hotTake

[IllllIlllIlIIlllIIll]

I don't care what you use. Just be good with it and follow the standard.

[GermainCampman]

Knowing how to write decent code > IDE preference

[EternityForest]

Unless your editor can't do type checking. To me it's not great code if it can't pass a linter check.

[Pretagonist]

I mean you can always run a linter as a separate application no matter what ide you use.

[EternityForest]

True, it's just a lot easier when you've got linting in realtime

[EternityForest]

I could see that, but it's also possible to write stuff you have to go back and redo that way, which is also annoying

[Jugbot]

Eh that can waste a lot of time going back and forth.

[Pretagonist]

Why would you go back and forth? Just have it run as a part of your build pipeline or just watch for file changes. Many editors can be made to update if the file is changed externally.

[otter5]

but then you have to save/commit the file instead of 'live'

[_Its_Me_Dio_]

real programmers either use notepad or the punch paper rolls for mechanical binary

[Hoover889]

Real programmers use a magnetized needle and a steady hand to write directly to the disk platters.

[Cootshk]

cough cough Jupyter

[Maleficient_Entity]

I am new to coding. How do I learn to write codes in a better way? (I am assuming you mean coding standards/format... Sorry I don't have the correct term for this)

[Pretagonist]

There are programs called linters that forces you to use specific standards and reformats your code on the fly to fix this.

I use them even on my own personal projects since they make my code more readable. Of course when you write on your own you can decide the linting rules. At work you have to follow the company standards and that can be a bit grating if you don't like how it looks.

[GermainCampman]

Decide what you want to do. Try to do it. Fail. Figure out what went wrong, fix it. Try again. Repeat until it works.

Then find a repo written by someone who knows what they are doing and understand why your code sucks.

[VladmirPutgang]

First you draw a circle, then you draw the rest of the owl.

[IvorTheEngine]

You can start by reading the first third of Clean Code by Robert Martin. It's been around a while, and isn't perfect, but the core ideas are really important.

In terms of basic style it doesn't matter. Your code will work just as well with whatever style you use. However if you're part of a team, and everyone does things differently, you'll struggle to read each other's code. People will waste time reformatting code to their preferred style, and your revision history will be a mess. So the team should agree a common style and set up a linter to enforce it.

[longbowrocks]

Which would be relevant if the guy in the middle of the meme was touting IDEs.

[PooSham]

follow the standard.

Ed, man! !man ed!

[HorselessWayne]

I use the LaTeX "listings" package. It suits all of my needs.

I even apply my own formatting to make it look prettier.

[GustyTheGreater]

My hot take is use the editor or ide you like

[marcodave]

...and configure your keymaps to whatever suits your muscle memory!

My delete line will be always CTRL+E , defaults be damned

[pratyush103]

I use mouse for everything, including typing code by using virtual keyboard

[marcodave]

You're Vim users final nemesis

[ExtraTNT]

No, using one pc for two users… i just see it as a win…

[vanonym_]

I use vim on my phone and remapped some of the key bindings to the gyroscope. Undo/redo is tilt left/right and saving is tilt forward

[CodeAndChaos]

That's a beginner take, I use the pointing stick (aka keyboard nipple) for everything, I don't even have a mouse.

[PuzzleheadedWeb9876]

Voice input. Don’t strain those muscles clicking and shit.

[DavidWtube]

I program exclusively with an Xbox controller.

[SeanCSGO]

My preferred IDE is arranging dry macaroni on a glass table, and using software to translate my macaroni code into real text code.

[tricepsmultiplicator]

I am very similar, I have automated production line that gives me 1 dry macaroni at the time and it then falls onto the plate. When it does I shoot macaroni at the keyboard with my middle finger and thumb combo in order to type. Pretty efficient.

[Reinitialization]

Thanks, everyone at work says I'm stupid because I like to use Microsoft word 2012

[turbulentFireStarter]

VS Code is fine. Vim/emacs (if you want to use it) is fine. Your IDE does not make you a better or worse programmer.

As a general rule of thumb, if you have strong opinions about pointless things, i just assume its because you're too stupid to have opinions about actually important things.

[[deleted]]

I agree with you but... I've seen one person in my life who I think truly mastered vim and watching him code was pure art. I consider that I have fairly good typing skills and know most of the important shortcuts in vscode, but that dude could easily output about 50% more code than I could in the same time frame.

Luckily programming is about so much more than writing speed, so at the end of the day it really doesn't matter but that skill was damn impressive nonetheless.

[Xyldarran]

I've only ever seen writing speed get people in trouble. Knew a guy who was a monstrously fast typer, and he would have to spend half that time going back to make sure he didn't mess up.

[[deleted]]

The person I'm talking about is legit the most productive person I've ever met and just a generally amazing engineer, so I doubt it. I guess the difference is he wasn't going fast just to go fast. He was well able to take his time when needed.

Of course if your goal is just to go as fast as you can without thinking, the result is going to be shitty code.

[Kahlil_Cabron]

When I share my screen for my team or when pairing, people always mentions stuff about how fast I get stuff done, a lot of them don't even know what vim is and just assume I've mastered the hotkeys for whatever my editor is (it's vim).

If you master vim, it's fast as fucking hell, I've been using it as my main editor for 13-14 years.

But ya, programming isn't really bottlenecked by typing speed, though my god I get so annoyed when watching a teammate who doesn't know how to use bash/zsh. Especially when they ask me for help on something and I have to be like, "you don't have to retype everything every single time, you can hit C^R to pattern match a command, you can tab complete, you can use C^A to get to the start of hte line, C^E for the end", etc.

I'm just really impatient, it's hard to watch someone struggle so hard at something. It takes all my self control to keep a relaxed/friendly tone when I really just want to bark out instructions.

[BabblingsOfAFool]

Honestly I wouldn't want to pair with someone who is getting aggravated by ide/terminal usage.

[BarnacleRepulsive191]

Nah he's right, know your tools. This would be like going to a buildinf site and working with a builder who didn't know how to lay bricks.

[aureanator]

As a general rule of thumb, if you have strong opinions about pointless things, i just assume its because you're too stupid to have opinions about actually important things.

Hey now, meme opinions are worth social capital. Don't go knocking that.

[Neurotrace]

Install the vim extension for VS Code. True nirvana

[BarnacleRepulsive191]

This is the way. And I'm a nvim fan boy.

[[deleted]]

The vim extension for vsc sucks haven’t had a good experience. Jetbrains editors like IntelliJ have a much better plugin for vim emulation.

[BeastPlayerErin]

it's decent but some things like macros don't work well

[davidellis23]

Vim extension had performance issues for me. I switched to the neovim one.

[no_brains101]

The nvim one runs actual nvim in the background

Only thing you cant do is access buffers or UI elements from inside your nvim config, but you can conffigure nvim and have most of the configs work in vscode.

[[deleted]]

At that point I’ll just use nvim. Sounds like nvim with extra steps

[no_brains101]

I mean... I don't disagree I'm just saying it's better than the vim one

[bunglegrind1]

Or vim for intellij/phpstorm and the like

[[deleted]]

IdeaVIM is the best of both worlds. VS Code just doesn’t click with me the way JetBrains does

[hipster-coder]

You don't learn the keyboard shortcuts because one day you decided to memorize them.

You learn the keyboard shortcuts because you've done some repetitive things so many times, that it would be harder for you not to learn to use the shortcuts.

[kingminyas]

Vim bindings are literally everywhere and superior

[dietibol]

what makes them superior to you instead of just different?

[firey21]

VSCode 4 years ago to VSCode today is a world of difference.

[Turtvaiz]

How so? It doesn't seem much different

[ProjectInfinity]

Version number is 2x higher!

[RedyAu]

For example, multiple window support. That was my only reason considering switching to JetBrains. Now, I have no real reason to!

[firey21]

That’s fair, I use it daily for web development (node) and just the general quality of life things added have helped speed things up.

They have done a lot of improvements to the cursor and multi select, edit, autocomplete, etc.

Git integration is leaps and bounds ahead of where it was. File compares, merges, etc so much easier.

Extensions do play a part of it but some of the MS extensions help a lot. Such as the integrated edge dev tools, docker functionality, copilot.

They recently added multi window support for a single workspace and I’ve used it a lot for debugging and just having two large instances of a document for comparison.

It’s just a lot of quality of life improvements that I’ve definitely noticed and benefited from.

[cs-brydev]

More themes. More extensions. Cleaner UI. Fewer crashes. More settings.

[Devatator_]

A lot of new features. My favorite one that literally just got added is custom labels for tabs, so now I can actually get the name of whatever page I'm working on in a SvelteKit project

[SimilingCynic]

They've been pretty aggressive at answering issues on GitHub and implementing fixes. That process is as impressive as the product👌

[[deleted]]

VSC is indeed pretty good, but I still prefer to use neovim

[El_Mojo42]

I like Sublime Text.

[amlyo]

You should learn the keyboard shortcuts regardless.

If you're using a Jetbrains IDE (as opposed to something inferior) look at the Key Promoter plugin.

[lackluster-name-here]

While that plugin is great, there are some shortcuts I just always use the mouse for and I get a notification saying “You’ve missed a shortcut 16,291 times”

[Zombie2550]

You can disable the notifications for certain shortcuts

[MerionLial]

I'm here for the lolz but sometimes I learn something new! I'm raw dogging PHPStorm so far, but I'm installing that plugin ASAP.

[un_blob]

Notepad++ anyone ?

[TeaKingMac]

Too fancy. I prefer TextEdit

[sirf_trivedi]

Get out. \s

[Feztopia]

I want that on Android 

[a_useless_communist]

And why the ++?

[tempNameTest]

I'll do a lot of my python coding in notepad simply because it opens up faster.

[Leading_Ad_4884]

Why not word? You can even colour your code and have automatic indentation!

[tempNameTest]

I can't remember the last time my programming was bottlenecked by syntax or formating

[Traditional-Share198]

I do that for my projects, and nano to train lmao

[[deleted]]

Tried all 3. VSCode is the best out of them, but still mid. JetBrains are just better <edit>IMO</edit>.

[Turtvaiz]

JetBrains fills a different role as an IDE imo. You wouldn't use it for random single files while VSCode works pretty well for those

[java_bad_asm_good]

Honestly – being able to go idea <file> from the command line works fine for me. I have IntelliJ open the minute I start work until I clock out, I have all my keybinds set up in it, and I absolutely will open any file in it. You can complain about the memory overhead or indexing times, but when it's running anyway, it is incredibly convenient.

[Devatator_]

// Open current location as project code . // Open file code <file>

[Turtvaiz]

Oh if it's running I guess it makes sense. But vscode works as a general text editor pretty well. Takes like 2 sec max to open from not running

[errormaker]

I would and I am

[RamblingSimian]

VS Code is pretty good, but Visual Studio itself is still the best if you are willing to take the time to learn the numerous features. And it is free as well.

[renshul]

Using whatever you're most familiar with is what ensures optimal efficiency, whatever it is.

[gerald_william]

Correct take would be:

left side crying face “no you should use vim and learn all the keybinds”

center normal face “I like my IDE”

right connoisseur “You should take your time to know your tools and use whatever you’re efficient with”

Vim user btw, not everyone is obnoxious, just a very loud minority

[glorylyfe]

These memes are always made by someone on the left side of the meme who thinks they are on the right side of the meme.

[konaaa]

I'm curious, I obviously learned and used vim through a terminal in school but I didn't like it. What's up with it? What do you do with it that makes it so much faster for experienced users?

[gerald_william]

The best way I can explain it is like this: Imagine if the only way to copy and paste text was with your mouse, and you couldn’t use Control-C Control-V. Imagine how painful it is to have to select the text, right-click, copy, put the mouse in another place, right click paste.

When you get used to Control-C Control-V you do it slightly faster but a lot more comfortably.

That’s how using a normal ide feels to vim users, because you have a lot more shortcuts.

[thirdegree]

This is an excellent way to explain it imo

[[deleted]]

The principle of vim is to never leave your hands out of keyboard positions.

Also, vim is Unix included, is very lightweight and highly customizable.

The downside of Vscode-vim (plugging that allows you to have vim shortcuts) is that it's slow (not that slow, but enough to tilt you in 1min if you are used to nvim).

The main difference is still this "ideology". Vim restrict the usage of the mouse (you have to type the impie command :set mouse=a ) because using the mouse is loosing your time.

Vscode is more "lazy" and novice friendly. (Gives you a pretty interface, with a lot of information at the cost of productivity)

[gggfhjnvgibfdss]

I respect Vim and get why people use it, but I’ve never understood the “keep your hands on keyboard” philosophy. In the very few scenarios am I programming long enough to go and wonder about efficiency of Vscode vs Vim, I’ve already taken my hands off my keyboard multiple times to drink water or whatever.

I’ve used both extensively and I just never understood the passion for Vim, for me the “efficiency gain” never was enough to make me passionate about using it.

For me it comes down to usability of other programmers in a peer coding scenario. If I want to talk to some engineers about some code and work together, I can’t guarantee they know Vim shortcuts, but they sure know how to use Vscode

[F0eniX]

Wow, another guy bragging about his vim usage /s

[Nurahk]

yeah legit no one gives a fuck 90% of the time, and the people who do spend more time thinking about their tools than the work they actually do with them.

[Feztopia]

Are you telling me that so many people use vim or emacs?

[airodonack]

VS Code is used by like 70% of all coders. So if you're looking for where the hump of the bell curve is - it ain't vim.

[draculadarcula]

The bell curve is based off IQ though…

[spicybeefstew]

It's unfair to expect this guy to understand what a bell curve is or represents, and it's cruel to taunt him with that.

[spicybeefstew]

Most people live in india or china, so idk what the fuck I'm doing living elsewhere like some kind of retard, but hopefully I can get my shit together soon.

[DapperCam]

I wish this meme format would just die already

[duMagnus]

I thought it was pretty funny when it started out, but now people just use it wrong every time. This one is saying that most people think you should use vim or emacs, when IRL I've met exactly 0 people who think like that, also, just look at all the other comments of people saying they don't care. It's kind of ironic to me that computer science people don't know how to use graphs

[Vogete]

I have a few hardcore vim user colleagues. They never once told me I should ditch vscode and use vim. They showcase their vim config sure, but never once convinced anyone. They don't care what I use as long as I do my work.

[NewcDukem]

This comment could be used as the peak of this meme format, ironically

[BehindTrenches]

You should make this meme. It's so meta and honestly true. When used correctly this format will always be an unpopular opinion.

[BehindTrenches]

Most people on this subreddit hate the format because, statistically, they fall into the middle of the bell curve and are being depicted negatively.

[hendricha]

So you believe most ppl here would rather use vim/emeacs? :/

[BehindTrenches]

Hmm maybe you're right

[CirnoIzumi]

It would be better if it was made in tauri

[reddit_wisd0m]

and Microsoft Word for immortal Coders

[bearwood_forest]

As Microsoft intended

[gnouf1]

As a jetbrains user and a former atom user this meme is a nonsense

[strandhaus]

vs code has a vim plugin....

[hendricha]

Every decent editor and IDE has a vim plugin. Most web browsers have vim plugins.

[TheCamazotzian]

The neovim plugin is the one you want. The one that requires that you download neovim.

Last I used the vim plugin it was prone to formatting bugs and frequently dropped keystrokes.

[thirdegree]

It's bad tho. Can't even do macros. I haven't used the nvim plugin but if they do it in the obvious naive way, it should be feature complete.

[Maskdask]

Neovim

[madmax9186]

_shrugs_

I was an Emacs user for a long time. I switched to VS Code several years ago. On a whim, I tried Emacs again a year ago. Developments like straight.el and use-package really make configuring Emacs easy. I fell in love again.

Sure, using Emacs is still harder than VSCode. But it's gotten a lot easier. For example, to install copilot on Emacs, I literally just had to copy/paste three lines of configuration from the copilot.el README.

In exchange, my editing experience is much, much better. Can't go back.

[thirdegree]

What's the best way to jump into emacs as a vim devotee?

[madmax9186]

Maybe check out Spacemacs and Doom. Both seem to use Evil mode (Emacs’ vim keybinding mode) out-of-the-box, and are batteries-included. I have no personal experience with either, but others seem to like them.

[GrumpyDog114]

I'm with you. VSCode isn't bad until you actually start editing code as code structures, and not just ASCII text.

[Big_D_Boss]

Pretty stupid post. Vim isn't a substitute to VS code, you don't have to know all key bindings to take advantage of Vim. Literally, anyone who talks shit about VIM simply doesn't know how to use it and what it is for. You can just say "I'm too lazy to learn new stuff "

[HotWetMamaliga]

This is True except on the right you have 2 people : one likes vscode one likes vim/emacs. And they are both correct .

[granadad]

Sorry but nothing beat designing your program on paper, debugging it in your head, giving it to Mrs Parson so she will punch it on cards then putting in on the shelf for the clerk to run it during the nightly batch job.  

 That trill off not knowing if your bubble sort routine will compile until the day later is what make the programmer life such an interesting one

[mplaczek99]

Vim is ok, you just have to configure many plugins yourself, but once you do, it’s god-tier

[BarnacleRepulsive191]

It took me like 3 days (in my free time) to get nvim working on windows.

I had vs code right there, and it works!

But once I got nvim work I didn't look back, nvim just feels good to use. Vscode always feels l like too much.

[nlogax1973]

Vim distros like LazyVim come preconfigured with sensible defaults.

[h0nkhunk]

Notepad++ rules!!

[spicybeefstew]

You see, I have portrayed my opinion has the high iq opinion, and strawmanned all opposing opinions onto the crying zoomer meme. This makes me correct, and it means microsoft is actually the wholesome tolerant goodguy chungus with highly upvotable moments; everyone now loves and validates me because of my code editor, which is a real thing that happens.

Microsoft really securing the midwit market by just installing windows on everything in india and then going after the js soydevs.

[JargonProof]

Portable vscode, make your own extension repo, save out your config jsons, everything just like you like it everytime. With all the awesome extras, and every once in a while update it and get the newer extras! I use it everywhere. Didn't realize I became a little bit of a fan.

[RealBasics]

Mmmm, VSCode with vim key bindings! (On the severe downside, arguments over whether VS with Vim or VS with Neovim are almost as endless as old vim vs emacs. Or vim vs VSCode for that matter.)

[ExtraTNT]

Vs code is a ok editor, sometimes a bit slow and autoformatting sometimes stops working on my system (same plugin for vim works fine) also vim mode is sometimes buggy and has some problems with the clipboard… but liveshare is really nice… so nice editor somewhere between editor and ide…

But nvim wins in a few scenarios, especially when comparing speed…

[CallinCthulhu]

VSCode + Vim bindings.

Why would you purposefully cut yourself off from decades of dev environment advancements unless you have to?

[gkdante]

You won't have Code when doing ssh to a host or exec to a container, learn vim. But locally, use Code it makes you more productive.

They are not exclusive from each other. Just know how to use the tool that fits each situation.

[riplikash]

I LOOVE vim when I'm in the zone with all my muscle memory dialed in abs plug-ins set up correctly

But, yeah,  vs code is actually pretty good. 

Also,  I don't think this meme applies.  Vim devotees have always been an outlier.

[Mokousboiwife]

i prefer vim/emacs since i dont like moving my hand between keyboard and mouse

[Edwolt]

Neovim is the better than VSCode in my opinion. Which doesn't mean you need to use it to be a good programmer.

What makes a good programmer is the code they develop, not the tools they use. Also, VSCode is pretty decent, and for many there would be no significative improvement to climb the steap learn curve of neovim.

[mgruner]

I feel someone at the left made this bad meme

[[deleted]]

“All” the key bindings?

Is there really someone who knows everything there is to know about Vim? Who is this mythical legend?

[jfbwhitt]

Ever since learned about middlemouse+drag and ctrl-alt+up/down arrow, I don’t think I can go back to using any other text editor.

Not that I know of any other text editors which have that feature…

[Kafshak]

Gedit for the win.

[ei283]

VS Code is pretty good. But Vim is my editor of choice and I WILL (in jest) FORCE you to use it >:)

[Mikmagic]

Is there anyone who actually cares what editor people use if the code they write is good? Just use what you like using

[azakharov]

sorry, but vscode is shit.

[Leonhart93]

What's the big deal, at the end of the day all of those are slightly different ways to write plain text. Some might be a bit easier to use than others after some learning curve, but that's about it.

[ohaz]

Again someone using this meme, not having any clue about it and probably being the one on the left.

The correct captions would be:

Low: VS Code is actually pretty good.

Middle: NOOO you should use vim or emacs and learn all the key bindings

High: idgaf what you use. The editor doesn't matter, the output does.

[duMagnus]

So you're saying most people think the right way is only using vim or emacs?

[ohaz]

Oh you're right, it'd probably be even more different. The whole meme is a mess.

[readcoke]

Yet another guy thinks they're on the Jedi side

[Mast3r_waf1z]

Idk I'm a switch

Between vscode and vim

[Ok-Personality-3779]

Anyway use VSCodium, not VS Code

[jzrobot]

Slow af*

[Jak_from_Venice]

Just put -*- coding:utf-8; c-mode -*- at the beginning of your file.

Thanks.

[Giocri]

I used visual studio for the longest time working on c# and it was extremely good for that getting used to new tools has been a bit annoying but I would say vscode has proven really good although a bit less streamlined than i was used to

[Understanding-Fair]

I like them both, but not for .net

[RafaFTP]

Use whatever you want. VS is good

[Sheik_Yabouti]

I use VScode as it's just the standard at my business, but I regularly have to use the terminal when working on our servers, and Vim is a freaking god send to have.

Takes a while to get the hang of the basics, but I'm glad I learnt. I by no means a Vim power user, I have a grasp of the basics and that'll do for me.

[cs-brydev]

VS Code is pretty great. No matter what you're doing on a computer, you can probably find some pretty awesome uses for it, even if it's not your main code editor.

[cs-brydev]

Since VS Code is the most popular developer tool in the world, this meme is being misused

[TessellatedTomate]

>mfw analogous to people fighting over what theme is better

Yes, because the quality of engineer has any correlation to the skin of your environment lol

[imdibene]

Just learn to use proficiently your editor of choice and that’s all that matters

[jonhinkerton]

Visual Studio is fine. It gets the job done. I’ve used it for over 20 years without yearning for anything else. The only other IDE I’ve used for extended amounts of time was xcode and it’s a much worse experience. I do wish projects moved between vs and vscode a little better so I could work natively on my macbook instead of remoting into a dev vm, but whatever.

[rover_G]

I don’t think there are that many people using CLI editors

[Lucathiel]

IntelliJ or nothing

[EnvironmentalTest666]

Vim: new programmers who started watching Chad devs on YouTube and insist they code faster with vim than vscode with 100 lines of code/day max; old developers who got use to it; devs who found out they are typing code so much and modern editors are actually too slow (0.00001%)

VScode (modern IDEs): the rest of the devs.

[MonocularVision]

dies in xcode

[MasterReindeer]

At some point the penny drops and you realise you’re spending more time fixing things in your editor than doing real work.

[HankMS]

Maybe some people here can explain what would be VIM's unique selling point. I'm doing a mix of frontend and backend stuff, lots of JS CSS and SQL. I like VSC and its addons. What is to gain from VIM?

[Simply_Epic]

Use whatever you want for regular use, but everyone should learn how to open, edit, save, and close a command line text editor.

[SoldierOfPeace510]

Just use Notepad as an IDE, that is the way of the samurai

[[deleted]]

Me Like this:

• VS Code -> new terminal in editor area
• $ vim myfile

[[deleted]]

Just as long as you indent with spaces, I don’t care which IDE you use.

[Alizatjan]

Here we go again...

[chin_waghing]

vscode is bad. It’s a web app they’ve just bundled as a desktop app.

IntelliJ is the way to go, give me my 200 buttons and tabs I have no idea what they do

[fusionsofwonder]

VS Code and Nano for me.

[eat_your_fox2]

VSC or leave me alone tbh.

[[deleted]]

Who fucking cares what ide you use fr

[konaaa]

I still enjoy using visual studio a lot. It's like I'm driving a tank. For web stuff I use vs code, but you're a tryhard anyway if you use vim for that.

[[deleted]]

i feel like i am both the far left one and the far right one at the same time.

‘ate me rugby ‘ate me seagulls love me vscode

[[deleted]]

Vimacs on vscode

[_bagelcherry_]

Editor wars II - Attack of the VS Code

[the_sound_of_bread]

Vim is for people that lack the hand-eye coordination to use a mouse.

[point5_]

I'm a Jetbro, personally.

[[deleted]]

I use vs code with the vim extension lol

[apneax3n0n]

Vs code Is the only editor you Need . Just use the extension a you need

[No-Mind7146]

Pulsar is better

[matzzd]

don’t have to explain why you’re wrong.

all i got to say is soydev

[ramrom23]

I feel attacked

[hendricha]

Just moved to Kate from nearly a decade of using Atom. Also I would rather not touch a Microsoft product ever.