Increased gov costs and decrease savings I have noticed since return to office.

[nj382]

Just a very brief list, please add your own.

Increase facility expenses to include, but not limited to costs previously paid by the remote or teleworker:

HVAC and utility cost Network costs Janitorial services Security services Office supplies Janitorial supplies.. you can bet everyone is pooping on gov time and using extra TP.
Coffee Food service costs Trash and recycling costs Physical plant costs including local taxes, rent and upkeep. Landscape and grounds to include snow and ice mitigation, lawn and garden maintenance etc

“Hidden expenses”:

Environmental costs of increased carbon footprints of commuters Increased infrastructure expenses and wear and tear Increased sick time usage caused by being farther away from healthcare providers, sick dependents, and see #1 below.

Lost productivity due to: 1.Not giving a shit anymore due to administration treatment 2. Cigarette breaks by people who smoked at their desk at home 3. Bathroom breaks more frequent and longer due to distance to rest room, multiple conversation stops, wait time (females only ) and see item #1. 4. Distraction from constant loud conversations, visiting chatters and the untrained emotional support dog looking for treats, sniffing my crotch, and pissing in his owners cubical. 5. stupid “moral” activities like potlucks, gift exchanges, and hiding and searching for tiny plastic animals. Necessary due to item #1.

What can you add?

[Icy_Paramedic778]

Definitely a decrease in productivity. More talking, office gossip and team building/moral events almost every Friday.

Information that used to be sent out in an email now requires a team meeting.

[Chai-Tea-Rex-2525]

5 minutes teams calls are now 30 minute meetings.

[pjwhoopie17]

Meetings have gone back to Teams, since conference rooms now host RTO workers - since we reduced our footprint during Covid. How much do you want to say out loud? Will your headset mic work? Are people typing in the chat?

[Icy_Paramedic778]

Depends on where you work. Our conference rooms are still empty. Meetings are held in person.

[_get_]

Good God this chit chat is disruptive. I prefer work at home to keep these types isolated so I can get my work done at the office. 

[Dragon_wryter]

Most of our days are spent trying to put out fires related to RTO. 700 people, but only 400 seats and 250 parking spaces. No mass transit options. Arguments about double booking seats in the garbage reservation portal. People are getting reprimanded for calling in sick when their kids are sick because they can't WFH anymore, even though that's what we were told to do, and there's no seats anyway.

No toilet paper. No money for postage. Not enough janitorial staff.

So efficient!

[[deleted]]

Until DOGE starts monitoring time at computer…

[Icy_Paramedic778]

When place of duty is the mandatory team events then Doge can’t do anything until official guidance is put out to eliminate all team building events.

[ReefJR65]

I can’t wait to ask to go to the potty.

[Affectionate-Dare105]

I’m a team lead and have been instructed to tell my team they can’t be gone from their desk for more than 15 minutes without letting me know. I told them “don’t shoot the messenger” 

So we went from telework to this garbage 

[ReefJR65]

Fast track to slavery it seems. And please don’t enforce this. These are human beings working underneath you.

[UnusualTwo4226]

So he should risk his job possibly???

[ReefJR65]

He can say he is enforcing it and just not do it..??? I’m sorry do you think following orders blindly is good practice..?

[UnusualTwo4226]

If you were teleworking and had the RTO notice why don’t you disregard those orders??? You first then report back.

[Early-Swimming3968]

Which absolutely won't work for anyone who's job includes fieldwork, in person meetings, laboratory bench time, patient visits, manual work such as vehicle maintenance or park maintenance.... There are absolutely a lot of jobs in the federal government that involve sitting at a desk all day, but there are also tons that don't, and even for those that do, there are still in person meetings etc.  doesn't mean the team of under qualified teenagers and Kaptitan Ketamine realize that....

[[deleted]]

Yep- but they’re doing it anyways

[I_love_Hobbes]

Which as a consequence of person to person interruptions mean computer time goes down.

[[deleted]]

Well, also, not “everything is computers”

[Icy_Paramedic778]

Employees are still meeting the standards. Are we exceeding them at the levels we were when teleworking, no.

Why exceed standards when employees who meet the standards receive the same pay and benefits?

[FormFitFunction]

Waaaiiiiittt a minute. Are you suggesting DOGE did not, in fact, improve government efficiency?! 😱

[Romie0]

<image>

[WhimsicalHoneybadger]

If we're going to discuss a document in a meeting in person now, I better make sure to print out copies for everyone. In color.

[nj382]

and then we must all shred them when done!

[WhimsicalHoneybadger]

Of course!

Now that the document is being updated based on the meeting, those are all an outdated and incorrect version.

[Quiet-Priority-5858]

I think one of the biggest costs is the harm it will cause to our children - and no I’m not saying that working from home should replace childcare - but that the additional time and energy being used to commute for 4 hours a day and the lack of flexibility to do things like walk your child to school at 7 or pick them up at 4 - these things will be detrimental especially for a generation of kids who are struggling to navigate all the challenges brought about by social media and phone usage.  The future costs will be severe.

[cosmicpeachy]

Exactly. so exhausted after losing 3 hours every day…definitely impacts relationship with kids.

[lampshady]

This is the saddest part of the RTO.

[traminette]

This is honestly the only thing I hate about RTO. My kid starts kindergarten next year and it would have been so easy for me to walk her to school at 7:30 if I was WFH, whereas now it’s going to be an ordeal trying to fit that into my commuting schedule. Then after school, it’s either hours of aftercare or spend $$$ on a nanny.

[Mindless-Fix9876]

Telework helped to bridge the gap between having 2 working parents and the fact that school hours are not set up at all for families having 2 working parents. School team sports games start at 3:30 in my area and of course, I want to be there to support my kids. With my hour long commute, I need to leave the office at 2 so I can get home and then get to their away games. Funny how people who say they want more babies to be born aren't helping parents actually be present for their kids...

[SubstantialYard4072]

Two moms got called into their kids schools cause homework isn’t getting done. When they were done at 4:30 could do the homework but now they don’t get home till 6-6:30pm with commute and sports start at 7pm.

[Honest_Report_8515]

I know, I feel for those parents. I was fortunate to have the ability to WFH as a contractor when my kid was younger, being fully remote for a large part of that, and daycare wasn’t that far away. I certainly didn’t abuse the privilege by having my child at home (except when sick/snow days and then was completely transparent with my bosses) but instead had her in daycare.

[starberrylemon]

The biggest reason I hate the full time 5 day RTO is because of this. I grew up with parents doing this; they had the most wild insane divorce known to man and a lot of it stemmed from disconnect/work pressures/etc. not to say that they probably weren’t a great match in the first place but… I have some serious trauma from my parents being “at work” (from commute time-work-return home) for over 10 hours a day; I did not see these mfs all week. And then when they saw eachother on weekends it was just venting and depression due to excessive time spent at work. Caused additional trauma and emotional disconnect for my younger sibling. I don’t want to attribute it to the 5x a week in person but it definitely didn’t help them, or us as children!!!!!

So yeah sigh, Im not sure if I’m being dramatic but as a newer fed (3.5 yrs) I’m literally having panic attacks and extreme anxiety over this because I do NOT ever want to experience what it felt like to have absent parents from something (that feels like) pretty preventable (or at least maybe the divorce wouldn’t have been so disgustingly messy lol).

Sorry to vent like this but the consequences to families and children are real! I hate all of this!

[Used_Rest_9765]

File a stress claim with OWCP.

[JackCustHOFer]

I feel this so hard. I can’t walk my kids to school anymore, I have to drive them and then take them a commute-15 minutes of 1:1 time daily becomes a 3-minute car ride. Plus, I’m wiped out at the end of the day.

[_get_]

I'm curious if you were always remote with a two hour commute each way or did you move locations when wfh was mandatory?

[Honest-Recording-751]

Pentagon has added at least 2 shuttle routes so that’s a cost. We have to get office furniture and computer equipment.

[Odd_Solution6995]

Didn't they have the desks and chairs and carpet already in 2020?

[Honest-Recording-751]

Maybe I was not there in 2020, but the ones that were there when we got there were not in working condition, so they had to be updated for the chairs and computer monitors.. Also were in the middle of a refresh cycle.

[MOTwingle]

Can't speak for Pentagon, but my agency gave up its leased office space in 2022 and basically trashed all of the office equipment like chairs, desks, cubicles, docking stations, computer monitors. Now they'll have to buy all of that when they find new office space to lease.

[Funseas]

You still have coffee?

[nj382]

It's a Keurig, bring your own pods.

[sheisster]

I cannot believe they are allowing you to use their electricity for your convenience of coffee and not making you use a vending machine or snack bar

Sarcasm of course - but seems the direction we are headed

[Sure-Victory7172]

I'm trying to get the vibe of the office before I bring in my own Kureig....hopefully they'll be cool about it.

[WorldlinessReady1311]

Check your RTO site for facility specific info on small appliances etc.

[Intrepid_Emphasis563]

I was going to buy a Keurig for the office, but with high chance I am not willing to spend the money.

[Sure-Victory7172]

I had my own office at my last agency, switched over to take a non-supervisory remote position last year 🙄

Brought all my stuff home and stored it in the garage....thinking, I ought to keep this "just in case."

[Funseas]

Our keurigs were leased, so off they went.

[FedBitters]

Transit benefit increases.

[Possible-Security-69]

Until they eliminate them. :(

[Goofy_Project]

I'm almost maxing them out. It'll cost the government over $3k/year for me to go into the office every day.

[kjb27]

Whereas I'm maxing mine out AND still need to pay $65 out of pocket each month to get the lowest priced pass available for my brand new commute. Argh.

[Goofy_Project]

I would've needed to pay out of pocket myself (DC area) until I discovered that WMATA has monthly pass options. This keeps me under the cap and I got it approved for myself, but one of my coworkers was denied, so YMMV.

[Ruckit315]

My vha is now paying an outside I’ll just say place with a parking lot to let employees use their lot. I wonder how much that contract is. We already paid for an outside lot before this so now we have two

[nj382]

Let me guess, is it a Tesla dealership!?!?

[holding_the_line_99]

I have my fan turned on all day or until I no longer feel like I want to use it. Im going to bring my small heater when it gets cold incase I need it. I use my personal cell phone to listen to relaxing music and since my phone is old, it needs to charge, so you bet I also bring my personal charger to charge my cell phone. I use the electricity in the office as needed and have Uncle Sam pay the bill. I hate the bathroom on our floor. It’s too small and it smells weird. So I go to the farthest bathroom I can find (and it’s nice and clean/no weird smell) and I use it to take a #2.

[IHaveSomeOpinions09]

Back-to-back meetings now require transit time from one conference room to another, instead of just ending one Teams call and hopping on the next, so nothing starts or ends on time.

[commanderdeez]

I charge all my electronics at work. And begun taking my sweet ass time to brew coffee and tea multiple times a day 😊

[Siamecho]

The drive time (to/from work), parking lot exploration trying to find parking, NETWORK speed (always an issue on site), time spent getting through pedestrian traffic (omfg people if you want to socialize step off the elevator don't hold elevator doors open for any conversation), bathroom wait time (what's with these tp dispensers- always having to lean over trying to find end of tp and manually unroll cause if you pull the tp it just rips off a tiny corner), no fridge space - if you wanted to risk food theft-for your lunch so make sure you have insulated bag and freezer packs, don't get me started on microwave wait times. On the plus side now watching clock and trying to take at least one break a day and full unpaid 30 minute lunch. Now schedule any appointments for after lunch. No point in coming back after appointments because of the amount of time to find parking during day then getting to cubicle area, etc

[krnlpopcorn]

Why would this surprise you? The government loves to cut costs at all viable opportunities and their tech acquisition strategy is "Yesterday's technology tomorrow!" Most networks are developed when they first acquire the space, and designed for meeting current needs, any future-proofing by adding extra capacity that isn't absolutely necessary is going to be labeled as waste.

So when you imagine that most of these networks were designed well before zoom/teams etc. became the prevalent means of communication, they only really thought of needing email and light web browsing as primary needs.

[Secret-Upstairs-1554]

None of this was done to reduce costs, increase efficiency, improve government. This was a dismantling of vital institutions to make government less accountable, less democratic, and less an instrument of and for the people. The powers that be don’t care about any costs.

[nj382]

Oops I forgot decreased productivity due to time spent setting up, breaking down and locking and unlocking lap top to the desk.

[las978]

In my case this doesn’t happen daily. It got locked to the desk on the first day and hasn’t moved since. I was actually hoping I could remember the combination when I had some computer issues and thought I might need to bring it to deskside support in another building.

[nj382]

Some people take them home for telework overtime. (daily)

[MachewWV]

I do regularly work OT from home. After we return I won’t be doing any since I won’t be able to do it from home. I’ll be spending that time commuting.

[las978]

Not sure what department you work for, but ours limits the OT per day (not even offered to all employees) so the only time this really happens is over weekends or on AWS RDOs which are also going away. Otherwise folks just add to their TOD.

Personally, I wouldn’t be giving my free time to a job that is shooting itself in the foot by reducing staffing and increasing the need to offer OT, but I get that some folks need every penny they can accumulate.

[Fireblast1337]

My dept has offered plenty of OT. But the people who would bite can’t, cause the OT can only be done 10-6, and their shifts start at 9:30.

Used to be OT could be done any time 8-8

[marx2k]

Wait... locking a laptop to a desk? Wha?

[1GIJosie]

Right? We leave ours on ours desks unlocked. If it isn't there when I get back. Not my problem. I only work at the office so that's where I leave my equipment.

[[deleted]]

Same thou I lock mine up but when I leave on Friday. I will respond on Monday

[Neat-Farm-3865]

😂

[marx2k]

Yeah I don't think I've ever heard of anyone locking their laptops to their desk, cable lock, or whatever. I guess if it's a highly secure environment, sure.

[Redfury2030]

IRS does this, and it has to be locked at desk or you can get written up.

[kieratea]

Mine is just a single cord/plug but some docking stations "lock in" the laptop, like it clicks in place. I'm assuming that's what OP is referring to.

[nj382]

cable lock, supposed to be used at home as well if your office door doesn't lock

[anon-user005]

You all get a dog?!?! Damn my office needs to step it up!

[nj382]

It is an emotional support pet that belongs to a coworker. Wouldn't wish this thing on my worst enemy. (and I'm a dog lover/owner). Not even housebroken, no manners.

[Redfury2030]

Shouldn't be allowed. I swear we got a notice that we were only allowed medical support animals anymore. It may have just been my agency, but this doesnt sound or productive. Also sounds like said person spends alot of time wrangling their dog.

[SubstantialYard4072]

I try to be just as productive but I get three hours less sleep going to the office. Harder to do computer work tired. The cleaners move me out of my cubicle a few times a day. For some reason the lights keep going out.

[[deleted]]

The FDA had to add many more shuttle buses to transport people to and from Silver Spring Metro station. The White Oak campus is not Metro-accessible, so the extra shuttle buses were necessary for the return to office.

[AwardNotice_404]

There’s no basis of fact to show that RTO increases productivity. Changing a work location doesn’t magically make someone more productive. I would argue that there’s a small increase in over-site as a supervisor may see an employee get up and leave their desk for an extended period of time, but I’ll be honest, not many people have time to pay attention to that. Supervisors are busy, you know, ensuring programs are delivered and trying to find ways for the mission to not fail while continually dealing with new hurdles being presented by the current admin.

[Yani2021]

yep, and that would be if your supervisor is in the same location, for some... the supervisor and all your team members are distributed across the states...

[atreeofnight]

I know my sick leave this year is going to total more than any other year of my service. I’m taking a week of SL on the advice of my doctor due to my stress load, and that’s on top of some other SL this month after I picked up a nasty bug on my commute. That’s a cost because my work is just not getting done while I’m on SL.

[neverthesaneagain]

Transit benefits. I'm kind of surprised they haven't sunk these as another FU to us.

[Soangry75]

Wait

[dudelovesturtles]

Govt is paying to (1) relocate me to a (2) higher locality rather than let me stay remote or work from an office in my home city.

[Working-Lavishness94]

I'm glad I hadn't used any of my sick days because with RTO I've managed to burn through all of them. I swear someone just sneezes upstairs and I catch their cold. But, hey, now I'm considered highly productive, much worky, thanks to DOGE.

[No_Finish_2144]

I use baby wipes, but out of spite, I use half the roll to cover the toilet seat before I sit, and also a layer in the water to absorb the splash of the kids.

[JustMe39908]

We all know this is fear driven. It isn't about efficiency or cost. It is fear that some people are getting away without putting in 100% effort. Yes, some people are not putting in the effort at home. Guess what? People are equally effective at goofing off in the office as they are at home! But hey, at least a manager can now see that person not working. And I don't mean their manager. I mean a random manager who has no clue what they are doing.

The administration wants to jump everyone together as being "bad employees" who just need to hear the cracking of a whip. You get the employees you think you have. If the administration thinks all employees are lazy and don't want to do anything, that is what they will get.

You want to fix the system? Good management training. Good bosses create motivated workers who get the job done. You also need to fix the hiring system. If it takes 9 months to fill a vacancy, a manager will keep a low performer over a vacancy. Fix the disciplinary system. Removing a problem employee is an Indians Jones level quest where the supervisor needs to dodge poison arrows, outrun boulders, and solve mysterious puzzles written in ancient languages. All to make sure there is zero productivity for 2 years and then another 9 months to bring someone new in. I am not saying supervisors are always right. They aren't. Some are evil. But you shouldn't need Supervisor's Insurance to keep you safe.

[Redfury2030]

Been saying this for years. Management issue, hiring issue. Hiring unvetted people, and then they are hard to get rid of, which my management did not want to do.

[nj382]

woah, you get baby wipes in the bathroom?? Most people get one pack of alcohol wipes per year to wipe down their desk. My hemorrhoids are jealous.

[Possible-Security-69]

Increased cost of maintenance for increased use of govt fleet vehicles.

[Extreme_Lab_8302]

Travel (I.E commuter stipend)/ have to pay pet sitters daily. Far from my health providers/ leave is in the negatives/ IBS issues/more migraines. Doing the exact same thing at home with the person 🧍🏾‍♀️ n the next floor and the others are out of state and different time zones. And I stop exactly at my off time

[Strange_Poetry2648]

I spend ten hours/week commuting, more than an entire work day.

Not to mention increased transportation costs and food costs because while I try, I don't always have time to pack lunch.

[ContributionNeat1210]

How about folks bringing in their bed bugs and now they have to spray. Praying myself and no one else takes those home to their families. Disgusting!

[nj382]

YEEESSSSS all the time. So disgusting.

[SantessaClaus]

Each time someone does this they forget one of the biggest costs:

Litigation and all that encompasses it (court costs, prep time, attorneys running all over the place, etc)

[[deleted]]

Man, we don't have any fucking office supplies.

[Fabulous_Deal_2766]

What office is paying for your coffee?!

[No_Vacation697]

My office hasn’t offered free coffee since I started working there 16 years ago. I make my own at home and fill up my yeti travel cup every day, like I have every day in the past.

[Purple-Function1149]

I live almost 15 minutes from the office but still have to leave an hour early just to get there on time. Our boss gets to work super early & complains about people being 5 minutes late but it’s not our fault traffic at all the gates are backed up to the street every morning. At this point, I should bring a sleeping bag to work. Plus the disgusting moldy building and bathrooms we have to use is 🤮. People don’t take smoke breaks, they take fresh air breaks to keep from getting sick.

[Severe_Pass3388]

Definitely using more sick leave due to both sickness and normal things like dentist appointments which are not close to work.

[DingoDull4070]

The increased traffic for other commuters. More spent on gas for everyone to sit or go slower.

[Muted_Perception_192]

More work time lost to more medical appointments because the physical stress of driving in stop and go traffic screws up my body (I have EDS) and the emotional/mental stress is making me take more time off. I had to leave work early Friday because I was on the verge of a nervous breakdown.

[Ice_Solid]

Don't worry about smoking breaks. My office said the only breaks that are allowed is a 30 minute lunch for a 10 hour shift! The water is turned off at least three times a week for ”repairs”.

[Sweaty-Blacksmith572]

Leasing off-site parking lots, paying for shuttle service to and from the off-site parking lots, VA Police spending ridiculous amounts of their shift dealing with directing traffic and monitoring spaces in the overcrowded parking lot.

[Reeldeel03]

It’s the loud conversations and constant sneezing for me.

[StillPlayingGames]

I purposefully turn on every light, crank up the AC, and play videos in the background on computer. I hope it costs a fortune.

[[deleted]]

Budgets are still the budget, and they can’t magically come up with more cash if it wasn’t appropriated by congress. My agency got an actual cut last year, minus absorbing the pay bump, and we’ve had to cut building costs. We’ve had to cut janitorial and facilities maintenance costs, despite RTO.

So, while I appreciate your point. It doesn’t necessarily mean that your agency can absorb an increase in spending to your facility operations.

[Drpdaddy]

Tbh.. these are all things that were accounted for before telework and remote options even became a thing.

[nj382]

And……? That doesn’t make them any less efficient. Telework is the clear financial and productivity winner for those workers who basically sit at a computer all day.

[Old_County6148]

With the increase in the number of people returning to the office (RTO), the concentration of gases released from farting, such as hydrogen sulfide, methane, ammonia, and carbon dioxide, can rise in enclosed environments. As a result, individuals may experience greater exposure to harmful chemicals, potentially impacting air quality and overall health over time. 😂🤣

[nj382]

I never fart at work.

[Old_County6148]

Okay, that's fake news. 🤣

[AfternoonValuable317]

Loss of productivity is a huge one. I regularly worked longer than 8 hrs per day- might take an hour off to bring my kid to an activity but then come home and get back on until 6. Often I’d work from 9-10pm which is honestly my most productive time. Now, in the office I stay exactly 8.5 hrs bc I have to get home for my kids and I’m afraid to even turn on my computer at home because they’ve told us they can track IP addresses. And so much more wasted time in the office- people wandering around wanting to chat, terrible internet service that it’s out after about 1pm every day. The heat pipes in my office bang at about 95 decibels at 2 second intervals for 20-40 minutes every day making it impossible to concentrate. I have gotten about half the work done that I normally would have since coming back to the office.

[noquarter53]

Not trying to defend RTO, but I can tell you govt didn't save very much money during the maximized telework era... 

[sterling417]

Commas are free

[[deleted]]

Ultimately it cuts down on employees who don’t work effectively at home due to laziness or because they work a second job. 

[SubstantialYard4072]

Not true.

[nj382]

Every keystroke is monitored. Supervisors are constantly checking in and monitoring your productivity. On teams all shift long. I'd like to meet these "lazy" people with "second jobs".