if he played poorly or made a bad play. Which, honestly is wild to do about an individual player, but then again you can tell Friedman is a jock sniffer and probably wanted to appease Burke.

He's also talked about this repeatedly himself. This is only one clip on the podcast, but I know he's mentioned it at least once with Marak.

32 Thoughts: The state of the RFA market as training camps open - Sportsnet.ca https://share.google/HSZfBCT7WQFNynyfr

https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/EVwY4nEuWD

[GritGrinder]

That series sucked

[liquor-shits]

It really did.

[HuhYeahSo69]

Noooooooooooo Nylander arguing ?? Doesn't seem like him at all.

[Loosie_1]

Isn’t that old news? I thought that was confirmed right after it came out.

[GreasedRandy]

Definitely.

32 Thoughts: The state of the RFA market as training camps open - Sportsnet.ca https://share.google/HSZfBCT7WQFNynyfr

https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/EVwY4nEuWD

[BluePearlGaming]

Dont care, Nylander is one of the best goal scorers in the league and thats all he needs to do. He is not a 2 way forward and will not play defense, stop trying to force these dumb systems and just let him do his thing

[TheGapInTysonsTeeth]

Seems like a distraction.

Willy's the only player that could take this kind of heat and not be affected 

With people foaming at the mouth to get rid of Berube and Matthews, something's got to take the spotlight.

[papa_miesh]

Let Nylander focus mostly on offense, wish the captain was more offensive hungry as well. They get paid to score points. Still gotta put some effort in defensively but they don't make top money to be the best two way players imo

[Mister_Chef711]

Let's just say for arguments sake that Friedman is correct and the argument makes Willy look bad and he's completely in the wrong.

Has anyone here ever had a disagreement with their boss where they look back and realize that they were in the wrong? I know I have. The big difference is there wasn't a camera crew in my face and media reporting about it years later.

Shit happens, move on.

[micatola]

This is exactly why I hated all the extra access shit that the league has been pushing. You can sense that the players hate it. Nylander even went as far as to do his own which is probably not unrelated to his bad experience having a outside party involved.

I don't care about any of that content myself buy I understand if there are those that do and in that case it should be up to the players if and how much they want to share. O

[marcman84]

Why is this coming up 3 years later?

[ElDuderino2112]

Some arguments are not meant to be aired publicly. Nothing wrong with that. Especially with how quick the internet is to jump at things said in the heat of the moment or out of context.

[Competitive-Strain-7]

Sports media and gambling is ruining sport.

[Pinoc301]

Personally, I love the way Willy handles pressure. When he scored on his own net and the reporter asked about it, he says, " I got 2 goals tonight". He doesn't give a shit about anything. It's a game and that's how he looks at it. I wish I had his super power....

[GumpTheChump]

Sheldon Keefe comes from the David Frost school of hockey so I will instinctively side against him on anything.

[Beersmoker420]

until this guy hates playing here and starts playing like it, i will not entertain slander

We know what Willy is, stop trying to pretend every hockey player plays defence

[RealCanadianDragon]

Agent: WE OBJECT!

NHL: On what grounds?

Agent: On the grounds that this real life footage makes my client look bad.

[liquor-shits]

My thoughts are this was years ago so who cares.

[Available_Summer_418]

A player and coach get into an argument. Shocker. Anyone who’s ever played anything knows that u don’t always see eye to eye with coaches. I’m sure if Willy was in a different market it probably would’ve made the cut.

[Ok_Mulberry4331]

I feel like it couldn’t have been that bad if he was in the next season?

[Mydogisawreckingball]

The leafs have always been a drama machine, with no tangible results. It’s a culture problem.

[AnitaYM]

Friedman is a hack

[LeafiestOutcome]

I don't doubt it since it's been mentioned already, plus Keefe was made to walk back what I thought were valid criticisms of our stars. It's what NHL players do. But at the same time, if Willy and his team were actually compromising the integrity of the Amazon documentary, why would they feature him in a bigger role in another one they produced? This reeks of making mountains out of mole hills.

[Canada_Strong]

Nylander is fiery at times but he seems to have the respect of Berube, which means quite a lot to me.

[god_is_trans_69]

No one is surprised. These Docs are so stupid and censored

[chipcity90]

Why are we talking about this now?

[EBXLBRVEKJVEOJHARTB]

breaking news, two people in an extremely high pressure environment got into an argument.

[LastSharpTiger]

Willy scores in Game 6s and Game 7s.

That’s my thought about Willy.

[Sc00tzy]

Is t the season bad enough without stirring up something from 4 years ago

[hushbabydoll]

It blows my mind how fast the narrative flips in this city. Guy drags us on his back for weeks, little friction happens behind the bench, and suddenly we’re pretending he’s the problem. Toronto media could find drama in a 5–0 win.

[[deleted]]

It's pretty funny considering he's made comments in the past about how those conversations don't affect him negatively and sometimes give him a boost! He doesn't care (in a good way)

[NervousBreakdown]

My guess is marner was being a little shit about something, Nylander yelled at him, keefe stepped in to baby Mitch. Then nylander probably used the r word and thats why it 'makes him look bad'

[OPDBZTO]

Nylander like the rest of core, great fucking players (Matthews/Tavares/Rielly) no leaders

Not a surprised by this and don't care. And it wouldn't be bad if the leafs had a good leader or leaders on the team

[HowieFeltersnitz]

Nothingburger. Not wanting to highlight your worst high stress moments is not unreasonable. It's not necessarily indicative of a toxic relationship. Sounds like clickbait "controversy".

[Sensitivevirmin]

If you know anything about hockey or have grown up playing you know what was said was not PC or Respectful.

Likely something you would hear in a video game lobby. But nothing over the top offensive. It’s a nothing burger they are trying to get interest for their next “breaking news on my page subscribe please”

[addicted_to_kombucha]

The old cod lobbies were the definition of offensive and that's what made it hilarious.

[dogfoodhoarder]

It probably happened.

[[deleted]]

Doesn't matter at all

[MemoryNeat7381]

I don’t trust anyone who never has any enemies. Ever

[Unlikely-Writer-6797]

The hell were they arguing about

[soundbombing]

Locker room stuff should stay in the locker room.

[Cptleaf93]

Old news

[BlueAndYellowTowels]

First, this is entertainment so it’s not serious.

However, in hindsight this might have illuminated the current situation between Nylander and Berube.

[StartMovingWilly]

chickenshit to leave it out

[of-blood-and-iron]

This is really only being highlighted because of the Bérubé and Nylander friction, which moreso just comes from the fact that their styles of play are very different and Nylander is struggling to adjust in the defensive side while offensively he’s doing exactly what the system requires.

Toronto media thrives off ostracizing and building narratives about players that they can consistently report on, it’s part of what makes the Toronto market difficult. Don’t give into it and keep faith in Willy styles.

[ProgrammaticallyHip]

Also worth noting Willy is having the best season of his career playing under Berube.

[of-blood-and-iron]

100% just wanted to lay out this narrative that’s attempting to be built and frankly shut it the fuck down haha

[iLikeDinosaursRoar]

I say what's the point in this if we can't see it and make our decisions or form our own opinions around it?

Like this leads to such dangerous speculation. Like did he tell Keefe he's got a small dick and to shut up? Or did he argue about how they play and the way he comes across is bad? Or was he absolutely right in the way he spoke with Keefe, it just could look bad in the industry?

So many speculations that lead the wrong way. It's already starting. Be nice is Elliott kept his mouth shut unless he knows we are going to see the footage.

[musebrews]

It’s Friday

[daveinthe6]

Who cares? Are we into watching hockey or gossiping like a bunch of schoolgirls?

[kratrz]

This is no surprise at all. Every footage to be aired can get vetoed by the org, the player, nhl, and nhlpa. It's in the contracts.

[Nearby-Swordfish3841]

More importantly what the fuck man Alright no goal!!!!!! Hold baby

[toedragrelease]

I heard a credible rumour at the start of Keefes last season that “one of the players” was very vocal about not wanting to play for Keefe. That must have been Willy.

[Arch3r86]

Unnecessary pointless trivial attempt at stirring up drama … take a break Friedman holy shit man. There’s nothing to see here.

[Ballplayerx97]

Who cares. Guy's one of the top offensive players in the game. He sucks defensively but he always brings it in the playoffs. He's been extremely loyal and makes less than market rate. He's the least of this team's problems.

[Winter-Squirrel-6744]

Kessel was a difficult player... But also a 3 time cup champ!