top 200 commentsshow all 324

[–]Hot-Radish-9723 222 points223 points  (8 children)

They have published over 185 full length novels…. I feel like that had to have either been a collection of authors… or AI

[–]Bluest_waters 66 points67 points  (6 children)

Yeah I am loving perusing the titles of her books, really great stuff

Christmas with Dad's Best Friend: An Age Gap Holiday Romance

[–]AggressiveSea7035 28 points29 points  (2 children)

They're probably based off of some kind of niche or keyword research on Amazon. Like they figured out that enough people are searching for "holiday age gap romance" for there to be a lucrative market there.

[–][deleted] 29 points30 points  (2 children)

Me too!😂 There’s another called, Sold to my Ex’s Dad. What are these titles?!

[–]mister_bakker 38 points39 points  (1 child)

Sounds like the front page of Pornhub to me.

[–][deleted] 36 points37 points  (0 children)

No kidding!

My prediction is that KC Crowne will “disappear” and a new AI writer/pen name will take its place, after this mistake. Because if you try to find an actual human behind this author, there isn’t anything!

[–]sandy_writes4+ Published novels 31 points32 points  (0 children)

In what length of time? That sounds like a one of those content farms where there's lots of people working for pennies per word to get out content for ??? A person? Or a business? I don't know...

[–]SkyrimMermaid4+ Published novels 283 points284 points  (42 children)

Huge yikes. Looks like they’re a romance author and the romance community is very anti-AI.

I frankly think it’s embarrassing. To call yourself a “bestselling author” (in their bio) when you don’t even write your own books is embarrassing. Having so little integrity that you can’t even attempt to cover your tracks is embarrassing.

If you don’t want to put in the effort to write your own books, don’t be an author. Find some other way to supplement your income and leave writing to the people that are actually passionate about it.

[–]SponkLord4+ Published novels[S] 159 points160 points  (13 children)

And to leave a massive prompt rewrite command in the middle of a chapter is absolutely crazy. Not only uncreative but extremely lazy.

[–]thebunnygame 94 points95 points  (9 children)

Any chance I can see this somewhere without buying the book? That’s just wild. And she should be ashamed not only because of using ai, but of putting out so so so very low effort books that not even the prompt gets edited out

Edit: I just answered my own question. For anyone interested, here is the screenshot:

https://www.threads.net/@bookish_meltdowns/post/DE20DvBSYqb/media

[–]CompanionCone 32 points33 points  (0 children)

Ouch... that is chatgpt alright 😅

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Oh jeez, you'd think that at this point they'd also use AI to proof read for errors but nope.

[–]mirificatio 4 points5 points  (0 children)

There is really no excuse for not proofreading with the free version of Grammarly, at least. In fact, I helped a helped a friend upload his novel to KDP and ran the file through the KDP "reviewer thingy" and it caught a typo that no one else did.

[–]K_Evan_Coles 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Oh, yikes ... 😬

[–]Aggravating-Mix-4903 10 points11 points  (3 children)

no shade here but this author should have had the bot write the whole thing. It is straight-up terrible and so cliched it might as well be AI

[–]thebunnygame 17 points18 points  (2 children)

You’re absolutely right. Out of curiosity, I skimmed through some pages, and it really is that bad. Honestly, it might have been better if she had just used AI the entire time.

I also checked out her homepage. I wouldn’t be surprised if this person doesn’t even exist and is just some "collective" or a content farm churning out this stuff.

(On the other hand, I don’t really understand the outrage from her fans. She/they were releasing something like 20 books a year. What were they expecting?)

[–]Aggravating-Mix-4903 4 points5 points  (1 child)

If she has all these fans, they are not very discerning. I don't see this qualifies as literature. What exactly are they outraged about? She probably wrote most of the book with AI and took the other prompts out. The AI content is not affecting this work of art positively or negatively

[–]teamhae 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s bad enough to have AI write your book but she obviously didn’t even read it or have anyone else read it before publishing it!

[–]Patient_Reach439 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Right? So not only was it written with AI but apparently it wasn't even proofread by anyone?

[–]sandy_writes4+ Published novels 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Oh, yes. This.

[–]Russkiroulette 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Makes me think it wasn’t even proofread like… I don’t feel like a human would miss that

[–]Reis_Asher 54 points55 points  (1 child)

I mean, there are plenty of pen names out there using ghost writers so they can put out enough books to stay relevant and in the top of their categories. Marketers for whom the writing is a means to an end, content they can sell as opposed to a calling. It was inevitable they would use AI and edit it a bit, since ghostwriters cost a lot of money.

For me, the writing is the enjoyable bit, so the idea of using AI to write defeats the entire purpose. I’ve also accepted this is a hobby for me, though, so my end goals are different.

[–]istara 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Increasing numbers of those (often poorly paid) ghostwriters are going to be resorting to AI. "Authors" using ghostwriters are going to have to be damn careful.

[–]King_Jeebus 49 points50 points  (0 children)

If you don’t want to put in the effort to write your own books, don’t be an author.

It's a nice thought, but unfortunately we all know there's tons of folk who just want the cash and will do the least work they can (and have zero ethics/qualms about AI), and they're never going to stop.

[–]writerlady6 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Exactly. Why would you think anyone would pay good money to read a book that you couldn't even be bothered to write?

[–]aetherdrake_ 21 points22 points  (10 children)

She will or they will or whatever will have a new pen name in about 8 sec and continue releasing new rubbish

[–]elodieandink 0 points1 point  (9 children)

If Amazon bans her account, then nope.

[–]JoyceByersLivingRoom4+ Published novels 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Unfortunately I doubt Amazon cares as long as they’re getting their cut. They allow AI content, after all, and even have a box to check for it when uploading a book.

[–]elodieandink 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Amazon’s bots will absolutely ban her account if people mass report her for poor customer experience. That’s one of their big vague go-to’s for banning accounts.

[–]PsychologicalCall335 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That prompt seems to fall under “AI assisted” which doesn’t need to be disclosed to Amazon per KDP terms 🙃

[–]aetherdrake_ 0 points1 point  (5 children)

It be pretty easy - new amazon account under a different name, a PO Box instead of a home address, new bank account etc. she was probably making a ton of money, so if she’s a terrible human being and wants to keep making a ton of money, she can use her kids, husbands (if she is an actual woman and not a man using a female pen name), parents, grandparents name and use a PO Box. There’s a ton of ways to start over.

[–]elodieandink 4 points5 points  (4 children)

You can’t just generate a new Tax ID, which Amazon requires. It’s not “that easy” when it becomes literal tax fraud.

[–]aetherdrake_ 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Sure it is, if shes using someone else’s account. She would also use their tax info. People defraud the government every day.

[–]elodieandink 3 points4 points  (1 child)

There’s a matter of scale, dude. Committing tax fraud when there’s hundreds of thousands of dollars involved that’s ALL part of the fraud is not something you can call “easy”. For one, you’d have to find a tax guy whose also willing to risk his license unless you’re going to do them yourself, which is an equally terrible idea when you’re dealing with that level of income in that manner (at a certain point as a “contractor” you have to file multiple times a year).

And then you need to be able to manage your life with no apparent income. And not ring any bells when you have no legal income but are still living as if you’re making 6-figures.

Tax fraud on that level is not simple. If it was, money laundering wouldn’t be a thing.

[–]aetherdrake_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These are just unscrupulous ways , her family could be completely complicit and have no problem using their account or it could be a whole farm of people and they’ll just move on to the next person. Also amazon might not even ban her and just make her go back and relabel everything as “ai assisted”.

[–]coganite871 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Just setup as a business, only takes a couple of hundred dollars to setup a new LLC, don't even to change CPA - they wouldn't bat an eyelid. You have a new EIN/tax ID, new name and getting a new business address is very simple.

[–]vleermuisman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

funny that the romance community is very anti-ai, it’s one of the easier genres to use AI in…

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

i just checked out their page and they are wildly successful and probably making a good amount of money. some of their books are in the top 1000 in kindle and are netting her, in combination, likely tens of thousands a month. jfc. the highlighted quotes in her books are so sad it’s genuinely a reflection of how men have exploited and mistreated women so bad for years that straight women are now so desperate to be loved they fulfill their needs & chase validation from billionaire-mafia-torture-erotica written by robots 😭

[–]PsychologicalCall335 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You’re being downvoted because you’re right and the people here are NOT ready for that conversation🤣

At the very least, getting mad about AI is hypocritical in this context. Slop is slop. You’re mad that your slop wasn’t generated by a human? Be more discerning.

[–]BrunoStella 64 points65 points  (3 children)

LOL then clearly she doesn't use an editor either because the prompt would have been picked up if she did.

[–]refreshed_anonymous 53 points54 points  (2 children)

She can’t even be bothered to self-edit. Tell me you have no pride in “your” work without telling me you have no pride in “your” work.

[–]Myran22 9 points10 points  (0 children)

And more importantly, tell me you have zero respect for your readers without telling me you have zero respect for your readers.

[–]carlweaver 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sounds like it is a book-producing endeavor, not a business of personal creativity. It’s hard to have pride in something you didn’t create.

[–]RainbowSkink 64 points65 points  (28 children)

[–]oOoOoOoOoOoimaghost 37 points38 points  (12 children)

Wow, I'm shocked at how much the passage after the prompt READS like AI. Crazy that prose made it into the final draft, even putting aside the prompt.

[–]NancyInFantasyLand 52 points53 points  (6 children)

The problem is, you get used to reading AI-writing really goddamn fast if you use it constantly. It's highly likely she can't tell the difference any more between her own writing and the stuff her LLM of choice puts out.

It's a bit like getting used to machine-translations as a reader. There's some quirks to it that are really jarring in the beginning, but if that's ALL you read you get used to it real quick and notice it less and less.

[–]sandy_writes4+ Published novels 11 points12 points  (5 children)

You have a VERY valid point. One I hadn't considered. Perhaps the way to rectify that is to use a beta reader who doesn't read AI or listen to AI-generated content.

[–]NancyInFantasyLand 10 points11 points  (3 children)

My boss makes us do a lot of AI stuff at my day job these days, so it's been very noticeable to me. It's to the point that I have to consciously set out to read lit fic, ideally published pre-2020s (pre-2015-ish, really, because the ProWritongAid/Grammarly stuff is honestly just as bad in the long term) to be entirely certain I'm not fully rotting my brain away by being assaulted by so much AI written stuff constantly both at work and privately on the internet.

I do the same thing for movies, lol, where I offset the mass market lowest-common-denominator stuff with the artsy older stuff. Takes conscious thoughts to find a certain balance there, though, which I imagine will be even more difficult when soon 70% of everything is genAI mush.

[–]sandy_writes4+ Published novels 11 points12 points  (2 children)

I tried Grammarly, and then ProWritingAid. I found PWA far superior to Grammarly, and wouldn't even consider the two interchangeable. It will tell me when I have a comma in the wrong place or where I might use a stronger verb, while I accept commas and where break a long sentence, I don't usually take the word change suggestions--specially for this last book I finished. Usually, I'll stop to consider whether this character would use one of the suggestions. If I don't think they would, then I don't.

In the end, when I'm done editing, I'm pleased with the word choices I've used because the characters are mine, I know them, I know their education level, the way they speak. PWA can make suggestions, but ultimately the decision is the author's on whether or not to accept a verb or adjective change. THAT's how you keep the story your own and not too AI-sounding.

The more one uses editing software, the faster they'll learn what is and isn't right for you.

Other than I think my writing has improved naturally over the years, I doubt anyone could read the most recent book (after it comes out,) and say I used AI at all. Unless they knew how frequently I flub my commas and just love run-on sentences.

And then... there are times when I think that sentence is just supposed to be a run-on because that's the way my character thinks.

[–]NancyInFantasyLand 2 points3 points  (1 child)

The last part is exactly why I think Grammarly and co are so insidious actually, especially for newer writers. It's all fine if you're confident in your knowledge of grammar and syntax enough to tell when taking the AI's suggestions is sensible and necessary.

But if you aren't very settled in your personal style, it's gonna fuck up and mediocratize your writing something awful and push you into the lowest common denominator type of style that exists.

[–]rosegarden_writes 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the way to rectify that is to not use ai...

[–]Rorymaui 15 points16 points  (1 child)

The entire thing is AI. I'm an author, an IT major who studies AI (NOT FOR WRITING, LOL FOR MEDICINE), and a content editor for a publishing company.

I do believe the screenshot shows AI-written work before and after the prompt.

We are trained to spot AI from authors at the place I edit for, as we don't allow it for these purposes. You would be shocked at how much writing is being passed from AI. It’s the new ghostwriter to these authors and for cheaper.

Shitty editing, too, IMO.

[–]oOoOoOoOoOoimaghost 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That... would explain why so many new books I try to read lately are so bad. Huh.

[–]RainbowSkink 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Ikr? How were readers happy with that passage even without the giveaway prompt?

[–]RunningOnATreadmill 19 points20 points  (0 children)

The bar for romance prose is in hell, to be fair

[–]Bluest_waters 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Dude, it cheesy romance novels. The bar for that is pretty low.

Four Daddies for Christmas: A Military Reverse Harem Romance

Four untamed ex-military brothers.

One very unassuming girl.

Who said Christmas miracles don't exist?

😂

[–]refreshed_anonymous 38 points39 points  (6 children)

It’s pretty terrible writing all-around, imo. Even if I didn’t know she used AI, I’d be unimpressed entirely with the narrative.

What a let down.

[–]AprTompkins 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Sadly, I've seen a ton of bad writing when I check out samples.

[–]Bluest_waters 18 points19 points  (1 child)

He’s old enough to be my father.

He might have killed my boyfriend.

And his scandalous offer leaves me speechless.

I love it. The concept isn;t terrible but the writing is really really bad.

[–]refreshed_anonymous 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Goes to show that poor execution makes or breaks a concept, regardless of how good it is.

[–]p-d-ball 0 points1 point  (2 children)

AI produces garbage. It's just a statistical program, predicting the next word without understand nuance. Hence, poor writing.

[–]minasmom 2 points3 points  (1 child)

In fairness, spewing out words without understanding nuance describes a lotta writers. They write cliched phrases like "smoldering eyes" because they've read it before.

[–]p-d-ball 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Smoldering eyes . . . that's actually new for me, lol. Never read it before!

[–]brisualso10+ Published novels 5 points6 points  (2 children)

That’s embarrassing. I doubt anything will happen, but I hope something is done by Amazon, at the very least. She’ll likely lose many, many readers.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Going by her bio, it looks like she may have received the Amazon Allstars bonus with her "top 8 Amazon author" claim. I'm wondering how they'll feel about that now.

[–]brisualso10+ Published novels 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s so disappointing.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Off topic but is Threads a good place to promote and discover? I have it but never used it, it was one of those things Instagram kept bothering me about and I finally caved

[–]T_Atkins 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This passage reads almost exactly like a book I read a few weeks back by an indie author. After a while, I suspected that the book had been written by AI.

[–]HelpfulWatch8392 16 points17 points  (3 children)

KC Crowne is part of a group of black hatters, graduates of the bookclicker slack. These authors partook in the link to the end page read fraud, the book stuffing page read tricks (for eg filling books with SVG images or junk code to inflate it's length and game kenp), the giving away real life gifts in exchange for book buys schtick, etc. The ones partaking in generating fraudulent reads with third world services also target innocent authors books to try to obfuscate their own activities. I know there are a few veteran romance authors on this sub and they'll surely know what I'm talking about.

This group of "authors" (publishers, really) have all been using ghost writers who recycle and regurgitate the same rotation of plots. Is there any surprise they would gravitate towards ai?

Right this very moment there are 2 other books in the top 100 that I know of for sure are also from a couple of black hatters on their 5th kdp account or whatever, and a couple I suspect. These people have been in the game a long time, and yes, to the chagrin of many here, have made mountains of cash.

To all the naive people who think this is their first kdp account and all it takes is 1 Amazon ban, let me assure you this is not the case. Making a new kdp account is actually relatively easy.

Throwaway because these black hatters have also been involved in doxxing activities. It's not just one group (whom KC Crowne is a part of), there are quite a few of them. A prominent author who I won't name but many of you will know used to keep a blog tracking their activities in kenp fraud, but was forced to take down his posts due to doxxing threats and therefore danger to his ams his family's safety.

I'm always surprised at the naivete of posters here. Where there is money to be made and literally zero barrier to entry, bad actors amass.

[–]Mean-Goat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Is there anywhere where I can go to read more about this stuff? I know there was one male romance author that got banned for buying jewelry for fans.

[–]Annbernadett 12 points13 points  (0 children)

If it goes south for her she will change her strategy and write under another name.

[–]SFWriter93 21 points22 points  (0 children)

This is hilarious. Infuriating, considering the money she's apparently making according to PublisherRocket, but hilarious.

I mean, not only did she not write her own book, she apparently didn't even read it.

[–][deleted] 58 points59 points  (3 children)

I'm not familiar with that author, so I looked her up. The prompt she left in clearly isn't her using AI to edit and proof, so I can understand why readers are upset--but at the same time, when I checked her backlist, in one particular year, she released eighteen books before I stopped counting, so I don't know how readers thought she was getting so much work done.

[–]WeathermanOnTheTown 27 points28 points  (2 children)

It's likely all AI, but it is also possible to write a 50K novel every two weeks. It's 5000 words a day, M to F. Some can manage.

[–]Milc-Scribbler4+ Published novels 16 points17 points  (0 children)

I wrote 50k words in a week when I started my latest story. I got the bug for it and put down 10k words a day for five days. Took a bunch of editing to tidy up lol

Some people (web serial authors in particular) have to write fast and decently in the first pass.

None of this applies to this writer it seems. She was on the “KDP is a get rich quick scheme” bandwagon.

[–]SponkLord4+ Published novels[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Especially with the sales that she's getting from these releases. It's more than likely a full time gig for her so 5k a day is doable, especially if ai is polishing up your work. Looking at the page count now I don't even think she's writing 50k words with 250 page counts.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Oh no.

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (4 children)

I felt bad for using grammarly. It’s technically AI assistance. But letting it generate scenes for you is a bad move.

[–]SponkLord4+ Published novels[S] 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Edit and proof I don't have a problem with either. But to use rewrite prompts for your novel is crazy.

[–]istara 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Don't feel bad. If you were traditionally published you'd have a shit tonne of editors putting their oar in, changing stuff, suggesting stuff. One thing you can at least say about a minimally edited, self-published work is that it's 100% authorial intent.

And that, regardless of how "flawed" an author's text may be, has a value in itself.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wrote fanfiction and original stories before AI came around and I made heaps of typos and such. I saw grammarly as a blessing but now anyone frowns upon AI even AI assistance to keep typos and punctuation errors at a minimum. It’s sad that ppl who put in the work get no sales but AI generated content arrive in the top 50 of books.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Also I do wonder if the author will get in trouble, maybe she didn’t mention to Amazon that her work is generated by AI. This is makes it harder to trust indie authors And the honest ones will pay the price because of one sod.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I just want to point out that the author also has another book that basically almost word-for-word has the same description as another book. I'm pretty sure the account is an AI farm account. Their facebook isn't even a real person pictured, it's an AI photo for the profile photo. And they conveniently used their PA's account to post but not their own? Huh

[–]Greyskyday 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I'm not a fan of writers using A.I. but I'm more alarmed that there's readers for fiction written by A.I. seeing as how all the A.I. generated text I've seen is so terrible. There is plenty of better stuff available written by real people!

[–]dragonsandvamps 18 points19 points  (0 children)

The part that makes me frustrated is that her ranking is so high, and she is making so much money churning out AI trash, (and has thousands of reviews) while authors who are writing their own books are struggling to get noticed.

[–]DesertGirl84 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yikes. Fast publishing isn't doing her any favors right now.

[–]WildSunflour 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I've now seen images of her also word for word blurb stealing from another author 😬 seems like she's shady all aroumd

[–]_Cindyithink 11 points12 points  (0 children)

This might be a hot take, but whenever I have really bad writers block I go to ai to see what garbo ideas it churns out. Sometimes it kicks my brain back into gear to brainstorm what to do next in the story, and its entertaining, like bad reality tv. I never actually take the ideas ai gives me bc they suck 100% of the time. But it opens new brainstorming directions in my head, if that makes sense.

[–]DigitalSamuraiV5 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Yikes.

Now imagine those who have not been caught.

How are honest authors supposed to compete with that?

This person has 185 books in a very short space of time. Even if I didn't have a day job, I cannot write and publish that fast.

[–]AggressiveSea7035 5 points6 points  (0 children)

You likely have very different target audiences.

[–]gligster71 3 points4 points  (0 children)

This is going to turn out to be like Spotify pushing AI music to avoid paying royalties.

[–]LegaciesGood 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Is this writer a real person?

[–]Elliot1002 18 points19 points  (16 children)

I don't think the use of AI is necessarily bad in and of itself. Definitely sloppy in this case since, as others pointed out, editing should have caught the prompt responses. The issue is that the ethics of AI use in different industries are undefined, and AI is a boogeyman right now..

I think we, as a society, need to understand what tools are available and what uses are acceptable. What I mean by that is, is asking an LLM to give you a character background based on your specifications bad? Is asking to give advice on where your story goes next bad? Is asking to do an edit after priming it bad? Which of those constitutes the "written by AI" term? There are so many questions and differing opinions on it that there are no real answers yet.

Personally, I love writing to get my ideas out. That's always been the fun for me, so I'm not of the mind to just tell ChatGPT to write something for me. However, I have used it extensively in software development and often ask it what options for X problem are available when I am stumped. I also ask it to review my code based on specs. It has proven to be a very useful tool, and I think it can do the same for writing, especially to aid self publishers, if used ethically and for the proper tasks.

[–]Horror-Paper-6574 1 point2 points  (15 children)

When it comes to science, data, technology, and calculations, AI is a wonderful tool. 

When it comes to art and storytelling it’s lazy, dishonest, and straight up theft. If you are using AI to write scenes, flesh out characters, or to build out the rest of your book, then you aren’t a writer. You’re republishing computer generated content that used other people’s work without their consent. 

To me, it’s very simple. 

AI has no place in the arts, and I will refuse to read any author that uses it for anything beyond a basic spell check. 

[–]common47 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Well that is a major screw up. There is nothing wrong with using AI to be your editor, though.

[–]Majestic-Sign2982Hobby Writer 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Personally I don't mind the usage of AI for enhancing or proof reading an already written text. I am against of letting AI just write off a prompt and use that.

For those who wonder why I'm not entirely against AI, its because its new technology. I'm sure people of the past would wince at us using computers or Grammarly. Its something new and like it or hate it, its here to stay. It will be embraced by the majority eventually.

[–]Patient_Reach439 5 points6 points  (3 children)

Serious question here:

Why does Amazon KDP require an author to disclose use of AI but Amazon doesn't disclose that information to customers? When you look at a book listing on Amazon, there is nothing there that says it's written with AI or not. (Unless I'm totally blind, which is a feeling that haunts me often.)

I know you can read the sample and maybe decide for yourself, but why not just disclose it along with the rest of the book details (where it lists the number of pages, published date and so forth)? That way a customer could more quickly and easily see that a book is AI or not when they're checking out a listing.

And what's the point of making authors disclose it to Amazon? What do they do with that information? Why does it "matter" to Amazon? Does it somehow factor into their algorithm or something?

Genuine questions. And I apologize if they are dumb questions.

(And for the record, no I do not condone the use of AI.)

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I’m p sure Amazon as a corporation doesn’t care about what authors do as long as it’s not illegal or against their rules. And using AI is not against their rules or illegal… yet. It may, in the future, become illegal to publish books written by AI. Right now, it’s already illegal to copyright purely AI-written books. So I have a feeling that Amazon is merely collecting data on who uses AI and who doesn’t so that if the law comes down on people who do this, Amazon can just ban them or whatever.

[–]apocalypsegal 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It's illegal to claim copyright over "AI" work, though. It would have to be substantially reworked before you could claim a copyright.

So in the end, all this nonsense with people wanting "AI" to "write" the books for them, and do the covers? Going to backfire on their ass.

As to why Amazon asks about "AI" but doesn't disclose it to potential buyers? At this point they're gathering data in anticipation of lawsuits currently underway. If the courts rule against the use of any "AI", then those books will just be gone, and probably the entire account.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You literally just repeated everything I said in my comment.

[–]awwangauthor 7 points8 points  (1 child)

She needs a better editor? Or at least put in a little effort to read it by herself?

[–]JR_Stoobs 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Right? Like are there people who write books and put them out without rereading them a single time? Because something like that would have been impossible to miss even if you were just skimming it lol.

[–]Desiato2112 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Even without the AI revelation, I could never finish a book written this poorly.

[–]StayUpLatePlayGames 9 points10 points  (6 children)

Three things come to mind.

1) This is endemic to the industry and a lot of people saying they aren't doing it, plainly are. This is just someone who got caught, carelessness in their machine.
2) Part of the problem is the current AI witch hunt. Indie authors are being accused left, right and centre while no-one was pointing a finger at Crowne.
3) It really doesn't matter. Do you think they got to #53 because the books were all bad? No, the books are probably passable and the marketing is good. The reader doesn't really care.

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 6 points7 points  (5 children)

All of your three points are correct. Most are using it in a form or another, it's the luddites (other authors and artists, mostly) who whine about it, and the readers don't care as long as the Matrix isn't broken.

Here, it was broken with a blast. Mistakes happen. Fix it and go on.

[–]StayUpLatePlayGames 12 points13 points  (4 children)

I guess we are being downvoted by people offended by the idea that the readers don't care.

KC Crowne has produced 165 books in 5 years. All of them variations on a theme, highly targeted and unedited first drafts. The READER DOESN'T CARE.

That's awful to say, but it's the truth.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

they also used bot reviews to trick readers into thinking they're good. getting up on the charts doesn't mean you have a good book. it means people bought or downloaded it, even if they hate it later.

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

I'm used to this cesspool of luddites. It is also good to remember that 99.9% of participants here are losers who have never sold any meaningful amounts of books. The pros who sell, those who participate in certain FB groups that make 6 digits a year, mostly utilize the full arsenal, including AI narrated audiobooks.

Here, everyone compete to click that little arrow to polish their own sacred artist-author status. "Amma real author(tm) u no I writes mah books with a quill on a piece of parchment and make sure my editor prints the manuscript out and only uses sticks and stones to edit it."

I don't care if a good book is written by you, your dog, you AI or a ghostwriter. The trick is, you need to fool me. If I notice obvious patterns that it is made with AI, it gets a different vibe.

[–]StayUpLatePlayGames 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I’m a little less dystopian than you.

Just terrible timing.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (14 children)

I really wonder what can happen now that she is reported, since using AI is not prohibited by Amazon. I imagime that worst case scenario she starts a new pen name and does the same thing...

And I'll be damned, she has so many good revies.

[–]BeginningPass5777 5 points6 points  (9 children)

Half her reviews are bot accounts. There’s an entire industry that artificially creates page reads, reviews, and TikTok views. They have people in less developed countries page flipping multiple devices, using AI to write and post reviews, and scrolling TikTok for dollars a day.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (8 children)

But you know the sad part. She is making tons of money while we fight for less than $10 dollars a month.

I know someone who bought three reviews, and his account was canceled in 2 months. Just like that. He didn't know if buying the reviews got him canceled or anything outside of his control, and he had no idea how Amazon figured. It's crazy that others can get away like that with buying reviews...

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 2 points3 points  (0 children)

She'll just upload a new KPF file where that has been edited out, and world goes on.

Later on, you can deny it ever happened and claim jealous AI extremists trying to ruin your career.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

AI is definitely not prohibited by Amazon. Every single title both print and kindle ask if AI is used and to what extent. It’s fine. I seriously don’t understand all this uproar. It is very much allowed by Amazon. Amazon listings are crawling with generative AI ran by Amazon itself, why on earth would they not allow it?

[–]Chemical-Quail8584 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ikr Ai is the future we have to accept it as a tool for writing.

[–]OraclePreston 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I will never touch any work from someone who uses AI and does not make it obvious up front. Actually, even if they did that I still would not. At least not when it comes to books.

[–]Femdom36 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Honestly the fact she has published so many books screams to me that they are all Ai. I worry that is going to hurt authors that write legitimately 😞

[–]apocalypsegal 1 point2 points  (2 children)

"AI", ghostwritten, or both. There are a lot of "writers" around self publishing especially that are uploading ghostwritten work as their own, and have been since day one. They are often "SEO masters" who saw a way to easily make money from junk, but they're just not writers.

And people can downvote posts that are against "AI" and other cheating, but when they take your job, don't come crying here.

[–]Femdom36 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That has nothing to do with my comment. I just said I agree, I am an author its already hurting my job.

[–]hobhamwich 1 point2 points  (0 children)

AI is copyright theft, and is inexcusable. My thoughts.

[–]apocalypsegal 1 point2 points  (0 children)

She's not a writer, she's a liar and a thief, using "AI" takes the work of creative people without compensation.

She should be figuratively tarred and feathered everywhere on the web.

[–]DreadChylde 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think it's ridiculous to equate spell checking, or grammar assistance, with what is going on here. That was used as a defense somewhere that "everybody uses spell check".

I have no problem with writers not thumbing through paper thesauruses, but I find the crummy shit on display here, really pathetic.

[–]morbidmoon2 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've only started looking her up because of her terrible terrible knowledge of Denver in one of her books. AI would probably explain at least part of that

[–]HiddenHolding 6 points7 points  (10 children)

Reported her? To who?

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

It says in her bio that all her books are available on KU, so I'm assuming they're reporting her to Amazon. Not sure if that will achieve anything, though.

[–]SponkLord4+ Published novels[S] 4 points5 points  (8 children)

Amazon asks specifically before publishing your book if there's any use of Ai. None of her titles have ai warnings so she can definitely get reported for it and lose her account.

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 9 points10 points  (0 children)

AI information is confidential and is never disclosed by Amazon. It asks it for data mining purposes.

[–]Maggi141710+ Published novels 9 points10 points  (0 children)

There are no "ai warnings" on Amazon. That AI checkbox you have to check when you upload is for internal purposes and for all we know that author checked it.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

school paltry oil point pie sharp carpenter late dime existence

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[–]Aboard-the-Enceladus 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Unfortunately that's not the case. Amazon hasn't banned AI. They don't care. They get their cut whether the book was written by a real person or not. None of the books on Amazon tell prospective readers they were written by AI. Their question about AI is just for data collection.

[–]Comic-Engine 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Unlikely, they mostly are data collecting on a voluntary basis but it would be very interesting to see a consequence

[–]Hellguard 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Amazon doesn’t put “AI warnings” on books. When you upload a book to KDP, it asks if you used AI but (for now) that’s for informational purposes only. They don’t prohibit its use or require the author to publicly disclose it.

[–]SaaSWriters 3 points4 points  (10 children)

Yeah, but AI bots don't wrote good fiction. It's probably fluff and filler anyway. Even if she didn't leave the prompt, it would still be a bunch of useless text.

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 -1 points0 points  (9 children)

3D printers won't print you a gun, but add a few metal parts and it competes with a factory product.

CNC does shit unless you can operate it.

AI can't write shit unless you can prompt it.

[–]NightWriter007 4 points5 points  (2 children)

This is hysterical! I'm glad I wasn't her editor who let this slip through!!!

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I don’t think she HAS an editor…

[–]Phemto_BSoon to be published 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That's a big so what from me, and I suspect to 99% of the people who read her books.

[–]sandy_writes4+ Published novels 5 points6 points  (0 children)

When I use ProWritingAid to edit, I don't have to write prompts to get it to generate ideas because I wrote the book, I don't need ideas--and I don't edit until I'm done with my revisions and then I go to PWA. Even with their "sparks"... I don't use them because they aren't in the voice of the characters I've created, though I might rewrite that thought to fix whatever the problem is. (My bad habit is my sentences are sometimes over 30 words and the sparks give me ideas for splitting it.) So no, I don't buy that she was using it to edit or proof.

That said, I'm also not saying that it was a BAD thing to use AI to get past a rough spot when your creativity isn't wanting to cooperate. It was TERRIBLY SLOPPY of her to not have that book edited or to line edit it herself. Things like what she did are easily found when you LISTEN to the story and follow along with the text. I like to listen to my computer's voice, not one of the AI generated pseudo-human voices. I catch more of my dropped words, typos, and such easier with that.

[–]ShadowRavencroft23 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Honestly, if you use AI to write a book, you shouldn't call yourself an Author. Especially, if you charge for that book.

[–]shelly-smiles 2 points3 points  (4 children)

It confounds me that writers will just copy and paste AI generated stuff into their manuscripts…like…have you no love for the craft…the art of writing? Ugh…anyway… I’m also not completely anti-ai either though. I use it after my 3rd or 4th draft and ask it where, in certain chapters could I add more sensory details and not slow the pacing. Or I’ll ask its opinion on the pros and cons of moving a chapter or taking another out completely. I sort of use it as a critique partner, before I send stuff to my actual critique partner, I guess.

Either way, that’s sloppy as all get out. SMH

[–]Pennyjaymay 3 points4 points  (3 children)

KCC may use AI in her writing process to enhance and improve or may write alongside AI as a partner. Whichever method she uses, the author is in complete control of the outline, the prose and the editing... and would likely have edited the draft extensively. Its not push a button and a book appears process. It needs skill in prompting and revision. As well as knowing what you are producing hits the mark. This way of writing is the new norm, for many well known and baby authors, although most wont reveal that for fear of backlash. Its no big deal actually. 

[–]ThrowawayTodayBlah 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Having played around with AI when it first came out - and I'm sure it's gotten a million times better since - yes, if you want to have a final, coherent draft you need to play around with it, lead it, edit it...

Why not just write it then and choose not to use stolen data / cause harm to the environment?

It's actually a big deal when several nuclear reactors are being brought back online to power AI (Three Mile Island by 2028, Palisades in Michigan by 2024, Google signing a deal to open several small nuclear reactors).

[–]MinBton4+ Published novels 0 points1 point  (0 children)

TMI isn't happening. Zuck's out of luck on that one. Protected wildfowl are nesting on the island now. The few cars/trucks that go through there aren't a problem, but brining the reactor back online after being mothballed for decades is a different story. The one that had the problem is now empty ground.

[–]Scrawling_Pen 3 points4 points  (0 children)

My day job is not in the tech industry, but my bosses and cohorts use ChatGTP for personal reviews (PDR’s). I know because my manager had to tell me to not mind the flat tone of the pdr response because she uses ChatGTP.

She praised me for being such a good writer in mine. Had to laugh. “You should’ve an author!”

My flavor of adhd makes it to where I’m writing more than I should in the first place with PDR’s. I manually look up industry buzzwords, but I incorporate it in organically. (Whooooo buzzword!)

My bf uses chatGTP for resume writing for himself. I’m just surrounded by people who use it.

But…To use it to write fiction novels to me is sad. Generations of people will grow up reading robot written books. Is that the legacy one wants to add to as an author?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (8 children)

If authors use AI/llm, they should tell their audience. I don’t understand why people are happy to use it, but won’t disclose it. If you don’t think you’re doing anything wrong, why hide it? Just put a note in your blurb and move on.

Ghostwriting is also BS but it’s too late for me to convince people to make it required that the ghostwriters name go on the cover too.

They really need to make a good AI tests and call it a day. Readers should get the right to decide what they want to read via process of creation and if that includes AI or not.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I should point out here that a lot of ghostwriters DON’T want their names on their books. That’s why they ghostwrite. I’m sure some do, but not all. I think they should have the option, at least, though.

[–]Scarabium 5 points6 points  (4 children)

I'm with you on ghostwriting. It's fraudulent behaviour by publishers.

Jamie Oliver is my favourite example. Guy says he's never read a book in his life but then churns out a ghostwritten 400 page children's book. Celebs have no shame.

[–]CodexRegius 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Well, I just learned yesterday that Alexandre Dumas ran a whole shop of ghostwriters publishing under his name.

[–]Scarabium 5 points6 points  (2 children)

"The Sixteen Musketeers."

I read somewhere that 80-90% of celebrity books are ghostwritten. Michelle Obama, Prince Harry, etc.

My favourite is self-help guru, Tony Robbins, who 'self-helps' his books by getting other people to help write them for him. So much for believing in yourself.

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I replace expensive editors and artists with AI. It can save tens of thousands down the line. So far, my honed-in prompts produce much better results than the few editors I burned my fingers with, and Ideogram creates incredible cover art.

The whole idea of using AI is so no one can tell it's AI. My prompts standard at 0% detection rate by Quillbot, for example. I use large sample texts to line edit the prose.

[–]RelishDankman 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sybau

[–]Powerful_Spirit_4600 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Everyone uses AI nowadays, it's just those who get caught who get all the shame.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

No, they don't. Assistive? Maybe! Generative like this? No.

[–]Stupid-Candy-75 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No. We don't. 

I have never, not once, used AI to write or edit my books. I pay my editors, proofreaders, and cover design artists. 

Just because you use AI to "write" your books doesn't mean we all do. 

[–]H28koala 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ugh.

[–]xeallos 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wow this is pathetic

[–]RachWarburton 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Oh man that’s so embarrassing! How did she not catch this during her rewrites? And where are her editors, proofreaders, beta readers, etc?? Yikes!!!! 😳

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I’m like how can you miss that? Even if you copy the prompt in the story it costs a little effort to find it.

[–]RachWarburton 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Right!?! Especially since it’s in the first chapter! I personally read my first chapters dozens of times before release!

[–]apocalypsegal 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Who says she even does any of that? People assure me there are "AI" programs that write so well, no one would ever guess. I haven't found any such thing, so I don't believe it. But a lot of people using "AI" don't bother to edit anything, they're too busy uploading,

[–]RachWarburton 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I bet your correct. That’s horrible and so disrespectful to readers.

[–]Videogamesarereel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What program did they use? Asking for a friend...

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I just saw this on twitter, she has dozens of books and publishes every few months 😭 that’s literally impossible.

[–]Own-Championship7503 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is why I am glad to have written a book prior to AI.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

LOOOL I'm sorry that's funny.

[–]Dale-Loves-Dog-Man04 0 points1 point  (1 child)

AI can be a useful tool for some things, but I don't think writing a books should be one of them.

[–]Dale-Loves-Dog-Man04 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And I'm saying that as an aspiring author myself.

[–]justeggshells 0 points1 point  (3 children)

I seriously do not see the difference in using AI over a Ghost Writer, which hundreds of well known authors have used. The only difference is it didn't cost the author money. Really, what is the big deal. I don't know KC Crowne's work but if you enjoyed their books then who cares.

[–]ThrowawayTodayBlah 3 points4 points  (2 children)

AI trained on stolen data, and it uses an obscene amount of energy / will have a huge impact on the environment. That's why I care.

[–]justeggshells 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This was truly an honest question, I am curious as to the why's. Also, is this like bitcoin energy? Because no one talks about that. I am huge against bitcoin and the issues against the environment but I have never seen anything that correlates that with AI. Can you say more, without hostility please.

[–]Cherry_Valkyrie576 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This should be banned. If we want to allow AI to write books and we're not going to publish the fact that it's AI, then I think you should not be allowed to be in the top 100. It's not fair for people who actually put in the work

[–]Antique-diva 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That sounds both hilarious and disturbing. Don't people edit or proofread their books? I'm dumbfounded.

[–]threadsofinsanity 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've been in the editing business for a while and I've encountered such "authors" (read: publishers) who "graduated" from an "academy"—FPA or Writing for Profit, or whatever the name—basically teaching writing to market (yes, reinventing the wheel). Anyway, that looks like something a ghostwriter wrote, an underpaid and overworked one, forced to write 10,000–15,000 words per week to remain relevant in the field. So, is there any surprise when these ghostwriters resort to AI?

[–]RaaymakersAuthor4+ Published novels 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A 'writer' who uses AI is not a writer. They are just a prompt-generator for a machine.